gta02 pcb layout
Hi, after years, was for scientific :) reasons wanted to give a new life to the gta02 I own. Opened it, and the usb connector was enough fragile. Tried to resolder it but the pcb couper line broke. Cannot see precisely to which resistor that line connected. So need a very good magnified photo or the pcb. Anybody can help? -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: gta02 pcb layout
hi! that was a lovely quick answer.. .found the schematics, but was not finding the pcb layout. it looks that I broke the one toward the gps unit, that is towards the ground, which is normaly not used... or .. is it used on gta02? On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 12:07 AM, joerg Reisenweber jo...@openmoko.orgwrote: On Tue 13 May 2014 23:49:13 mobi phil wrote: Hi, after years, was for scientific :) reasons wanted to give a new life to the gta02 I own. Opened it, and the usb connector was enough fragile. Tried to resolder it but the pcb couper line broke. Cannot see precisely to which resistor that line connected. So need a very good magnified photo or the pcb. Anybody can help? schematics http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/schematics/GTA02/Schematics_Freerunner-GTA02_A5-A7cumulative_public_RC0.pdf together with component placement http://people.openmoko.org/joerg/schematics/GTA02/lindi-searchable/ should go a long way for this. Usually ti's just a question to find the right one of two ends of a 0402 resistor or capacitor. The other (wrong) end is usually connected to another similar 0402 component (or GND, or Vdd) so by testing for 4 conductance aka 0R connections from both ends of component A to both ends of component B you should be able to spot the wrong end. The other one is the right end then, which you want to use to connect your bridging wire to. If you need more help, just holler. /j -- () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments (alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some supplementary links:) http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: gta02 pcb layout
I wanted to see only the surface pcb. But it looks that I am lucky. Broke a pin that is usually marked as not used ... soldering mission completed successfully... could connect with cdc ethernet... thanks a lot! On Wed, May 14, 2014 at 12:59 AM, joerg Reisenweber jo...@openmoko.orgwrote: On Wed 14 May 2014 00:27:11 mobi phil wrote: hi! that was a lovely quick answer.. .found the schematics, but was not finding the pcb layout. The PCB layout is an 8-layer (iirc, maybe 10) which is pretty hard to publish in any useful representation other than the layout program's own one. Anyway you don't need PCB layout to solve your problem. it looks that I broke the one toward the gps unit, that is towards the ground, which is normaly not used... or .. is it used on gta02? Please send (link to) a number of macro snapshots illustrating your problem in a way so I can look up a solution for you. cheers jOERG -- () ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail /\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments (alas the above page got scrapped due to resignation(!!), so here some supplementary links:) http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml http://www.nonhtmlmail.org/campaign.html http://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil_still.shtml http://www.gerstbach.at/2004/ascii/ (German) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Profiling on openmoko (or ARM generally)
On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Gennady Kupava g...@bsdmn.com wrote: Hi, mobi phil, I am using oprifile. It is excellent profiled, even no need to recompile anything. It is way better. You you want more details/help/examples you can find me on irc. Currently i am planning some optimizations based on profiling data. Thanks Gennady, nice to hear that oprofile works on ARM ... was fighting to get eresi tools (www.eresi-project.org) working on ARM. Will come back to you with results. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Profiling on openmoko (or ARM generally)
Hello, Almost no success in finding past conversation about application profiling on openmoko (and ARM generally). If you did any profiling, please tell me what tools you used. It seems that gprof is not collecting timing information, just number of calls. -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: glamo gdrm,
Modesetting on Glamo is a menace. One tiny false move and either the GPU or the LCM will get upset and decide not to talk to you any more. Here are my numbers for rotated operation. Your rotated display probably comes from your timings being out by a bit. mode.vrefresh = 0 mode.hdisplay = 640 mode.hsync_start = 656 mode.hsync_end = 658 mode.htotal = 660 mode.vdisplay = 480 mode.vsync_start = 496 mode.vsync_end = 504 mode.vtotal = 512 mode.clock = 2450 Currently, KMS doesn't have the concept of rotation, so what goes on to make this work is a horrendous hack, and only supports one landscape orientation (rotated clockwise). Tom Thanks Thomas, hello list just realised that my answer email did not leave my box :(... i was writing... well, I am not really interested in the concept of rotation in kms, but using the phone in landscape mode. I am writing a simple phone framework (proof of concept) that is based only on fb or drm. I need landscape mode for a full screen kb. Portrait would do the job, but all draw operations have to be rotated. It is not tragical, but I thought if the phone is supporting it, why not using it... I tried the settings proposed by you (that differed only in mode.refresh ! :) from my original one). It works and not.. I did not set back the values for portrait and when starting the second time the same application, WSOD... new experience... yes.. I really need the landscape mode as default. The little framework I write, as mentioned would benefit if stuff would be rendered by default to landscape. Based on my measurements copying a 640*480 back buffer to front buffer takes 50msec in non rotated mode, whereas it takes 250msec if I want rotation when rendering. If anybody has some sane timings for landscape, I would really appreciate them.. (preferabbly to have the orientation of USB cable upwards... :) ) rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: glamo gdrm,
Andreas, thanks for the tips, but the values suggested by gtf or cvt did not work (WSOD). I found on internet some values suggested that worked: crtc-mode.vrefresh = 8952 ; crtc-mode.hdisplay = 640 ; crtc-mode.hsync_start = 656 ; crtc-mode.hsync_end = 752 ; crtc-mode.htotal = 800 ; crtc-mode.vdisplay = 480 ; crtc-mode.vsync_start = 490 ; crtc-mode.vsync_end = 492 ; crtc-mode.vtotal = 525 ; crtc-mode.clock = 2518; Thomas, now I have the landscape mode with drm, but it seems that the same problem as was earlier with pixels shifted. The full fb seems to be shifted -100 on x. This is true if I draw to the mapped fb, or if I do accelerated commands. I tried to fix it based on analogy with commit ee53d975c157a9763b6f8637f1c47a3bc0671f77 but... hm... not really straigtforward. Any hints? rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
