Adding new page to wiki (was: Re: sysfsutils -- the script)
On Thu, 24 Jul 2008 09:22:37 +0200, arne anka [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't you have access to the wiki? nope. lost my creds somewhere -- and to be honest, i never got the hang of this whole wiki thing ... at least when it comes to creating pages from scratch. Hi, In case this helps, To get a new password go to: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Special:Userlogin Enter your username: Arne.anka and click the 'E-mail password' button. To start a new page you can either create a link to it first on another page, like this: [My_new_page] then click the resulting link and start editing the new page, or you can add your new page name to the URL in your browser's address-bar, like this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/My_new_page and create the page first, before linking to it, or allow the wiki nannies to do the linking for you... they will see your page show up here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Special:Recentchanges Here is some info on adding your page to the correct categories: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Editing_wiki I added the info from this email here: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko_Wiki_Editing_Guidelines#Adding_a_new_page Hope that helps Richard. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
OT: Do Linux-oriented companies use Linux?
Hi, I'm interested in promoting the use of Linux at the workplace. I've found that invariably policies at companies make it harder to use Linux as they will prohibit its use on the network, or use MS-centric tools like Exchange or proprietary document formats or software that requires Windows. This was even the case at my previous company where they develop applications on Solaris. They require everyone to have good Linux/Unix knowledge but actively discourage using Linux/OpenSolaris at the workplace. I was wondering how this is handled at companies like Openmoko (or is it FIC?). What is the network setup like, which OS is standard? What do you guys use on your laptops? Thanks for any info. Richard. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Antwerp group buy
Hi all, We're at about 7 confirmed people around Antwerp, Belgium, who will be placing a group-order, probably from Germany. That way we should save considerably on postage and get a discounted purchase price. Anyone who'd like to join us to order within the next week or so, and can come to Antwerp to pick-up their phone is welcome to send me a mail. Regards, Richard. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: 10 or more phones order
On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:28:56 +0200, Ilja O. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Apr 28, 2008 at 12:12 PM, Federico Lorenzi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: And why is it not in Python? It would be too easy to read. So why's it not in Perl then, You could do all that in a simple one-liner... ;o) Richard ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FreeRunner delayed a further 6 months?!?!??
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 01:49:57 +0100, Marco Trevisan (Treviño) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I do agree with this... Btw imho all the words written in this thread are due to only one thing: the lack of communication by the FIC developers (the hardware ones first of all, but also the software ones). I think they mostly talk with their code, but the most part of the community doesn't really know what they're doing and what is really happening in Taiwan. That's why this thread started! So, imho not to loose credibility FIC/Openmoko should have a better relationship with its followers relasing more informations both about the project status and about the future plans. Don't you agree? All the info is there, you just have to subscribe to the other mailinglists, see: http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/ and also the feeds section: http://planet.openmoko.org/ I think if you have time to make a weekly overview of all that info, and blog it somewhere, you would be providing what you are asking for... I'd read it... Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Community update: Regarding Neo FreeRunner pre-orders
On Mon, 25 Feb 2008 22:48:08 +0100, David Pottage [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If FIC setup a web shop in a European country with a low sales tax rate such as Belgum, Europeans buying Freerunner phones could save around 10% compared with buying from a German web shop. Don't you mean Luxemburg? They have 15% tax I think, in Belgium it is 21%. Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: support for using yyyy-mm-dd (2008-01-31) date format in Wiki and elsewhere
On Tue, 05 Feb 2008 01:27:31 +0100, Jeremiah Flerchinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I myself am used to using dates like 04 Feb 2008. How about just inverting this order so it matches what you want, but the abbreviation of the month is used? Then nobody would get confused on what is the day what is the month. they would if they're not used to the English abreviations for the months... I say we use Unix timestamp, then everyone can write their own parser to format it like they prefer. ;o) Seriously though, using 2008-feb-01 has the disadvantage of one not being able to sort by month, where 2008-02-01 sorting and adding/subtracting months is easier. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: New To the list
