[agi] Out of Office AutoReply: Mail System Error - Returned Mail

2006-11-08 Thread Susan M. Prater
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Re: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread John Scanlon
Fully decoding the human genome is almost impossible. Not only is there the problem of protein folding, which I think even supercomputers can't fully solve, but the purpose for the structure of each protein depends on interaction with the incredibly complex molecular structures inside cells. A

Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Matt Mahoney
James,Many of the solutions you describe can use information gathered from statistical models, which are opaque.  I need to elaborate on this, because I think opaque models will be fundamental to solving AGI.  We need to build models in a way that doesn't require access to the internals.  This requ

Re: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Eliezer S. Yudkowsky
Eric Baum wrote: Eliezer> Eric Baum wrote: (Why should producing a human-level AI be cheaper than decoding the genome?) Eliezer> Because the genome is encrypted even worse than natural Eliezer> language. (a) By decoding the genome, I meant merely finding the sequence (should have been clear

Re: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Matt Mahoney
I think that natural language and the human genome have about the same order of magnitude complexity. The genome is 6 x 10^9 bits (2 bits per base pair) uncompressed, but there is a lot of noncoding DNA and some redundancy. By "decoding", I assume you mean building a model and understanding th

Re: Re: RE: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Matt Mahoney
Ben Goertzel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >I am afraid that it may not be possible to find an initial project that is both > >* small >* clearly a meaningfully large step along the path to AGI >* of significant practical benefit I'm afraid you're right. It is especially difficult because there is a

Re: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Eric Baum
Eliezer> Eric Baum wrote: >> (Why should producing a human-level AI be cheaper than decoding the >> genome?) Eliezer> Because the genome is encrypted even worse than natural Eliezer> language. (a) By decoding the genome, I meant merely finding the sequence (should have been clear in context), wh

Re: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Eliezer S. Yudkowsky
Eric Baum wrote: (Why should producing a human-level AI be cheaper than decoding the genome?) Because the genome is encrypted even worse than natural language. -- Eliezer S. Yudkowsky http://singinst.org/ Research Fellow, Singularity Institute for Artificial Intelligen

[agi] An AGI baby

2006-11-08 Thread Bob Mottram
I don't know if the Novamente baby is going to be anything like a human baby.  If it is, this article might be of interest.  Design methodologies for central pattern generators: an application to crawling humanoids   http://birg2.epfl.ch/publications/fulltext/righetti06d.pdfAlso for some more cogni

Re: Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Ben Goertzel
Richard wrote: What Rabinovich et al appear to do is to buy some mathematical tractability by applying their idea to a trivially simple neural model. That means they know a lot of detail about a model that, if used for anything realistic (like building an intelligence) would *then* beg so many

Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Richard Loosemore
Back in 1987, during my M.Sc., I invented the term 'dynamic relaxation' to describe a quasi-neural system whose dynamics were governed by multiple relaxation targets that are changing all the time. So the idea of having a multi-lobe attractor, or structured, time-varying attractors, is not by

Re: Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Ben Goertzel
About > http://www.physorg.com/news82190531.html > > "Rabinovich and his colleague at the Institute for Nonlinear Science at the > University of California, San Diego, Ramon Huerta, along with Valentin > Afraimovich at the Institute for the Investigation of Optical Communication > at the Univers

RE: RE: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Jef Allbright
Eric Baum wrote: > As I and Jef and you appear to agree, extant Intelligence > works because it exploits structure *of our world*; there is > and can be (unless P=NP or some such radical and unlikely > possibility) no such thing as as "General" Intelligence that > works in all worlds. I'm go

Re: Re: RE: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Ben Goertzel
Eric wrote: The challenge is to find a methodology for producing fast enough and frugal enough code, where that methodology is practicable. For example, as a rough upper bound, it would be practicable if it required 10,000 programmer years and 1,000,000 PC-years (i.e a $3Bn budget). (Why should

Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Richard Loosemore
Kevin wrote: http://www.physorg.com/news82190531.html "Rabinovich and his colleague at the Institute for Nonlinear Science at the University of California, San Diego, Ramon Huerta, along with Valentin Afraimovich at the Institute for the Investigation of Optical Communication at the Universit

Re: RE: [agi] Natural versus formal AI interface languages

2006-11-08 Thread Eric Baum
Ben> Jef wrote: >> As I see it, the present key challenge of artificial intelligence >> is to develop a fast and frugal method of finding fast and frugal >> methods, Ben> However, this in itself is not possible. There can be a fast Ben> method of finding fast and frugal methods, or a frugal meth

Re[3]: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Mark Waser
So, how to get all this probabilistic commonsense knowledge (which in humans is mostly unconscious) into the AGI system? a-- embodied learning b-- exhaustive education through NLP dialogue in very simple English c-- exhaustive education through dialogue in some artificial language like Lojban++ d-

Re: Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread James Ratcliff
My plan has both A with B and D examplesand Ben: So, I feel much of the present discussion on NLP interpretation isbypassing the hard problem, which is enabling an AGI system to learnthe millions or billions of commonsense (probabilistic) rules relatingto basic relationships like with_tool, which h

RE: Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Kevin
http://www.physorg.com/news82190531.html "Rabinovich and his colleague at the Institute for Nonlinear Science at the University of California, San Diego, Ramon Huerta, along with Valentin Afraimovich at the Institute for the Investigation of Optical Communication at the University of San Luis P

Re: Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread Ben Goertzel
Hi, About But a simple example is ate a pepperoni pizza ate a tuna pizza ate a VEGAN SUPREME pizza ate a Mexican pizza ate a pineapple pizza I feel this discussion of sentence parsing and interpretation is taking a somewhat misleading direction, by focusing on examples that are in fact very e

Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread James Ratcliff
Matt: To parse English you have to know that pizzas have pepperoni, that demonstrators advocate violence, that cats chase mice, and so on.  There is no neat, tidy algorithm that will generate all of this knowledge.  You can't do any better than to just write down all of these facts.  The data is no

Re: [agi] The crux of the problem

2006-11-08 Thread James Ratcliff
Yes. All of the above.We have already heard the statement from all around I believe, and seen the results that show that one single algorithm is just not goign to work, and its unreasonable to think it would. So then its really down to breaking up the parts, defining them precisely, and determining

Re: [agi] The concept of a KBMS

2006-11-08 Thread YKY (Yan King Yin)
On 11/7/06, James Ratcliff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Yan,>   Do you have a version of the "book" layout that is all on one page, or PDF or anything? >   I would like ot print the whole thing off and look over it in more detail.> Also lots of broken links, run a link checker, the GO link on the