On Fri, 29 May 2020, Rich Alderson via cctalk wrote:
Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling bin. It's a
long pause, that's all.
Thank you for the reassuraance.
We will count on you to keep us informed as things
On 5/29/20 2:31 PM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote:
On 05/29/2020 03:05 PM, Rich Alderson via cctalk wrote:
Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling bin. It's a
long pause, that's all.
Well, that's a relief, at
I was interested in computers from grade 11; that would have been in 1967.
I got my first microcomputer in 1978, a Heathkit H8 - terribly priced here
in Canada. From there I went to the Coleco ADAM. It was essentially an
APPLE II clone, well the OS was. Not sure what has become of ADAM-user
groups
Derailing a little bit but did the LCM loan things or allow folks to bring
in equipment to fix it get running? Was sort of curious when hanging out
in their library area thinking it's a lot like all my bookshelves for
things I haven't done but could. I feel like I saw software there also.
Though
On 05/29/2020 03:05 PM, Rich Alderson via cctalk wrote:
Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling bin. It's a long
pause, that's all.
Well, that's a relief, at least!
Jon
A, Rich, now you've gone and taken all the mystery out of it, and the
fun of complaining about something over which we have no control! Unfair
to Local 12 of the Villains, Thieves, and Scoundrels Union! :D
On Fri, May 29, 2020 at 2:25 PM Rich Alderson via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org>
On Fri, 29 May 2020, Rich Alderson via cctalk wrote:
Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling bin. It's a
long pause, that's all.
It's not you guys we're worried about. It's those skeezy shitbirds at
Vulcan
On 2020-05-29 4:05 PM, Rich Alderson via cctalk wrote:
> Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
>
> Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling bin. It's a long
> pause, that's all.
>
>
After one completely out of the blue move, there will be no further
Thank you.
From: "cctalk"
To: "Electronics Plus" , "cctalk"
Sent: Friday, May 29, 2020 1:05:17 PM
Subject: RE: Living Computer Museum
Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling b
Just to make sure everyone knows that we haven't lost our minds:
Nothing is going in the skip/dumpster/e-waste recycling bin. It's a long
pause, that's all.
Rich Alderson
ex-Sr. Systems Engineer/Curator emeritus
Living Computers: Museum + Labs
2245 1st Ave S
Seattle, WA 98134
Cell: (206)
On 5/29/2020 12:34 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:
On 5/29/20 10:57 AM, TeoZ via cctalk wrote:
All this shows me is that in principal people will pick the extreme ends
of a topic to fight about but in reality once you get into specifics and
details most people are really in the middle and
On 5/29/20 10:57 AM, TeoZ via cctalk wrote:
> All this shows me is that in principal people will pick the extreme ends
> of a topic to fight about but in reality once you get into specifics and
> details most people are really in the middle and tend to agree on what
> should be done (in most
Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'
Subject: RE: Living Computer Museum
-Original Message-
From: cctalk On Behalf Of Daniel Seagraves
via cctalk
Sent: 29 May 2020 14:04
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Living Computer Museum
I’ve been just kinda
-Original Message-
From: cctalk [mailto:cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org] On Behalf Of Rob Jarratt
via cctalk
Sent: Friday, May 29, 2020 10:57 AM
To: 'Daniel Seagraves'; 'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'
Subject: RE: Living Computer Museum
> -Original Mess
> -Original Message-
> From: cctalk On Behalf Of Daniel Seagraves
> via cctalk
> Sent: 29 May 2020 14:04
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
> Subject: Re: Living Computer Museum
>
> I’ve been just kinda skimming along in this thread, I’
On Fri, 29 May 2020, Daniel Seagraves via cctalk wrote:
I’ve been just kinda skimming along in this thread, I’ve been busy; Just wanna
make sure I have everything down...
0: If you sent anything to a museum, you’ve been fleeced - you’re an idiot.
1: If you didn’t send anything to a museum,
At 08:04 AM 5/29/2020, Daniel Seagraves via cctalk wrote:
>Iâve been just kinda skimming along in this thread, Iâve been busy; Just
>wanna make sure I have everything down...
"Anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone
going faster than you is a maniac" - George Carlin
- John
I’ve been just kinda skimming along in this thread, I’ve been busy; Just wanna
make sure I have everything down...
0: If you sent anything to a museum, you’ve been fleeced - you’re an idiot.
1: If you didn’t send anything to a museum, you’re a hoarder - you’re an idiot.
2: If you send things to
Eric Smith wrote:
> When we restored the PDP-1 at CHM, we *really* wanted to make sure
> that the public could interact with it, though in a limited
> fashion. Ken Sumrall and I built quick-and-dirty Spacewar control
> boxes out of particle board and arcade switches, which were intended
> for
On May 28, 2020, at 5:25 PM, Tony Aiuto via cctalk
wrote:
>
> So depressingly true. I run the little museum in Google's NYC office.
> I've had a bunch of working 80's-90's era machines and workstations on
> display, but they require constant repair because people are too lazy or
> entitled to
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 4:36 PM William Donzelli via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > This is one of the things that disappointed me most about the Computer
> History Museum in Mountain View, CA. Sure you can’t let the public interact
> with *everything*, but since so much of computing
On 2020-05-28 5:02 PM, William Donzelli via cctalk wrote:
>> You know, in general I don't disagree with this statement, but I'll go on
>> record here and say that in my 5 years at LCM, I don't recall a single
>> keycap going missing, or anything getting stolen.
>
> Good fortune, maybe!
>
> On
yep the theft part is always present and very aggravating many things are
just best kept behind glass and you can open the sliding 8 footer on
the side of display and and let someone go in and play if they are
deserving sometimes... Keeps the dust off too... Ed#
In
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 2:20 PM Chris Hanson via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> This is one of the things that disappointed me most about the Computer
> History Museum in Mountain View, CA. Sure you can’t let the public interact
> with *everything*, but since so much of computing since
Good fortune, maybe!
On another ship I sometime volunteer on (DE-766 SLATER), someone stole
a piece of silverware from the officer's ward room (the dining room,
basically)., Yes, just a knife or fork or whatever... but gone
forever.
Perhaps it is the audience of people who attend these
> You know, in general I don't disagree with this statement, but I'll go on
> record here and say that in my 5 years at LCM, I don't recall a single keycap
> going missing, or anything getting stolen.
Good fortune, maybe!
On another ship I sometime volunteer on (DE-766 SLATER), someone stole
a
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 1:36 PM William Donzelli via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > This is one of the things that disappointed me most about the Computer
> History Museum in Mountain View, CA. Sure you can’t let the public interact
> with *everything*, but since so much of computing
> This is one of the things that disappointed me most about the Computer
> History Museum in Mountain View, CA. Sure you can’t let the public interact
> with *everything*, but since so much of computing since its inception has
> been about interaction with active systems, just displaying them
On May 28, 2020, at 9:41 AM, Robert Harrison via cctalk
wrote:
>
> Does anyone know what it would take to sustain the museum until it can
> reopen? Are tickets a major source of income?
> This is the first I have heard of the museum, so I don’t know much about it,
> but it sounds like
If museums allowed for all donations without prior approval, they would have to
build a receiving dock and warehouse. A simple contact takes care of the
problem.
The museums website should include a section on their donation policy to make
it easier. What they may accept, what they won’t, who
Does anyone know what it would take to sustain the museum until it can reopen?
Are tickets a major source of income?
This is the first I have heard of the museum, so I don’t know much about it,
but it sounds like something worthy to try to save.
Sent from my iPhone
> On May 28, 2020, at 1:30
> Do tell.
"Normal" museums do not assign values to artifacts, and are very much
against (for the most part) buying artifacts directly, as doing so
basically assigns numeric values. This is to discourage "pot hunting",
named so after the looters of antiquities.
Art museums generally do not have
On May 28, 2020, at 10:31 AM, William Donzelli via cctalk
wrote:
>
>> Loans are standard practice in art museums, from other museums as well as
>> from private collections. Perhaps not so much in science/technology museums.
>
> Art museums work under a different set of rules and ethics than
They would have to when items can be worth millions each and are one of a
kind.