On Fri, 07 Dec 2007 11:18:15 +0100, flexd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I believe it's called a Neo1973, not Treo. Maybe they changed the name to accent the tri-band character of the phone ;o) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GTK vs QTopia vs Android - (was: Re: Android needs applications) (will be: new vision for openmoko)
On Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:59:33 +0100, Michael Schmidt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So make a poll for GTK-OS versus Qtopia. maybe it is not only a technical question. Is there an emulator to test both systems on my windows machine? then i can give a vote based on the stomach. If not, then I vote for Qtopia, as this allows secure VOIP with the mentioned Qt-Application for openmoko. Why start another QT/GTK discussion? This has been hashed to death already in so many projects. What you have is a device, Neo1973 that will come preloaded with Openmoko, a GTK based OS. You then have the choice to add or replace that with Qtopia, or Sun's JavaFX Mobile platform, or any number of other OSses that will shorely be ported to the Neo soon. That's great, No need for additional OS wars. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Bi-weekly OpenMoko community update
On Mon, 15 Oct 2007 11:18:55 +0200, Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: so no, we do want and require the source code to everything Change your government then. Of course. This is but a small first step on the road to world domination ;o) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
ARM offers more duplication
See: http://www.theregister.com/2007/10/04/arm_linux/ http://www.arm.com/markets/cmc/linux.html http://www.arm.com/products/os/linux.html ARM are developing another open source Linux platform including an X11, GTK+ GUI environment. Shame openembedded or openmoko didn't show up in their Google searches when they put this project together. Isn't FIC a sufficiently large customer to allow partner status? Oh well... even more choice, we just have to wait longer for it. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Help Request for our Webshop
On Sat, 22 Sep 2007 17:33:42 +0200, Sean Moss-Pultz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear Community, We have a specification and database model in place for our new webshop but we can't find the resources needed to implement this in the near future. I think it is great that you ask this of the community first. I was wondering just the other day why Openmoko never posted any job openings on the list, and now you did. Having people who are enthusiastic about the project working on it can only be for the better. Cheers, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: GPS accuracy
On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 21:43:45 +0200, Krzysztof Kajkowski [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi! Check out picture in this article: http://www.openmoko.org.pl/node/41 I had my Neo on the buttom of my back pack while riding a bike. Accuracy was up to about 2m. It was realy good. Hi, Do you mean your phone was inside your backpack and it could reliably save a position every 3 seconds? Or was it stuck to the outside of your backpack? And you were not using the 'assistive' part of a-gps, i.e. not communicating with a server to provide positioning info? I'm surprised as I heard reports from other devices of people having to go up on a hill and wait for 10 minutes before they got a position fix... BTW, I think you have a small error in the title Qtopia on Neo1973 unrevealed!. If you meant to say they have hidden something that was previously revealed it is correct, otherwise you'd want to use 'Qtopia on Neo1973 revealed' or 'Qtopia on Neo1973 unveiled' Regards, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Message duplicates
Hi Harald, Could you please check whether spamassassin has frozen again? The duplicate messages seem to have started once more. Thanks, Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: ATT is cruising for a bruising
On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 13:06:02 +0200, Sander van Grieken [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: wifi+in china - use Tor Maybe better just not use email at all in that case: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/09/10/misuse_of_tor_led_to_embassy_password_breach/ ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Message duplicates (was: Changes between GTA1 and GTA2?)
On Fri, 17 Aug 2007 07:06:53 +0200, Harald Welte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's actually a crashing spamassassin, which then causes the DATA section of an incoming SMTP transfer to time out, which again causes some sending email servers, such as gmail, who have a short timeout, to transfer the message again. And 'some mail admin' is unfortunately just me. Hi Harald, Could you please check whether spamassassin has crashed again? The duplicate messages seem to have started once more. A crude solution to make spamassassin restart if it crashes could be to start it with a script, wrap the start command in a loop that can never finish. When spamassassin dies, the command will re-run... Then you can find the reason it crashes later on when you have time. (probably never ;o) Thanks, Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Message duplicates (was: Changes between GTA1 and GTA2?)
