Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-26 Thread Bill Unruh
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007, Sergei Steshenko wrote: On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:19:24 +0100 Benoit Rouits [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Le dimanche 25 novembre 2007 à 18:26 +0300, Vladimir Mosgalin a écrit : That's the main reason why I asked - I heard that people can hear 22khz or about that when they are

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-26 Thread Sergei Steshenko
On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 10:52:17 -0800 (PST) Bill Unruh [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 26 Nov 2007, Sergei Steshenko wrote: On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:19:24 +0100 Benoit Rouits [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Le dimanche 25 novembre 2007 à 18:26 +0300, Vladimir Mosgalin a écrit : That's the main

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-25 Thread Vladimir Mosgalin
Hi Bill Unruh! On 2007.11.24 at 10:11:16 -0800, Bill Unruh wrote next: Thank you for all your responses! That is quite normal It is in fact good hearing (although many kids can hear up to 22-25 kHz). And it will get worse, especially if you like That's the main reason why I asked - I heard

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-25 Thread Bill Unruh
On Sun, 25 Nov 2007, Vladimir Mosgalin wrote: Hi Bill Unruh! On 2007.11.24 at 10:11:16 -0800, Bill Unruh wrote next: Thank you for all your responses! That is quite normal It is in fact good hearing (although many kids can hear up to 22-25 kHz). And it will get worse, especially if you

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-24 Thread Vladimir Mosgalin
Hi Gene Heskett! On 2007.11.23 at 11:56:56 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote next: Anyway, in analog mode, are you sure there is no option to switch off bandwidth filter? No one in their right mind would want to do that as the aliasing would drive you up a wall. The other delay distortions the

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-24 Thread Sergei Steshenko
On Sat, 24 Nov 2007 13:49:30 +0300 Vladimir Mosgalin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PS a bit of OT: I'm 24, and I barely hear 18khz (in headphones), unless it's VERY loud - I can hear only up to 17500-17800 clearly at average volume level. Is there something wrong with my ears or it should be like

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-24 Thread Rene Herman
On 24-11-07 11:49, Vladimir Mosgalin wrote: PS a bit of OT: I'm 24, and I barely hear 18khz (in headphones), unless it's VERY loud - I can hear only up to 17500-17800 clearly at average volume level. Is there something wrong with my ears or it should be like this? You're perfectly fine.

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O?with?external clock sync ?

2007-11-24 Thread Gene Heskett
On Saturday 24 November 2007, Vladimir Mosgalin wrote: Hi Gene Heskett! On 2007.11.23 at 11:56:56 -0500, Gene Heskett wrote next: Anyway, in analog mode, are you sure there is no option to switch off bandwidth filter? No one in their right mind would want to do that as the aliasing would

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-23 Thread Clemens Ladisch
Paolo Saggese wrote: On Thursday 22 November 2007 15:25, you wrote: This is a valid wish, isn't it? And at least the M-Audio Audiphile cards can sync themselves to the S/PDIF In clock. They can, but the word clock is used only as a sample clock. It will not reduce the amount of jitter of

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-23 Thread Vladimir Mosgalin
Hi Darrell Bellerive! On 2007.11.22 at 17:54:19 -0800, Darrell Bellerive wrote next: I have never been happy with this card. While it works okay for playing basic sound, getting it to do anything more sophisticated is pure black magic. For example, I have never gotten full duplex to work.

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Clemens Ladisch
Paolo Saggese wrote: Of course I plan to use the PC only to provide a bitperfect (exact copy of the original media, normally CD) digital stream to an external DAC. As you probably know better than me, the one major known problem when you strive for the highest possible quality in digital

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Rene Herman
On 21-11-07 20:33, Paolo Saggese wrote: Thus, I would need a sound card which must be: * cabable of bitperfect (pass through) operation at CD standard 16bit/44.1KHz (as well as, possibly, also at higher resolutions and sample rates such as 16/48, 24/48, 24/96 and 24/192). 16/44.1 is basic

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Clemens Ladisch
Rene Herman wrote: On 22-11-07 11:10, Clemens Ladisch wrote: An SPDIF input _always_ derives its clock from its signal. Besides, the clock for the actual DAC has to be a multiple of the bit clock anyway, so there must be a PLL to derive the DAC's clock from the input signual, i.e., the

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Clemens Ladisch
Rene Herman wrote: On 21-11-07 20:33, Paolo Saggese wrote: Thus, I would need a sound card which must be: * cabable of bitperfect (pass through) operation at CD standard 16bit/44.1KHz (as well as, possibly, also at higher resolutions and sample rates such as 16/48, 24/48, 24/96 and

