Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
On 5/2/07, Casper van Donderen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.mesdigital.com/english/Products/product_mmsp2.asp I think this chip is pretty opensource since it is used in the GP2X I don't want to pay money to micro$oft for wma support, so I do _not_ want that chip. Anyway I guess it is full of bug: MP3, WMA Decode Codec : Support from Microsoft¢ç (porting Windows¢ç CE.NET) MPEG1 Layer 12 Codec : Support from Microsoft¢ç (porting Windows¢ç CE.NET) G.711, ADPCM Codec : Support from Microsoft¢ç (porting Windows¢ç CE.NET) And I do not think it is open source ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
Flemming Richter Mikkelsen wrote: On 5/2/07, Casper van Donderen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.mesdigital.com/english/Products/product_mmsp2.asp I think this chip is pretty opensource since it is used in the GP2X I don't want to pay money to micro$oft for wma support, so I do _not_ want that chip. Anyway I guess it is full of bug: MP3, WMA Decode Codec : Support from Microsoft¢ç (porting Windows¢ç CE.NET) MPEG1 Layer 12 Codec : Support from Microsoft¢ç (porting Windows¢ç CE.NET) G.711, ADPCM Codec : Support from Microsoft¢ç (porting Windows¢ç CE.NET) And I do not think it is open source I guess this one would be better, but I don't know how they distribute drivers. The problem with powervr is that they just provide IP. So I assume it depends on the manufacturers then (I'm afraid most of them are working in a quite closed development) : http://www.imgtec.com/PowerVR/products/Video/MVDA2/index.asp The bad point of this kind of chip are the limited amount of supported codecs, so this kind below would be better ; also because it's OpenGL|ES 2.0 compatible ;) [...] Video processing for free, with the real-time programmable architecture providing extensive accelerated functions support for multi-standard video decode and encode. -- ak vertexfragment shaders that seems to be extended in this chip to access other kind of resources (maybe a kind of fast texture wrapper around raw video blocks ?). http://www.imgtec.com/PowerVR/products/Graphics/SGX/index.asp?Page=2 Now I think the main problem would be the price of a chip like that. Why not use an FPGA with a bunch of arithmetic operations widely used in audio / video compression (eg. DCT) and write a media library that forward most of the job on the FPGA. I don't know if there is more complete solutions available, but the basic idea is here : http://www.opencores.org/projects.cgi/web/video_systems/overview (well I don't have the whole mailing list archived here, so it has maybe been already mentioned before) ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
Yeah the iPod video has a video chip But on the internet I read that the iPhone might go with the Samsung s3c2460 chip, That chip has a hardware video decoder on it. But I think another option could be the MagicEyes MMSP2 chip used in the GP2X linux handheld, that has hardware video (up to OpenGL ES), and an embedded camera controller (maybe usable in the future models with camera, up to 4M pixels) http://www.mesdigital.com/english/Products/product_mmsp2.asp I think this chip is pretty opensource since it is used in the GP2X Casper _ http://www.live.nl Windows Live Messenger___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
The question is how well does the Neo handle video?. There was some discussion on the list a while back about this. Sounds like playing/decoding video will tax the processor pretty hard. I'm sure someone will get it working, but I got the impression it would take some skill. It would definitely be awesome though! -Steven On 4/30/07, adrian cockcroft [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Slingbox currently can stream your home video system (including TiVo) to a computer or high speed (3G/WiFi) phone. It works well on laptops, and I've seen it demonstrated on phones and it looks quite good. This implies that its at least technically feasible to stream MythTV to a Neo. Adrian On 4/30/07, Tim Newsom [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 11:56, Steven ** wrote: /snip I don't understand. Of course I'll want MythTV on my phone (iPhone or Neo). I'm not going to buy Apple TV because I already have MythTV setup and doing everything I want and more. I intend, at the very least, to use my Neo as a remote control for my Myth Box. I'd also like to get a simple Myth frontend so that I stream video to the Neo. That will be harder, but awesome. -Steven Can you imagine... Think of you tube but with channels of shared tv broadcast to phones... Maybe like public tv but where users or individuals could select the content... Does that exist? I am not talking rebroadcasting (copyright issues) but new content owned by individuals who would like to share it and give the rights for that. --Tim ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