glamo gdrm,
Hello! I was trying to change to landscape from a custom drm application with following: crtc-mode.vrefresh = 8952 ; crtc-mode.hdisplay = 640 ; crtc-mode.hsync_start = 656 ; crtc-mode.hsync_end = 658 ; crtc-mode.htotal = 660 ; crtc-mode.vdisplay = 480 ; crtc-mode.vsync_start = 496 ; crtc-mode.vsync_end = 504 ; crtc-mode.vtotal = 512 ; crtc-mode.clock = 2450; ret = drmModeSetCrtc(fd, crtc_id, fb_id, 640, 480, r-connectors, 1, (crtc-mode)) ; the original settings reported by drmModeGetCrtc are //480x640 8952 480 496 504 512 640 656 658 660 2450 //240x320 32712 240 256 264 272 320 336 338 340 2450 as it is in xf86-video-glamo/src/glamo-kms-crtc.c, based on the values for 480x640, I inverted the values of v with h and the other way arround. Unfortunatelly the white screen shows up... is any of the timings wrong? rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QtMoko v22
no - andy-tracking does not have kms stuff. All 2.6.32 kernels were until now also without kms - they are built from om-gta02-2.6.32. At that time KMS branch had some problem, which were fixed. Last time i tried KMS branch it worked fine. So maybe next 2.6.32 based release will be with kms. yes, there was this white screen issue. Thomas fixed it and I also tested it, and no problem since then... -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: andy-tracking and gdrm-2.6.32
Thanks Timo, I haven't recently tried it out, but all in all you may be interested in using http://git.bitwiz.org.uk/?p=kernel.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/gdrm-for-merging, which is basically the very latest om-gta02-2.6.32 + KMS/DRM support. It's not currently available at git.openmoko.org. -Timo Was not aware about the repo on Thomas's site. Will try bluetooth with the mentioned reference (gdrm-for-merging). -- rgrds, mobi phil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: andy-tracking and gdrm-2.6.32
maybe then merging gdrm stuff from gdrm branch from git.openmoko.org and rest from gdrm-for-merging? or what would be the best to merge to have both stable 2.6.32 and drm/kms? On Mon, May 17, 2010 at 7:11 PM, Thomas White t...@bitwiz.org.uk wrote: On Mon, 17 May 2010 14:00:13 +0200 mobi phil m...@mobiphil.com wrote: Was not aware about the repo on Thomas's site. Will try bluetooth with the mentioned reference (gdrm-for-merging). Watch out - there's a huge problem with command queue handling in gdrm-for-merging which I haven't had a chance to sit down and fix yet.. Tom -- Thomas White t...@bitwiz.org.uk ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: andy-tracking and gdrm-2.6.32
maybe then merging gdrm stuff from gdrm branch from git.openmoko.org and rest from gdrm-for-merging? or what would be the best to merge to have both stable 2.6.32 and drm/kms? It's nothing to do with merging, I just made a new branch, cleaned up and more suitable for merging back to the main OM branch, and in the process I introduced a bug which I haven't fixed yet. it has to do a bit with merging... Well... you practically answered my question with the second part of the answer... Not quite sure what you meant by merging bits of the old and new gdrm branches, but that certainly won't magically make the problem go away. The best merge to do if you want everything vaguely stable would be to merge gdrm-2.6.32 into om-2.6.32. The merge may or may not be easy.. (that's why gdrm-for-merging exists in the first place). Maybe wrongly, but I assumed that you introduced that bug to the kms/drm part, so I thought to try to merge all non kms/drm from gdrm-for-merging with gdrm-2.6.32, that seemed to have stable kms/drm. But I better wait for the maestro to do that, no rush... rgrds, mobi phil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
andy-tracking and gdrm-2.6.32
Hello Thomas (Hello List) I am a bit confused with the kernel branches... I assume that om-gta02-2.6.32 is the 2.6.32 kernel version one people are experimenting in distros... However I was reading references to the drm/kms changes in those distros, but your kms/drm changes do not seem to be merged into om-gt02.6.32. I am working on gdrm-2.6.32, but the only problem is that bluetooth is not working at all.. Did you ever use bluototh on gdrm-2.6.32, or did anybody else do so? rgrds, mobi phil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QtMoko v22
the uImage-v22.bin is 2.6.29 isn't it? was not following for a while the list... could anybody tell me where I could find a 2.6.32.bin? On wiki it is stated that andy tracking would be used for 2.6.32, but not sure if that is from the 2.6.29 times.. rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QtMoko v22
thanks but still do not know if it is based on andy tracking. whatever kernel it is.. does it have the Thomas Whites Kms stuff merged? On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 1:54 PM, Torfinn Ingolfsen tin...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, May 15, 2010 at 1:31 PM, mobi phil m...@mobiphil.com wrote: the uImage-v22.bin is 2.6.29 isn't it? Yes, QtMoko V22 has this kernel: neo:~# uname -a Linux neo 2.6.29-rc3-v21 #10 Tue Apr 6 22:54:31 CEST 2010 armv4tl GNU/Linux was not following for a while the list... could anybody tell me where I could find a 2.6.32.bin? QtMoko V23 (testing) has this kernel: neo:~# uname -a Linux neo 2.6.32v20 #16 Tue May 4 21:11:16 CEST 2010 armv4tl GNU/Linux HTH -- Regards, Torfinn Ingolfsen ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[qtmoko], opie
Hi there, http://opie.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/Applications did anybody try to build opie apps (see link above) with latest qt (qtmoko)? -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [E-devel] X11 dependencies hardcoded in ecore_evas
