Re: [9fans] mounting fossil

2013-03-15 Thread Peter A. Cejchan
Okay, I'll give it a try. I must first decide on a (quasi)stable dir tree. The problem is that I have almost 2TB of data, so should I have another 2TB disk for Venti if I want to put there all? Thanks, Peter. On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 4:54 PM, a...@9srv.net wrote: I reorganize my data very

[9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread mycroftiv
The amazing PATENTED IBM Multi-Pipe! I wanted to post to let 9fans know about an exciting new software patent that was just issued by the US patent office. United States Patent #8,380,765 is for an incredible new Plan 9 related supercomputing technology called the Multi-pipe. If you want to

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread erik quanstrom
congrats to ericvh. - erik

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread Kurt H Maier
Here's the original iosrv/hub announcement: http://9fans.net/archive/2009/07/278 So what's the real difference between iosrv/hubfs and MULTI-PIPES? Is anyone here good enough at translating patentese to code to tell what the technical differences are? The patent even specifically mentions 9P.

[9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread mycroftiv
Kurt H Maier wrote: So what's the real difference between iosrv/hubfs and MULTI-PIPES? Is anyone here good enough at translating patentese to code to tell what the technical differences are? The patent even specifically mentions 9P. Well, since I'm trying to deal with this in human way

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread hiro
Is this all a threat? 9fans cold war veterans playing out the old game or something?

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread John Floren
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 8:04 AM, Kurt H Maier kh...@intma.in wrote: Here's the original iosrv/hub announcement: http://9fans.net/archive/2009/07/278 So what's the real difference between iosrv/hubfs and MULTI-PIPES? Is anyone here good enough at translating patentese to code to tell what

[9fans] ISO C and typestr

2013-03-15 Thread Joel C. Salomon
Has anyone presented the 9c extension typestr to the C standardization committee (WG14)? Looking at the documents at http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg14/, I see that various vendors have let the committee know about their extensions, both to offer directions for future standardization and to

Re: [9fans] ISO C and typestr

2013-03-15 Thread Charles Forsyth
On 15 March 2013 16:52, Joel C. Salomon joelcsalo...@gmail.com wrote: BTW, the C11 standard includes a restricted form of 9c's anonymous sub-structs (with no pointer conversion). isn't the pointer conversion most of the point of them?

[9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread erik quanstrom
i'm sure i'm missing something obvious here, but exec has something like this up-seg[ESEG] = newseg(SG_STACK, TSTKTOP-USTKSIZE, TSTKTOP/BY2PG); (some versions may not have /BY2PG, but that's beside the point.) what happens if there is already a segment at TSTKTOP-USTKSIZE that has been

Re: [9fans] ISO C and typestr

2013-03-15 Thread Joel C. Salomon
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 1:01 PM, Charles Forsyth charles.fors...@gmail.com wrote: On 15 March 2013 16:52, Joel C. Salomon joelcsalo...@gmail.com wrote: BTW, the C11 standard includes a restricted form of 9c's anonymous sub-structs (with no pointer conversion). isn't the pointer conversion

[9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread mycroftiv
John Floren wrote: I probably didn't read the iosrv and hubfs stuff well enough, but multi-pipes are not like gnu screen--unless hubfs and/or iosrv can do barriers and reduces and I just missed that part? The connection to screen is really only in usage. Iosrv and Hubfs were the result of

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread John Floren
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 10:17 AM, mycrof...@sphericalharmony.com wrote: John Floren wrote: I probably didn't read the iosrv and hubfs stuff well enough, but multi-pipes are not like gnu screen--unless hubfs and/or iosrv can do barriers and reduces and I just missed that part? The connection

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread Bakul Shah
On Mar 15, 2013, at 6:21 AM, mycrof...@sphericalharmony.com wrote: Anyway, I thought the world deserved to have a non-patent encumbered version of Multi-pipes that could deliver very similar functionality, but not conflict with IBM's Patented Invention. So, I used /dev/timemachine to send

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread hiro
great, from mac os and virtual machines we're back to what really matters: bureaucracy

[9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread mycroftiv
John Floren wrote: Looking through my mail archives, I found a link from Eric that led me to http://graverobbers.blogspot.com/search/label/brasil which I think contains the seeds of multi-pipes. Note that these were all posted prior to your time-traveling expedition. I apologize for not

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread Kurt H Maier
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 10:29:09AM -0700, Bakul Shah wrote: If it is same or close enough, what matters is if your code can be shown as prior art. I don't see how. The US is first-to-file land, now. khm

