[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-11 Thread Tarn Alcock via cctalk
For cleaning and maintaining floppies give shadowtronblog on YouTube a watch. He lovingly restores various vintage equipment. There are a few vids of him restoring some floppies, cleaning heads, greasing mechanical bits etc. I think his TRS80 playlist had a fair bit of that in IIRC.

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-11 Thread Chris Zach via cctalk
The belts that I use for TU58's work but are a bit on the tight side. I'd say buy a set of those, and also a set that is is 1.5 times the size and twice as wide. It's not that big of a deal, technically it may cause a bit more stress to the sleeve bearings and cause them to wear out in 20

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-11 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 1/10/23 15:24, Mike Katz via cctalk wrote: > I haven't seen any mention of greaseweazel types of "flux" readers. > They read the flux changes off of the floppy and then interpret them > with a separate program. > Before the greaseweazel, and similar boards, there were the Catweasel >

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Sellam Abraham via cctalk
I had the same issue with one of those drives. I think I may have it but I need to source a belt to fix it. The black goop that used to be the belt got all over the mechanism. It was a pain to clean off completely. Sellam On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 10:11 PM Chris Zach via cctalk <

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
The "Tandy Portable Disk Drive" was a strange beast. At one time, some folk wrote software to run on PC to operate it. Otherwise, it's another flux transition project. OTOH, RS also had an external 5.25" box ("Disk/Video Interface"), which has a very simple MFM format, with the Microsoft

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Chris Zach via cctalk
Speaking of reading old floppies, I got my Model 100 and Tandy Portable Disk Drive down from the shelf to read some old floppies I found from the 1980's. 3.5 inch disks with a whopping 100k capacity each! Problem was drive was saying the disks were "not formatted". Took it apart, found that

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Mike Katz via cctalk
I haven't seen any mention of greaseweazel types of "flux" readers. They read the flux changes off of the floppy and then interpret them with a separate program. I use this to analyze DEC RX01 & RX02 8" floppies. I know it works with FM, MFM and GCR disks as well as single and double sided

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
On Tue, 10 Jan 2023, Fred Cisin wrote: So, a flux transition board might work, (for OSI disks) On Tue, 10 Jan 2023, Mike Katz wrote: I haven't seen any mention of greaseweazel types of "flux" readers. They read the flux changes off of the floppy and then interpret them with a separate

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Sellam Abraham via cctalk
Yes, the 2/2P models I [think I] had were blue. Sellam On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 2:21 PM Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: > >> A few years later, I got a used ["Euro"]-Apple II, converted for USA > >> use, in an OSI Challenger case (with wood (walnu?) sides), with an > >> external RCA keyboard. > >>

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
A few years later, I got a used ["Euro"]-Apple II, converted for USA use, in an OSI Challenger case (with wood (walnu?) sides), with an external RCA keyboard. If you didn't get it, then maybe Eric Smith? On Tue, 10 Jan 2023, Sellam Abraham via cctalk wrote: Was it this style (Challenger 4P)?

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Sellam Abraham via cctalk
Was it this style (Challenger 4P)? https://imgs.search.brave.com/p_LUazpNEKMRJwuHl-uqgVmE7lVt1-7AodxQMTSCvOY/rs:fit:400:326:1/g:ce/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cu/aXRoaXN0b3J5Lm9y/Zy9zaXRlcy9kZWZh/dWx0L2ZpbGVzL2hh/cmR3YXJlL09oaW9D/aGFsbDRQMy5KUEc I can't remember if I ever had a 4P but I did have I think two 2

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
A few years later, I got a used ["Euro"]-Apple II, converted for USA use, in an OSI Challenger case (with wood (walnu?) sides), with an external RCA keyboard. On Tue, 10 Jan 2023, Sellam Abraham via cctalk wrote: Did the motherboard have an additional RAM chip to accommodate the PAL-based

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Sellam Abraham via cctalk
On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 12:53 PM Fred Cisin via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > A few years later, I got a used ["Euro"]-Apple II, converted for USA use, > in an OSI Challenger case (with wood (walnu?) sides), with an external RCA > keyboard. > Did the motherboard have an additional RAM

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
On Tue, 10 Jan 2023, Van Snyder via cctalk wrote: In about 1975, I was sharing an office with a lady who bought an Ohio Scientific 6502 computer, with two 5.25 inch floppy disk drives, instead of an Imsai 8800 with one 8.4 inch drive. She got a tee shirt that said "I've got two floppies." Except

