Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Chuck McCown 
I used to have a pre flight checklist written by a guy that worked on film 
sets.  He was in charge of all things electrical.  That was more of a book than 
a check list.  Things like spare filters for generators and making sure you 
record the hours that bulbs have burned.  It had a lot of really good ideas on 
it so that you could prevent holding up the shooting of a movie by your lack of 
attention to detail.  I am sure there is a painful story behind every entry.  
Wish I could find it.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019 7:45 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

Film crews have best boys.  Or girls.  And gaffers and key grips.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_boy

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Robert
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 7:43 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

 

Somehow make it known that "best guys" get best treatment and you get to a best 
guy by being pro-chuck...

On 6/8/19 2:32 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

  It was nice this morning to see two of my best guys ask if they could come in 
today and finish this job.  

   

  From: Keefe John 

  Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:25 PM

  To: AFMUG 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

   

  Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict adverse. 
They'd much rather no show than say no to your face. 

   

  Keefe 

   

  On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza  wrote:

Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale improves 
.."? 

 

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM  wrote:

  We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to 
push through a project.  Mandatory OT.  

   

  Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I 
am offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to 
convince me they are on death’s door?

   

  Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry, 
hope you feel better soon.  

  Grumble

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Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Chuck McCown 
I understand gaffer, I used to wear gaffs and climb poles.  I presume in the 
early days of movies, lots of electrical work involved poles.  Grips, I guess 
people that hold things?  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019 7:45 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

Film crews have best boys.  Or girls.  And gaffers and key grips.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_boy

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Robert
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 7:43 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

 

Somehow make it known that "best guys" get best treatment and you get to a best 
guy by being pro-chuck...

On 6/8/19 2:32 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:

  It was nice this morning to see two of my best guys ask if they could come in 
today and finish this job.  

   

  From: Keefe John 

  Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:25 PM

  To: AFMUG 

  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

   

  Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict adverse. 
They'd much rather no show than say no to your face. 

   

  Keefe 

   

  On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza  wrote:

Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale improves 
.."? 

 

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM  wrote:

  We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to 
push through a project.  Mandatory OT.  

   

  Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I 
am offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to 
convince me they are on death’s door?

   

  Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry, 
hope you feel better soon.  

  Grumble

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Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Ken Hohhof 
Film crews have best boys.  Or girls.  And gaffers and key grips.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Best_boy

 

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Robert
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 7:43 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

 

Somehow make it known that "best guys" get best treatment and you get to a best 
guy by being pro-chuck...

On 6/8/19 2:32 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com   wrote:

It was nice this morning to see two of my best guys ask if they could come in 
today and finish this job.  

 

From: Keefe John 

Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:25 PM

To: AFMUG 

Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

 

Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict adverse. 
They'd much rather no show than say no to your face. 

 

Keefe 

 

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale improves 
.."? 

 

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to push 
through a project.  Mandatory OT.  

 

Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I am 
offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to 
convince me they are on death’s door?

 

Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry, hope 
you feel better soon.  

Grumble

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Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

2019-06-08 Thread Robert 
20 years ago, when I flamed out of the Web-o-sphere, I wish I had known 
you, I would have loved to work for you in my 40's Would probably 
have been more fun than starting this business up!


On 6/8/19 2:34 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
None have applied.  One close to 40 claimed to be a diesel mechanic 
etc etc.  He got here and he could not even diagnose trailer lights 
properly, nor could he back up a truck connected to a trailer.  Then 
he got into a fist fight with another employee and dropped a handhole 
on a guy in the ditch...  He had the look of a tweaker to me.

*From:* Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Saturday, June 8, 2019 3:29 PM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Article in paper today says 50 and even 40 year olds are having 
trouble finding jobs despite being qualified. The phone interview goes 
fine, but at the in person interview they see how old the candidate is 
and they want someone younger.


Maybe an opportunity to hire those over-the-hill 40-somethings.

