Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 01:41:49PM +0200, arne anka wrote: > > 1) Find somewhere to buy a 10 uF SMD capacitor small enough. E.g. there's > > nowhere in Denmark I can get one. I'd need to go abroad (Malmö, > > Sweden)[1] > > i assume, you are located at sjælland, then? Yes. > any chance you'd be willing to apply that fix to othere people's frerunner? > i'd gladly consider a trip to copenhagen or roskilde ... No promises until I've applied the #1024 fix to my own Freerunner. -- Rask Ingemann Lambertsen Danish law requires addresses in e-mail to be logged and stored for a year ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 03:51:59PM +0400, Paul Fertser wrote: > Rask Ingemann Lambertsen writes: > > > > 1) Find somewhere to buy a 10 uF SMD capacitor small enough. E.g. there's > > nowhere in Denmark I can get one. I'd need to go abroad (Malmö, Sweden)[1] > > for a shop that sells a 0805 16 V one to hobbyists or, as I'll do in this > > case, buy 20 0805 22 uF ones from Digikey, of which 18 will be used > > for the bass fix, one for #1024 and one for fun and games[2]. > > I admit it's easier to source the cap being in Moscow, here you just > go to a shop and buy as many as you need. But even if one can't go to > a shop himself he can ask a buddy to get the caps and send by snail > mail. I can't see how it's can make a real problem. This means you need to find a buddy who can get the caps. I think it's just a lot easier to find components in your part of the world. For example, while looking for a VS6724Q0FB camera module, I've come across no less than four russian webshops[1] that seem to offer it. In contrast, the only three places that turn up in Europe are distributors that only sell to businesses and organisations[2]. [1] http://www.radel.ru/items_128989.htm http://www.prom-electro.ru/index.php?categoryID=13+99+2 http://www.cec-mc.ru/icatalog/view/377595.html http://www.imek.su/66500/item66295.html [2] http://www.eurotech.co.uk/components/1523.html http://www.rutronik.com/ http://www.baselectronic.com/stocklist.html > > 2) Disassemble the Neo not doing any damage. > > Trivial, wiki instructions are very clear, and plastic clips are > durable enough. I did it the day i bought my FR without fear or > issues. No, you need to apply a lot more force than I'm comfortable with for a device that I want to keep in a usable condition. As it turns out, it works out fine, but that's not obvious from the beginning. But yes, maybe we just need to make a video of someone doing it. For example, I would be most interested in seeing Jörg Reisenweber's one-hand trick with the PCB. > > 5) Put the can back on in a reasonably good shape. > > 6) Assemble the Neo. > > Both are non-issues for any man who's not disabled. I withdraw 5) and 6). If you've gone so far as to take the Neo apart in the first place, reassembling it will be a non-issue. > Having seen so many cool hardware projects/tricks/hacking devices/DIY > mods from European folks i really doubt it's that hard to find a guy > who can solder modern components somewhere nearby. Aren't there any > projects in universities that require soldering? So there're people > who know how to do it. I, for one, wouldn't really know where to look if I couldn't solder myself. > Sometimes i'm told i'm leaving in a parallel universe. Well, that's > quite possible indeed. And a much better universe too. Where did you find that wormhole? :-) -- Rask Ingemann Lambertsen Danish law requires addresses in e-mail to be logged and stored for a year ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
On Tuesday 11 August 2009 00:43:53 Paul Fertser wrote: > On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 08:47:01PM -0500, Mikhail Umorin wrote: > > Ok, maybe I'll give it a try (i.e. ask some one else to do it) :-) > > What's a good website to get the required cap (and what cap, brand, > > product #)? > > What you need is 0805 ceramic capacitor, 22uF, 6.3V (or more). > > If you're in Moscow, i suggest buying here: > > http://chipdip.ru/product0/276924954.aspx > > This was bought and used successfully by Q-Master. > > HTH Thank you for the info, Paul. Thanks also for the hint about digikey.com as the source for those caps in the US. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
Michal Brzozowski writes: > 2009/8/11 Paul Fertser > Mikhail Umorin writes: > > Paul, I think you are missing the risk part of it: if I screw up in > software I > > can just reflash the device if I break a tiny piece of hardware -- my > $400 fr > > is gone. > > I'm somehow certain that's a wrong assumption. Unless you do something > really cruel you're not likely to foobar the whole device. Also even > some fatal mistake will cost you less than $400 because the prices > really dropped lately. > > I think I've read an email on this group from someone who broke > their LCD by trying to do the # 1024 fix. The geek inside me will > gladly wait for one of the resellers to offer the fix. IIRC it was a buzzfix attempt. Doing #1024 is safer for the LCM (as you put the device LCM down and solder on the opposite side of the pcb). Also, even a new LCM bought from one of the resellers doesn't cost $400. -- Be free, use free (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) software! mailto:fercer...@gmail.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
