RE: [libreoffice-accessibility] Using Calc with NVDA screen reader
Hi Chris! I saw your similar email on the NVDA email list as well as the below on the LO accessibility email list. Michael is correct. Let me add to this with the following two things. JAWS has a setting to force the use of MSAA, and NVDA has a setting to force the use of UA (at least for MS Word). I am not sure how these settings interact with LO, but there may be something here. More generally, there is a pending fix in LO (scheduled for version 7.4) and NVDA (scheduled for version 2022.1, I think) to address multiple cell selection in Calc. A fix is required in both applications for this. your reported issue may have something to do with this. HTH, Richard -Original Message- From: Michael Weghorn Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 4:46 AM To: Christopher Mullins ; accessibility@global.libreoffice.org Subject: Re: [libreoffice-accessibility] Using Calc with NVDA screen reader Hi Chris, welcome to this list and thanks for sharing your experience from using LibreOffice with NVDA. My comments on the aspects you mention are inline below. On 10/01/2022 18.27, Christopher Mullins wrote: > In Excel, the cell in focus is always selected (highlighted) and if I use > Control+c to copy it's value to the clipboard, NVDA will announceCopied to > clipboard. If I do the same thing in Calc, NVDA will announceNo > Selectionhowever, the cell value will be copied to the clipboard. This is > also the case if I use Control+Shift+Space toSelect all, all cells are copied > to the clipboard but NVDA announcesNo Selectionwhen I press Control+c. On Windows, there are 2 different technologies that applications can use to implement accessibility: UIA (User Interface Automation) and MSAA (Microsoft Active Accessibility). Microsoft Office uses UIA, while LibreOffice uses MSAA. From what I can see, Excel triggers a UIA notification event after finishing the copy operation and NVDA speaks "Copy" as a consequence. I'm not aware of any equivalent in MSAA, so I think the reason why Excel announces something while LibreOffice does not is basically that the two applications are using different technologies to implement accessibility. At least from a technical perspective, that looks OK to me. > The most annoying issue is how NVDA voices numbers. I formatted a column as > Currency, 2 decimal places, currency symbol £ and leading minus signs on > negative numbers. NVDA does not voice the currency symbol at all, even with > symbol verbosity set toAlland trailing zeroes on the fractional side of the > decimal point are truncated. That's actually something that should be improved, and there is already a report for this in LibreOffice's issue tracking system, Bugzilla: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=115335 Best regards, Michael -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: accessibility+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/accessibility/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: accessibility+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/accessibility/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
Re: [libreoffice-accessibility] Using Calc with NVDA screen reader
Hi Chris, welcome to this list and thanks for sharing your experience from using LibreOffice with NVDA. My comments on the aspects you mention are inline below. On 10/01/2022 18.27, Christopher Mullins wrote: In Excel, the cell in focus is always selected (highlighted) and if I use Control+c to copy it's value to the clipboard, NVDA will announceCopied to clipboard. If I do the same thing in Calc, NVDA will announceNo Selectionhowever, the cell value will be copied to the clipboard. This is also the case if I use Control+Shift+Space toSelect all, all cells are copied to the clipboard but NVDA announcesNo Selectionwhen I press Control+c. On Windows, there are 2 different technologies that applications can use to implement accessibility: UIA (User Interface Automation) and MSAA (Microsoft Active Accessibility). Microsoft Office uses UIA, while LibreOffice uses MSAA. From what I can see, Excel triggers a UIA notification event after finishing the copy operation and NVDA speaks "Copy" as a consequence. I'm not aware of any equivalent in MSAA, so I think the reason why Excel announces something while LibreOffice does not is basically that the two applications are using different technologies to implement accessibility. At least from a technical perspective, that looks OK to me. The most annoying issue is how NVDA voices numbers. I formatted a column as Currency, 2 decimal places, currency symbol £ and leading minus signs on negative numbers. NVDA does not voice the currency symbol at all, even with symbol verbosity set toAlland trailing zeroes on the fractional side of the decimal point are truncated. That's actually something that should be improved, and there is already a report for this in LibreOffice's issue tracking system, Bugzilla: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=115335 Best regards, Michael -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: accessibility+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/accessibility/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
[libreoffice-accessibility] Using Calc with NVDA screen reader
Hi I'm new to the list, fairly new to the product, a blind user utilising the NVDA screen reader and this is my first post. As a former Excel user, I cannot help but draw comparisons between the two products in the way they interact with NVDA and for the fairly simplistic spreadsheet requirements I have, there is not much to choose between them. I do have a couple of issues which are annoying but not show-stoppers and they may arguably be down to my ignorance of the way Calc works or a problem with how NVDA and Calc interact, rather than accessibility issues but to me, the distinction is blurred. In Excel, the cell in focus is always selected (highlighted) and if I use Control+c to copy it's value to the clipboard, NVDA will announceCopied to clipboard. If I do the same thing in Calc, NVDA will announceNo Selectionhowever, the cell value will be copied to the clipboard. This is also the case if I use Control+Shift+Space toSelect all, all cells are copied to the clipboard but NVDA announcesNo Selectionwhen I press Control+c. The most annoying issue is how NVDA voices numbers. I formatted a column as Currency, 2 decimal places, currency symbol £ and leading minus signs on negative numbers. NVDA does not voice the currency symbol at all, even with symbol verbosity set toAlland trailing zeroes on the fractional side of the decimal point are truncated. My sighted wife tells me the currency symbols and trailing zeroes are present on screen and numbers in the column conform to the specified display format. Examples -£273.40 is voiced by NVDA as -273.4 and £40.00 is voiced as 40. The issue with trailing zeroes being truncated is also prevalent in numbers formatted with decimal places. I don't know what work has been done on the NVDA side to make Libra Office Calc accessible but for the 2 issues described above, NVDA and Calc do not seem to be talking to each other correctly. Cheers Chris Sent fromMailfor Windows -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: accessibility+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/accessibility/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