On Mon, 27 Aug 2007 12:25:12 +0200, Harald Welte [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, Aug 27, 2007 at 11:56:57AM +0200, Richard Bennett wrote: Hi Harald, Could you please check whether spamassassin has crashed again? it locked up again :( The duplicate messages seem to have started once more. nobody inside openmoko will ever notice that, since we all use cyrus imapd, and its deliver program will filter duplicate message-ids A crude solution to make spamassassin restart if it crashes could be to start it with a script, wrap the start command in a loop that can never finish. When spamassassin dies, the command will re-run... Then you can find the reason it crashes later on when you have time. (probably never ;o) that would really be easy. unfortunately it just locks up, doesn't die. Ok, thanks for fixing it. There are still some dupes coming through, but I guess those were rejected before you fixed Spamassassin and will stop shortly. Regards, Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Crossroads
On Wednesday 14 March 2007 09:30, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote: I have a much more important question, however: will the Neo work with european electrons, or will I need to import asian ones? If I'd need to import a new set of electrons to use for charging my battery every time it runs out, it'd become very expensive very soon. If, on the other hand, I could use my regular wall outlet, the power would be free. You might need to buy a power (head) adapter depending on where you live. But this is what we all have to go through traveling around this world. Can anyone *OFFICIAL* give me any advice on this? If you don't do that within 10 minutes, I'll get a Windows Mobile phone instead. If you're seriously considering buying a Windows Mobile over something like a power adapter, which you could buy at any store for maybe 10 euro, this really is the wrong the device for you now. Hopefully we can better meet your requirements in September. Really guys, this is developers device now. It's for people who think Windows Mobile sucks. And we [all of us together] can do better ;-) -Sean I think you forgot to switch on your irony filter this morning ;o) I'm pretty sure that post was meant tongue-in-cheek as an example of an unrealistic customer support request at this stage... Cheers, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: FOSDEM OpenMoko talk now on video.google.com
On Tuesday 27 February 2007 09:07, denis wrote: Have you ever seen Nokia (or any other company) announcing the SAME device (just with 2-5 more features) in 6 months. I have never seen this. Yeah. I think it is really great that they are so open about these things. At least this way everybody has a choice - either use the simulator to develop your apps, and buy the phone after the hardware upgrade (yes, after they add WIFI, motion detectors, stereo mics, multi-point touch screen and a heart-rate monitor), or if you can afford it, buy one early and upgrade later-on at a reduced price. Any other company would just release the updated phone 2 weeks after you bought yours, and wouldn't offer a trade-in deal... Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Content from the old wiki to the new wiki
On Sunday 18 February 2007 02:50, ryan lerch wrote: The content transfer from the old wiki (http://www.linuxtogo.org/gowiki/OpenMoko/) to the new one (http://wiki.openmoko.org/) is about 1/3 complete. if you have some spare time, and are not a developer as such, yet want to help out, feel free to help us transfer this content over. for a run-down of the content that still needs to be migrated see the wiki's community portal: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/OpenMoko:Community_Portal Ok, I moved the FOSDEM article. I created a new section ' FIC / OpenMoko at Events' on the new wiki to allow grouping all events together. I have a few questions: Should we delete the old articles? I just put the new URL at the top, but maybe it is best to delete it altogether? Old: http://www.linuxtogo.org/gowiki/OpenMoko/AtFOSDEM New: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FOSDEM How would I go about making a category 'events' so all events can be shown on a page grouped together, and the URL would become .../wiki/events/FOSDEM ? Why can PDF files not be uploaded? it says that that is not a recommended image format, but I'm trying to upload it as a file, not image. Is there no WIKI webmaster yet, for this kind of questions? The Search function doesn't seem to work at all. Cheers, Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Content from the old wiki to the new wiki
On Sunday 18 February 2007 17:30, Ole Tange wrote: On 2/18/07, Ole Tange [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 2/18/07, Richard Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why can PDF files not be uploaded? it says that that is not a recommended image format, but I'm trying to upload it as a file, not image. I will look into that. I just uploaded http://wiki.openmoko.org/images/2/27/Neo1973-doll.pdf by checking the box: Ignore warning. I can link to it using: [[Media:Neo1973-doll.pdf]] Hope that answered your question. That's what I did, but it kept giving the same warning... when I tried it now it gave: Fatal error: Call to a member function on a non-object in /space/www/wiki/includes/ImagePage.php on line 247 But then refreshing the page and all was ok... I added your PDF to the Fosdem page too, if that's ok. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Content from the old wiki to the new wiki