*From:*AF  *On Behalf Of *dave
*Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2019 3:28 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

LOL!
I can see that with some of the yonger generation of military.
I questioned almost everything when I was a PV2/E2 it was in our dna
As I become wiser and more intuitive it became clear :)


On 6/6/19 3:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

You do sometimes have to teach them not to blindly follow orders. 
I worked at one company that hired several young military guys,
and we referred to them as the “hut hut hut” guys.  If the boss
told them to take that hill, they would take that hill no matter
what, rather than question if the boss was maybe a pointy haired
moron.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atks5rRqQkg

*From:*AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com *On Behalf Of *dave
*Sent:* Thursday, June 6, 2019 7:59 AM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Since I was a Full time and a Part time soldier I was brought up
with good values and the meaning of hard work even though I had
my spell of crazy young man days but I think my first Tour humbled
me a bit to understand Focus.
Now that i am older it seems my Focus on some days fails me and I
often wonder if there are younger more focused people to
sustain hard work when needed.

I strongly believe in the hard worker and the veterans returning
home looking to start a new.



On 6/5/19 12:00 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Or like me, I can fly a desk, but I’m afraid of heights and
that would be a problem if you hired me as an installer.

*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com *On Behalf Of
*Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Wednesday, June 5, 2019 9:01 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Indeed. For an installer, it seems to me that
construction-type experience is probably more valuable than
tech experience.

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 8:21 AM Jay Weekley
 wrote:

Was he in the dilemma of trying to get a tech job without
experience but
couldn't experience without a job?  I'm as interested in
someone that
knows a wood bit from a mortar bit as I am in someone that
can perform a
simple router setup.

Jerry Head wrote:
> Disagree.
> We hired an installer last year who just turned 18.
> He was one of three people (of 9 who answered the ad)
who showed up.
> We had a simple test of programming a XX-Link router.
> He failed.
> My network engineer said "Lets try him anyway".
> We did hire him and he has worked out really well.
> So there's that I guess.
>
>
> On 5/31/2019 9:34 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>> Anyone worth a crap is not out looking for a job these
days.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On May 30, 2019, at 10:51 PM, Forrest Christian (List
Account)
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> A couple of thoughts:
>>>
>>> Many of these type of people will be working on
something interesting
>>> in their own time.    Maybe some probing questions
about what they
>>> have done on their own.  Depending on what you're
looking for, things
>>> like 'have you ever played with an arduino?  Raspberry
Pi? etc?'
>>> might help.
>>>
>>> Have you thought about what would have attracted you
to a job listing?
>>> That might be a good starting point.
>>>
>>>

Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Robert 
Somehow make it known that "best guys" get best treatment and you get to 
a best guy by being pro-chuck...


On 6/8/19 2:32 PM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
It was nice this morning to see two of my best guys ask if they could 
come in today and finish this job.

*From:* Keefe John
*Sent:* Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:25 PM
*To:* AFMUG
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT
Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict 
adverse. They'd much rather no show than say no to your face.

Keefe
On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza 
 wrote:


Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale
improves .."?
On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM  wrote:

We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an
off day to push through a project.  Mandatory OT.
Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more
money, here I am offering them 10 hours of time and a half,
and they would rather try to convince me they are on death’s door?
Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK
fine, sorry, hope you feel better soon.
Grumble
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[AFMUG] OT CEU class today

2019-06-08 Thread chuck 
I have to get CEU credits to renew my contractor’s license every couple of 
years.  I found one Saturday class that got me all 6 hours in one sitting.  
However it was on the Residential International Building Code.  My contractors’ 
license is for excavation.  Triple checked that this class would work.  I took 
it expressly because I knew next to nothing about the subject.  Thought it 
would be less boring.  

Ok get in my seat and the first thing they gave was a quiz.  I knew nothing 
about any of the questions.  Things like which seismic zones are we in and in 
what is the wind speed used for structural calculations.  Things like that.  
How many inches minimum between a toilet bowl and a wall...

So it turned it in without marking anything.  Then checked out the syllabus.  
It spoke to a quiz that will be administered at the end of the course and that 
I needed at least 70%.  Gheeze wrong class, wrong class.  Then it spoke to 
the book, it was an open book class.  There is a 3 inch thick $150 book that 
contains the code.  Similar to the NEC book.  Don’t have the book.  But I am 
not the only one sweating, almost nobody had the book.

I asked a woman that was facilitating the sign ups about the fact that I don’t 
have a book and I know nothing about IRBC.  She said to just relax and take 
notes.  She was sure I would be fine.

Instructor starts in.  Really entertaining old timer that has been doing this 
for 50 years.  Then he pauses a moment and says:
“You will have a test at the end of the course today.  The first question on 
that test reads. . . “ he reads the question.  It was about seismic zones for 
this area.  Then he says: “The answer will be A, Seismic zone D”  And then 
proceeds with the lecture, periodically pausing to give us all 25 questions and 
answers.  