The target device of my experiments is the openmoko. For this reason I put the openmoko-dev list to cc, maybe somebody is interested there. oddd. lossy uses libjpeg. BOTH use eet. eet uses jpeg compression for lossy and zlib for comp. there is also raw that doesnt compress at all. well.. then I do not understand why it crashes I use libjpeg.7 .. Anyway it is not the main point now. I changed to COMP and it works. anyway ... my experiment was not really successful... support for sdl and directfb seems to be broken at elementary lib level... tried to add myself the different cases in elm_wind_add and brohters, but did not work, I found a a patch on a a thread here to make directfb working, but it did not. The intention of my experience was to see if evas/ecore would behave better on top of a potentially accelerated directfb backend. However as far I understood from the code evas/ecore would have zero benefit from a 2d accelerated directfb driver. My question is: 1. as was reading on some other threads that one wants to get rid of Xrender. Would however efl be able to use some 2d acceleration (blit from videa ram to videa ram, draw/fill rectangle etc.) 2. is there any interface to inject some 2d accelerated code into the fb driver? For example the most annoying on openmoko freerunner is slow scrolling. For example your map example becomes the same sluggish. This could be probably solved by scrolling through a temp invisible video memory buffer. -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [E-devel] X11 dependencies hardcoded in ecore_evas
opengl. also in the need when people want their translucent list items with static bg's etc. - you do redraws anyway. you can cut out some redraw with intermediate buffers - but then you pay a price in memory usage. in memory usage of RAM or VRAM? you can do this via map... but.. gasp.. that needs an intermediate buffer and... glammo cant generate those other than in software. what do you mean other than in software I think with drm/dri it can be done .. -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: drm/glamo Re: glamo backlight
Thomas,
If I start/stop some directfb programs, the 2rd or 3rd time I start one they
hang in the last ioctl, see below
open(/dev/fb0, O_RDWR)= 8
fcntl64(8, F_SETFD, FD_CLOEXEC) = 0
setsid()= 1655
open(/dev/tty0, O_RDONLY|O_NOCTTY)= 9
ioctl(9, VT_GETSTATE, 0xbed0e5da) = 0
ioctl(9, VIDIOC_QUERYCAP or VT_OPENQRY, 0x15178) = 0
ioctl(8, FBIOGET_CON2FBMAP, 0xbed0e4c0) = 0
fstat64(8, {st_mode=S_IFCHR|0660, st_rdev=makedev(29, 0), ...}) = 0
ioctl(8, FBIOPUT_CON2FBMAP, 0xbed0e4c0) = 0
ioctl(9, VIDIOC_G_COMP or VT_ACTIVATE, 0x8) = 0
ioctl(9, VIDIOC_S_COMP or VT_WAITACTIVE
The fd 9 is probably the tty0 and 8 is /dev/fb0. I know if it would hang on
ioctl(fb0) then drm would seem more guilty
However this behaviour was not there before the patch for ~150 pixels
shifted. Any idea?
--
rgrds,
mobi phil
being mobile, but including technology
http://mobiphil.com
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false stamentent on http://www.enlightenment.org ?
On the page: http://www.enlightenment.org/p.php?p=aboutl=en The Openmoko Freerunner http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner sold thousands of devices with EFL on them. Maybe I am wrong, but the default software was never with EFL, or? I suppose no reseller changed the software etc Well the statement is really ambiguous, but however you take it it is false. If so, EFL guys, please change (I am sure they tapped the list :) ). Or am I wrong? - rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: false stamentent on http://www.enlightenment.org ?
If so, EFL guys, please change (I am sure they tapped the list :) ). Or am I wrong? om2008 - and it was shipped on devices. many of them. it used e17 + qt apps - e17 uses efl. launcher was part of illume. Ok.. please ignore then... Not that it would be an attack from my side, hence I am finally reserved time to go a bit through Elementary... :) -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: drm/glamo Re: glamo backlight
Thanks Thomas!!! works great... guys try out the tuxpaint (apt-get install tuxpaint) ... so sweet... -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: glamo backlight
The correct full sysfs location for JBT should be: /sys/bus/spi/devices/spi2.0/lcd/jbt6k74-lcd/ . Getting the not initialised message indicates that the correct code is compiled into the kernel at least (the message is generated by the JBT driver, and the Glamo driver won't compile without the JBT driver after my dirty hack). If the device really doesn't exist, it'd be good to test with the main 2.6.32 (non-KMS/DRM) branch (without trying to enable DRM in the config, of course). The 2.6.32-gdrm branch will not work with a non-KMS configuration (i.e. normal glamo-fb compiled in) unless by sheer luck. Main Openmoko 2.6.32 without DRM also still doesn't work, as far as I know, but I could be slightly out of date there. I've attached the config I currently use when compiling 2.6.32-gdrm. Are you sure that the backlight is not coming on, rather than it being on but the display being all black? Neither the Glamo nor JBT driver are actually responsible for the backlight coming on - the backlight itself is just an LED-powering output from the PCF chip. Is there anything under /sys/class/backlight? Thanks for your answer... Unfortunately I do not receive the emails. Found the answer on the mailinlist homepage... please cc my address directly, if any. your config file helped !!! CONFIG_BACKLIGHT_PWM=y was missing! furthermore you have: CONFIG_LEDS_TRIGGER_BACKLIGHT=y I had: CONFIG_LEDS_TRIGGER_BACKLIGHT=y so I think it would not be bad to add as many config files as many relevant changes/patchces happen... and maybe they should be named arch/arm/configs/gta02.patch.blahblah so drm works (your example gdrm-waitq etc. etc) I can have fun again with the drm .. :) rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
drm/glamo Re: glamo backlight
fyi: after successful booting and running the gdrm-waitq example I got on the log: glamo-drm: Fence seq#157 was not signalled (with increasing #ref numbers) and usb network seems to be frozen after second reboot and running intensive directfb test applications problem cannot be reproduced... directfb and other frambuffer applications run on /dev/fb0, however the old bug with display shift to the right is again present. (everything is shifted ~150 pixels to the left) the same with qtmooko... if you could provide the patch straightforward, would be nice, if not, will try to see your old patch... rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
glamo baclight
Hello Thomas, hello co.*ty (do not know if my email reaches the community, anyway please CC to me) tried to build on gdrm-2.6.32, but backlight is gone... I seems that if I build with the obsolete _glamo_fb, then it works... any idea? could you please eventually send me a .config file that works for you? -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: glamo baclight