On Sunday 18 February 2007 17:19, Ole Tange wrote: Ok, I moved the FOSDEM article. I created a new section ' FIC / OpenMoko at Events' on the new wiki to allow grouping all events together. I would think it might be better put under http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Current_events Except that that page is not linkled from the front page, that I can see. Could the Current_events page be set to show its 5 first items on the frontpage ? (I'd use the views module if this was Drupal). I added [[Category:events]] to both pages to tie them together for a start. How would I go about making a category 'events' so all events can be shown on a page grouped together, and the URL would become .../wiki/events/FOSDEM ? A category is added using: [[Category:FOO]]. It will not create the URL, but it will make it easy to make pages like: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Category:Ideas Ok, I used [[Category:events]] . It's irritating the way the wiki changes the capitalization all the time, reminds me of windows... Events are typically date centered. Would it be feasible to change all event titles, so they start with the start date in ISO8601: -MM-DD? Then the category page would show events in calendar order. 2007-02-23 FOSDEM 2007-03-15 Pingwinaria 2007 I tried that, by moving the current page, but the category links don't get updated, and I moved the main page first by accident (and moved it back), so in the end I left it like that. The Search function doesn't seem to work at all. That is a bad bug report. If you search for NEO you get no results, so I thought it didn't work at all. Now it seems it only searches the titles of pages, not the content, even after selecting all the checkboxes in 'preferences'. Maybe that's by design, but then 'Search Title' would be a better description. Cheers, Richard. (BTW, no need to CC me offlist, I follow all posts to the list) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Attaching accessories (was: OpenMoko Challenges
On Tuesday 13 February 2007 03:36, Ryan Kline wrote: Wouldn't it be hilarious if we finally find a USB power solution after spending many hours laboriously building a device only to find that Sean has decided to power the USB port. yes, but that wouldn't solve all the problems: You'd still have something hanging off the bottom of the phone. You'd still have trouble getting 5volt out of a 3.3volt phone without emptying the battery real fast. It is still hard to charge the phone while connecting an accessory to it. Connecting more then one accessory would be a mess. Many accessories like infra-red eye or RF sender (for remote control applications), and many others don't have a USB interface. Of course, if FIC themselves don't release a flexible accessory platform, like the proposed smart-battery with payload, and the NEO becomes popular, a company like Velleman for instance might well release a range of accessories. Cheers, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Attaching accessories (was: OpenMoko Challenges
On Tuesday 13 February 2007 13:05, Florent THIERY wrote: yes, but that wouldn't solve all the problems: You'd still have something hanging off the bottom of the phone. To me, the most valuable feature is the keyboard; a small one, but usable. And it's not something you use on mobility situation (in the streets...). With the not-sexy-at-all battery powered usb hub, will a keyboard work easily? USB keyboard support in the kernel would be sufficient, right? It would seem to be cleaner to use a bluetooth keyboard. No messy cables or anything, and it has batteries built-in. There's a few examples on the wiki. Cheers, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Get your own OpenMoko T-Shirt
On Monday 12 February 2007 04:59, Daniel Willmann wrote: Hi, I spent some time designing t-shirts and polo-shirts with the OpenMoko logo: http://www.spreadshirt.net/shop.php?sid=211795 Thanks goes to the coreteam who allowed me to use the logo. Hi, Is this something where the proceeds go to Openmoko somehow, or simply a private initiative? Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Attaching accessories (was: OpenMoko Challenges
On Tuesday 13 February 2007 02:08, Florent THIERY wrote: http://www.cyberpowersystems.com/CPH420MP.asp , available on Amazon There seem to be battery powered usb hubs ** *Hub 420 MP* You do run the risk of looking a bit like a nerd with one of those and a few USB peripherals hanging off your phone though ;o) r ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Fake it at FOSDEM
Hi, It's not that I have too much time on my hands or anything, I just finally got around to adding some stuff to the WIKI that I had lying around: http://www.linuxtogo.org/gowiki/OpenMoko/AtFOSDEM Cheers, and see you there! Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Fake it at FOSDEM
On Friday 09 February 2007 23:03, Marcel de Jong wrote: On 2/9/07, Richard Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, It's not that I have too much time on my hands or anything, I just finally got around to adding some stuff to the WIKI that I had lying around: http://www.linuxtogo.org/gowiki/OpenMoko/AtFOSDEM I actually had to rotate that image to find out what the text on the back said... :) Yeah... it was done so that when the (fake) phone hangs from your neck, other people can read the text on the back, but that the frontpanel is the correct way round when you yourself look at it... I've no idea what the real backpanel looks like though, as I couldn't find a photo of it anywhere - probably just boring black... BTW, if anyone needs a lift to Brussels from Antwerp or Mechelen on that Friday, send me a mail. Cheers, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Missed call communication protocol
On Thursday 08 February 2007 09:01, Alexandre Ghisoli wrote: Sorry to throw a spanner in the works but I'm not sure that this will work here. It may work in other countries. I think I heard about it working in the US. I'll second that for switzerland. When you subscribe for a E1 channel or direct VoIP trunk, you cannot send full e.164 number, but only the last digits that stick in the range of number the telco gave (rent ?) to you. Now that you mention it I have noticed that sometimes to during testing, but not always. Now, for law enforcement, you are *NOT* allowed to change your clip on the network. Ok, if that is the case then using the CLI won't fly beyond skunkworks anyway. 2/ For ISDN network (Q.931 signaling), use of the UserInfo field, on the signaling session (yes, you can send some byte when the phone is ringing, without charge) Ok... Are you sure you don't mean the 'Display' field in the ISDN SETUP message? I can't find references to a UserInfo field in q931. http://www.cotse.com/CIE/Topics/126.htm Apparently the Q.931 protocol limits the maximum length of the Display Field information element to 44 octets, that should mean one can use 44 characters for a message without opening the line, which would be fine. It seems that GSM should support the full range of ISDN messages, http://kbs.cs.tu-berlin.de/~jutta/gsm/js-intro.html so I'm wondering, why is no one using this for enhanced caller-ID, or similar applications. Where's the catch? Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Missed call communication protocol