Then with 25 minutes left to go in the 6 hour mandatory block they hand out the 
exam.  Turns out 24 of the 25 questions all have A as the correct answer.  And 
answer #8 would have been A except for recent code change in the amount of 
natural light a bedroom must have (or perhaps it was ventilation) as a 
percentage of floor space.  It was 8% .  

Then when everyone was done in about 3 minutes, he asked us to self correct, 
grade and hand them in.  

It was fun, and I know now that if your top of foundation is more than 8 inches 
above the earth you do not have to have a pressure treated mud sill.  And that 
the head room above stairs must be 6’ 8” or more.  Ledger boards for decks must 
be bolted to the rim joist or foundation of the house and your attic vent must 
be one square foot for every 150 square feet of ceiling areas.  Good stuff!!

Next time I am gonna do a different subject.  Perhaps renew my electrical 
(specialty, solar) contractors license...-- 
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Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

2019-06-08 Thread Jay Weekley 

Yeah, dropping the handhole would have been the deal breaker.

ch...@wbmfg.com wrote:
None have applied.  One close to 40 claimed to be a diesel mechanic 
etc etc.  He got here and he could not even diagnose trailer lights 
properly, nor could he back up a truck connected to a trailer.  Then 
he got into a fist fight with another employee and dropped a handhole 
on a guy in the ditch...  He had the look of a tweaker to me.

*From:* Ken Hohhof
*Sent:* Saturday, June 8, 2019 3:29 PM
*To:* 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group'
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Article in paper today says 50 and even 40 year olds are having 
trouble finding jobs despite being qualified. The phone interview goes 
fine, but at the in person interview they see how old the candidate is 
and they want someone younger.


Maybe an opportunity to hire those over-the-hill 40-somethings.

*From:*AF  *On Behalf Of *dave
*Sent:* Friday, June 7, 2019 3:28 PM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

LOL!
I can see that with some of the yonger generation of military.
I questioned almost everything when I was a PV2/E2 it was in our dna
As I become wiser and more intuitive it became clear :)


On 6/6/19 3:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

You do sometimes have to teach them not to blindly follow orders. 
I worked at one company that hired several young military guys,

and we referred to them as the “hut hut hut” guys.  If the boss
told them to take that hill, they would take that hill no matter
what, rather than question if the boss was maybe a pointy haired
moron.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atks5rRqQkg

*From:*AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com *On Behalf Of *dave
*Sent:* Thursday, June 6, 2019 7:59 AM
*To:* af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Since I was a Full time and a Part time soldier I was brought up
with good values and the meaning of hard work even though I had
my spell of crazy young man days but I think my first Tour humbled
me a bit to understand Focus.
Now that i am older it seems my Focus on some days fails me and I
often wonder if there are younger more focused people to
sustain hard work when needed.

I strongly believe in the hard worker and the veterans returning
home looking to start a new.



On 6/5/19 12:00 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Or like me, I can fly a desk, but I’m afraid of heights and
that would be a problem if you hired me as an installer.

*From:* AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com *On Behalf Of
*Mathew Howard
*Sent:* Wednesday, June 5, 2019 9:01 AM
*To:* AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Indeed. For an installer, it seems to me that
construction-type experience is probably more valuable than
tech experience.

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 8:21 AM Jay Weekley
 wrote:

Was he in the dilemma of trying to get a tech job without
experience but
couldn't experience without a job?  I'm as interested in
someone that
knows a wood bit from a mortar bit as I am in someone that
can perform a
simple router setup.

Jerry Head wrote:
> Disagree.
> We hired an installer last year who just turned 18.
> He was one of three people (of 9 who answered the ad)
who showed up.
> We had a simple test of programming a XX-Link router.
> He failed.
> My network engineer said "Lets try him anyway".
> We did hire him and he has worked out really well.
> So there's that I guess.
>
>
> On 5/31/2019 9:34 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>> Anyone worth a crap is not out looking for a job these
days.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On May 30, 2019, at 10:51 PM, Forrest Christian (List
Account)
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> A couple of thoughts:
>>>
>>> Many of these type of people will be working on
something interesting
>>> in their own time.Maybe some probing questions
about what they
>>> have done on their own.  Depending on what you're
looking for, things
>>> like 'have you ever played with an arduino?  Raspberry
Pi? etc?'
>>> might help.
>>>
>>> Have you thought about what would have attracted you
to a job listing?
>>> That might be a good starting point.
>>>
>>>
>>>
 On Thu, May 30, 2019 at 6:28 AM Adam Moffett

 wrote:

 When I was

Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread chuck 
God bless capitalism.  

