Re: Reviving ancient MFM drives (was Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC)

On Thu, 28 Sep 2017, Geoffrey Oltmans wrote: Speaking of I've got a couple of old MFM drives (10 and 20 MB of a variety whose name and model #'s escape me, I wanna say Tandon, but not sure). They seem to work fine when I initially format and partition, but as they run for a while, they get

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On Thu, 28 Sep 2017, Chuck Guzis wrote: "Low level format" is pretty much a relic of the old non-servo MFM drives. I recall that early Maxtor IDE drives implemented a LLF Lowlevel formatting has to be done for *all* ST-506 interface drives (e.g. "MFM" and "RLL" drives). It is the disk

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

Chuck said: > On 09/28/2017 08:57 PM, Anders Nelson via cctalk wrote: >> Update: I bought the Kennedy 9800 as it pushed all my buttons at once. >> >> Now I'm looking for 8" mag tapes/reels that will fit! Anyone know where I >> can find these, maybe 3pcs? I could laser-cut some frosted acrylic or

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 05:36:40PM -0700, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: [...] > What I find perplexing is the acronym "SATA" for "Serial ATA". The name would > imply that a drive can be connected to a 5170, but I'm not aware of any SATA > adapters for the 5170 PC/AT. SATA has a different

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 09/29/2017 03:01 PM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > > > On 9/29/17 11:35 AM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: > >> Does the little Kennedy drive have a vacuum takeup reel? > > No, they are tension arm, very similar design to the 7970 > > I wanted to compare the mechanical design of the 9000 to

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On Sep 29, 2017 6:49 AM, "Peter Corlett via cctalk" wrote: On Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 05:36:40PM -0700, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: [...] > What I find perplexing is the acronym "SATA" for "Serial ATA". The name would > imply that a drive can be connected to a 5170, but I'm

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 09/29/2017 07:04 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote: > I think there are two barriers to that. No sata is a cards. And BIOS of > that era still required you to tell it the chs for the drive... So, let's change the acronym to SSATA - "Serial Sort-of AT Attachment" --Chuck

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 09/29/2017 01:35 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: On 09/29/2017 09:00 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: On 9/29/17 8:48 AM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: I did a few of these on a lathe years ago. It was a couple minutes job per reel. you are also going to have to cut holes near the hub

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 9/29/2017 9:54 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: On 09/29/2017 07:04 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk wrote: I think there are two barriers to that. No sata is a cards. And BIOS of that era still required you to tell it the chs for the drive... So, let's change the acronym to SSATA - "Serial

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

Hi Anders, I found the reason for my SD card problems--a missing semicolon. There was supposed to be a stall until SDIO transfer complete; instead of a stall, the next statement was being executed. Argh. It's those little things that really trip you up. At any rate, I've even got

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 09/28/2017 11:44 PM, Anders Nelson via cctalk wrote: Hi Chuck, Yeah I could try that but unless I can separate the reel halves from the hub I'd have to make a jig of sorts to absorb the laser beam on the bottom side of the cut. Can the sides be separated? And is it possible to cut down a

Re: Reviving ancient MFM drives (was Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC)

On Fri, Sep 29, 2017 at 3:05 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > On Thu, 28 Sep 2017, Geoffrey Oltmans wrote: > >> Speaking of I've got a couple of old MFM drives (10 and 20 MB of a >> variety whose name and model #'s escape me, I wanna say Tandon, but not >>

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On Thu, Sep 28, 2017 at 7:36 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk < cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote: > > What I find perplexing is the acronym "SATA" for "Serial ATA". The name > would imply that a drive can be connected to a 5170, but I'm not aware > of any SATA adapters for the 5170 PC/AT. > I'm sure

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 09/29/2017 10:46 AM, Mike Stein via cctalk wrote: - Original Message - From: "Chuck Guzis via cctalk" To: "Paul Koning" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Friday, September 29, 2017 11:29

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 09/29/2017 06:07 AM, Paul Koning wrote: > There are chips that convert between serial and parallel ATA; one of > those could perhaps be used. I'm more used to applying them for > attaching a serial ATA controller to a parallel ATA drive, but > possibly they might work in the other direction

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 09/29/2017 01:11 AM, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: > I don't consider writing servo information as lowlevel formatting. I should have been more precise. What I meant was "embedded servo". Most, if not all, modern drives use this technique rather than dedicate a separate surface to

RE: HP 7970E - interest to split?

Van: Steve Malikoff via cctalk Verzonden: vrijdag 29 september 2017 09:26 Aan: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Onderwerp: Re: HP 7970E - interest to split? On my Kennedy 9000s the rubber O-rings have expanded on all

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 09/29/2017 10:56 AM, Henk Gooijen via cctalk wrote: On a related note my plan is to make a USB-based, Pertec-compatible controller for it. Not sure how SimH connects with peripherals so I'm /very/ eager to talk with someone familiar with its workings. I'll also release all the board files

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

> On Sep 29, 2017, at 12:33 PM, Jon Elson via cctalk > wrote: > > On 09/29/2017 10:56 AM, Henk Gooijen via cctalk wrote: >> >> >> >> On a related note my plan is to make a USB-based, Pertec-compatible >> controller for it. Not sure how SimH connects with peripherals

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

- Original Message - From: "Chuck Guzis via cctalk" To: "Paul Koning" ; "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" Sent: Friday, September 29, 2017 11:29 AM Subject: Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC >

RE: HP 7970E - interest to split?