[9fans] A personal apology to EricVh

2013-03-15 Thread mycroftiv
Hi Eric, I'm Ben. I'm sorry I triggered this controversy, it wasn't my intention to do anything other than ridicule what I thought was a bad software patent. I think you personally are probably a great person and someone I'd like to meet and be friends with. I love Plan 9 and I have a hard time

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread Bakul Shah
On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 13:46:54 EDT Kurt H Maier kh...@intma.in wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 10:29:09AM -0700, Bakul Shah wrote: If it is same or close enough, what matters is if your code can be shown as prior art. I don't see how. The US is first-to-file land, now. I believe prior

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread erik quanstrom
On Fri Mar 15 14:18:28 EDT 2013, ba...@bitblocks.com wrote: On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 13:46:54 EDT Kurt H Maier kh...@intma.in wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 10:29:09AM -0700, Bakul Shah wrote: If it is same or close enough, what matters is if your code can be shown as prior art. I

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread Matthew Veety
On Mar 15, 2013, at 13:46, Kurt H Maier kh...@intma.in wrote: On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 10:29:09AM -0700, Bakul Shah wrote: If it is same or close enough, what matters is if your code can be shown as prior art. I don't see how. The US is first-to-file land, now. khm I only thought

Re: [9fans] The PATENTED IBM MULTI-PIPE : the evolution of unix pipes

2013-03-15 Thread Kurt H Maier
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 03:20:56PM -0400, Matthew Veety wrote: I only thought that was starting in April? Actually, it starts tomorrow. http://www.uspto.gov/aia_implementation/aia-effective-dates.pdf

Re: [9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread cinap_lenrek
note here: havnt tested this with any code yet. writing a simple test program for this case would be a good next step. -- cinap

Re: [9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread erik quanstrom
On Fri Mar 15 16:42:15 EDT 2013, cinap_len...@gmx.de wrote: note here: havnt tested this with any code yet. writing a simple test program for this case would be a good next step. what i can't explain is why this doesn't fail on a 32-bit kernel. i've attached a test program and a proposed

Re: [9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread erik quanstrom
sorry. it also doesn't work on 386. after i force-map the page with a memset, i get the expected: minooka; 8.system2 vastart 0xdf7fe000 rc 725735: suicide: sys: trap: fault read addr=0x0 pc=0x3c2c

[9fans] what are people using for IRC these days

2013-03-15 Thread John Floren
So, while my IRC bouncer runs on my Plan 9 server, I've been connecting to it using Linux and Windows clients. Now that I've got my rpi set up with a nice monitor and everything, I'm looking at IRC on Plan 9 again. What clients are people using these days? I remember using something in Acme that

Re: [9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread cinap_lenrek
putting the TSTK above the user stack is what the alpha and ppc kernels do. but just looking for a hole in exec seems also good. also note that you dont need a whole USTKSIZE window. only TSTKSIZ (or spage) window is fine for the upper half of the temporary stack because thats what exec accesses.

Re: [9fans] what are people using for IRC these days

2013-03-15 Thread Jacob Todd
On Fri, Mar 15, 2013 at 6:12 PM, John Floren j...@jfloren.net wrote: So, while my IRC bouncer runs on my Plan 9 server, I've been connecting to it using Linux and Windows clients. Now that I've got my rpi set up with a nice monitor and everything, I'm looking at IRC on Plan 9 again. What

Re: [9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread erik quanstrom
On Fri Mar 15 18:50:20 EDT 2013, cinap_len...@gmx.de wrote: putting the TSTK above the user stack is what the alpha and ppc kernels do. but just looking for a hole in exec seems also good. also note that you dont need a whole USTKSIZE window. only TSTKSIZ (or spage) window is fine for the

Re: [9fans] exec() question

2013-03-15 Thread cinap_lenrek
it also works in practice. the only catch was that fault386 does: if(!user){ if(vmapsync(addr)) return; - if(addr = USTKTOP) panic(kernel fault: bad address pc=0x%.8lux addr=0x%.8lux, ureg-pc, addr);

Re: [9fans] what are people using for IRC these days

2013-03-15 Thread a
It sounds like you're describing irc7. There's also an irc7.2, which is some cosmetic changes, plus factotum authentication. I usually use the ircsrv from irc7.2 (which does the factotum bit, talks the irc protocol, creates a /tmp and /srv file, and sits in the background) and the irc from irc7

[9fans] A personal history of pipe multiplexing

2013-03-15 Thread mycroftiv
A short personal history of Plan 9 pipe muxing This post is purely personal, historical, technical, and makes zero comment on anything other than my own personal history of software development. In the summer of 2009, I'd been working with Plan 9 for slightly less than a year, and I was mostly