From: Jason Wilson 
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 3:37 PM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

How long till US Mail figures out it’s cheaper to sent their mail over Amazon’s 
transport?

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019 at 2:33 PM  wrote:

  Fedex has been in the transport only business.

  Amazon has been in the content only business.

  This is like Netflix building their own fiber network for their own content 
  and only their own content and not allowing it to be delivered over you or 
  Comcast or ...

  -Original Message- 
  From: fiber...@mail.com
  Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:00 PM
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery 
  neutrality?!?

  That's nice and all, but what's that got anything to do with net neutrality?


  Jared



  Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
  From: "Tim Withrow via AF" 
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Cc: "Tim Withrow" 
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery 
  neutrality?!?

  Free market economy. All the shippers are discovering Amazon is going to 
  beat them at their own game. I think it's too late in the game now for the 
  shippers to pull away and still have a positive outcome on their balance 
  sheet.


  
  On Saturday, June 8, 2019 fiberrun  wrote:

  I don't get it; what am I supposed to be upset about?

  I see no connection to net neutrality or even first mile access.


  Jared



  Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
  From: "Sean Heskett" mailto:af...@zirkel.us]>
  To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
  mailto:af@af.afmug.com]>, Members 
  mailto:memb...@wispa.org]>
  Subject: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

  So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the 
  neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??

  Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)


  
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html[https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html]
  -Sean
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http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com[http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com[http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com]]

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Jason Wilson
Remotely Located
Providing High Speed Internet to out of the way places.
530-651-1736
530-748-9608 Cell
www.remotelylocated.com



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Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread Jason Wilson 
How long till US Mail figures out it’s cheaper to sent their mail over
Amazon’s transport?

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019 at 2:33 PM  wrote:

> Fedex has been in the transport only business.
>
> Amazon has been in the content only business.
>
> This is like Netflix building their own fiber network for their own
> content
> and only their own content and not allowing it to be delivered over you or
> Comcast or ...
>
> -Original Message-
> From: fiber...@mail.com
> Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:00 PM
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery
> neutrality?!?
>
> That's nice and all, but what's that got anything to do with net
> neutrality?
>
>
> Jared
>
>
>
> Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
> From: "Tim Withrow via AF" 
> To: af@af.afmug.com
> Cc: "Tim Withrow" 
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery
> neutrality?!?
>
> Free market economy. All the shippers are discovering Amazon is going to
> beat them at their own game. I think it's too late in the game now for the
> shippers to pull away and still have a positive outcome on their balance
> sheet.
>
>
> 
> On Saturday, June 8, 2019 fiberrun  wrote:
>
> I don't get it; what am I supposed to be upset about?
>
> I see no connection to net neutrality or even first mile access.
>
>
> Jared
>
>
>
> Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
> From: "Sean Heskett" mailto:af...@zirkel.us]>
> To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group"
> mailto:af@af.afmug.com]>, Members
> mailto:memb...@wispa.org]>
> Subject: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?
>
> So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the
> neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??
>
> Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)
>
>
>
> https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html[https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html]
> -Sean
> 
> -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com[mailto:AF@af.afmug.com]
>
> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com[http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com[http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com]]
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Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

2019-06-08 Thread chuck 
None have applied.  One close to 40 claimed to be a diesel mechanic etc etc.  
He got here and he could not even diagnose trailer lights properly, nor could 
he back up a truck connected to a trailer.  Then he got into a fist fight with 
another employee and dropped a handhole on a guy in the ditch...  He had the 
look of a tweaker to me.  

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 3:29 PM
To: 'AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group' 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

Article in paper today says 50 and even 40 year olds are having trouble finding 
jobs despite being qualified.  The phone interview goes fine, but at the in 
person interview they see how old the candidate is and they want someone 
younger.