-ext2 0x0096-0x1000 : rootfs glamo-mci glamo-mci.0: powered (vdd = 21) clk: 399kHz div=0 (req: 400kHz). Bus width=0 initialised ok s3c2410_udc: debugfs dir creation failed -19 s3c2440-usbgadget s3c2440-usbgadget: S3C2440: increasing FIFO to 128 bytes usb0: MAC 00:1f:11:01:67:82 usb0: HOST MAC 00:1f:11:01:67:83 g_ether gadget: Ethernet Gadget, version: Memorial Day 2008 g_ether gadget: g_ether ready mice: PS/2 mouse device common for all mice s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: Starting s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: Created Group filter len:12 coords:2 close:10 thresh:6 s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: Created Median filter len:20 coords:2 dec_threshold:24 s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: Created Mean filter len:4 coords:2 s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: Created Linear filter coords:2 s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: 4 filter(s) initialized s3c2440-ts s3c2440-ts: Successfully loaded input: s3c2410 TouchScreen as /class/input/input0 input: PCF50633 PMU events as /class/input/input1 pcf50633-rtc pcf50633-rtc: rtc core: registered pcf50633-rtc as rtc0 tried to build on gdrm-2.6.32, but backlight is gone... I seems that if I build with the obsolete _glamo_fb, then it works... -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [qtmoko] cannot flash v14, dfu-util -71
As already reported somwhere else, the -71 error comes often when the usb cable is not good. I used the front connection of my pc, that has internally probably a bad connection inside.. tried to flash with the cable attached to usb connector on motherboard, and flashing works On Fri, Oct 9, 2009 at 1:19 PM, ghislain ghisl...@basetrend.nl wrote: I have this sometimes too, mostly when flashing a lot (and lots of connect / reconnect the Neo). This is what helps me the most of the time (I use Ubuntu 9.04): sudo /etc/init.d/udev refresh-devices But you can always load the installer-image I've created ( http://www.openmobile.nl/pages/downloads.php#qtm14 QtMoko V14 ) so you won't have to flash it over USB, just unzip the image to the first (vfat) partition on you're sdcard and boot from it in NOR mode. It's also a lot faster then flashing over USB. But beware, there are some little changes in the configuration: swap is on partition 2 of the sdcard (instead of 4) and nfs mounts to /media/jffs2 (instead of /). -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/qtmoko-cannot-flash-v14-tp3793119p3794143.html Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Waterproof bag
go for medium, you might want to put some dolarrs and other papers into it, when you go under water... :) On Sat, Oct 10, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Michael Sheldon m...@mikeasoft.com wrote: Hi Christian, Christian Rüb wrote: has anyone tried one of the waterproof (5m) bags from Aquapac? Is the mini [1] sufficient or is it too tight and it would be better to use medium [2]? Yes, I have one, the mini is too small (it almost fits, but not quite), luckily Aquapac let me exchange it for a medium which fits without any problems (although there's a fair amount of excess space). Cheers, Mike. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[qtmoko] cannot flash v14
Tried twice, but got following error... earlier images worked. Dfu-ing the kernel worked however, and it boots (obvious), but after lots of jffs2 errors.. hangs /qtmoko$ sudo dfu-util -a rootfs -R -D qtmoko-debian-v14.jffs2 [sudo] password for X: dfu-util - (C) 2007-2008 by OpenMoko Inc. This program is Free Software and has ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY Opening USB Device 0x:0x... Found Runtime: [0x1d50:0x5119] devnum=7, cfg=0, intf=0, alt=6, name=rootfs Claiming USB DFU Interface... Setting Alternate Setting ... Determining device status: state = dfuERROR, status = 14 dfuERROR, clearing status Determining device status: state = dfuIDLE, status = 0 dfuIDLE, continuing Transfer Size = 0x1000 bytes_per_hash=2152707 Starting download: [#dfu_download error -71 Error during download -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [qtmoko] qt 4.6 directfb
the mentioned preview version seems to have only X11 backend, so we have to wait... On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 5:42 PM, Fabio Locati fabioloc...@gmail.com wrote: The move from 4.4 to 4.5 have requested some times due to some regressions that it would have implied. I hope that this change will be more streightforward... but I haven0t looked into it, yet ;) On Thu, Oct 1, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Vinzenz Hersche hers...@puzzle.ch wrote: Am Mittwoch, 30. September 2009 20.47:41 schrieb mobi phil: Hello, there is a statement on: http://qt.nokia.com/developer/qt-4.6-technology-preview Improved support for DirectFB does any of you mean what was improved?? Maybe the day will come and we will have the direcfb driver for glamo, and qtmoko could also benefit from that i hope, there's a soon upgrade in qtmoko after the new qt-release.. it realy looks like good work! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Fabio A Locati Home: Segrate, Milan, Italy (GMT +1) Phone: +39-328-3799681 MSN/Jabber/E-Mail: fabioloc...@gmail.com PGP Key: 9EF6 3C79 F6DF 76CD 770A 43A1 DCCB 415C 9656 3334 Envolved in: KDE, OpenStreetMap, Ubuntu, Wikimedia Sent from Sesto San Giovanni, MI, Italy ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[qtmoko] qt 4.6 directfb
Hello, there is a statement on: http://qt.nokia.com/developer/qt-4.6-technology-preview Improved support for DirectFB does any of you mean what was improved?? Maybe the day will come and we will have the direcfb driver for glamo, and qtmoko could also benefit from that -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: QtMoko v11
links2 is the fastest web browser so far, I use it daily on the freerunner. You may build it with directfb and/or X11 support... then netsurf seems to be faster than dillo... On Sun, Sep 20, 2009 at 10:03 PM, Jim Morris m...@e4net.com wrote: Radek Polak wrote: My favourite one is links2. Fast, stable, fixed size fonts. Yes I like links2 but how do you set it up to run from the FR when it is a console app? Do you have a way to add desktop icons or something for launching it? Long term plan is to use arora. Looks very nice and uses QtWebkit so it shouldnt be that hard to port it. I'll take a look at it, is it being ported? if not I can try to port it. -- Jim Morris, http://blog.wolfman.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[qtmoko] v10 loaded
-- Hello, Bluetooth keyboard: connects, stays connected for a while then kaputt :) (old problem) Webkit browser, crashes on huge page for. eg.: n-tv.de, also when going from one page to another one, pages are transparent, and overlap etc. Wifi: did not manage to get it working, though was working on v9 anyway, good job, thanks rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: MokoTouch Project (Qt4 Embedded Based Distro)
Nice work... maybe somebody will come up with a QT accelereted driver for glamo rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
why openmoko is so slow? Is it a joke?