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Rene Herman
On 22-11-07 15:25, Clemens Ladisch wrote: Rene Herman wrote: On 21-11-07 20:33, Paolo Saggese wrote: Thus, I would need a sound card which must be: * cabable of bitperfect (pass through) operation at CD standard 16bit/44.1KHz (as well as, possibly, also at higher resolutions and sample

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Paolo Saggese
Hi everybody, first of all, I'd like to thank you all so much for the prompt and many replies I've got... Wow, they came in faster then I was able to read! :-) (there's still someone claiming that Linux has no support?! :-) On Wednesday 21 November 2007 22:19, Sergei Steshenko wrote:

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Rene Herman
On 22-11-07 20:49, Sergei Steshenko wrote: Just a random thought on jitter - if you like music recorded originally before the digital era - don't bother. I.e. analog tape recorder wow and flutter ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow_and_flutter ) is much higher than digital jitter.

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Sergei Steshenko
Just a random thought on jitter - if you like music recorded originally before the digital era - don't bother. I.e. analog tape recorder wow and flutter ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wow_and_flutter ) is much higher than digital jitter. And that wow and flutter is already in the now digital

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Paolo Saggese
On Thursday 22 November 2007 11:39, Rene Herman wrote: I suppose your external DAC has no actual WordClock (BNC connection) output? indeed, it does not. As it does not have an SPDIF output, either... but I'm a DIY guy (with an EE degree...) and can add whatever output I need or even build a

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Rene Herman
On 22-11-07 20:38, Paolo Saggese wrote: On Thursday 22 November 2007 11:39, Rene Herman wrote: I suppose your external DAC has no actual WordClock (BNC connection) output? indeed, it does not. As it does not have an SPDIF output, either... but I'm a DIY guy (with an EE degree...) and

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Vladimir Mosgalin
Hi Sergei Steshenko! On 2007.11.21 at 23:24:35 +0200, Sergei Steshenko wrote next: Regarding soundcard and syncrhonization - M-Audio Revolution 7.1, and quite possibly M-Audio Revolution allow you to use external clock source. I meant M-Audio Revolution 7.1, and quite possibly

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Rene Herman
On 22-11-07 19:44, Paolo Saggese wrote: [OT on] In fact, unfortunately cdparanoia is not (or perhaps no longer) good enough to do perfect DAE. Over the course of ripping 735 CDs now to my harddrive with cdparanoia, I have found that all's well as long as cdparanoia leaves nothing but spaces

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Paolo Saggese
On Wednesday 21 November 2007 23:49, Bill Unruh wrote: The clock jitter tends to be in the ppm range. This means that the frequency jitter is very low (if I believe the ppm then at the level of -120dB) which is completely inaudible. My cheap Transit card reliably gives me noise

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Sergei Steshenko
On Thu, 22 Nov 2007 22:00:29 +0100 Paolo Saggese [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: [snip] If the digital audio folks have had a lesser simplistic approach in the first place, we would not have had to wait some 20 years before gettin' a barely acceptabe sound out of a CD... [snip] In a sense, one

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-22 Thread Rene Herman
On 22-11-07 22:00, Paolo Saggese wrote: (what's worse is that, nevertheless, even now a good analogue system can still sound MUCH better than any CD: it actually takes a good SACD or DVD-A system to come close to the good old LP when it comes to the real perceived audio quality!) If we're

[Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-21 Thread Paolo Saggese
Hi everybody, I have a question for you guys. (I'm new to this list and hope this is the right place to ask and not an FAQ... I've tried to search to see if this question had been answered previously, but I have been not able to find what I was looking for). I'm thinking about using a

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-21 Thread Sergei Steshenko
On Wed, 21 Nov 2007 20:33:39 +0100 Paolo Saggese [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everybody, I have a question for you guys. (I'm new to this list and hope this is the right place to ask and not an FAQ... I've tried to search to see if this question had been answered previously, but I have

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-21 Thread Sergei Steshenko
On Wed, 21 Nov 2007 23:19:58 +0200 Sergei Steshenko [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Regarding soundcard and syncrhonization - M-Audio Revolution 7.1, and quite possibly M-Audio Revolution allow you to use external clock source. I meant M-Audio Revolution 7.1, and quite possibly M-Audio Revolution

Re: [Alsa-user] best card for bitperfect SPDIF I/O with external clock sync ?

2007-11-21 Thread Bill Unruh
On Wed, 21 Nov 2007, Sergei Steshenko wrote: On Wed, 21 Nov 2007 20:33:39 +0100 Paolo Saggese [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi everybody, I have a question for you guys. (I'm new to this list and hope this is the right place to ask and not an FAQ... I've tried to search to see if this