-Original Message-
From: William Donzelli via cctalk
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2020 1:31 PM
To: Paul Koning ; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Living Computer Museum
Loans
> Loans are standard practice in art museums, from other museums as well as
> from private collections. Perhaps not so much in science/technology museums.
Art museums work under a different set of rules and ethics than other museums.
--
Will
>
> On 2020-05-28 4:14 AM, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
>>> ...
>>
>> Its a challenge. Most Museums refuse to accept loans. It’s a lot of admin.
>> If the original owner dies what happens.
>> Under what terms can it be removed. Value if stolen or damaged? If it is
>> working and it breaks.
>>
On 5/28/20 7:52 AM, William Donzelli via cctalk wrote:
Dumpsters ain't cheap.
s/Dumpsters/EWASTE disposal/
On 2020-05-28 4:14 AM, Dave Wade via cctalk wrote:
>> -Original Message-
>> From: cctalk On Behalf Of Chris Hanson via
>> cctalk
>> Sent: 28 May 2020 04:54
>> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
>>
>> Subject: Re: Living Compute
> On May 28, 2020, at 9:49 AM, Bill Degnan wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 9:14 AM Paul Koning via cctalk
> wrote:
> Also remember that museums don't necessarily honor contracts, and when they
> don't, courts may fail to enforce them. There was a notorious case a few
> years ago
> Much of the effort of running a thrift store is disposal of
> donated material that has no rapid resale value.
And cost. Dumpsters ain't cheap.
--
Will
Much of the effort of running a thrift store is disposal of
donated material that has no rapid resale value.
- John
Like all the vintage computers that must flow into Goodwill locations
everywhere... that Dell then disposes of somehow?
- Ethan
--
: Ethan O'Toole
At 09:25 AM 5/28/2020, Bill Gunshannon via cctalk wrote:
>Nothing like asking people to jump thru hoops before you let them
>do you a favor. :-)
Much of the effort of running a thrift store is disposal of
donated material that has no rapid resale value.
- John
> If you want something nice, I can send you a few pallets of broken LCDs.
> They're all really rare - I've never seen ones with the same serial number
> on them.
>
> Don't worry, I won't ask first. ;-)
You pay for shipping, and I'll take them!
--
Will
On Thu, May 28, 2020, 10:25 Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> On 5/28/20 9:53 AM, William Donzelli wrote:
> >> Why would I do that? I had something people said was rare.
> >
> > Museums with a lot of "gravity" (like LCM) tend to get offered a *lot*
> > of REALLY RARE
On 5/28/20 9:53 AM, William Donzelli wrote:
Why would I do that? I had something people said was rare.
Museums with a lot of "gravity" (like LCM) tend to get offered a *lot*
of REALLY RARE items, like broken C64s, Packard Bell desktops, boxes
of ten year old games on CD-ROM, dirty USB
> Why would I do that? I had something people said was rare.
Museums with a lot of "gravity" (like LCM) tend to get offered a *lot*
of REALLY RARE items, like broken C64s, Packard Bell desktops, boxes
of ten year old games on CD-ROM, dirty USB keyboards, 56K Sportsters,
and so forth.
Yeah,
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 9:14 AM Paul Koning via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> Also remember that museums don't necessarily honor contracts, and when
> they don't, courts may fail to enforce them. There was a notorious case a
> few years ago involving a museum created by a bequest that
On 5/28/20 9:18 AM, William Donzelli wrote:
I once sent them some rather rare documentation (at the suggestion of
other collectors). I got back a letter with a nasty tone stating they
do not accept unsolicited items. I have no idea what that meant as to
the continued existence of the item. It
> I once sent them some rather rare documentation (at the suggestion of
> other collectors). I got back a letter with a nasty tone stating they
> do not accept unsolicited items. I have no idea what that meant as to
> the continued existence of the item. It certainly did not come back
> to me.
Also remember that museums don't necessarily honor contracts, and when they
don't, courts may fail to enforce them. There was a notorious case a few years
ago involving a museum created by a bequest that required it to be remain
located in whatever town it was founded in (a small town in PA, I
On 5/27/20 11:02 PM, Alan Perry via cctalk wrote:
That wasn’t an option for most folks. They told me that they didn’t accept
items on loan.