Van: Anders Nelson via cctalk Verzonden: vrijdag 29 september 2017 05:57 Aan: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts Onderwerp: Re: HP 7970E - interest to split? Update: I bought the Kennedy 9800 as it pushed all my buttons

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 9/29/17 8:48 AM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: > I did a few of these on a lathe years ago.  It was a couple minutes job per > reel. you are also going to have to cut holes near the hub so that you can get a tape started on the takeup reel.

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

> On Sep 29, 2017, at 11:29 AM, Chuck Guzis wrote: > > On 09/29/2017 06:07 AM, Paul Koning wrote: > >> There are chips that convert between serial and parallel ATA; one of >> those could perhaps be used. I'm more used to applying them for >> attaching a serial ATA controller

Re: HP 9845 complete system on auction in Sweden

Cory - good suggestion about the double sided tape. what was the orig. bonding material between face glass and tube? just curious Ed# In a message dated 9/26/2017 5:29:30 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, coryheisterk...@gmail.com writes: It's the understood chemical

Re: cctalk Digest, Vol 39, Issue 2

Hello, explanation is easy. Old electrolytic will have a bigger current leakage, i.e. the unwanted amount of current which flows through it. With resistances having high value, the small current is completely eated by the leakage, thus never charging the capacitors. As you are connecting the

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

> On Sep 28, 2017, at 8:36 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk > wrote: > > On 09/28/2017 05:12 PM, Jules Richardson via cctalk wrote: >> On 09/27/2017 09:59 AM, Ethan via cctalk wrote: >>> The idea of IDE, as my understanding, is the controller that existed >>> as an >>> ISA

Re: cctalk Digest, Vol 39, Issue 2

Hi Andrea, I assume that's a message for me about my strange grounding issue? I'd already replaced the caps in that startup circuit, it's one of the first things you do when troubleshooting a non-booting Newbrain. In this case it seemed to be some electrolytic spill from the original leaky caps

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

For what it's worth, I found long ago that the IDE interface was far closer to the PC-based ESDI controller command set than the WD MFM drive one. ESDI even responds to commands such as IDENTIFY, where that command doesn't exist in the WD1003-type controller vocabulary. ESDI also supports larger

Re: HP 9845 complete system on auction in Sweden

Paul so the case it self is what held the class in place then? Ed# In a message dated 9/29/2017 11:00:27 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: On my 9835A it was Canadian Balsam a common optical bonding material. I bonded the shield on my to the front of the

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 09/29/2017 11:20 AM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: I can only imagine a real AT would be even less likely to handle a drive over about 40 MB. I think the limit was normally 512MB in the old c/h/s addressing days, wasn't it? For a connected drive, the BIOS set aside 4 bits for the number of

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

> On Sep 29, 2017, at 10:35 AM, Jules Richardson via cctalk > wrote: > > On 09/29/2017 11:20 AM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: >> I can only imagine a real AT would be even less likely to handle a drive >> over about 40 MB. > > I think the limit was normally 512MB in the

Re: HP 9845 complete system on auction in Sweden

On 2017-09-29 2:02 PM, Ed via cctalk wrote: Cory - good suggestion about the double sided tape. what was the orig. bonding material between face glass and tube? just curious Ed# On my 9835A it was Canadian Balsam a common optical bonding material.   I bonded the shield on my to

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 09/29/2017 09:00 AM, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote: > > > On 9/29/17 8:48 AM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: > >> I did a few of these on a lathe years ago.  It was a couple minutes job per >> reel. > > you are also going to have to cut holes near the hub so that you can get a > tape started >

RE: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

> And, that won't work, either. The BIOS in older machines will not work > right at ALL with a high capacity drive. > In some cases you will get a usable volume with vastly reduced > capacity, but in most cases it will just not recognize the drive at > all. I'm not talking about original AT's

Re: HP 9845 complete system on auction in Sweden

On Fri, 29 Sep 2017, Ed via cctalk wrote: what was the orig. bonding material between face glass and tube? just curious fungus?

Re: HP 9845 complete system on auction in Sweden

yes if the tree sap stuff if can get fungus in it. had that happen to microscope lenses in the lab Ed# In a message dated 9/29/2017 2:11:26 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: On Fri, 29 Sep 2017, Ed via cctalk wrote: > what was the orig. bonding

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

On 09/29/2017 11:20 AM, Jon Elson via cctalk wrote: I can only imagine a real AT would be even less likely to handle a drive over about 40 MB. 40MB would not be much of a problem. DOS, through 3.30 had a limit of 32MB per partition, but you could upgrade to newer DOS, or break it up into

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

"Low level format" is pretty much a relic of the old non-servo MFM drives. I recall that early Maxtor IDE drives implemented a LLF On Fri, 29 Sep 2017, Christian Corti via cctalk wrote: Lowlevel formatting has to be done for *all* ST-506 interface drives (e.g. "MFM" and "RLL" drives). It is

Re: HP 7970E - interest to split?

On 9/29/17 11:35 AM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote: > Does the little Kennedy drive have a vacuum takeup reel? No, they are tension arm, very similar design to the 7970 I wanted to compare the mechanical design of the 9000 to the 7970 but don't know if I have the time/interest any more.

Re: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC

- Original Message - From: "Ali via cctalk" To: "'General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts'" Sent: Friday, September 29, 2017 5:31 PM Subject: RE: formatting MFM drives on a IBM PC > And, that won't work, either. The BIOS in