Hello all I spent this weekend some time to compare and to try to understand what is slow, why is openmoko slow... At least concerning the display I came to the concusion that X windows is/should not too much to blame. I installed the latest SHR distro on a mSD card, and run it both on Freerunner and ETEN glofiish M800, thanks to the gnufiish project. I have to say that everything on eten m800 is much faster, rendering, screen refresh, scrolling etc. However both devices have the same processor at the sam speed, andsame SD card. I run both x11perf, and a little program to draw rectangles on the framebuffer. The speed ratio between the openmoko and eten m800 framebuffer is 7/10, this measured with my small tool. I run x11perf -all on the ETEN M800 with the Xfbdev, you will find the results attached. I tried to run x11pref -all on freerunner with Xfbdev but it crashes at the beginning of the second test... I will try to run the same here the comparison of the first test (Dot) for gnufiish 600 reps @ 0.0009 msec (112.0/sec): Dot 600 reps @ 0.0009 msec (113.0/sec): Dot 600 reps @ 0.0009 msec (112.0/sec): Dot 600 reps @ 0.0009 msec (112.0/sec): Dot 600 reps @ 0.0009 msec (113.0/sec): Dot 3000 trep @ 0.0009 msec (112.0/sec): Dot for freerunner.. 200 reps @ 0.0025 msec (394000.0/sec): Dot 200 reps @ 0.0025 msec (402000.0/sec): Dot 200 reps @ 0.0025 msec (393000.0/sec): Dot 200 reps @ 0.0028 msec (36.0/sec): Dot 200 reps @ 0.0026 msec (391000.0/sec): Dot 1000 trep @ 0.0026 msec (388000.0/sec): Dot so, you can see the differences between the numbers... However I am a bit confused, and need to read once more the manpage to know exactly how to interpret the numbers, but at first glance, there is a huge difference... As I said, I wil try to run the x11perf on the Xglamo to see if there are any improvement... However I am not sure that the acceleration would solve the problem... I think that the bottleneck is the data bus, or? the story with the SDcard connected to the glamo chip... So... my question is ... is it a joke that the openmoko framebuffer is so slow compared to other similar phones??? In this case I would really advice people to refrain in buying the openmoko, and better go for glofiish M800, that has a keyboard and radio as plus, and kernel support is almost ready... Again, on M800 SHR is really fluid... However loading applications is slow... Maybe libraries are not cached well? | rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: why openmoko is so slow? Is it a joke?
That depends on your sense of humour ;-) Well, I would say it was a very bad joke. I spent eq. of 400 dolars, I was waiting 1 year for glamo acceleration etc, etc. that would make the phone usable etc, and it turns out, that it will never be. With the slow bus, one can forget about acceleration... What can be accelerated if you have to send information about complex bitmaps... I find openmoko, better say freedesktop as a nice project, and even openmoko name should be avoided. They found a very cheap solution, they sold the devices for lot of money, practically they fooled lot of people. I can imagine the company manager behind smiling about all the complain emails and naive users still hoping their freerunner will display nicely one day. I think after this being known, one should be crazy buying the openmoko. One should instead maybe encourage the gnufiish project (or others) to port the kernel, and use those phones as reference. One would at least avoid tons of emails about slow graphics, about why X window etc. Again, M800 has keyboard, very usefull for a linux phone. Only drawback, it has only 64megs memory, but better have less applications running smoother, than several slower... So ... whatsoever would be the device... forget about plan B, forget about openmoko for ever... Concentrate on linux for mobile device and encourage hackers to write drivers for them, eventually paying them per paypal etc. rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
running windows mobile applications on openmoko
I am sure, most of you would just smile... but what about porting WINE to support WINCE applications ? -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: running windows mobile applications on openmoko
without knowing the depth of WINE, I assume there are following things inside: 1. an executable loader/remaper/dynamic linker etc. 2. mapping windows system/kernel calls to linux system/kernel calls the same two things should be implemented... Why? because there are tons of useful applications on windows mobile. Both 1 and 2 the more they would be deeper embedded into an openmoko device, more people would consider the linux device as an alternative... When I mean deeper embedded, means closer to kernel... The more layers are between the slower the application will run. afaik, wince has nothing in common with windows except the manufacturer, the name and some ideas of gui design. well from programmers point of view, they are quite close to each other. The main thing, gui programming is probably 60% of the main Win32 API of windowsXP/NT etc. -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: running windows mobile applications on openmoko
I'm not sure if it is possible, but I'd like to see a full qemu kvm emulating a virtual platform compatible with WinCE, this should be possible (see VMware mobile virtualization) and may be easier and more compatible than rewriting wine. The interesting thing in doing that is to use some real missing software for the freerunner and the FOSS in general as complete and usable gps navigation system or the wanted skype client. Regards Nicola Was not aware about VMWare for mobile... Thanks for that.. have a look at it... However qemu would not do the job very well without kernel based virtualisation... (kvm) or? If you run an application on virtualisation layer, that could run slower, than through a compatibility layer. However with hardware support for virtualisation, on x86 (intel/amd) systems the programs almost run as they would run on the host. On the other side running a virtual machine means aditional kernel and system that needs aditional memory etc... so probably now is more appropiate to have things like ages ago WINE on PC'. anybody any idea if kvm can be used on arm linux? I think not.. I do not think there is any virtualization engine running on arm... or? -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: running windows mobile applications on openmoko
p.s. VMware MVP is a thin layer of software that is embedded on a mobile phone to decouple the applications and data from the underlying hardware. ...oh yeah... did not read about the topic... it seems that XEN 3.3 has similar intentions ... however there are no details on the vmware homepage... is it possible to download the software? http://www.efluxmedia.com/news_VMware_Releases_MVP_for_Cell_Phones_28589.html On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 7:50 PM, mobi phil m...@mobiphil.com wrote: I'm not sure if it is possible, but I'd like to see a full qemu kvm emulating a virtual platform compatible with WinCE, this should be possible (see VMware mobile virtualization) and may be easier and more compatible than rewriting wine. The interesting thing in doing that is to use some real missing software for the freerunner and the FOSS in general as complete and usable gps navigation system or the wanted skype client. Regards Nicola Was not aware about VMWare for mobile... Thanks for that.. have a look at it... However qemu would not do the job very well without kernel based virtualisation... (kvm) or? If you run an application on virtualisation layer, that could run slower, than through a compatibility layer. However with hardware support for virtualisation, on x86 (intel/amd) systems the programs almost run as they would run on the host. On the other side running a virtual machine means aditional kernel and system that needs aditional memory etc... so probably now is more appropiate to have things like ages ago WINE on PC'. anybody any idea if kvm can be used on arm linux? I think not.. I do not think there is any virtualization engine running on arm... or? -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: running windows mobile applications on openmoko
Take a look at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNo6pn-dnSQ !! Regards Nicola yep... but that is not my device :) ... I found the video after I received the info... -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: running windows mobile applications on openmoko
