Re: Which image
I get the impression that only qtopia has daily builds, is that correct? No, ASU has it too If wee want to use ASU the most recent is the one from 2.) i.e. May 20? Try here http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200807/20080703/ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
On Thursday 03 July 2008, Andy Selby wrote: I get the impression that only qtopia has daily builds, is that correct? No, ASU has it too If wee want to use ASU the most recent is the one from 2.) i.e. May 20? Try here http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200807/20080703/ Is this not qtopia? or is ASU hidden behind this: Openmoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080703-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 Eildert ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
Try here http://buildhost.openmoko.org/daily/freerunner/200807/20080703/ Is this not qtopia? or is ASU hidden behind this: Sorry, I just realised I posted the exact same url as you did. ASU does include qtopia apps, but it also has the shelf widgets (the popdown menu at the top of the screen) Openmoko-openmoko-devel-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080703-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 ASU images have *qtopia-x11* in the filename like this one from that page Openmoko-openmoko-qtopia-x11-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080703-om-gta02.rootfs.jffs2 If we want to install additional packages is would FSO also be an option? Not as far as I know, they're trying to get the basics working, last i checked it could suspend/resume and make/receive calls, nothing more ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
On Thursday 03 July 2008, Andy Selby wrote: If we want to install additional packages is would FSO also be an option? Not as far as I know, they're trying to get the basics working, last i checked it could suspend/resume and make/receive calls, nothing more opkg works - I installed gpe-scap to take some screenshots. I don't know if the home screen can be configured to launch other apps though. You may be stuck with using ssh to get things going unless you feel like writing some code. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
The base software is just that. Base software. It will function as an everyday phone with dialer, SMS, and contacts. So, you can take that base and build on it, by yourself or with others. Or, come August timeframe you can get the Beta release of ASU. FSO is a framework or middleware if you like. The point is - what can we *developers* target for our end users? Without some stability on this image issue, 3rd-party developers are gonna get screwed. There may well be a market for new apps on OpenMoko; but not if there is no way we developers can reliably target bundles for the phone. ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
The point is - what can we *developers* target for our end users? fso, as i understand it. it offers a framework separating gui from internals and is supposed to be gui toolkit agnostic, thus allowing to coexist qt, gtk, e?? and whatever toolkits for guis will become available. Without some stability on this image issue, 3rd-party developers are gonna get screwed. There may well be a market for new apps on OpenMoko; but not if there is no way we developers can reliably target bundles for the phone. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
On Wed, 2008-07-02 at 12:16 +0200, Jay Vaughan wrote: The point is - what can we *developers* target for our end users? Without some stability on this image issue, 3rd-party developers are gonna get screwed. There may well be a market for new apps on OpenMoko; but not if there is no way we developers can reliably target bundles for the phone. Depending on exactly what you need, you should be able to develop in just about anything you want. The Openmoko devs have been vocal about the normal Moko firmware having Qt, GTK+, and EFL libraries on it, as well as at LEAST Python as a scripting language (I'm sure there will be more, though I don't know exactly which ones will be stock). If your application needs telephone facilities, or to communicate with the specialized hardware on a FreeRunner or other Moko device, you should target the FSO D-Bus specs (Though those are still in flux). As long as your software is packaged in the OPKG format (Like all Moko software should be), then you should be able to add a Dependency on just about any other package provided in an OpenMoko directory (Though if you're targeting the widest audience, you should probably stick to the main repo(s)). -KW ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? In my opinion, try them all and find one you like. There really needs to be a *much* better degree of pimp'atude coming from OpenMoko on the images to run .. like, an official page, available in a non-obscure place, which details the current released image and how to get it and use it. Right now, its a minefield - we have so many choices. If there were *one* standardized, well- publicized location to go, to find out whats cool and new about the latest image release, this would help us developers a great deal. As it is right now its very difficult to release an app for OM, not knowing what image is going to be used. This image fracture is damage. ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
Here is a good comparison of the images http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/2008/06/28/gtk-asu-fso-tmtla/ -Charles On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 5:10 AM, Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? In my opinion, try them all and find one you like. There really needs to be a *much* better degree of pimp'atude coming from OpenMoko on the images to run .. like, an official page, available in a non-obscure place, which details the current released image and how to get it and use it. Right now, its a minefield - we have so many choices. If there were *one* standardized, well- publicized location to go, to find out whats cool and new about the latest image release, this would help us developers a great deal. As it is right now its very difficult to release an app for OM, not knowing what image is going to be used. This image fracture is damage. ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
Jay Vaughan wrote: What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? In my opinion, try them all and find one you like. There really needs to be a *much* better degree of pimp'atude coming from OpenMoko on the images to run This is my responsibility and I'm well aware that it's needed, and has been needed, for a very long time. Unfortunately time has not permitted me to attend to this yet. Michael ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
