Re: [ANN] GTA04 Keyboard prototype
Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller h...@goldelico.com writes: Hi, we have developed a prototype for a 80 button QWERTY keyboard PCB that could eventually be connected/integrated into the GTA04. It should fit into a specially designed battery cover so that you can easily stow it away if not needed. Such battery covers could be produced individually through 3D printing solving the issue of manageing and stocking 20 different key layouts. This seems really nice! I added myself to the wishlist. Is the back cover keyboard 3D model available? I have a 3D printer currently being shipped to me and I would like to try to print the cover when the printer arrives. But watch yourself how we think it can look like: http://youtu.be/WM94%5fR5eKcc There is also a new video showing a comparison with some other keyboards: http://youtu.be/wGASnE1zGh4 Pleas tell us if you like this idea and what you would like to pay for such an extension unit through the Wishlist function of our shop: http://www.handheld-linux.com/wiki.php?page=GTA04%3AKeyboard Two issues are still to be developed: a) how to reliably connect it to the GTA04 PCB (soldering copper wires or a FFCs is a little difficult so it should have a tiny, flexible but robust B2B cable). Maybe, we can use a micro-USB socket or similar (we need to connect 6 wires). This may also need a redesign of the GTA04 board (for a nice plug) b) design a 3D printable case with key-caps that is robust enough If you want to support us for developing this idea, please give us a kickstart donation. Nikolaus PS: the keyboard driver for the TCA8418 is already part of Linux 3.3 - and has been backported to the 2.6.32-kernel. This has been tested to work on a BeagleBoard XM. http://git.goldelico.com/?p=gta04-kernel.git;a=commit;h=f19d5c430458bbce8955bc9e04dd161f6a80347d It just needs platform data in the board file: http://git.goldelico.com/?p=gta04-kernel.git;a=blobdiff;f=arch/arm/mach-omap2/board-omap3gta04.c;h=8a7e4b0803920f635e7101bfbd5a60b6b84b1107;hp=3e49efef2de0b42cd419a46a9cd45448fd04a44c;hb=4b2de3db742abce9212c1af2cc576e2a3a64b0d9;hpb=1d7c6b5f043661621ec374d96c3c4a4454f9bb7b -- Joakim Verona ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ANN] GTA04 Keyboard prototype
On Tue, 2012-05-01 at 18:06 +0200, Dr.H.NikolausS wrote:
we have developed a prototype for a 80 button QWERTY keyboard PCB
that could eventually be connected/integrated into the GTA04
This is some good work and the PCB looks like it will be useful.
However, I think it may be premature to start designing keyboard
circuits.
I think the really important issue in developing a hardware keyboard is
in the physical design; the arrangement of keys, how the shape of keys
effects ease of typing, how the keyboard is integrated into the case,
etc. In order to develop case designs that include a keyboard, we must
first have designs for cases without a keyboard :-)
At present, we do not have this. As I understand it, Slyon's cases do
not fit together properly and so we cannot build a complete GTA04 case
from them yet (has this changed?) There are also no case component kits
available.
I think it would be more advantageous to spend time dealing with these
basic problems. That way, we will have a solid base from which to build
more advanced designs, including designs that incorporate a keyboard.
Also, I believe we should not limit ourselves to the existing case
shape. I will say more about that in a separate email to the GTA04
list.
--
Bob Ham r...@settrans.net
Diaspora: r...@pod.settrans.net
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Re: [ANN] GTA04 Keyboard prototype
Hi Bob,
Am 02.05.2012 um 10:30 schrieb Bob Ham:
On Tue, 2012-05-01 at 18:06 +0200, Dr.H.NikolausS wrote:
we have developed a prototype for a 80 button QWERTY keyboard PCB
that could eventually be connected/integrated into the GTA04
This is some good work and the PCB looks like it will be useful.
However, I think it may be premature to start designing keyboard
circuits.
Well, the circuit itself was already part of the GTA04 schematics so it
was not too difficult to extract that into an external PCB. And once designed
it is easy to move the buttons a little around before it goes into mass
production. So that it fits the case.