there is a bit of aggression on these email lists words like recover, shock... do not belong here.. generally they trigger worst words.. hope not in my case... first: it is about imagination. Why do you think WINE was created? because there was always software written for windows, that some people wanted to run on linux second: having such an abstraction layer, is good also for managers, who take decisions... Imagine a company buying 100 devices... you tell them buy linux, they can run your windows mobile applications as wel. third... forh do not bother :) On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Rui Miguel Silva Seabra r...@1407.orgwrote: The interesting thing in doing that is to use some real missing software for the freerunner and the FOSS in general as complete and usable gps navigation system or the wanted skype client. If there isn't what you want, either fix something close to it or write a new program, or make a bounty to pay someone to do it :) I've still to recover from the shock of reading these words... Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: running windows mobile applications on openmoko
This discussion is fruitless anyways. WINE allows you to run x86 programs in the PE format (which is the DOS/Windows executable format, as opposed to the ELF used by linux) and provides much of the libraries these programs expect. It doesn't change the fact that these programs are compiled to be run on intel-compatable opcodes, and it would take an emulator to use programs written for windows on an ARM processor like the freerunner. As for something like WINE but for Windows CE, that would have a smaller scope then the WINE project but you still have specialized libraries for the mobile api (stuff like the mobile version of directx, bluetooth libraries, etc). A quick googling shows that the loader will work according to this[1] thread, so there is hope at least. And mobi, Nicola: virtualization requires processor support for emulating the given architecture. This is why using qemu to emulate a x86 is so much slower then using qemu+kvm to emulate a x86: in the latter case the processor is doing some of the work instead of the software. I don't know of any case of a processor virtualizing an architecture besides itself, except for x86-64 processors virtualizing for a x86. [1]- http://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2005-September/040161.html Joseph Booker http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community Thanks for pointing to that discussion... I conclude from it that at least loading the applications is not so difficult to implement... -- rgrds, mobi phil being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[QtMoko]QtWebKit
Hello, The webbrowser in the distro is very slow, and crashes after viewing 1 page. I wonder if it is the QtWebKit from http://trac.webkit.org/wiki/QtWebKit If not, did anybody try that on openmoko? regards mobiphil -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
gui alternative
Hello, Did anybody try http://home.comcast.net/~fbui/ or http://www.directfb.org/ on openmoko? what about integrating the mplayer hack (2d acceleration) into directfb rgrds mobi phil -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [QtMoko]QtWebKit
it seems that Midori depends on gtk... the question was more for some qt based decoration :) On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 7:22 PM, xelapond xelap...@gmail.com wrote: Are you referring to Midori? On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 1:30 AM, mobi phil m...@mobiphil.com wrote: Hello, The webbrowser in the distro is very slow, and crashes after viewing 1 page. I wonder if it is the QtWebKit from http://trac.webkit.org/wiki/QtWebKit If not, did anybody try that on openmoko? regards mobiphil -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: your mail
Having already the tags marked [this tag] you can search for all the tagse, you can then order them, and easily search inside them, even if there are 2000, once you have identified the tag, you can search for topics linked with them... On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 10:58 PM, Marcel tan...@googlemail.com wrote: Am Mittwoch, 24. Juni 2009 22:45:54 schrieb mobi phil: A forum is probably better place than email lists if the email lists tend to cover huge amount of information. Having a forum, you can keep o bit more order in the knowledge base that is accumulating in the email list. Tags/labels would be probably even more powerful than the simple categories in a forum. They would make easier to search in the huge amount of discussions/shared information on the email list. By encouraging everybody to use in the Subject field, or inside the conversation tags/labels, it would be much easier to find information, even with search engines. I would suggest to extend the [topic] labels to sthg. like Subject: [kernel][usb][external gps] etc. or separated by , Subject [kernel, usb, external gps] For such, we would need a list of predefined tags. If everyone chooses his/her (do we actually have women [I know about Brenda :)] here?) own tags and occasionally has a typo in them, we will get perfect chaos. Now try to force people to look up a list of tags for possibly fitting ones. I think this whole tagging approach is nice from a technical/programmer's point of view, but as a user, I do not even want to think about having to tag each and every of my 2000 digital photos, not even talking about other files. [I'm sliding off topic, don't I? :)] ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[Debian][qtmoko] /dev filesystem
booting debian spends a while on populating dev filesystem would it not be clever to move back to the prepopulated filesystem? mobiphil -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[QtMoko] bluetooth keyboard
I wonder if anybody managed to setup the keyboard with the bluetooth tool inside QT. The tool asks to insert the pin and then to insert it on the keyboard, however it stays connected only 1-2 seconds. Any idea? I can however connect with the method described on http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Freedom_Slim_Keyboard -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: posting style preferences was Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
maybe http://wave.google.com/ will solve the problem? http://mobiphil.com On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 7:25 AM, fredrik normann fredrik.normann.j...@gmail.com wrote: so true 2009/6/26 Fabian Schölzel fabian.schoel...@googlemail.com Long long ago, someone wrote : And sometimes, you just dont have to quote, because the discussion hierarchy isnt lost within mailing lists. True. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
I agree that C++ compiler produces larger footprint. This is due to the more complex abstraction, expanded templates etc. Normally memory density doubles each year and prices halfs. For implementing the same abstraction, you would create probably the same size of exectable both in C and C++, and probably you would not use more than 20% more memory. What about productivity? I am sure that implementing a correct memory management strategy: smart pointers, object managers ( they add a bit to the overhead, but with increasing memory, does it matter?), it would be probably possible to avoid the annoying transition from prototype phase in pyothon to C phase (or other similar). By the way, did anybody measure/compare (with real data, not based on presumptions and previous experiences) the memory consumption (text, data, dynamic data etc.) of QT and other frameworks applications? On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 1:32 AM, Laura Vance van...