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Liam Proven via cctalk
On Mon, 9 Jan 2023 at 17:02, Doc Shipley via cctalk wrote: > >Short version is that the GUI Disk Utility hides too much of what > it's doing AND, more to the point, makes assumptions by default. Yes, > it's possible to override the default but after [holy crap!] 2 decades > of using it I

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread Van Snyder via cctalk
On Tue, 2023-01-10 at 06:16 +0100, nico de jong via cctalk wrote: > Speaking of old floppies In about 1975, I was sharing an office with a lady who bought an Ohio Scientific 6502 computer, with two 5.25 inch floppy disk drives, instead of an Imsai 8800 with one 8.4 inch drive. She got a tee

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-10 Thread nico de jong via cctalk
On 2023-01-10 08:12, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: On 1/9/23 22:31, Fred Cisin wrote: A little quick speculation, but not determinable without the system, . . . The Teac FD55F was a 96tpi "720K" drive at 300 RPM The Teac FD55G was a "1.2M" drive. 360RPM The FD55GF was both, and there were

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 1/9/23 22:31, Fred Cisin wrote: > > A little quick speculation, but not determinable without the system, . > . . > The Teac FD55F was a 96tpi "720K" drive at 300 RPM > The Teac FD55G was a "1.2M" drive. 360RPM > The FD55GF was both, and there were several variants, with different > jumpers,

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread nico de jong via cctalk
On 2023-01-10 07:31, Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: On 1/9/23 21:16, nico de jong via cctalk wrote: Hello Chuck Speaking of old floppies, when I was busy converting floppies (I've now been retired for 10 years) I frequently had problems reading some 5.25" disks, but only on specific drives.

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Fred Cisin via cctalk
On 1/9/23 21:16, nico de jong via cctalk wrote: Hello Chuck Speaking of old floppies, when I was busy converting floppies (I've now been retired for 10 years) I frequently had problems reading some 5.25" disks, but only on specific drives. Those disks came from IBM systems, probably S/3. I

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread nico de jong via cctalk
On 2023-01-10 07:14, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: On 1/9/23 21:16, nico de jong via cctalk wrote: Hello Chuck Speaking of old floppies, when I was busy converting floppies (I've now been retired for 10 years) I frequently had problems reading some 5.25" disks, but only on specific drives.

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 1/9/23 21:16, nico de jong via cctalk wrote: > Hello Chuck > > Speaking of old floppies, when I was busy converting floppies (I've > now been retired for 10 years) I frequently had problems reading some > 5.25" disks, but only on specific drives. Those disks came from IBM > systems, probably

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread nico de jong via cctalk
Hello Chuck Speaking of old floppies, when I was busy converting floppies (I've now been retired for 10 years) I frequently had problems reading some 5.25" disks, but only on specific drives. Those disks came from IBM systems, probably S/3. I cannot be sure that the solution holds, but it

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 1/9/23 11:56, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > At this point in time, this is advisable for almost any magnetic media > any of us would be working with. Though I’ll admit I have looked at a > couple of the disks before imaging them, I’m trying to remember to > image first, then read the image.

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Zane Healy via cctalk
> On Jan 8, 2023, at 5:36 PM, Chris via cctalk wrote: > > Disks give errors, duh. Whatever you use to image a disk, use it as a first > attempt, as that may be the ONLY chance to save the contents. People put a > disk in the drive, do a directory scan, screw around some more. And then the >

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Zane Healy via cctalk
On Jan 9, 2023, at 8:02 AM, Doc Shipley via cctalk wrote: > > On 1/8/23 23:21, Grant Taylor via cctalk wrote: >> On 1/8/23 8:41 PM, Doc Shipley via cctalk wrote: >>> I avoid Disk Utility like the plague. >> Doc, will you please elaborate on why you avoid the Disk Utility (.app)? > > Short

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Zane Healy via cctalk
On Jan 9, 2023, at 11:19 AM, Glen Slick via cctalk wrote: > https://www.usb.org/sites/default/files/usbmass-ufi10.pdf > > USB Mass Storage Class – UFI Command Specification Revision 1.0 > 4.10.2 Formattable Capacity Descriptors > The UFI device supports the following capacity descriptors. >

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Zane Healy via cctalk
> On Jan 8, 2023, at 7:41 PM, Doc Shipley via cctalk > wrote: > > On 1/8/23 19:29, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: >> When reading old floppies, how often is it advisable to clean the drive? I >> managed the first 3.5” floppies no problem, I’m using a USB Floppy Drive >> hooked up to my Mac