I think the really important issue in developing a hardware keyboard is
in the physical design; the arrangement of keys, how the shape of keys
The arrangement of keys is more or less standardized, so there isn't
much room for experimentation.
effects ease of typing, how the keyboard is integrated into the case,
etc. In order to develop case designs that include a keyboard, we must
Yes, shape effects ease of typing. But also do the mechanical properties of
the electric contacts. I.e. what their contact force is. You can only test that
with having the electronics ready (at least in a prototype status).
first have designs for cases without a keyboard :-)
Well, but what do you do if you design a keyboard where the mechanical
switches are not available? Part of the experiment was to test how well
these Panasonic things work, how easily they can be soldered, what they
impose as the minimum distance between buttons.
I.e. you can't do one without the other. And have to start somewhere...
And, the shape of the keycaps can be changed and optimized. That is the
good thing with 3D printing.
At present, we do not have this. As I understand it, Slyon's cases do
not fit together properly and so we cannot build a complete GTA04 case
from them yet (has this changed?) There are also no case component kits
available.
The key missing part is the UMTS pentaband antenna. There are
antenna modules out there (e.g. Antenova) but those are too big.
I think it would be more advantageous to spend time dealing with these
basic problems. That way, we will have a solid base from which to build
more advanced designs, including designs that incorporate a keyboard.
That time will be spent anyways. But without having this prototype, it wasn't
clear if we could head for a case variant with keys at all.
Usually in product design the electronics (and availability of components)
imposes more constraints so that design follows function. I.e. a good industrial
designer creates clothing for the internals. If you ask a designer to draw a
sketch and then try to build electronics inside, you can no longer use standard
components. Well, if you are Apple or Samsung, you can break this rule and
set the standard for new components.
But it is still useful to draw such sketches to know what we want...
I.e. both parts are important and none can do without the other.
Also, I believe we should not limit ourselves to the existing case
shape. I will say more about that in a separate email to the GTA04
list.
Yes, please do! Ideas are always welcome.
--
Bob Ham r...@settrans.net
Diaspora: r...@pod.settrans.net
for (;;) { ++pancakes; }
You could do pancakes+=2; :)
Nikolaus
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Re: Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community
It has become a little quiet here in the last weeks so that I really fear about the spirit and status of this community. So what are your dreams with respect to open mobile handhelds? What would you like as future hardware? What to see in software distros? Anything else? What missing piece are you waiting for? Let me list the hopes I had when buying the Freerunner. They're mostly related to middleware, and start with the idea of a programmable phone, not a wireless computer. - tracking of billing in real-time, using a set of user-provided rules. In practice, telling me how many text messages I have left out of my monthly limit - programmable reactions to different calls - reject some callers, voicemail others, record unknown, set custom ringtones - compound communication model - most of the time I don't want to pay attention whether I'm sending a message via mail, XMPP or SMS, whether I call using GSM or VOIP, whether I connect the Internet via WiFi or GSM - what I care about are properties of the connection: reliability, security and cost. When I call someone, I usually want to just get connected, no to think about which program I need to run. Also, this approach lets store all communication history in one place. - a geolocation API (combining GPS, GSM and WiFi information) that will be able wake me up when I reach my train station. Potentially useful for determining reliability of communication (see above). These days what I care about is much more humble: reliable GPS (SHR + tangogps were the best combo I've seen so far), full communication logging (SHR was pretty good at this too), alarm (SHR alarm was wonderful) and PIM: calendar, some form of note making and todo list. Cheers, rhn ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Discussion: what are your dreams for the Openmoko Community
On 04/30/2012 08:21 AM, Al Johnson wrote: Nice list. Comments below... On Sunday 29 April 2012 18:59:34 Benjamin Deering wrote: A threaded/prepared camera hole for attaching a microscope or telescope lense would be nice. Is there any suitable standard for this? Microscope lenses seem to be 23.5mm, but I'm not sure if that would be the correct optics. It looks like someone sells a snap-on macro lense for iphone: http://store.apple.com/us/product/H7758LL/A/olloclip-quick-connect-lens-for-iphone-4s so maybe something could be designed and printed for GTA04 to snap on. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QtMoko v44 for Freerunner now available
Hi Thanks for the new version Radek, fresh installed on my GTA02! It's ok on the NAND, but on SD I'm unable to boot it. Qi apparently skips the card and it boots from NAND instead. Is it because of the issue with the v44 kernel for the GTA02? Thanks. Joif ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ANN] GTA04 Keyboard prototype
On Wed, 2012-05-02 at 11:02 +0200, Dr. H. Nikolaus Schaller wrote:
I think the really important issue in developing a hardware keyboard is
in the physical design; the arrangement of keys, how the shape of keys
The arrangement of keys is more or less standardized, so there isn't
much room for experimentation.