2009/8/11 Paul Fertser > Mikhail Umorin writes: > >> > But I think you should still not assume that every Neo owner has > >> > access to the #1024 GSM fix necessary for the 140 hour standby time. > >> > >> Should i also refrain from assuming every Neo owner has access to some > >> *nix box? Or to ssh client? This might make sense _if_ Neo wasn't a > >> geek/hacker/developer device. But it is so its users are supposed to > >> be able to solve small riddles along their ways to freedom. > > > > Paul, I think you are missing the risk part of it: if I screw up in > software I > > can just reflash the device if I break a tiny piece of hardware -- my > $400 fr > > is gone. > > I'm somehow certain that's a wrong assumption. Unless you do something > really cruel you're not likely to foobar the whole device. Also even > some fatal mistake will cost you less than $400 because the prices > really dropped lately. > I think I've read an email on this group from someone who broke their LCD by trying to do the #1024 fix. The geek inside me will gladly wait for one of the resellers to offer the fix. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
BTW... is this bug fixed in A7? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
On Monday 10 August 2009 17:22:12 Paul Fertser wrote: > Mikhail Umorin writes: > >> > But I think you should still not assume that every Neo owner has > >> > access to the #1024 GSM fix necessary for the 140 hour standby time. > >> > >> Should i also refrain from assuming every Neo owner has access to some > >> *nix box? Or to ssh client? This might make sense _if_ Neo wasn't a > >> geek/hacker/developer device. But it is so its users are supposed to > >> be able to solve small riddles along their ways to freedom. > > > > Paul, I think you are missing the risk part of it: if I screw up in > > software I can just reflash the device if I break a tiny piece of > > hardware -- my $400 fr is gone. > > I'm somehow certain that's a wrong assumption. Unless you do something > really cruel you're not likely to foobar the whole device. Also even > some fatal mistake will cost you less than $400 because the prices > really dropped lately. > > > Software and hardware are two totally different animals and being a geek > > in one does not imply being a geek in the other. > > Being a geek is a way of life, that's how i see it. > > > I don't feel comfortable with any hw work exactly because of the risks > > involved. So, I would like some else fix this hw bug, but not just a guy > > around the corner -- I want a high degree of certainty that I shall get > > back a working device. > > Well, i had a talk with cell phone repair guy today. Showed him my FR > with front case dismounted so he could see how much work is involved > in doing the buzz-fix. He said the work itself is very-very easy and > he'd charge $30 or probably $15 if he liked the client. > > Probably you just can't imagine what cell phone repair guys usually > do, comparing to that buzzfixing is really easy. Ok, maybe I'll give it a try (i.e. ask some one else to do it) :-) What's a good website to get the required cap (and what cap, brand, product #)? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
Mikhail Umorin writes: >> > But I think you should still not assume that every Neo owner has >> > access to the #1024 GSM fix necessary for the 140 hour standby time. >> >> Should i also refrain from assuming every Neo owner has access to some >> *nix box? Or to ssh client? This might make sense _if_ Neo wasn't a >> geek/hacker/developer device. But it is so its users are supposed to >> be able to solve small riddles along their ways to freedom. > > Paul, I think you are missing the risk part of it: if I screw up in software > I > can just reflash the device if I break a tiny piece of hardware -- my $400 fr > is gone. I'm somehow certain that's a wrong assumption. Unless you do something really cruel you're not likely to foobar the whole device. Also even some fatal mistake will cost you less than $400 because the prices really dropped lately. > Software and hardware are two totally different animals and being a geek in > one does not imply being a geek in the other. Being a geek is a way of life, that's how i see it. > I don't feel comfortable with any hw work exactly because of the risks > involved. So, I would like some else fix this hw bug, but not just a guy > around the corner -- I want a high degree of certainty that I shall get back > a > working device. Well, i had a talk with cell phone repair guy today. Showed him my FR with front case dismounted so he could see how much work is involved in doing the buzz-fix. He said the work itself is very-very easy and he'd charge $30 or probably $15 if he liked the client. Probably you just can't imagine what cell phone repair guys usually do, comparing to that buzzfixing is really easy. -- Be free, use free (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) software! mailto:fercer...@gmail.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
On Monday 10 August 2009 06:51:59 Paul Fertser wrote: > > But I think you should still not assume that every Neo owner has > > access to the #1024 GSM fix necessary for the 140 hour standby time. > > Should i also refrain from assuming every Neo owner has access to some > *nix box? Or to ssh client? This might make sense _if_ Neo wasn't a > geek/hacker/developer device. But it is so its users are supposed to > be able to solve small riddles along their ways to freedom. Paul, I think you are missing the risk part of it: if I screw up in software I can just reflash the device if I break a tiny piece of hardware -- my $400 fr is gone. Software and hardware are two totally different animals and being a geek in one does not imply being a geek in the other. I don't feel comfortable with any hw work exactly because of the risks involved. So, I would like some else fix this hw bug, but not just a guy around the corner -- I want a high degree of certainty that I shall get back a working device. Mikhail. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix
Rask Ingemann Lambertsen writes: > On Sun, Aug 02, 2009 at 11:17:48PM +0400, Paul Fertser wrote: >> "arne anka" writes: >> >> > the only time i ever heard of 140h suspend were the mail from daniel >> > willmann after he applied a hw fix to #1024. >> >> Yes, exactly. But fixing is fairly trivial, the soldering part is in >> fact easier than the buzz fix. > >Yes, the soldering part. So you "only" have the remaining parts to do: > > 1) Find somewhere to buy a 10 uF SMD capacitor small enough. E.g. there's > nowhere in Denmark I can get one. I'd need to go abroad (Malmö, Sweden)[1] > for a shop that sells a 0805 16 V one to hobbyists or, as I'll do in this > case, buy 20 0805 22 uF ones from Digikey, of which 18 will be used > for the bass fix, one for #1024 and one for fun and games[2]. I admit it's easier to source the cap being in Moscow, here you just go to a shop and buy as many as you need. But even if one can't go to a shop himself he can ask a buddy to get the caps and send by snail mail. I can't see how it's can make a real problem. > 2) Disassemble the Neo not doing any damage. Trivial, wiki instructions are very clear, and plastic clips are durable enough. I did it the day i bought my FR without fear or issues. > 3) Take the can off in such a shape as to be able to put it on > again. Well, i did it myself during F9N (not exactly comfortable conditions!) with a usual knife i borrowed from Daniel. Did no damage. That was the first time i opened the GSM can. Requires a bit of patience, otherwise trivial. > 5) Put the can back on in a reasonably good shape. > 6) Assemble the Neo. Both are non-issues for any man who's not disabled. >And the thing is, if you don't already have a soldering iron and can't > borrow one (including someone to operate it?) then part 4) isn't really all > that trivial either. Having seen so many cool hardware projects/tricks/hacking devices/DIY mods from European folks i really doubt it's that hard to find a guy who can solder modern components somewhere nearby. Aren't there any projects in universities that require soldering? So there're people who know how to do it. > Unless someone sets up a #1024 fix programme, like there was the > buzz fix programme, the #1024 fix will likely be out of reach to > most of those affected. Rask, with all my respect i still can't see what makes it prohibitively hard for most of FR users to actually implement #1024 fix. Sometimes i'm told i'm leaving in a parallel universe. Well, that's quite possible indeed. >These days, you're less likely to be punished by hanging for such > behaviour. I do not exactly like the analogy :-/ > But I think you should still not assume that every Neo owner has > access to the #1024 GSM fix necessary for the 140 hour standby time. Should i also refrain from assuming every Neo owner has access to some *nix box? Or to ssh client? This might make sense _if_ Neo wasn't a geek/hacker/developer device. But it is so its users are supposed to be able to solve small riddles along their ways to freedom. -- Be free, use free (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) software! mailto:fercer...@gmail.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix (Was: Document with answers to most popular battery-related questions is ready)
> 1) Find somewhere to buy a 10 uF SMD capacitor small enough. E.g. there's > nowhere in Denmark I can get one. I'd need to go abroad (Malmö, > Sweden)[1] i assume, you are located at sjælland, then? any chance you'd be willing to apply that fix to othere people's frerunner? i'd gladly consider a trip to copenhagen or roskilde ... ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
The "trivial" #1024 GSM fix (Was: Document with answers to most popular battery-related questions is ready)
On Sun, Aug 02, 2009 at 11:17:48PM +0400, Paul Fertser wrote: > "arne anka" writes: > > > the only time i ever heard of 140h suspend were the mail from daniel > > willmann after he applied a hw fix to #1024. > > Yes, exactly. But fixing is fairly trivial, the soldering part is in > fact easier than the buzz fix. Yes, the soldering part. So you "only" have the remaining parts to do: 1) Find somewhere to buy a 10 uF SMD capacitor small enough. E.g. there's nowhere in Denmark I can get one. I'd need to go abroad (Malmö, Sweden)[1] for a shop that sells a 0805 16 V one to hobbyists or, as I'll do in this case, buy 20 0805 22 uF ones from Digikey, of which 18 will be used for the bass fix, one for #1024 and one for fun and games[2]. 2) Disassemble the Neo not doing any damage. 3) Take the can off in such a shape as to be able to put it on again. 5) Put the can back on in a reasonably good shape. 6) Assemble the Neo. And the thing is, if you don't already have a soldering iron and can't borrow one (including someone to operate it?) then part 4) isn't really all that trivial either. Unless someone sets up a #1024 fix programme, like there was the buzz fix programme, the #1024 fix will likely be out of reach to most of those affected. So the lady looked at the riot from the comfort of her castle. "Why is the crowd so angry?" she asked. "They have no money to buy bread, mylady" she was explained. "Can't they just eat cookies?" she asked. These days, you're less likely to be punished by hanging for such behaviour. But I think you should still not assume that every Neo owner has access to the #1024 GSM fix necessary for the 140 hour standby time. [1] http://www.electrokit.se/ [2] If I had an A5, I'd give it a shot to make it start without a battery. -- Rask Ingemann Lambertsen Danish law requires addresses in e-mail to be logged and stored for a year ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