Video would be a bit essential I would think... if an iPod can do it, shouldn't a mini computerphone be able to? If we want to compete with other touch phones and smart phones, video playback is a strong selling point. Not that I know how to make it happen at all... Maybe we can use code from Neuros? They make open source and (I think) GPL'ed video players. http://www.neurosaudio.com/ ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
Steven ** wrote: The question is how well does the Neo handle video?. There was some discussion on the list a while back about this. Sounds like playing/decoding video will tax the processor pretty hard. I'm sure someone will get it working, but I got the impression it would take some skill. It would definitely be awesome though! Basically - it's not too much of a problem for reasonable codecs, at half resolution (hardware scaled in the LCD). You're not going to be doing h.264 ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
el jefe delito said the following on 01/05/07 15:03: Video would be a bit essential I would think... if an iPod can do it, shouldn't a mini computerphone be able to? AFAIK the video iPods have hardware decoding chips, so the iPod isn't decoding the video. Which is why they can only play certain kinds of video codecs. Rory ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
On 5/1/07, Rory McCann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: el jefe delito said the following on 01/05/07 15:03: Video would be a bit essential I would think... if an iPod can do it, shouldn't a mini computerphone be able to? AFAIK the video iPods have hardware decoding chips, so the iPod isn't decoding the video. Which is why they can only play certain kinds of video codecs. I own a Palm T|X. I would think the ARM based Samsung S3C2410AL-26 (Capable of running up to 266 MHz) in the Neo should compare favorably to the ARM based Intel XScale PXA 270 running at 312 MHz in the Palm T|X. The difference in CPU speed may be compensated for by the Neo's use of 128 MB of SDRAM vs the Palm T|X's use of 128 MB of slower non-volatile memory (only 100 MB accessible by Palm applications). I have used the predecessor to CorePlayer Mobile (called tcpmp) to watch video and listen to audio not supported by Palm's default music app. Core Player Mobile supports the following video codecs: - H.264 (AVC) - MKV - MPEG-1 - MPEG-4 part 2 (ASP) - DivX - XviD - MJPEG I have tried H.264, MPEG-1, MPEG-4 part 2 (ASP) and XviD. H.264 encoded podcasts downloaded from tikibartv.com played but were nearly unwatchable. The video and sound were far too jerky for enjoyable viewing. I encoded my own video content in MPEG-1, MPEG-4 and XviD at various bit rates and had good experiences with playback. references: http://coreplayer.com/content/view/28/44/ http://www.tikibartv.com/ -- Andrew Becherer Undergraduate, Computing and Software Systems University of Washington, Tacoma ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
On 4/29/07, Martin Lefkowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have an HTC wizard right now branded as cingular that I am running skype on. If I remember correctly I downloaded the software off the skype site for this handset. Does this mean it's approved or not approved? With your setup, it's a gray area. With the iPhone, it is presented as anything not approved is inherently banned. You were able to get the app because that phone is at least slightly open. The press on the iPhone makes it seem completely closed. Wouldn't it be a problem for the FTC if Cingular didn't approve software like this because it wouldn't be fair and equitable for that frequency? They would need to have some sort of test for certification right? Or, is this the difference between licensed and unlicensed 802.11b/g/etc. uses 2.4 GHz unlicensed spectrum. No FTC beyond the power limits that would be enforced on the manufacturer of the chip. It's the wifi chip that needs FTC approval, not the software. Also you probably wouldn't need myth TV on the Iphone for the reasons Apple does distinguish themselves as described above. I don't understand. Of course I'll want MythTV on my phone (iPhone or Neo). I'm not going to buy Apple TV because I already have MythTV setup and doing everything I want and more. I intend, at the very least, to use my Neo as a remote control for my Myth Box. I'd also like to get a simple Myth frontend so that I stream video to the Neo. That will be harder, but awesome. -Steven Marty ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