On Thursday 08 February 2007 16:20, Jonathon Suggs wrote: Telcos are not going to let this type of thing happen. I'm all for being able to do things for 'free as in beer' with my 'free as in speech' phone...BUT if we start abusing some features/protocols then they will notice/retaliate. True, using the altered CLI to pass messages could be regarded as abuse, but using the q931 Display field for passing information is a legitimate use of the protocol. That said, this has been a great thread with some very good concepts and outside the box thinking. However, the underlying concept of what we are doing/proposing *IS WRONG* no matter how you look at it. We are trying to effectively use something that does cost money (air time) and instead of paying for it, manipulate it so that we get benefit and pay nothing in return. Just because a resource has not been monetized by the telcos yet, doesn't mean it 'IS WRONG' by definition, it just means nobody saw a business case in charging for it yet. When I started using SMS there was no charge for it, the telco's didn't think people would want to to pay for such a crippled service. In this day of disruptive technologies it is sometimes not clear what is abuse, and what is progress. Is it good or bad that Google decide they have the right to scan whole libraries of books without having permission from the authors? some call it progress, others theft. Is Skype good or bad? Don't they abuse a shared network originally meant for sharing data by sending voice over it without paying? This is also has potential for giving OpenMoko and open phones in general a bad name/press. Headlines reading renegade phones undermine network, higher charges for everyone coming with some baseless statistics about how much it cost them to effectively ban this activity. That's true, but it might also make it clear that there is a need for a cheap lightweight signaling mechanism. If you attended a VON you will notice mobile carriers are full of 'leveraging added value services' IMS is supposed to be the holy grail. In reality they are having trouble getting much beyond MMS, wallpapers and ringtones. They just don't have the imagination to find services that will allow them to recoup on their 3G investments. Now if, instead of treating their customers like dumb terminals, they start to realize that given the correct tools the customers will find their own products, and be happy to pay for them, as long as the point of entry is kept low enough... They need to supply a lightweight signaling protocol, access to their IMS infrastructure through an API, and the ability to prick holes in their walled garden, similar to the way we use firewalls. Sure it sounds radical, but everyone is doing it on the internet, why not in telecom? This would allow really powerfull tools to be built, things the telco's could never imagine, similar to what people are doing with Googlemaps, or Openmoko/Neo for that matter. I administer racks and racks of servers, and never thought I would use a third-party web-service. I like doing things myself, being in controll. Nevertheless I have ended up being an Amazon Webservices customer. Why? because they offer radically new ways of working with a very low initial cost. (I'm talking about EC2 and S3). With a project in its infancy we need to make friends not enemies. We especially don't need to (unnecessarily) piss off the people that control the communication links...as without them (love or hate them) we can't really do anything. With a product like Neo, and a platform like Openmoko we'll be breaking down a whole lot more doors than just this one. Telco's can be afraid of this, and most will be, but if there are any radical thinkers amongst them, like the people behind the Neo, they will recognize that this is an opportunity to use the community to help develop their products for them, and see that offering low-cost tools to allow a flourishing community to thrive will cost them a lot less than old-school RD departments sitting on their hands coming up with overpriced stale offerings. (Why is there still no presence indicator for SMS, no buddy-lists, no re-use of existing online profiles, no server-backup of your contacts, no online access to your SMSes, no online access to your voice-mail, or voice-mail to email forwarding, no multi-number accounts with online presence indicators for work/home and optional location information (Yes he has arrived in London, but is currently in meeting until 2pm) , why isn't all that integrated in the existing business tools?) The list goes on and on. I think it was brought up before that the underlying messaging protocol should be pluggable/interchangeable. That sounds like a good way to proceed. Being able to specify if you should get notifications via SMS or a persistent GPRS connection or even possibly through an out-of-band signaling method like what is being
Re: Missed call communication protocol
On Thursday 08 February 2007 15:06, Alexandre Ghisoli wrote: I was working on a project, maybe 15 years ago, where we developped a modem to transfer data : 1/ during setup, for free 2/ during the blanks of a conversation (approx 80% of the time, because only one speaks at time, so you got a free 64kbps channel :)) This takes not very long until telco notice the D channel trafic, and since then, they charge for alerting, even if no answer (maybe 10% of unanswered call) to cover this trafic costs. I can't say I have ever seen these costs mentioned anywhere for wholesale termination, but they might be mentioned in the TC, and only applied if they detect a strangely high percentage of bad calls. Actually, I would be quite happy if they opened-up this mechanism, and did charge something (like 10% of the CPM) for it for those end-users who wanted the service. it would allow seeing extended user identification for people not yet in your contacts book, and quick saving of contacts without typing their names. (amongst a whole range of other uses) So, second part was to cut additional messages (SETUP DISPLAY) between network (aka roaming or international call). This need a more deeper test, but IMOO, this *could* be working on some networks, and probably not on some other. Now, about GSM networks and Gateways, I really dont know if this is a 1:1 passtrough .. I think some testing would be usefull, although I it will probably not work reliably across networks... I still have a 4E1 Didgium board lying around somewhere begging for something usefull to be done with it... Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Missed call communication protocol
