Re: [WSG] Browser Check
On 07-Sep-07, at 10:17 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Browser check for the following site: http://www.condometropolis.com/buy_orlando_condos.php? Name=action=searchSubmit=Browse+All+Condos!first=yes I get a MySQL error: Warning: mysql_connect(): Access denied for user: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' (Using password: YES) in /home/content/h/a/s/hase1/html/db.php on line 8 Error connecting to mysql *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] lack of 'lang' attribute fails WAI
On Sat, September 8, 2007 8:32 am, Tee G. Peng wrote: There is also this possibility that a site needs two languages in one page, for instance, a site offers language learning. There is nothing wrong with pages have two or more languages for each page. Just as long as the CHANGE in langauge is marked up. To markup a change in language you need to have an initial reference point. So one language has to be assigned as the primary language. not surprising. Haviung the same content on one page is no real problem, it would be easy to have text in Chinese and English. The probability is that for each page only one language would be used for the UI and navigation. Its also likely that the metadata on the page is onely in one language. Its passible to have metadata in more than one language, but it came become problematic. Anyway the title element should realistically only have one langauge. So regardless of whether the content in Chinese and English, one language logically woiuld be morie prominant fior the page in question. It becomes more obvious for pages that are bilingual English and Arabic or English and Hebrew, etc. The User Interface would have a dominate directionality left-to-right or right-to-left, the directionality of the page would be reflected in the primary language. Andrew -- Andrew Cunningham Research and Development Coordinator Vicnet State Library of Victoria Australia [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: Re: [WSG] Browser Check
Thank you for your email. I shall be away from the office between September 8th and September 17th. If your enquiry is urgent, then please call my assistant on 01749 676798 in my absence. Kind regards, Nick Roper *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: Re: [WSG] lack of 'lang' attribute fails WAI
Thank you for your email. I shall be away from the office between September 8th and September 17th. If your enquiry is urgent, then please call my assistant on 01749 676798 in my absence. Kind regards, Nick Roper *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5
On 31-Aug-07, at 11:08 PM, Designer wrote: Well Vlad, whether it fits your conception or not, there is such a thing as a site whose prime function is visual. The only 'information' in the site I mentioned is what something 'looks like'. If you can't see it, there is nothing you can do to help that. It's a sad fact of life I'm afraid. Bob, While not quite in direct response to your statement, I thought I'd share this article from over at A List Apart: http://alistapart.com/articles/revivinganorexicwebwriting Specifically the 'A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words' bit. I admit to having overlooked alt text. Until a year ago I sniffed at the idea of creating useful alt text for images. “If a user is blind,” I reasoned, “what does he care that I have a photograph of the university tower on my website?” My fellow designer shrugged. “Well, I guess if you don’t really care about what the image says,” she said slowly, “you really don’t need it in the first place.” Best, - Rahul. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5
Rahul Gonsalves wrote: On 31-Aug-07, at 11:08 PM, Designer wrote: Well Vlad, whether it fits your conception or not, there is such a thing as a site whose prime function is visual. The only 'information' in the site I mentioned is what something 'looks like'. If you can't see it, there is nothing you can do to help that. It's a sad fact of life I'm afraid. Bob, While not quite in direct response to your statement, I thought I'd share this article from over at A List Apart: http://alistapart.com/articles/revivinganorexicwebwriting Specifically the 'A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words' bit. I admit to having overlooked alt text. Until a year ago I sniffed at the idea of creating useful alt text for images. “If a user is blind,” I reasoned, “what does he care that I have a photograph of the university tower on my website?” My fellow designer shrugged. “Well, I guess if you don’t really care about what the image says,” she said slowly, “you really don’t need it in the first place.” Best, - Rahul. *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] *** Hi Rahul., Whilst interesting and quite valid, I think the article is not about stuff on web sites that are primarily visual art. What I mean is that the sort of stuff which is purely visual poetry cannot have an alt tag which adds anything other than a 'lable'. Consider (just as an example) a web site to accompany a show by Mark Rothko, with a handful of images from the show displayed on the site. Those images just cannot be appreciated by someone who cannot see them. No amount of descriptive prose will mean anything to to a blind reader. (In fact, the images lose a lot compared to their actual presence in the gallery, even for sighted viewers). In case you are unfamiliar with Rothko, you can see stuff at : http://www.nga.gov/feature/rothko/classic1.shtm. Using this arbitrary example, I still maintain that a site of images such as any of these will be of no more value to a blind user for having alt tags, other than to point out that 'there is a picture there'. Of what, the blind user has no idea because they are impossible to describe. I personally do use alt tags, every time : but I am aware of situations where they are pretty useless. -- Bob www.gwelanmor-internet.co.uk *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] Investigating the proposed alt attribute recommendations in HTML 5