@thespazcat.com wrote: It's not about the programmer managing memory, the C++ compiler produces a MUCH larger memory footprint. I like C++ programming, and I used C for years before that. My first exposure to C++ was when I simply compiled one of my C programs with the C++ switch. An executable file that was about 2k compiled as C became about 140k compiled as C++ ... I didn't modify the code at all. The thing that I think is a complete absurdity is the fact that so much of the software for the FR is written in an interpreted language (Python). This alone contributes to the slowness of the device. Heck, the frameworkd is a python program. (top shows python /usr/bin/frameworkd). The core systems need to be compiled. With a past employer, I did most of my development in perl, and I ran into a bottleneck in the interpreter for startup time. I copied the program in C++ and did a load comparison of the two. It was easy to bring the system to its knees with the interpreted language, but I couldn't even get the cpu load to bump more than a tiny bit using the compiled C++. (I write perl using the same structure as my C++, so it's very easy for me to port between the two) This is nothing against python in general, I don't think any interpreted language belongs in a phone except provide the interpreter for the individual owner to write their own code... but interpreted code should not make up the core of the system. Interpreted languages are excellent for rapid prototyping and initial development, but once it's ready for any type of release, it should be ported to C (in this case) or C++. I do use my Freerunner (rev6 that nobody has told me about a buzz... and I've asked them) on a daily basis. I choose not to let my phone go on standby, because I had heard about some of the problems with my current release, but I'm willing to charge it frequently since I am choosing to not let it standby. At some point, I'd like to get into the SMS code and make it do a few things: - Show the contact rather than the phone number - Show the actual time the message was received. (currently all messages are 1-1-1970) - Link the SMS message to a voicemail icon (my provider sends a message from -@ when I have voicemail and ascii triangle@ when all voicemail has been heard). But that's when I have the time. :) -Laura mobi phil wrote: memory?... this remembers me about women... you can give the same amount of money to a blond, black, brunette, blue eyes etc. women... all of them they will spend it the same nanosecond... give the same money to a good businessman He will use it carefully... the programming language does not make too much difference neither. Give the same memory to an unconscious programmer he will waste it the same, just in few lines of code whatever C or C++ or C-- his is programming. Only issue could be memory fragmentation, that with a little care could be avoided in C++ as well. Average C++ programmers have no idea how to save memory. But C++ at least helps you a bit more to think in patterns, to keep much more order with less effort. I think if one keeps for the backend all the legacy (not pejorative ) C code, but coding against a simple widgetset for the GUI in C++ is not a bad idea. Creating a C wrapper, was not really a joke, for only C programmers... I am not saying that C++ is better for the embedded devices, far from that. Just that Qt has a much better abstraction than other toolkits, and is easier to use than few other toolkits. And besides that produces much better user experience. And it is portable. Encourage programmers to create GUI with QT, in few days there will be somebody who will port that to windows CE as there is QT toolkit for CE as well. Then maybe wince programmers would also think about programming against some more generic toolkit etc. By the way... did anybody reverse engineer' a bit the iphone ?or Android?(not necessarily only the code, but gui
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
How long do you think people will carry arround the freerunner in their pockets, when next year the same time you will be able to buy a crap :) nvidia tegra based device with 500MB memory for 200$ ? Plan for the future, not for the past :) On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 12:22 PM, Michal Brzozowski ruso...@poczta.fmwrote: 2009/6/25 mobi phil m...@mobiphil.com I agree that C++ compiler produces larger footprint. This is due to the more complex abstraction, expanded templates etc. Normally memory density doubles each year and prices halfs. But the Freerunner has 128mb of RAM, and I don't see it doubling every year :-) ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
no offense, but thinkin only about yourself, what you want, is probably the cause nr. one for openmoko company/project failing. If you want a company to sponsor the development of the project, they need to have benefit. They can generate benefit by selling devices. But if you fail to put on the device minimal usability only a small amount of the potential customers will consider buying the device. By providing a bit more usability openmoko would have been able to sell more phones. Lot of IT friends laughed at me when I tried to show them the phone... actually I could show nothing. If I was able to show a bit more... these guys would have probably considered buying the phone etc... Developing only for your own satisfaction and thinking zero about giving back as usability helps less than zero! On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 12:46 PM, Marcin Ćwikła jahc...@gmail.com wrote: Sebastian Krzyszkowiak pisze: And I'm developing mostly for myself (satisfaction, learning, and usable phone :P) For me too! :) -- jahckal ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
I am affraid that even if you would do your best you would not be able to reason what is usefull for all the people who subscribed for the list. It is usefull for at least two people: the person who started the thread and me :). On the other side it is inpolite to reason in name of others. So the conclusion is your last post is zero at power of infinet usefull :) On Thu, Jun 25, 2009 at 2:14 PM, Matthias Apitz g...@unixarea.de wrote: El día Thursday, June 25, 2009 a las 01:50:19PM +0200, mobi phil escribió: no offense, but thinkin only about yourself, what you want, is probably the cause nr. one for openmoko company/project failing. If you want a company to sponsor the development of the project, they need to have benefit. They can generate benefit by selling devices. But if you fail to put on the device minimal usability only a small amount of the potential customers will consider buying the device. By providing a bit more usability openmoko would have been able to sell more phones. Lot of IT friends laughed at me when I tried to show them the phone... actually I could show nothing. If I was able to show a bit more... these guys would have probably considered buying the phone etc... Developing only for your own satisfaction and thinking zero about giving back as usability helps less than zero! I think one (you and others) should not do top posting; in addition I think that the full thread is less than zero usefull; matthias -- Matthias Apitz t +49-89-61308 351 - f +49-89-61308 399 - m +49-170-4527211 e g...@unixarea.de - w http://www.unixarea.de/ People who hate Microsoft Windows use Linux but people who love UNIX use FreeBSD. -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
Hey!! Is this kind of phrase i am not interested in c++. driving the linux phone development? I can never understand how is it possible to have such a huge gap on the scale between C programmers and C++ programmers? Why are C++ programmers dying out? Is it because some C programmers never managed to get the point with C++ and those who did, switched automatically to Java? I propose a C wrapper arround Qt, for the C programmers, and everybody will still benefit, beleive me. QT is a treasure, is a nice clean code! And it is fast! By the way... nvidia tegra, the new dancer on the stage says no linux on tegra http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2009/06/nvidia-says-no-to-linux-on-tegra-netbooks-chooses-wince.ars or http://www.google.com/search?hl=enq=nvidia+tegra+linux mobiphil mobiphil.com On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 8:56 PM, Al Johnson openm...@mazikeen.demon.co.ukwrote: On Monday 22 June 2009, mobi phil wrote: I think carrying Xwindows is the biggest mistake. I personally encourage QT or new start with gtk on top of www.directfb.org/, so that gtk based interfaces can be reused... By the way did anybody consider gtk with directfb as direction? Or I am wrong and the bottleneck is not really Xwindows? This has been discussed _many_ times before. Those with extensive experience in this area have said X is not the bottleneck. I've just dug out a few of Raster's comments: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2009-April/046056.html http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2008-November/035825.html http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-February/001924.html ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone (was Re: Is a FreeRunner sufficient for me?)