I once sent them some rather rare documentation (at the suggestion of
other collectors). I got back a letter with a nasty tone stating they
do not
om: cctalk On Behalf Of Chris Hanson via
>> cctalk
>> Sent: 28 May 2020 04:54
>> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
>>
>> Subject: Re: Living Computer Museum
>>
>> On May 27, 2020, at 8:48 PM, Jecel Assumpcao Jr
>> wrote:
>>
> -Original Message-
> From: cctalk On Behalf Of Chris Hanson via
> cctalk
> Sent: 28 May 2020 04:54
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
>
> Subject: Re: Living Computer Museum
>
> On May 27, 2020, at 8:48 PM, Jecel Assumpcao Jr
>
His sister now runs his companies and has been dismantling his dreams. She
already wrecked his space launch company.
On Thu, 28 May 2020, 00:29 Ethan O'Toole via cctalk,
wrote:
> > Indeed. This looks bad. Hopefully they can pull a rabbit out of their hat
> > and figure out how to reopen, but
On 5/27/20 9:02 PM, Ethan O'Toole via cctalk wrote:
The big problem with this situation is that it’s simply unnecessary:
Living Computer Museum + Labs is not independent of Vulcan, and Vulcan
can *easily* afford to keep the people who work there on payroll and
working from home
I live in hope for the tag “for now”. It’s always my first place to visit
when I fly in to the west coast.
//m
On Thu, 28 May 2020 at 9:58 am, Bill Degnan via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> On Wed, May 27, 2020 at 7:36 PM William Donzelli via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
On 5/27/2020 8:53 PM, Chris Hanson via cctalk wrote:
On May 27, 2020, at 8:48 PM, Jecel Assumpcao Jr wrote:
I would think that if people you liked got replaced with people who
don't care then you might have a major battle trying to get back stuff
you loaned.
It might be a battle, possibly
The big problem with this situation is that it’s simply unnecessary:
Living Computer Museum + Labs is not independent of Vulcan, and Vulcan
can *easily* afford to keep the people who work there on payroll and
working from home indefinitely.
Did Vulcan have a lot of exposure to real estate?
yikes that almost has a tome of finality to it eh?
Ed#
In a message dated 5/27/2020 3:11:19 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes:
https://www.livingcomputers.org/Closure.aspx
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 12:02 AM Chris Zach via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
most museums of all varieties are closed still the smart ones
will remain so for a while longer...the foolish will jump the gun.Ed#
sdIn a message dated 5/27/2020 2:57:12 PM US Mountain Standard Time,
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes:
On Wed, 27 May 2020, Guy Sotomayor via
On May 27, 2020, at 8:48 PM, Jecel Assumpcao Jr wrote:
>
> I would think that if people you liked got replaced with people who
> don't care then you might have a major battle trying to get back stuff
> you loaned.
It might be a battle, possibly even a major one, but it would be fundamentally
Alan Perry wrote on Wed, 27 May 2020 20:02:06 -0700
> That wasn't an option for most folks. They told me that they didn't accept
> items on loan.
>
> alan
>
> > On May 27, 2020, at 19:33, Chris Hanson wrote:
> >
> > This is why people should avoid donating equipment directly to institutions
On May 27, 2020, at 8:02 PM, Alan Perry wrote:
>
> That wasn’t an option for most folks. They told me that they didn’t accept
> items on loan.
Well, that really sucks.
-- Chris
That wasn’t an option for most folks. They told me that they didn’t accept
items on loan.
alan
> On May 27, 2020, at 19:33, Chris Hanson via cctalk
> wrote:
>
> This is why people should avoid donating equipment directly to institutions
> and instead lend hardware to them.
>
> At least
The big problem with this situation is that it’s simply unnecessary: Living
Computer Museum + Labs is not independent of Vulcan, and Vulcan can *easily*
afford to keep the people who work there on payroll and working from home
indefinitely.
This is happening entirely because the people holding
This is why people should avoid donating equipment directly to institutions and
instead lend hardware to them.
At least then you have a claim with which to try to get your stuff back if they
fold, close, or decide to go in a direction you don’t like.