Hi all, In keeping with moving the control advantage away from the network operators, and to the users, I wonder what you think of this suggestion: When you use a SIP server, like Openser.org , you can set the CLI (Calling line identifier) to any value you like when you send the call on to a PSTN gateway. That means the 'from' number you see on your mobile screen when I call you from a SIP proxy can be any numeric value I like. (most PSTN termination gateways will require a valid e164 number http://www.answers.com/topic/e-164). So I can send a call to my openmoko number, using a CLI set to +10 followed by 13 arbitrary numbers, which should satisfy the e164 requirement . No real phone numbers start with +10 , so I could program my openmoko to reject any calls arriving with a CLI starting with +10, and to process the next 13 numbers of the CLI as a message, hiding this call from the missed calls list. As far as I know there is no networks charge for a rejected call from a mobile, and initiating a call from the openmoko to a number that always returns a 'busy' would also be free of charge. This gives us a free up/down communication channel that can take a payload of 13 numbers in each packet. This could be used for: * Push email notification. * Presence. Like the 'online' indicator in a chat app that shows your status. This is the next big area carriers are looking to charge us for, with their new IM platforms. It can also be used in the routing logic of your own SIP proxy/PBX, for instance: Forward calls to mobile unless GSM presence is 'meeting' in that case send calling number by SMS, if SMS presence is 'available', and forward calls to secretary. * Ultra Short Message Service (SMSes that use a phrase-book on both sender and receiver, so you send the number that identifies a pre-formatted message i.e.: 112='Please call home when you're free'). * Trigger predefined macros (shell scripts) on the phone, like Send GPS coords by SMS. * Sync applications, like 'mark meeting14 as postponed', or New updates available, do you want to sync now? etc Unless our list lawyers shoot this idea down from the start, we could start thinking about the best way to define a missed-call protocol. I'm thinking of using 4 of the numbers as a identifying pincode, then a 3 digit action identifier, and use the next 6 digits as payload depending on what action was selected . For instance update our presence info from the Openmoko to a server: Call server: +122334455 send CLI +101234999100100 That is: +1 = Required valid international code 0 = protocol identifier that never occurs in real calls. 1234= pincode to identify the caller, and assign access rights. (Many different servers could send MCP (missed call protocol) messages to the same phone, a bit like the bluetooth pincode/identifier) 999 = matches 'update presence information' 1 = GSM available. 0 = GPRS offline 0 = Bluetooth offline 1 = SMS available 0 = reserved 0 = reserved. What do you think? Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Missed call communication protocol
On Wednesday 07 February 2007 13:42, Florent THIERY wrote: I like it too, but technically, it's a hidden channel (illegal...) Hi, I wonder if it is illegal, it is used quite a lot allready: Callback has been used for years to circumvent collecting charges: ring a number that returns a 'busy' signal, the system then calls back the CLI it detected. Ringback is used widely by carriers: Call someone who's number is busy, the carrier will offer to connect you when the other party is free, using the CLI they detected from your failed call. Progress messages: Carriers will routinely playback audio messages without actually opening the line, like 'The person you are trying to call is out of reach...' . Missed Call display on a mobile. By displaying the message 'you have 4 missed calls', and then making it possible to ring these people back mobiles are already using MCP in a limited way. As far as I see there is nothing illegal going on. When SMSses were first introduced they were free too, it was only later carriers started charging for them. Carriers could also start charging for missed calls, if people started using MCP in a big way, but by that time openmoko will have wifi ;o) Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Missed call communication protocol
On Wednesday 07 February 2007 12:26, wim delvaux wrote: If this works I vote for it (for as long as it will work ...) However receiving SMS is also free no ? couldn't you use that ? You usually pay to send SMSses. Of course some calling plans entitle you to X free speech minutes, and X free SMSses, but at the end of the day you are still paying for them. If we keep the protocol light enough that it can function by using the Missed Call feature, then we can use the same protocol to do lightweight messaging over GPRS, Bluetooth, Wifi or SMS, whatever transport mode happens to be available, falling back on the Missed Call feature if nothing else is available. In cases where SMS is free to send and receive , or you have unlimited GPRS, you could configure openmoko to use those channels for sending its MCP messages. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Wiki pdf / images
Hi, I am trying to add a pdf and some images to an openmoko wiki page http://www.linuxtogo.org/gowiki/OpenMoko/AtFOSDEM , but the 'attach file' option in 'More actions' is grayed out. Can attaching files be allowed, or am I doing something wrong? Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Openmoko podcast
Hi, i didn't see this podcast mentioned here yet: http://www.lugradio.org/episodes/70 Lugradio have a typically disrespectful Openmoko (Yoko-Ono, Open-boner) review, and an interview with Mickey Lauer. I also never realized that FIC is not just some little startup, but actually the company originally behind HTC. That makes it a lot more likely that they will still be around for V2 to get released, and for V1 to actually work. Good stuff. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Introduction, and: Re: an idea: GPS blog?