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Warner Losh via cctalk
On Mon, Jan 9, 2023 at 12:19 PM Glen Slick via cctalk wrote: > On Mon, Jan 9, 2023, 10:23 AM Warner Losh via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> > wrote: > > > On Sun, Jan 8, 2023, 6:29 PM Zane Healy via cctalk < > cctalk@classiccmp.org> > > wrote: > > > > Also, a normal USB Floppy drive can only

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Glen Slick via cctalk
On Mon, Jan 9, 2023, 10:23 AM Warner Losh via cctalk wrote: > On Sun, Jan 8, 2023, 6:29 PM Zane Healy via cctalk > wrote: > > Also, a normal USB Floppy drive can only handle 1.44MB formatted floppies. > 720k might work (but there is nothing in the standards to describe this) > and oddball

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 1/9/23 10:23, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote: > > Also, a normal USB Floppy drive can only handle 1.44MB formatted floppies. > 720k might work (but there is nothing in the standards to describe this) > and oddball formats are right out. > I've found that most 3.5" USB floppy drives also support

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Warner Losh via cctalk
On Sun, Jan 8, 2023, 6:29 PM Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > When reading old floppies, how often is it advisable to clean the drive? > I managed the first 3.5” floppies no problem, I’m using a USB Floppy Drive > hooked up to my Mac Laptop, I was able to image them using “Disk Utility”. > The

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Doc Shipley via cctalk
On 1/8/23 23:21, Grant Taylor via cctalk wrote: On 1/8/23 8:41 PM, Doc Shipley via cctalk wrote: I avoid Disk Utility like the plague. Doc, will you please elaborate on why you avoid the Disk Utility (.app)? Short version is that the GUI Disk Utility hides too much of what it's doing

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-09 Thread Paul Koning via cctalk
> On Jan 9, 2023, at 2:48 AM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk > wrote: > > On 1/8/23 22:28, Chris via cctalk wrote: >> If alcohol isn't a good idea, white vinegar or dilute ammonia could also >> work. Ammonia is the world's best peneyrant as far as I'm concerned. But to >> get into deep crevaces

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Chuck Guzis via cctalk
On 1/8/23 22:28, Chris via cctalk wrote: > If alcohol isn't a good idea, white vinegar or dilute ammonia could also > work. Ammonia is the world's best peneyrant as far as I'm concerned. But to > get into deep crevaces and crannies it needs time. Sometimes 24 - 48 hours. > It will remove

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Chris via cctalk
If alcohol isn't a good idea, white vinegar or dilute ammonia could also work. Ammonia is the world's best peneyrant as far as I'm concerned. But to get into deep crevaces and crannies it needs time. Sometimes 24 - 48 hours. It will remove somenpaint lickity split.

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Chris Zach via cctalk
When reading old floppies, how often is it advisable to clean the drive? I managed the first 3.5” floppies no problem, I’m using a USB Floppy Drive hooked up to my Mac Laptop, I was able to image them using “Disk Utility”. The next two floppies have had errors. Though I think I was able to

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Grant Taylor via cctalk
On 1/8/23 8:41 PM, Doc Shipley via cctalk wrote: I avoid Disk Utility like the plague. Doc, will you please elaborate on why you avoid the Disk Utility (.app)? -- Grant. . . . unix || die

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Sellam Abraham via cctalk
When I'm archiving disks and begin to get unrecoverable errors, I do a head cleaning and, if the errors go away, it was a dirty head; but if they don't, something's wrong with the disk. Sellam On Sun, Jan 8, 2023 at 5:29 PM Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > When reading old floppies, how often is

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Doc Shipley via cctalk
On 1/8/23 19:29, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: When reading old floppies, how often is it advisable to clean the drive? I managed the first 3.5” floppies no problem, I’m using a USB Floppy Drive hooked up to my Mac Laptop, I was able to image them using “Disk Utility”. The next two floppies

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Warner Losh via cctalk
For 5.25" RX50 floppies, I imaged 400 of them before I needed to clean the drive... and even then I'm not sure it needed it... Warner On Sun, Jan 8, 2023, 6:29 PM Zane Healy via cctalk wrote: > When reading old floppies, how often is it advisable to clean the drive? > I managed the first 3.5”

[cctalk] Re: Reading Old Floppies

2023-01-08 Thread Chris via cctalk
I think people use alcohol to clean the ceramic heads. Not complicated, but getting in there ... You could also think about vacuuming or blowing crap out of the mechanism before cleaning the heads. Disks give errors, duh. Whatever you use to image a disk, use it as a first attempt, as that