Steven ** wrote: On 4/29/07, Martin Lefkowitz [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have an HTC wizard right now branded as cingular that I am running skype on. If I remember correctly I downloaded the software off the skype site for this handset. Does this mean it's approved or not approved? With your setup, it's a gray area. With the iPhone, it is presented as anything not approved is inherently banned. You were able to get the app because that phone is at least slightly open. The press on the iPhone makes it seem completely closed. Its not 'the press', its Steve Jobs himself. Wouldn't it be a problem for the FTC if Cingular didn't approve software like this because it wouldn't be fair and equitable for that frequency? They would need to have some sort of test for certification right? Or, is this the difference between licensed and unlicensed 802.11b/g/etc. uses 2.4 GHz unlicensed spectrum. No FTC beyond the power limits that would be enforced on the manufacturer of the chip. It's the wifi chip that needs FTC approval, not the software. You're wrong, on several counts. 1) The FTC is the Federal Trade Commission, responsible for things like dealing with anti-competitive behavior. The FCC (Federal Communications Commission) is responsible for various other things, including 'spectrum regulation'. 2) power limits are not the only thing (or even the most important thing) that you need to worry about with a compliant ISM (Part 15.247) WLAN device. Far **MORE** important is out of band emisisons, especially operation in the 'restricted bands' just outside the 2.4GHz spectrum. 3) The FCC doesn't approve 'chips', the manufacturer of the design obtains certification. Note: the *whole* design is tested, and in many instances, this **includes** the software. It certainly includes the entire radio section, from baseband through, and including the antenna. ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
Slingbox currently can stream your home video system (including TiVo) to a computer or high speed (3G/WiFi) phone. It works well on laptops, and I've seen it demonstrated on phones and it looks quite good. This implies that its at least technically feasible to stream MythTV to a Neo. Adrian On 4/30/07, Tim Newsom [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 11:56, Steven ** wrote: /snip I don't understand. Of course I'll want MythTV on my phone (iPhone or Neo). I'm not going to buy Apple TV because I already have MythTV setup and doing everything I want and more. I intend, at the very least, to use my Neo as a remote control for my Myth Box. I'd also like to get a simple Myth frontend so that I stream video to the Neo. That will be harder, but awesome. -Steven Can you imagine... Think of you tube but with channels of shared tv broadcast to phones... Maybe like public tv but where users or individuals could select the content... Does that exist? I am not talking rebroadcasting (copyright issues) but new content owned by individuals who would like to share it and give the rights for that. --Tim ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Anti Iphone (Was Re: Some light ahead...)
I have an HTC wizard right now branded as cingular that I am running skype on. If I remember correctly I downloaded the software off the skype site for this handset. Does this mean it's approved or not approved? Wouldn't it be a problem for the FTC if Cingular didn't approve software like this because it wouldn't be fair and equitable for that frequency? They would need to have some sort of test for certification right? Or, is this the difference between licensed and unlicensed BTW, I just got the Cingular 8125, refurbished, for about $80 with a 2 year contract. This is the one with Wifi inside -- haveing a computer in your pocket takes some getting used to. It will be interesting to see if Apple can distinguish themselves, as they have always done, on the gui. To make it easy to use as a phone when you need a phone, and as a featureful computer when that is needed considering the limitations of the form factor. That is slightly different than making it just easy to use. I predict that the iphone will die early if they keep the software closed and not have it read my mind. However if it is the case that they make it safer for me to make a phone call on the road, as well as being a good PDA/computer they may have a chance. Also you probably wouldn't need myth TV on the Iphone for the reasons Apple does distinguish themselves as described above. Marty [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Message: 4 Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 16:26:36 -0500 From: Steven ** [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: To: community community@lists.openmoko.org Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Apple has said they won't allow any third party apps they don't approve. That most likely means no apps Cingular doesn't approve also. You think Cingular is going to allow VOIP apps that reduce the money Cingular makes off the phone? You think I'll be able to get my little MythTV remote app approved by Apple? etc. The iPhone hardware may be sweet, but the rest is a nightmare. -Steven On 4/27/07, Duncan Hudson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 4) Relax... you're not going to be able to add features to an iPhone. OSX is unix based, so you and I both know that one will be able to add apps to the iPhone. We also both know that for it to succeed in the business environment they'll have to allow 3rd party apps. Know that I want nothing more than for this device to succeed, but I truly believe with each slip its success becomes more difficult. There comes a point in the game when one just has to play the hand that they're holding - whether it's a winning hand or not... Dunc ___ OpenMoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