On Tuesday 23 January 2007 10:51, Oleg L. Sverdlov wrote: Videoblogging has its niche, but how about a small application that remembers where you've been during a day , and how long; and then visualizes everything in form of nice coloured curves, and publishes to your blog? Hi, I've been thinking the same thing, if you are talking about colored curves over a map that is. Maybe I can take this opportunity to introduce myself: I'm Richard Bennett, I'm an independent software developer living in Belgium, but doing a lot of my work in the US through my partnership company, GRITechnologies.com . Some years ago I made an application for tracking snow plows by GPS. This was in the days before prevalent wifi, and worked by sending the GPS coordinates back to the server in small dumps, by SMS or by GPRS (or the US equivalent). Something similar should be perfectly possible for travelers using the Neo... send in an SMS every hour with the coordinates, and prompt the user if they would like to add a descriptive text about the area they are in. Alternatively it could just store the coordinates for a longer time and send one SMS for a whole days travel. Before getting too excited I thought I'd better wait and see how well the GPS works though, because if you have to hold the phone up in the air and wait for 2 minutes for it to sync it won't be very user-friendly... Here are some screenshots of the app we made: http://www.gritechnologies.com/products/webowl/screenshots/ I also wrote a few papers on tracking GPS using SVG too: http://www.gritechnologies.com/papers/gps_tracking_with_svg/ http://www.gritechnologies.com/papers/gps_tracking_with_svg/part2.html http://www.gritechnologies.com/papers/gps_tracking_with_svg/svg_and_base64.html (The SVG examples won't work unless you have Adobe's SVG plugin version 3) So yes... I've been thinking of doing this, but need to see if the GPS performs fast enough to keep it user-friendly. Other work I'm doing for the US Census Bureau is displaying statistics on a lightweight web-mapping client, see: http://lehdmap.dsd.census.gov/ (try 'anoka' for a test lookup) I have the interface working on my Nokia E61 on the Opera and the Nokia browser, but the lack of a mouse makes selecting arbitrary areas difficult. The Neo with GPS and a touch-screen might be ideal for data input... The mapping data could be loaded from a micro-SD card, or cached from a bluetooth/USB network, and surveyors could annotate the data in the field, either in realtime, or store and sync. It would also be an option to load the mapping data locally, and the data overlays over GPRS. This is just a bit of RD, I don't know if it will work out or not, but it's fun to play around with. We're using the Mapserver as the back-end (http://mapserver.gis.umn.edu/), so if there are any people interested in working on mapping and Openmoko, we can setup a wiki page or something to help focus our efforts, or at least link to the various projects. Cheers, Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Neo1973 device description and picture for xoo.
On Monday 22 January 2007 12:17, Sean Moss-Pultz wrote: Wow somebody buy this guy a beer! Best place would be the beer event of fosdem. Friday evening. ;) Deal. Drinks will be on me! -Sean Does that mean Openmoko will be at FOSDEM in Brussels next month? and you are refering to this friday: http://www.fosdem.org/2007/beerevent ? I'll be there too in that case. (To the wiki-listbot, yes I'll add something to the wiki about this too, if confirmed) Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Is python built-in
On Monday 22 January 2007 14:03, Tomasz Zielinski wrote: 2007/1/22, Jose Manrique Lopez de la Fuente [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I would like to know if python and pygtk is going to be installed in Neo1973 devices. Of course, some extra info about extra-python-features in this device would be nice. I seriously doubt it. I found python RPM and it has about 10 MB *compressed*. All default Neo1973 software (including kernel and libs) must fit in 64MB flash storage... Hi, If I'm looking correctly, Nokia's Python for s60 platform comes in a 2 mb: http://forum.nokia.com/info/sw.nokia.com/id/ee447e84-2851-471a-8387-3434345f2eb0/Python_for_S60.html Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: how to get the video Re: Sean interview
On Monday 22 January 2007 20:28, Dave Crossland wrote: On 22/01/07, Robert Michel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Is it available in a downloadable format for people who can't view Flash movies? (I'm running Linux on a PPC machine here, so nothing from Adobe...) hmm I found this http://www.arrakis.es/~rggi3/youtube-dl/ www.keepvid.com does what this does :-) And in case you're wondering what to use to play a .flv, vlc dvd player will do that. I got it like this: urpmi libdvdcss2 libdvdplay0 wxvlc vlc-plugin-a52 vlc-plugin-ogg vlc-plugin-mad apt-get should be similar, you don't really need all the plugins for the .fla of course. Richard ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Free Your Phone
On Tuesday 23 January 2007 00:30, Gervais Mulongoy wrote: The best part is that neither carrier will be able to stop me from writing warez for this phone and all future OpenMokos. You're lucky it isn't a Windows mobile phone, or you'd have your phones and email tapped by the FBI if you posted that on the manufacturer's website ;o) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why do I want WiFi?
On Thursday 18 January 2007 13:25, Gabriel Ambuehl wrote: On Thursday 18 January 2007 09:54, Renaissance Man wrote: Seamless swapping needs the carriers' help. And they won't do it for free, rest assured. Already being done. See http://truphone.com Doesn't really say how it works. An all SIP solution doesnt really sound like it could ever be seamless with GSM. I'd really like to know just how this supposed to work, because if they pulled this off, it would be really huge. Hi, I was at their presentation at VON Berlin, and if I understand correctly, they will try to send an incoming call to your SIP UA first, and if it is unreachable they will forward it to your GSM line. The same goes for outgoing calls. I don't think they suggest that the same call would switch between hotspot / gsm / hotspot without interuption at the moment. You can sign-up for a free account if you have an S60 OS Nokia phone, from anywhere in the world basically. They seem to be in the 'give it all away for free to get some market-share' phase. Here's the presentation they gave: http://www.openser.org/events/2006-OpenSER-Summit/slides/openser-summit-2006_04_james.body_truphone-reversing-the-paradigm.pdf At the time the presentation did seems a little 'too good to be true' to me though, given that nobody at VON could manage to get their Nokia e-series phones to sync with the provided wifi, not even the people demoing the Nokia e61 at the Nokia stand... HTH Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: what is the difference between openMoko and windows mobile based phones
On Thursday 18 January 2007 12:39, hank williams wrote: What I mean by this is that it seems everyone is saying that the big difference is that you can get 3rd party *real apps* on the phone. And this is said as if windows mobile phones like moto q, blackjack and pocket PC phones wont allow this. You are buying freedom, but this comes at a cost: I'm prepared to pay more for a phone that might offer less out of the box, to get freedom. I'm prepared to invest time learning how to improve my phone, purely because I enjoy that. I'm prepared to pay upfront, pay more than the market price, or re-purchase the same (improved) device a year later, to support a company that gives me freedom. I'm prepared not to buy a phone - however good it is - that would make Microsoft any money, because they control our freedom and it is important that manufacturers see they can make money without pre-loading each and every device with monopolistic software that restricts user's freedom. You cannot believe how hard it is to purchase a laptop that doesn't automatically include paying Microsoft or Apple some $50 or so in license fees, even if you'll never use their software. (And many companies are even paying for windows twice, once at purchase time and once with their corporate licensing models) What freedom? Last year my son bought a cheap MP3 player. He was surprised that on a windows computer he could only put songs on it, not get them off again. Why? Microsoft wants to give the impression this will prevent people copying songs, so their partner's in the music business are happy. At the same time the memory-stick people are happy, as MS protect their market too. The only person who gets screwed-over is the customer. Plug the same MP3 player into a Linux PC, and you can do what you want with it, even use it as a memory stick for file-transfer. Now I am not saying open source isnt great. But from your *average* users perspective I would love to hear the advantages of the open source for these devices. Is this just a geek issue? I think the free and open movement is based around people who are prepared to make sacrifices to uphold their convictions, and they will often be referred to as geeks. It is starting to creep into the mainstream though, with more and more people realizing that the restrictions they thought were inherent to a device or technology were actually artificially put in place to restrict them, and to get them to keep paying for upgrades and extra options when this is not really necessary. It seems like most of the apps described on this list could be done with any of the windows mobile phones. I'd just love, for my own edification, to hear why this is wrong. Most could, but not always executed in your best interest but often in the interest of the service providers and the manufacturers, often buggy and shoddy (ref lots of Nokia apps), and often not free or opensource. Now if I wanted to load 4 SIM cards into memory, and switch between them when making outgoing calls to avoid roaming charges, which platform would have any chance of allowing this to work? Or if I wanted to backup all my phone's settings and then clone them onto a new phone... ideal for distributing phones within a company. Or if I want to have a command-line operated phone... usersms -ufred 'How are you?' Or if the phone does not support a bluetooth keyboard? Research it and build the driver/profile yourself, or float the idea and wait for someone else to do it, or search the net and find out someone already has. You basically asked what is better, Windows or Linux, and the above is my take on that. Cheers, Richard. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org https://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
