Re: C64's still managing building systems

[drlegendre . via cctalk]

"A new, more current system would cost between $1.5 and 2 million. "

Something tells me there's more than a Commodore Amiga involved, here. This
figure must include the radio hardware and controllers at each of the
schools. The article goes on to say that a student at one of the high
schools wrote the software that runs it all.. but it must also require some
sort of controller / interface, so who supplied that (sans software)?

Doesn't really make much sense, but then again, not a lot of reporting does.

On Sat, Dec 2, 2017 at 6:34 PM, Kevin Parker via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> I spotted this article in one of my tech news feeds - it makes a couple of
> references to C64's still managing building systems.
> Rationale "it isn't broken".
>
>
>
> May be of interest to some list members.
>
>
>
> https://www.commercialrealestate.com.au/news/many-commercial-property-
> companies-still-underestimate-the-impact-of-technology-study/
>
>
>
> There's also a link in the above article to an older article (and a video)
> about a Commodore Amiga running the heating system for 19
> schools for 30 years which may also be of interest.
>
>
>
> http://woodtv.com/2015/06/11/1980s-computer-controls-grps-heat-and-ac/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Kevin Parker
>
> P: 0418 815 527
>
>
>
>
>
>

Re: C64's still managing building systems

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

"A new, more current system would cost between $1.5 and 2 million. "


On Sun, 3 Dec 2017, drlegendre . via cctalk wrote:

Something tells me there's more than a Commodore Amiga involved, here. This
figure must include the radio hardware and controllers at each of the
schools. The article goes on to say that a student at one of the high
schools wrote the software that runs it all.. but it must also require some
sort of controller / interface, so who supplied that (sans software)?
Doesn't really make much sense, but then again, not a lot of reporting does.


First, the school board needs to go to Hawaii, Japan, France, Germany, and 
Greece, in order to see how it is done there.
(In our commuter community college (adult enrichment, college 
prep, basic and remedial skills, skill updating for local professionals, 
job training for the digital sweatshop), the Chancellor took his large 
"entourage" to China "to recruit students for the community college".
How many 18 year olds would relocate to a different continent for the sole 
purpose of attending a local community college?


Then they need to hire a consultant to define the problem.

Then they need consultants to conduct studies.

Then they need to contract with systems analysis consulting companies to 
prepare proposals of possible solutions.


Then they need engineering consultants to reject the current round of 
proposals.


Then they need to see if IBM wants to design a dedicated system.  That may 
require some more travel.


Then they need to fly in the superintendent's brother in law to check it 
out.


Then, IFF there is any money left in the budget for the project, they can 
hire a consultant to buy and set up an Arduino, or an old Amiga out of the 
closet.


Yes, they do spend somewhat more than the direct hardware cost.

Re: C64's still managing building systems

[Mike Stein via cctalk]

- Original Message - 
From: "Fred Cisin via cctalk" 
To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" 
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2017 3:45 PM
Subject: Re: C64's still managing building systems


>> "A new, more current system would cost between $1.5 and 2 million. "
> 
> On Sun, 3 Dec 2017, drlegendre . via cctalk wrote:
>> Something tells me there's more than a Commodore Amiga involved, here. This
>> figure must include the radio hardware and controllers at each of the
>> schools. The article goes on to say that a student at one of the high
>> schools wrote the software that runs it all.. but it must also require some
>> sort of controller / interface, so who supplied that (sans software)?
>> Doesn't really make much sense, but then again, not a lot of reporting does.
> 
> First, the school board needs to go to Hawaii, Japan, France, Germany, and 
> Greece, in order to see how it is done there.
> (In our commuter community college (adult enrichment, college 
> prep, basic and remedial skills, skill updating for local professionals, 
> job training for the digital sweatshop), the Chancellor took his large 
> "entourage" to China "to recruit students for the community college".
> How many 18 year olds would relocate to a different continent for the sole 
> purpose of attending a local community college?
> 
> Then they need to hire a consultant to define the problem.
> 
> Then they need consultants to conduct studies.
> 
> Then they need to contract with systems analysis consulting companies to 
> prepare proposals of possible solutions.
> 
> Then they need engineering consultants to reject the current round of 
> proposals.
> 
> Then they need to see if IBM wants to design a dedicated system.  That may 
> require some more travel.
> 
> Then they need to fly in the superintendent's brother in law to check it 
> out.
> 
> Then, IFF there is any money left in the budget for the project, they can 
> hire a consultant to buy and set up an Arduino, or an old Amiga out of the 
> closet.
> 
> Yes, they do spend somewhat more than the direct hardware cost.
--
That seems to describe perfectly the approach to our (Canada's) federal payroll 
system that's gone from a $5 million contract to $180m in two years, with lots 
of employees still not getting their correct pay or any pay at all
.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/phoenix-ibm-contract-union-pay-government-1.4295827

Peanuts compared to Queensland's 6m to 1.2 billion disaster:

http://www.smh.com.au/it-pro/government-it/queensland-health-payroll-fail-government-ordered-to-pay-ibm-costs-20160404-gnxpqj.html

Gotta hand it to IBM's lawyers though; they came out blameless...

m

Vidar large format scanner available

[Bob Rosenbloom via cctalk]

I have a Vidar P-62 large format scanner available to anyone willing to 
come pick it up.