-- Chris
On Wed, May 27, 2020 at 9:23 PM William Donzelli via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > Anytime somebody with $20B dies it will take years to sort out the estate
> > because of taxes and people lining up for money due (legit or not).
>
> Yes, for people that had no "exit strategy", but
> Anytime somebody with $20B dies it will take years to sort out the estate
> because of taxes and people lining up for money due (legit or not).
Yes, for people that had no "exit strategy", but somehow I think Paul
Allen did some sort of estate planning before he passed...
--
Will
They probably don't know.
Anytime somebody with $20B dies it will take years to sort out the estate
because of taxes and people lining up for money due (legit or not). Any
charities set up before he passed probably have to live off of what money
they had on hand before his passing for a few
If you're in South Eastern Pennsylvania, Kennett Classic is open; lean and
mean and I suppose and a 50th of the LCM but open nonetheless (by
appointment). The sign on the door reads "No shoes, no shirt, no mask- no
service. I was there all day today.
Currently working to decipher some Honeywell
Aw shit
(Where is the nearest U Haul?)
CZ
On 5/27/2020 8:13 PM, Ian McLaughlin via cctalk wrote:
This related story makes the situation a bit scarier.
https://www.seattletimes.com/entertainment/vulcan-to-close-its-arts-entertainment-division-which-includes-cinerama-and-seattle-art-fair/
That’s worrying. When the Historical Resource Center I was working with in my
area shutdown a few years ago, Ian came down and collected a U-Haul worth of
stuff, including part of my personal collection. What I really regret sending
up there is a large box of Honeywell DPS-8 documentation
This related story makes the situation a bit scarier.
https://www.seattletimes.com/entertainment/vulcan-to-close-its-arts-entertainment-division-which-includes-cinerama-and-seattle-art-fair/
On Wed, May 27, 2020 at 7:36 PM William Donzelli via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > They've been closed to visitors since early March I think.
>
> A lot of smaller museums are going into hibernation. Most are
> confident they will reopen sometime in the future, but well past the
>
> They've been closed to visitors since early March I think.
A lot of smaller museums are going into hibernation. Most are
confident they will reopen sometime in the future, but well past the
points that they are allowed to by government order.
It is unfortunate for the paid staff.
--
Will
Indeed. This looks bad. Hopefully they can pull a rabbit out of their hat
and figure out how to reopen, but I'm not holding my breath.
Mike
That place was funded by Paul Allen right? I would have thought it would
have been setup to last many years.
- Ethan
--
:
Indeed. This looks bad. Hopefully they can pull a rabbit out of their hat
and figure out how to reopen, but I'm not holding my breath.
Mike
On Wed, May 27, 2020, 6:26 PM Lee Courtney via cctalk
wrote:
> "In the coming weeks we’ll follow up with information about ticket,
> membership and
"In the coming weeks we’ll follow up with information about ticket,
membership and donation refunds."
The "membership and donation refunds." bothers me the most, especially with
Paul Allen no longer on the scene.
If LCM were to cease operations permanently that would be a disaster, as
there is
https://www.livingcomputers.org/Closure.aspx
On Thu, May 28, 2020 at 12:02 AM Chris Zach via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> Hm. Well, if I have to drive out there and pick up AI, the letter is
> there. Just let me know.
>
> C
>
> On 5/27/2020 5:52 PM, Guy Sotomayor via cctalk
Hm. Well, if I have to drive out there and pick up AI, the letter is
there. Just let me know.
C
On 5/27/2020 5:52 PM, Guy Sotomayor via cctalk wrote:
I just received an email from the Living Computer Museum that they were
suspending operations. It wasn't clear from the email what that
On Wed, 2020-05-27 at 14:57 -0700, geneb wrote:
> On Wed, 27 May 2020, Guy Sotomayor via cctalk wrote:
>
> > I just received an email from the Living Computer Museum that they
> > were
> > suspending operations. It wasn't clear from the email what that
> > actually means.
> >
>
> They've been
On Wed, 27 May 2020, Guy Sotomayor via cctalk wrote:
I just received an email from the Living Computer Museum that they were
suspending operations. It wasn't clear from the email what that
actually means.
They've been closed to visitors since early March I think.
g.
--
Proud owner of F-15C
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