Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-10-03 Thread Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev
On Sun, Oct 02, 2022 at 03:25:19PM +, Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev wrote: > I'm also perfectly happy with the status quo of the default signet > having block signers and gatekeepers for soft forks activated on the > default signet. I'm more concerned with those gatekeepers being under >

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-10-02 Thread Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev
Thanks for this AJ, especially the history on prior soft forks, the vast majority of which I was unclear on. > The point of doing it via signet and outside of core is there doesn't need to be any community consensus on soft forks. Unlike mainnet, signet sBTC isn't money, and it isn't

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-10-02 Thread Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev
On Fri, Sep 16, 2022 at 05:15:45PM +1000, Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev wrote: > So that's the concept. For practical purposes, I haven't yet merged > either CTV or APO support into the bitcoin-inquisition 23.0 branch yet I've now merged CTV and updated my signet miner to enforce both CTV and APO

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-10-01 Thread Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev
On Wed, Sep 28, 2022 at 11:48:32AM +, Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev wrote: > SegWit was added > to a new testnet (Segnet) for testing rather than the pre-existing testnet > and I think future soft fork proposals should follow a similar approach. I think past history falls into a few groups:

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-28 Thread alicexbt via bitcoin-dev
Hi Michael, > We then get into the situation where the block signers (currently AJ and > Kalle) are the gatekeepers on what soft fork proposals are added. Things that could solve the gatekeeping issue: 1) Adding more maintainers that are experienced enough to review consensus code. 2) Every

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-28 Thread Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev
I've given this some extra thought and discussed with others who may later chime in on this thread. I'm now convinced this should be done on a custom public signet rather than on the default signet. SegWit was added to a new testnet (Segnet) for testing rather than the pre-existing testnet and

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-19 Thread Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev
On Sun, Sep 18, 2022 at 02:47:38PM -0400, Antoine Riard via bitcoin-dev wrote: > Said succinctly, in the genesis of creative ideas, evaluation doesn't > happen at a single clear point but all along the idea lifetime, where this > evaluation is as much done by the original author than its peers and

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-18 Thread Antoine Riard via bitcoin-dev
Hi AJ, Thanks to setup a new laboratory for consensus upgrades experiment! Idea was exposed during the last LN Summit, glad to see there is a useful fork now. While I think one of the problem particular in the current stagnation about consensus upgrades has been well scoped by your proposal,

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-18 Thread Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev
Hi alicexbt > Good to see some positivity, finally. I had enthusiasm for this concept of enabling proposed soft fork functionality on signet 2 years ago [0]. Nothing has changed, still enthusiastic :) Not enthusiastic about the months wasted on unnecessary contentious soft fork drama since

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-18 Thread alicexbt via bitcoin-dev
Hi Michael, > I agree with Matt. The less said about the "Aw shucks Jeremy didn't know that > CTV didn't have community consensus at the time" [0] and "it was the lack of > process that was the problem" the better. The linked gist cannot be taken seriously and I am not sure why you keep

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-17 Thread Michael Folkson via bitcoin-dev
I agree with Matt. The less said about the "Aw shucks Jeremy didn't know that CTV didn't have community consensus at the time" [0] and "it was the lack of process that was the problem" the better. If people don't care about lack of community consensus there is no process in a permissionless,

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-17 Thread Matt Corallo via bitcoin-dev
On 9/17/22 2:14 AM, Anthony Towns wrote: On Fri, Sep 16, 2022 at 12:46:53PM -0400, Matt Corallo via bitcoin-dev wrote: On 9/16/22 3:15 AM, Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev wrote: As we've seen from the attempt at a CHECKTEMPLATEVERIFY activation earlier in the year [0], the question of "how to

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-17 Thread Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev
On Fri, Sep 16, 2022 at 12:46:53PM -0400, Matt Corallo via bitcoin-dev wrote: > On 9/16/22 3:15 AM, Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev wrote: > > As we've seen from the attempt at a CHECKTEMPLATEVERIFY activation earlier > > in the year [0], the question of "how to successfully get soft fork > > ideas

Re: [bitcoin-dev] bitcoin-inquistion: evaluating soft forks on signet

2022-09-16 Thread Matt Corallo via bitcoin-dev
Apologies for any typos, somewhat jet-lagged atm. On 9/16/22 3:15 AM, Anthony Towns via bitcoin-dev wrote: Subhead: "Nobody expects a Bitcoin Inquistion? C'mon man, *everyone* expects a Bitcoin Inquisition." As we've seen from the attempt at a CHECKTEMPLATEVERIFY activation earlier in the year