memory?... this remembers me about women... you can give the same amount of money to a blond, black, brunette, blue eyes etc. women... all of them they will spend it the same nanosecond... give the same money to a good businessman He will use it carefully... the programming language does not make too much difference neither. Give the same memory to an unconscious programmer he will waste it the same, just in few lines of code whatever C or C++ or C-- his is programming. Only issue could be memory fragmentation, that with a little care could be avoided in C++ as well. Average C++ programmers have no idea how to save memory. But C++ at least helps you a bit more to think in patterns, to keep much more order with less effort. I think if one keeps for the backend all the legacy (not pejorative ) C code, but coding against a simple widgetset for the GUI in C++ is not a bad idea. Creating a C wrapper, was not really a joke, for only C programmers... I am not saying that C++ is better for the embedded devices, far from that. Just that Qt has a much better abstraction than other toolkits, and is easier to use than few other toolkits. And besides that produces much better user experience. And it is portable. Encourage programmers to create GUI with QT, in few days there will be somebody who will port that to windows CE as there is QT toolkit for CE as well. Then maybe wince programmers would also think about programming against some more generic toolkit etc. By the way... did anybody reverse engineer' a bit the iphone ?or Android?(not necessarily only the code, but gui patterns I think paying a little attention to their way of doing things maybe will inspire a bit. would not like to offend... just some random ideas... mobip...@mobiphil.com On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 8:08 PM, David Ford da...@blue-labs.org wrote: do you understand the weight involved with using c++? without very very careful management, c++ is rather hefty for embedded devices. granted, having 128M to work in is indeed far more tenable than smaller devices but it's still onerous. C is much more lightweight and very functional. any benefits of c++ usually don't overcome the drawbacks for embedded devices. -d On 06/24/09 07:09, mobi phil wrote: Hey!! Is this kind of phrase i am not interested in c++. driving the linux phone development? I can never understand how is it possible to have such a huge gap on the scale between C programmers and C++ programmers? Why are C++ programmers dying out? Is it because some C programmers never managed to get the point with C++ and those who did, switched automatically to Java? I propose a C wrapper arround Qt, for the C programmers, and everybody will still benefit, beleive me. QT is a treasure, is a nice clean code! And it is fast! ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: your mail
A forum is probably better place than email lists if the email lists tend to cover huge amount of information. Having a forum, you can keep o bit more order in the knowledge base that is accumulating in the email list. Tags/labels would be probably even more powerful than the simple categories in a forum. They would make easier to search in the huge amount of discussions/shared information on the email list. By encouraging everybody to use in the Subject field, or inside the conversation tags/labels, it would be much easier to find information, even with search engines. I would suggest to extend the [topic] labels to sthg. like Subject: [kernel][usb][external gps] etc. or separated by , Subject [kernel, usb, external gps] On Wed, Jun 24, 2009 at 1:08 PM, Michele Brocco ssj2mi...@gmail.com wrote: I think that you could also use nabble to have a bit of forum experience if you like. http://lists.openmoko.org/nabble.html ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Why one cannot recommend the freerunner as a daily phone
that is why I vote for QT :) and I ment X11 sorry for offending you by using my jargon :), however there are at least *4,200,000* results on google for Xwindows, so I think one could understand the point :) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:31 PM, Fabio Locati fabioloc...@gmail.com wrote: QtMoko ( http://qtmoko.org ) does not use X ;) On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 6:27 PM, Timo Juhani Lindforstimo.lindf...@iki.fi wrote: mobi phil m...@mobiphil.com writes: trivial functions. I think carrying Xwindows is the biggest mistake. I It's X Windows System, X Version 11, X11 or simply X. Also, feel free to not use X if you don't want. I don't see how that'd be difficult if you only need a simple dialer. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Fabio A Locati Home: Segrate, Milan, Italy (GMT +1) Phone: +39-328-3799681 MSN/Jabber/E-Mail: fabioloc...@gmail.com PGP Key: 9EF6 3C79 F6DF 76CD 770A 43A1 DCCB 415C 9656 3334 Envolved in: KDE, OpenStreetMap, Ubuntu, Wikimedia ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
[qtmoko] vim editor qt port
in my opinion the qt port is the winner... if it could enjoy the 2d and 3d acceleration in framebuffer... but my question is... did anybody think about porting vim interface to qt? thanks -- being mobile, but including technology http://mobiphil.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