It has a SCSI interface. Drivers for Windows XP are available on the 
web, don't know about newer Windows
or other operating systems. Also, it's completely untested, I have 
nothing that's has a SCSI interface.


Located in Santa Cruz, CA

Some photos here: http://anifur.com/clist/

Bob

--
Vintage computers and electronics
www.dvq.com
www.tekmuseum.com
www.decmuseum.org

Re: C64's still managing building systems

[Richard Loken via cctalk]

On Sun, 3 Dec 2017, Mike Stein via cctalk wrote:

That seems to describe perfectly the approach to our (Canada's) federal 
payroll system that's gone from a $5 million contract to $180m in two 
years, with lots of employees still not getting their correct pay or any 
pay at all


I think it should be called the Icarus Project rather than the Pheonix 
Project since Icarus flew too close to the sun and fell to his death in

compoarison to the Pheonix who dies in flames and rises from his own
ashes.  I don't see much hope of this Pheonix rising any time soon.

--
  Richard Loken VE6BSV: "...underneath those tuques we wear,
  Athabasca, Alberta Canada   : our heads are naked!"
  ** rllo...@telus.net ** :- Arthur Black

RE: Vidar large format scanner available

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

36".
It is NOT a flatbed.


On Sun, 3 Dec 2017, Ed Sharpe via cctalk wrote:


how large is it? thx ed#

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Sunday, December 3, 2017 Bob Rosenbloom via cctalk  
wrote:
I have a Vidar P-62 large format scanner available to anyone willing to
come pick it up.

It has a SCSI interface. Drivers for Windows XP are available on the
web, don't know about newer Windows
or other operating systems. Also, it's completely untested, I have
nothing that's has a SCSI interface.

Located in Santa Cruz, CA

Some photos here: http://anifur.com/clist/

Bob

--
Vintage computers and electronics
www.dvq.com
www.tekmuseum.com
www.decmuseum.org



--
Fred Cisin  ci...@xenosoft.com
XenoSofthttp://www.xenosoft.com
PO Box 1236 (510) 234-3397
Berkeley, CA 94701-1236

RE: Vidar large format scanner available

[Ed Sharpe via cctalk]

how large is it? thx ed#

Sent from AOL Mobile Mail

On Sunday, December 3, 2017 Bob Rosenbloom via cctalk  
wrote:
I have a Vidar P-62 large format scanner available to anyone willing to 
come pick it up.

It has a SCSI interface. Drivers for Windows XP are available on the 
web, don't know about newer Windows
or other operating systems. Also, it's completely untested, I have 
nothing that's has a SCSI interface.

Located in Santa Cruz, CA

Some photos here: http://anifur.com/clist/

Bob

-- 
Vintage computers and electronics
www.dvq.com
www.tekmuseum.com
www.decmuseum.org

FTGH: Old ham radio headset

[Noel Chiappa via cctalk]

FTGH:

  http://ana-3.lcs.mit.edu/~jnc/jpg/tmp/HeadSet.jpg

Noel

Re: Slightly Meta: Travel tips for people traveling internationally with vintage equipment

[Michael Thompson via cctalk]

>
>
> From: Michael Brutman 
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts"
> 
> Subject: Slightly Meta: Travel tips for people traveling
> internationally with vintage equipment?
> Message-ID:
>  mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> I'm actively working on show planning for VCF PNW and I'm noticing that we
> have a few international travelers planning to attend and exhibit their
> machines/projects.  I'd like to put together a FAQ for the logistics of
> traveling with vintage equipment across the US border.  If you have ideas
> please let me know.
>
> For example: Should I plan on providing letters in advance stating that a
> person is a registered exhibitor at our show, including details like the
> show location, dates, times, and contact information in case there is a
> question about why somebody is carrying strange looking equipment into the
> US?  Is there any sort of paperwork or customs form needed even if nothing
> is being sold or left in the US?  Any other gotchas to look for?
>
>
> Thanks,
> Mike
>

I often travel internationally with strange looking electronics. If I am
questioned, I say that it is for my personal use during travel.

If you are bringing things that are very valuable, you can get a Carnet to
temporarily import items to the US and then export them without paying
duty. It is sometimes a painful process to find the right person at the
airport to stamp the Carnet on the way in and out, and often the customs
people have no idea what a Carnet is. The Carnet also costs more than $200
and requires a security deposit based on the value of the item.

https://www.export.gov/article?id=ATA-Carnet
http://www.uscib.org/ata-carnet-faqs-ud-1675/



-- 
Michael Thompson

Re: FTGH: Old ham radio headset

[Ed via cctalk]

A  ww 2  style headset! 
 
Ed#
 
 
In a message dated 12/3/2017 9:59:01 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,  
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: