Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2022-09-12 Thread Mališa Vučinić
Hi Christian, > On 10 Sep 2022, at 12:30, Christian Amsüss wrote: > > * Do RFCs 9030/9031 allow that a device uses an explicit frame counter, > which it increments in its own pace? As mentioned, we’ve made every attempt to make RFC 9031 applicable to non-TSCH use cases, as well. Construction

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2022-09-12 Thread Tero Kivinen
Michael Richardson writes: > > * Do RFCs 9030/9031 allow that a device uses an explicit frame counter, > > which it increments in its own pace? > > They don't say anything about it, I think. > It's an IEEE/802.15.4 issue. > > 6tisch specifies TSCH mode, which includes the ASN. (To be

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2022-09-12 Thread Michael Richardson
Christian Amsüss wrote: > So before going on with questions about "how would any of this be > signaled", my question is: > * Do RFCs 9030/9031 allow that a device uses an explicit frame counter, > which it increments in its own pace? They don't say anything about it, I think.

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2022-09-10 Thread Christian Amsüss
Hello Mališa, (reviving the old thread because interest as sparked anew at the RIOT summit, and Michael helped me see some alternatives) my previous mails in this thread were focused around syncing time in some different way. Maybe this is all not necessary -- as long as the nodes themselves

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2021-09-20 Thread Mališa Vučinić
> On 20 Sep 2021, at 12:54, Christian Amsüss wrote: > I originally thought I'd just take a K1 and K2 and the existing key > usage table, but these are actually 6TiSCH specific. It'd be quite a > waste to repeat the 14 modes to say the same about any other MAC > (especially as using the K1/K2

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2021-09-20 Thread Christian Amsüss
On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 12:15:27PM +0200, Mališa Vučinić wrote: > As you could probably see from RFC9031, we did make an attempt to > separate TSCH-specific from generally-applicable text, yes, thanks for that -- if that were not done, the endeavour would be a lot harder. > The use cases you

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2021-09-20 Thread Mališa Vučinić
Hi Christian, As you could probably see from RFC9031, we did make an attempt to separate TSCH-specific from generally-applicable text, but we indeed never instantiated it for non-TSCH setups and additional parameters would need to be registered and described. I do concur that the biggest

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2021-09-20 Thread Christian Amsüss
Hello Michael, On Sun, Sep 19, 2021 at 03:48:44PM -0400, Michael Richardson wrote: > > have the discussions in the development of CoJP ever sidetracked to its > > applicability for non-TSCH setups? > > not really. thanks, that's good to know too. > I think that the CoJP worked very very hard

Re: [6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2021-09-19 Thread Michael Richardson
Christian Amsüss wrote: > have the discussions in the development of CoJP ever sidetracked to its > applicability for non-TSCH setups? not really. > Parameters registry could suffice to make CoJP usable for DSME, NBE or > BE (CAP / CSMA/CA) modes. I think that the CoJP worked

[6tisch] Extending CoJP (minimal-security) for non-6TiSCH 802.15.4 networks

2021-09-19 Thread Christian Amsüss
Hello 6TiSCH group, have the discussions in the development of CoJP ever sidetracked to its applicability for non-TSCH setups? Sure, there would be differences: The joined devices would need to keep track of time in some way on their own (possibly less precise than for ASNs; a confident upper