Designer wrote: http://www.nga.gov/feature/rothko/classic1.shtm. Using this arbitrary example, I still maintain that a site of images such as any of these will be of no more value to a blind user for having alt tags, other than to point out that 'there is a picture there'. Of what, the blind user has no idea because they are impossible to describe. You're arguing as if a site, or the web as a whole for that matter, exists in isolation. The 'label' you mention in the part I've left out, may indeed be just the cue a visitor need. More information can then either be found on the page/site, somewhere else on the web, or in the real world. By providing cues - meaningful alt text and/or otherwise - about the original, a suitable translation can often be found elsewhere by those who want one. By not providing cues, we do indeed leave visitors in the dark. ( The site you use as example, contains more than enough information alongside the image. A reference - alt attribute - to tell _which_ image that information belongs to is missing though. Several other weaknesses on that example-site btw - all regarding images. ) There are art galleries that experiment with techniques to make art - paintings or other types of art - more accessible to those who can't fully use the senses the artist aimed at. Some of these techniques are well suited for the digital world, but I don't think they have spread to the web, yet. Will something get lost in translation? Surely it will. However, that doesn't mean a blind user is necessarily left with no idea. Blind people's senses may also be developed far beyond what we - the seeing - may imagine. I do have a friend who can interpret flat images pretty well by the use of her hands. She is sensing differences in reflected temperature, instead of reflected light that most of us are limited too. That she also tends to get the use of colors more or less right, is even more surprising. Given a few more cues she gets a pretty good understanding about most pictures. This just to say: don't underestimate people's ability to appreciate something, just based on what senses they do *not* have. Alt attributes should stay - be required in HTML 5, and they should be used in a meaningful way. What's meaningful depends on the case, but if images are important parts of the content then an alt text should be provided - even if it is just a 'label'. regards Georg -- http://www.gunlaug.no *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: [WSG] lack of 'lang' attribute fails WAI
On Sep 8, 2007, at 2:40 AM, Andrew Cunningham wrote: Its passible to have metadata in more than one language, but it came become problematic. Anyway the title element should realistically only have one langauge. Hi Andrew, I am curious, is there guideline from WCAG that state there should only be one language for the title? I am trying to look at this matter with Search engine perspective. For a bilingual or multilingual site which has more than one language in the page, an author may make good use for having title as as well as other metedata in different languages. Although search engine giant google can search sites in any language but it maybe prudent to add special treatment for other native search engine that specializes in its native language, for example, a search engine from India maybe more capable in its Search algorithm with 18 Indian languages as well as its neighbors' languages such as Nepali, Urdu and Tibetan; whereas, baidu, a popular Chinese search engine not just does a better job for Chinese site searching but other languages such as Tibetan, Mongolian and Uyghur because they official part of China territories. If a site contains English and one or more of the above mentioned languages, it's likely at least x% of users who visit the site may use a native search engine, thus a valid reason to have more than one languages in the metadata. tee *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: Re: [WSG] lack of 'lang' attribute fails WAI
Thank you for your email. I shall be away from the office between September 8th and September 17th. If your enquiry is urgent, then please call my assistant on 01749 676798 in my absence. Kind regards, Nick Roper *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
Re: Re: Re: [WSG] lack of 'lang' attribute fails WAI
Thank you for your email. I shall be away from the office between September 8th and September 17th. If your enquiry is urgent, then please call my assistant on 01749 676798 in my absence. Kind regards, Nick Roper *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe: http://webstandardsgroup.org/join/unsubscribe.cfm Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ***
