Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

+1 on all. Except that Little's Law is very general as it applies to any ergodic process. It just derives from the law of large numbers. And BTW, Little's law is a very powerful law. We use it unconsciously all the time. On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 11:53 PM, wrote: > Luca's point tends to be

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

> > Probably, me forming some papers wrapping this up would be worthwile. > > [1]https://phys.org/news/2017-08-high-bandwidth-capability-ships.html > > [2]https://arxiv.org/pdf/1705.10630.pdf > I couldn't refrain. Currently, I've no affiliation rights, therefore I'm not eligible to push up to

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

> I tend not to care as much about how long it takes for things that do > not need R/T deadlines as humans and as steering wheels do. > > Propigation delay, while ultimately bound by the speed of light, is also > affected by the wires wrapping indirectly around the earth - much slower > than

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

> >> What I actually wanted to posit in relation to that is that one could >> get sooner a c-cabable backbone sibling by marrying two ideas: the >> airborne concept ongoing as outlined plus what NASA is planning to >> bring about for the space backbone, e.g [1][2]. It's laser based >> instead of

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

I think everything is about response time, even throughput. If we compare the time to transmit a single packet from A to B, including propagation delay, transmission delay and queuing delay, to the time to move a much larger amount of data from A to B we use throughput in this second case because

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

As I am writing up my slide-pack for LCA2018 this reminded me to test out irtt sleep bench against my running system. Seems either the Skylake Parts are much better in Combination with current kernels at this than what you were running on - what is the kernel of the x86 result? ---

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

On Sun, 17 Dec 2017, Benjamin Cronce wrote: This is an interesting topic to me. Over the past 5+ years, I've been reading about GPON fiber aggregators(GPON chassis for lack of a proper term) with 400Gb-1Tb/s of uplink, 1-2Tb/s line-cards, and enough GPON ports for several thousand customers.

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

On Sun, 17 Dec 2017, Matthias Tafelmeier wrote: What I actually wanted to posit in relation to that is that one could get sooner a c-cabable backbone sibling by marrying two ideas: the airborne concept ongoing as outlined plus what NASA is planning to bring about for the space backbone, e.g

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017, Jonathan Morton wrote: Ten times average demand estimated at time of deployment, and struggling badly with peak demand a decade later, yes. And this is the transportation industry, where a decade is a *short* time - like less than a year in telecoms. I've worked in

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

(Awesome development - I have a computer with a sane e-mail client again. One that doesn’t assume I want to top-post if I quote anything at all, *and* lets me type with an actual keyboard. Luxury!) >> One of the features well observed in real measurements of real systems is >> that packet

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

Please - my email was not an intention to troll - I wanted to establish a dialogue, I am sorry if I’ve offended. > On 13 Dec 2017, at 18:08, dpr...@reed.com wrote: > > Just to be clear, I have built and operated a whole range of network > platforms, as well as diagnosing problems and planning

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

Just to be clear, I have built and operated a whole range of network platforms, as well as diagnosing problems and planning deployments of systems that include digital packet delivery in real contexts where cost and performance matter, for nearly 40 years now. So this isn't only some kind of

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

> Have you considered what this means for the economics of the operation of networks? What other industry that “moves things around” (i.e logistical or similar) system creates a solution in which they have 10x as much infrastructure than their peak requirement? Ten times peak demand? No. Ten

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

> On 12 Dec 2017, at 22:53, dpr...@reed.com wrote: > > Luca's point tends to be correct - variable latency destroys the stability of > flow control loops, which destroys throughput, even when there is sufficient > capacity to handle the load. > > This is an indirect result of Little's Lemma

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

On Wed, 13 Dec 2017, Jonathan Morton wrote: Occasionally, of course, practically everyone in the country wants to tune into coverage of some event at the same time. More commonly, they simply get home from work and school at the same time every day. That breaks the assumptions behind pure

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

This is also true in the consumer space, and is the reason why ISPs can save money by taking advantage of statistical multiplexing. On average, I personally could be satisfied with a megabit, but it's a real pain to download gigabyte-class software updates at that speed. If it takes me literally

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

Luca Muscariello writes: > I think everything is about response time, even throughput. > > If we compare the time to transmit a single packet from A to B, including > propagation delay, transmission delay and queuing delay, > to the time to move a much larger amount

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

On Mon, 4 Dec 2017, dpr...@reed.com wrote: I suggest we stop talking about throughput, which has been the mistaken idea about networking for 30-40 years. We need to talk both about latency and speed. Yes, speed is talked about too much (relative to RTT), but it's not irrelevant. Speed of

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

I suggest we stop talking about throughput, which has been the mistaken idea about networking for 30-40 years. Almost all networking ends up being about end-to-end response time in a multiplexed system. Or put another way: "It's the Latency, Stupid". I get (and have come to expect) 27

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

Oh we have these in the Enterprise segment already. The main use case is VNF on edge device for SDN applications right now. But even so the range of vendors/devices is pretty limited. On 4 December 2017 at 23:57, Pedro Tumusok wrote: > Looking at chipsets coming/just

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

Looking at chipsets coming/just arrived from the chipset vendors, I think we will see CPE with 10G SFP+ and 802.11ax Q3/Q4 this year. Price is of course a bit steeper than the 15USD USB DSL modem :P, but probably fits nicely for the SMB segment. Pedro On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 11:47 AM, Joel Wirāmu

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

Bingo; that's definitely step one - gateways capable of 10gbit becoming the norm. On 4 December 2017 at 23:43, Pedro Tumusok wrote: > For in home or even SMB, I doubt that 10G to the user PC is the main use > case. > Its having the uplink capable of support of more

Re: [Cerowrt-devel] [Bloat] DC behaviors today

For in home or even SMB, I doubt that 10G to the user PC is the main use case. Its having the uplink capable of support of more than1G, that 1G does not necessarily need to be generated by only one host on the LAN. Pedro On Mon, Dec 4, 2017 at 11:27 AM, Joel Wirāmu Pauling