Julf wrote:
And even if you hit that very special +11 dB beast, all that happens is
that you clip one sample period. How much clipping was there in that
Iggy recording again? :)
Yup. And since we're upsampling, the duration of that sample period is
even briefer.
Archimago wrote:
I want to see a *real* piece of music (not some synthetic test tone)
that needs +5dB headroom (not to mention +11dB as in one of the other
threads). I'm thinking a 3dB headroom (1/2-bit) should be enough for
upsampling...
And even if you hit that very special +11 dB beast,
Hi guys, I wanted to quickly see how much headroom is needed for
probably the loudest clipped/compressed/limited track I have in my
collection to examine the effect in real music. From the Iggy The
Stooges album Raw Power.
Thanks, i pretty much think that is it. SoX for example does a gain drop
by 3dB when automaticaly guarding for clipping. Like Julf and others
already mentioned the DAC designer itself should already think about
such things when he has processing in mind.
Somehow Benchmark is now the first time i
Archimago,
As mentioned on PFM, try the track I Can Talk by Two Door Cinema Club
from the album Tourist History. DR4 with one inter-sample peak of +1.4b
and a very large number of peaks at about plus half a decibel.
Darren
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
darrenyeats wrote:
Archimago,
As mentioned on PFM, try the track I Can Talk by Two Door Cinema Club
from the album Tourist History. DR4 with one inter-sample peak of +1.4b
and a very large number of peaks at about plus half a decibel.
Darren
Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk HD
DR4
Mnyb wrote:
Would a more natural signal that just touches 0dB for one sample be
a problem to?
Yes.
Is this really limited to asrc ? could not any digital filter used have
this problem .
It is a problem in any situation where you have to interpolate between
two samples, so most DSP
Chaps,
Think about it, even the DAC2 does not accommodate arbitrarily large
peaks! The HA thread indicates some are up to 11db and a BM guy pops up
saying you can get more headroom by not maxing the volume.
That right there should tell us that we shouldn't assume a DAC just
deals with it.
I
darrenyeats wrote:
Chaps,
Think about it, even the DAC2 does not accommodate -arbitrarily large-
peaks. The HA thread indicates some are up to 11db and a BM guy pops up
saying you can get more than 3.5db headroom by not maxing the volume.
That right there tells us not to assume anything.
Julf wrote:
Wish I had time to draw the picture
Found a very good discussion on the topic: 'Gearsluz - Tips and
techniques: Intersample peaks'
(http://www.gearslutz.com/board/showwiki.php?title=Tips-and-Techniques:Intersample-peaks)
A relevant quote: Ceilings of .3 or .1 etc dBFS are
Not that i am interested in this to much but reading about this
headroom it must be something en vogue since the DAC2 arrived.
My brainfart makes only sense if you don´t already use your player with
digital volume control or you are afraid about normal digital volume
control.
My idea is to pad
Wombat wrote:
Not that i am interested in this to much but reading about this
headroom it must be something en vogue since the DAC2 arrived.
And why would the headroom be an issue?
Julf's Profile:
Julf wrote:
And why would the headroom be an issue?
For example
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=98753hl=benchmark
Look closely in the sig of the member John_Siau.
Most likely they created a problem we didn´t had before we knew it :) I
don´t worry about it to much but my
Wombat wrote:
For example
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=98753hl=benchmark
Look closely in the sig of the member John_Siau.
Most likely they created a problem we didn´t had before we knew it :) I
don´t worry about it to much but my idea here costs nothing and may
Julf wrote:
Intersample peaks are not a problem as long as you are in the digital
domain. They only become an issue if the analog stages after (or in)
your DAC have no headroom. It is very, very unusual for analog stages to
have no headroom - usually distortion just increases ever so
Wombat wrote:
May be or may not be.
Which part don't you agree with?
This thread is about creating headroom.
Sure. Is a discussion about the possible need for that headroom
inappropriate?
Julf's Profile:
Julf wrote:
Intersample peaks are not a problem as long as you are in the digital
domain. They only become an issue if the analog stages after (or in)
your DAC have no headroom. It is very, very unusual for analog stages to
have no headroom - usually distortion just increases ever so
Wow, it seems the HA guy managed to get a 11db intersample peak!
Darren
darrenyeats's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10799
View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=98706
darrenyeats wrote:
The problem is the oversampling that happens in the DAC. If you have say
a 44kHz input it gets converted to a higher rate internally (still
digital) and some of the new data points can be over 0db. Benchmark
refer to this as DSP headroom in their DAC2 marketing materials;
Julf wrote:
Yes, but any DSP operation can result in overflow, and that has to be
accounted for. I would call performing DSP operations without checking
for overflow a design error. Sounds a bit funny to promote lack of that
particular design error as a special feature.
That's what I was
Won't this only really be a problem with loudness war recordings that
sound so good anyway :)
Would a more natural signal that just touches 0dB for one sample be
a problem to ?
Is this really limited to asrc ? could not any digital filter used have
this problem .
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