 

Maybe an opportunity to hire those over-the-hill 40-somethings.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of dave
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 3:28 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

 

LOL!
I can see that with some of the yonger generation of military.
I questioned almost everything when I was a PV2/E2 it was in our dna
As I become wiser and more intuitive it became clear :)




On 6/6/19 3:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

  You do sometimes have to teach them not to blindly follow orders.  I worked 
at one company that hired several young military guys, and we referred to  them 
as the “hut hut hut” guys.  If the boss told them to take that hill, they would 
take that hill no matter what, rather than question if the boss was maybe a 
pointy haired moron.

   

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atks5rRqQkg

   

   

  From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of dave
  Sent: Thursday, June 6, 2019 7:59 AM
  To: af@af.afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

   

  Since I was a Full time and a Part time soldier I was brought up with good 
values and the meaning of hard work even  though I had 
  my spell of crazy young man days but I think my first Tour humbled me a bit 
to understand Focus. 
  Now that i am older it seems my Focus on some days fails me and I often 
wonder if there are younger more focused people to 
  sustain hard work when needed. 

  I strongly believe in the hard worker and the veterans returning home looking 
to start a new.







  On 6/5/19 12:00 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Or like me, I can fly a desk, but I’m afraid of heights and that would be a 
problem if you hired me as an installer.

 

From: AF mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com On Behalf Of Mathew Howard
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 9:01 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group mailto:af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

 

Indeed. For an installer, it seems to me that construction-type experience 
is probably more valuable than tech experience.

 

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 8:21 AM Jay Weekley  
wrote:

  Was he in the dilemma of trying to get a tech job without experience but 
  couldn't experience without a job?  I'm as interested in someone that 
  knows a wood bit from a mortar bit as I am in someone that can perform a 
  simple router setup.

  Jerry Head wrote:
  > Disagree.
  > We hired an installer last year who just turned 18.
  > He was one of three people (of 9 who answered the ad) who showed up.
  > We had a simple test of programming a XX-Link router.
  > He failed.
  > My network engineer said "Lets try him anyway".
  > We did hire him and he has worked out really well.
  > So there's that I guess.
  >
  >
  > On 5/31/2019 9:34 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
  >> Anyone worth a crap is not out looking for a job these days.
  >>
  >> Sent from my iPhone
  >>
  >>> On May 30, 2019, at 10:51 PM, Forrest Christian (List Account) 
  >>>  wrote:
  >>>
  >>> A couple of thoughts:
  >>>
  >>> Many of these type of people will be working on something interesting
  >>> in their own time.Maybe some probing questions about what they
  >>> have done on their own.  Depending on what you're looking for, things
  >>> like 'have you ever played with an arduino?  Raspberry Pi? etc?'
  >>> might help.
  >>>
  >>> Have you thought about what would have attracted you to a job listing?
  >>> That might be a good starting point.
  >>>
  >>>
  >>>
   On Thu, May 30, 2019 at 6:28 AM Adam Moffett  
   wrote:
  
   When I was young I went exploring.  I'd ask my mom if I could go for 
a
   bike ride.  I never really specified where, and just kept ranging
   farther and farther from home.  I'd end up in creeks, culvert pipes,
   climbing fences, walking through woods, construction sites, quarries,
   and basically anywhere else I didn't get kicked out of.  I got 
   there on
   my bike so in terms of parental permission I put it all under the
   category of "going for a bike ride".  I only got arrested once, but I

Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread chuck 
It was nice this morning to see two of my best guys ask if they could come in 
today and finish this job.  

From: Keefe John 
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:25 PM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict adverse. 
They'd much rather no show than say no to your face. 

Keefe 

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza  wrote:

  Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale improves 
.."? 

  On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM  wrote:

We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to 
push through a project.  Mandatory OT.  

Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I am 
offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to 
convince me they are on death’s door?

Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry, 
hope you feel better soon.  
Grumble
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Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread chuck 

Fedex has been in the transport only business.

Amazon has been in the content only business.

This is like Netflix building their own fiber network for their own content 
and only their own content and not allowing it to be delivered over you or 
Comcast or ...


-Original Message- 
From: fiber...@mail.com

Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 2:00 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery 
neutrality?!?


That's nice and all, but what's that got anything to do with net neutrality?


Jared



Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
From: "Tim Withrow via AF" 
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: "Tim Withrow" 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery 
neutrality?!?