I think there's quite a lot of variation in modern phone keyboards. For
example, some Blackberry phones have two alphanumeric characters per
key, some phones have no number keys, some have an arrow key block and
some don't, etc.
Even within the confines of a basic qwerty keyboard, there seem to be
many variations in layout; whether the rows are offset or aligned in a
grid, whether there is a multi-row Enter key, the size of the space bar,
etc.
effects ease of typing, how the keyboard is integrated into the case,
etc. In order to develop case designs that include a keyboard, we must
Yes, shape effects ease of typing. But also do the mechanical properties of
the electric contacts. I.e. what their contact force is. You can only test
that
with having the electronics ready (at least in a prototype status).
That's a fair point.
first have designs for cases without a keyboard :-)
Well, but what do you do if you design a keyboard where the mechanical
switches are not available? Part of the experiment was to test how well
these Panasonic things work, how easily they can be soldered, what they
impose as the minimum distance between buttons.
I see.
At present, we do not have this. As I understand it, Slyon's cases do
not fit together properly and so we cannot build a complete GTA04 case
from them yet (has this changed?) There are also no case component kits
available.
The key missing part is the UMTS pentaband antenna. There are
antenna modules out there (e.g. Antenova) but those are too big.
It might be worth designing a slightly different case in order to
accommodate a usable antenna module. There is a danger of allowing
one's self to be limited by the existing design. I would say change the
case design if it will allow production of complete phones.
for (;;) { ++pancakes; }
You could do pancakes+=2; :)
True. But why would I want to skip a pancake? ;-)
--
Bob Ham r...@settrans.net
Diaspora: r...@pod.settrans.net
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Re: QtMoko v44 for Freerunner now available
On Wed, 02 May 2012 18:04:42 +0200 francesco.dev...@mailoo.org wrote: Hi Thanks for the new version Radek, fresh installed on my GTA02! It's ok on the NAND, but on SD I'm unable to boot it. Qi apparently skips the card and it boots from NAND instead. Is it because of the issue with the v44 kernel for the GTA02? Thanks. Joif I'd be willing to bet it's something to do with your Qi setup or the SD card setup as IIRC Qi polls the SD card first for a bootable partition and only then boots from NAND. HTH, Brian ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [ANN] GTA04 Keyboard prototype
we have developed a prototype for a 80 button QWERTY keyboard PCB ... That's cool news, thet put some hope on top of current lots-of-garbage-but-no-usable-device style smartphone market. b) design a 3D printable case with key-caps that is robust enough I suggest using a scissor mechanism where the keyboard slides out instead. Hmm... I could not get what is the alternative to keyboard that slides out the main case. If keyboard is not mechanically mounted with phone into single divice (e.g. if it is a separate box connected by a wire), it immediately gets a major usability hit - same as e.g. external bluetooth keyboard has. One can't keep phone AND keyboard in one hand while e.g. standing in crowded transport. Nikita ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QtMoko v44 for Freerunner now available
Il 02/05/2012 18:29, Brian ha scritto:
I'd be willing to bet it's something to do with your Qi setup or the SD
card setup as IIRC Qi polls the SD card first for a bootable partition
and only then boots from NAND.
HTH,
Brian
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Maybe it is my SD card that is broken. I tried Qi from QtMoko v38 and
v44, installed QtMoko v38 and v44 on the SD, formatted the SD more than a
time, I am able to mount it (both on my pc and my GTA02), read and
write it, no errors shown by disk checks, but still no boot.
Because Qi doesn't show any output I cannot say what is going
on. Maybe I can use uboot but I don't know the parameters to select
the SD. I use the following for the boot from NAND:
setenv bootargs ${bootargs_base} ${mtdparts} rootfstype=ubifs
ubi.mtd=6,2048 root=ubi0:om-gta02-rootfs; nand read.e 0x3200
kernel 0x30; bootm 0x3200
How can I adapt it for the SD?
Thanks
Joif
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