Free market economy. All the shippers are discovering Amazon is going to 
beat them at their own game. I think it's too late in the game now for the 
shippers to pull away and still have a positive outcome on their balance 
sheet.




On Saturday, June 8, 2019 fiberrun  wrote:

I don't get it; what am I supposed to be upset about?

I see no connection to net neutrality or even first mile access.


Jared



Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
From: "Sean Heskett" mailto:af...@zirkel.us]>
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
mailto:af@af.afmug.com]>, Members 
mailto:memb...@wispa.org]>

Subject: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the 
neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??


Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)


https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html[https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html]
-Sean
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Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

2019-06-08 Thread Ken Hohhof 
Article in paper today says 50 and even 40 year olds are having trouble finding 
jobs despite being qualified.  The phone interview goes fine, but at the in 
person interview they see how old the candidate is and they want someone 
younger.

 

Maybe an opportunity to hire those over-the-hill 40-somethings.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of dave
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 3:28 PM
To: af@af.afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

 

LOL!
 I can see that with some of the yonger generation of military.
 I questioned almost everything when I was a PV2/E2 it was in our dna
As I become wiser and more intuitive it became clear :)




On 6/6/19 3:03 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

You do sometimes have to teach them not to blindly follow orders.  I worked at 
one company that hired several young military guys, and we referred to  them as 
the “hut hut hut” guys.  If the boss told them to take that hill, they would 
take that hill no matter what, rather than question if the boss was maybe a 
pointy haired moron.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Atks5rRqQkg

 

 

From: AF    On Behalf 
Of dave
Sent: Thursday, June 6, 2019 7:59 AM
To: af@af.afmug.com  
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

 

Since I was a Full time and a Part time soldier I was brought up with good 
values and the meaning of hard work even  though I had 
my spell of crazy young man days but I think my first Tour humbled me a bit to 
understand Focus. 
Now that i am older it seems my Focus on some days fails me and I often wonder 
if there are younger more focused people to 
sustain hard work when needed. 

I strongly believe in the hard worker and the veterans returning home looking 
to start a new.







On 6/5/19 12:00 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

Or like me, I can fly a desk, but I’m afraid of heights and that would be a 
problem if you hired me as an installer.

 

From: AF    On Behalf 
Of Mathew Howard
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 9:01 AM
To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group   
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Assessing life skills

 

Indeed. For an installer, it seems to me that construction-type experience is 
probably more valuable than tech experience.

 

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019 at 8:21 AM Jay Weekley mailto:par...@cyberbroadband.net> > wrote:

Was he in the dilemma of trying to get a tech job without experience but 
couldn't experience without a job?  I'm as interested in someone that 
knows a wood bit from a mortar bit as I am in someone that can perform a 
simple router setup.

Jerry Head wrote:
> Disagree.
> We hired an installer last year who just turned 18.
> He was one of three people (of 9 who answered the ad) who showed up.
> We had a simple test of programming a XX-Link router.
> He failed.
> My network engineer said "Lets try him anyway".
> We did hire him and he has worked out really well.
> So there's that I guess.
>
>
> On 5/31/2019 9:34 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>> Anyone worth a crap is not out looking for a job these days.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On May 30, 2019, at 10:51 PM, Forrest Christian (List Account) 
>>> mailto:li...@packetflux.com> > wrote:
>>>
>>> A couple of thoughts:
>>>
>>> Many of these type of people will be working on something interesting
>>> in their own time.Maybe some probing questions about what they
>>> have done on their own.  Depending on what you're looking for, things
>>> like 'have you ever played with an arduino?  Raspberry Pi? etc?'
>>> might help.
>>>
>>> Have you thought about what would have attracted you to a job listing?
>>> That might be a good starting point.
>>>
>>>
>>>
 On Thu, May 30, 2019 at 6:28 AM Adam Moffett >>>  > 
 wrote:

 When I was young I went exploring.  I'd ask my mom if I could go for a
 bike ride.  I never really specified where, and just kept ranging
 farther and farther from home.  I'd end up in creeks, culvert pipes,
 climbing fences, walking through woods, construction sites, quarries,
 and basically anywhere else I didn't get kicked out of.  I got 
 there on
 my bike so in terms of parental permission I put it all under the
 category of "going for a bike ride".  I only got arrested once, but I
 probably deserved it a few more times.

 I also took things apart and used bits of wire and a battery to play
 with the components.  At an early job they were impressed that I
 correctly used the word "potentiometer" in a sentence.  I also 
 plugged a
 DC motor into a 120V AC outle --a valuable lesson there. I also 
 melted a
 NiCad battery on the carpet when I left it on the charger too long.

 My hobbies included model trains and my RC car.  I could tell you the
 difference between a parallel and series circuit when I was 10. I 
 tagged
 along with my brother when he went out shooting with his Ruger 
 10/22.  I
 slept out in

Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Ken Hohhof 
And they have long hair and listen to rock and roll music.  Oh wait, that’s 
what my parents said about my generation.

 

From: AF  On Behalf Of Keefe John
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 3:25 PM
To: AFMUG 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

 

Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict adverse. 
They'd much rather no show than say no to your face.

 

Keefe 

 

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza mailto:losguyswirel...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale improves 
.."? 

 

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com> > wrote:

We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to push 
through a project.  Mandatory OT.  

 

Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I am 
offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to 
convince me they are on death’s door?

 

Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry, hope 
you feel better soon.  

Grumble

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Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Keefe John 
Unfortunately kids these day have no work ethic and are conflict adverse.
They'd much rather no show than say no to your face.

Keefe

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 12:47 PM Jaime Solorza 
wrote:

> Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale
> improves .."?
>
> On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM  wrote:
>
>> We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to
>> push through a project.  Mandatory OT.
>>
>> Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I
>> am offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to
>> convince me they are on death’s door?
>>
>> Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry,
>> hope you feel better soon.
>> Grumble
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Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread fiberrun 
That's nice and all, but what's that got anything to do with net neutrality?


Jared
 
 

Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019 
From: "Tim Withrow via AF" 
To: af@af.afmug.com
Cc: "Tim Withrow" 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

Free market economy. All the shippers are discovering Amazon is going to beat 
them at their own game. I think it's too late in the game now for the shippers 
to pull away and still have a positive outcome on their balance sheet.
 
 

On Saturday, June 8, 2019 fiberrun  wrote:
 
I don't get it; what am I supposed to be upset about?

I see no connection to net neutrality or even first mile access.


Jared
 
 

Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
From: "Sean Heskett" mailto:af...@zirkel.us]>
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" 
mailto:af@af.afmug.com]>, Members 
mailto:memb...@wispa.org]>
Subject: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the 
neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??
 
Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)
 

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html[https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html]
-Sean
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Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread Tim Withrow via AF 

Free market economy. All the shippers are discovering Amazon is going to beat 
them at their own game. I think it's too late in the game now for the shippers 
to pull away and still have a positive outcome on their balance sheet.
On Saturday, June 8, 2019 fiberrun  wrote:
I don't get it; what am I supposed to be upset about?

I see no connection to net neutrality or even first mile access.


Jared
 
 

Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
From: "Sean Heskett" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" , Members 

Subject: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the 
neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??
 
Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)
 

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html
-Sean
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Re: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread fiberrun 
I don't get it; what am I supposed to be upset about?

I see no connection to net neutrality or even first mile access.


Jared
 
 

Sent: Saturday, June 08, 2019
From: "Sean Heskett" 
To: "AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group" , Members 

Subject: [AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the 
neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??
 
Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)
 

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html
-Sean
 -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com 
http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com[http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com]

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[AFMUG] Where is the outrage over package delivery neutrality?!?

2019-06-08 Thread Sean Heskett 
So if FedEx was and ISP and Amazon was an “edge provider” wouldn’t all the
neutrality freaks be up in arms with pitchforks over this??

Oh wait probably not since this is just free market capitalism ;-)

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/06/07/tech/fedex-amazon/index.html

-Sean
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Re: [AFMUG] Mandatory OT

2019-06-08 Thread Jaime Solorza 
Didn't you have that poster, " beatings will continue until morale improves
.."?

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019, 9:19 AM  wrote:

> We had a situation where we needed everyone to show up on an off day to
> push through a project.  Mandatory OT.
>
> Half the crew called in sick.  These young folks want more money, here I
> am offering them 10 hours of time and a half, and they would rather try to
> convince me they are on death’s door?
>
> Not sure where to draw the line.  If they are truly sick, OK fine, sorry,
> hope you feel better soon.
> Grumble
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