This is my responsibility and I'm well aware that it's needed, and has been needed, for a very long time. Unfortunately time has not permitted me to attend to this yet. Well to help you out, I'll just keep talking about it for a while, but only every now and then, and at least only until I get my gta01 doing something actually .. you know .. useful. ;) ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
Are there any screenshots anywhere of the current state of FSO? I am interested because this thread is the first I have heard of it. On Tue, 2008-07-01 at 11:40 -0400, Charles Pax wrote: Here is a good comparison of the images http://www.vanille-media.de/site/index.php/2008/06/28/gtk-asu-fso-tmtla/ -Charles On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 5:10 AM, Jay Vaughan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? In my opinion, try them all and find one you like. There really needs to be a *much* better degree of pimp'atude coming from OpenMoko on the images to run .. like, an official page, available in a non-obscure place, which details the current released image and how to get it and use it. Right now, its a minefield - we have so many choices. If there were *one* standardized, well- publicized location to go, to find out whats cool and new about the latest image release, this would help us developers a great deal. As it is right now its very difficult to release an app for OM, not knowing what image is going to be used. This image fracture is damage. ; -- Jay Vaughan ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 12:20 PM, Mo Abrahams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are there any screenshots anywhere of the current state of FSO? I am interested because this thread is the first I have heard of it. I haven't been able to find any, but keep an eye on http://planet.openmoko.org/ . That's where Photo Tour of the ASU was posted. -Charles ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
2008/7/1 Mo Abrahams [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Are there any screenshots anywhere of the current state of FSO? I am interested because this thread is the first I have heard of it. http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=toPe0S8QpJY ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
http://dos.jogger.pl/2008/06/29/asu-to-przyszlosc/ 2008/7/1 Mo Abrahams [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Are there any screenshots anywhere of the current state of FSO? I am interested because this thread is the first I have heard of it. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Which image
The base software is just that. Base software. It will function as an everyday phone with dialer, SMS, and contacts. So, you can take that base and build on it, by yourself or with others. Or, come August timeframe you can get the Beta release of ASU. FSO is a framework or middleware if you like. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Eildert Groeneveld Sent: Monday, June 30, 2008 1:54 PM To: List for Openmoko community discussion Subject: Which image Hello Folks so here it is the nice black box. It does boot and it could even connect to the Vodaphone network and got the LL phone ringing. great! But what now? The applications look rather skinny. What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? greetings Redil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
Hi Folks, I have tried a lot of images, and been frequently disappointed by finding many Applications running on top of basic functionality with obvious and longstanding bugs. The latest image, the one called fso, is really exciting as it is simple to start with, beautiful to look at and seems to be intended for steady improvement. It has delightfully clear fonts for the big letters and numbers and its very small ones are still crystal clear. I am apparently one of a small minority which sees the openmoko as a little computer which can make phone calls. In addition I dont see the use of fingers as always appropriate on a screen with wonderful resolution capable of displaying a lot of text. Currently I have on the NAND side of the phone an interesting image from ScaredyCat, well hidden on his site but still there (1) which has 1. a qwerty keyboard, which is almost perfect (bug1270) being usable in a terminal having control characters etc available. 2. The ability to detect all the partitions on my SD card which enables me to write to it music, or text while it is in the phone, AND to write to it images for loading from the SD card. Thus I can dual boot the phone. That latter ability I have not found on any recent images. Whereas I have other images with those capabilities the one I refer to has the extra advantage it is not cluttered with a lot of things irrelevant to my really basic requirements and is thus a good basis for experiment. (It can make and receive phone calls). (1) Now I can't find it, the site seems to have been cleaned up. It was called: OpenMoko-minimal-openmoko-image-glibc-ipk-P1-Snapshot-20080227-fic-gta01.rootfs.jffs2 Please note that current bootloader does not dual boot for me and I am still using another SCaredyCat special for that. I never did find out why the one suggested in the wiki did not work for me. This is all old history I suppose. The important point is that it would be just marvellous if there was a group of people interested enough in solid basic functionality so that the phone could actually be used, as well as played with. This is one of the reasons for the importance of dual boot. clare On Tue, 1 Jul 2008, Al Johnson wrote: On Monday 30 June 2008, Eildert Groeneveld wrote: Hello Folks so here it is the nice black box. It does boot and it could even connect to the Vodaphone network and got the LL phone ringing. great! But what now? The applications look rather skinny. What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Which image
On Monday 30 June 2008, Eildert Groeneveld wrote: Hello Folks so here it is the nice black box. It does boot and it could even connect to the Vodaphone network and got the LL phone ringing. great! But what now? The applications look rather skinny. What would be the best image to use currently. Is the FSO an option? Any advice? What's best rather depends on what you want to do with it. I suggest you try them and see what work for you. The images are only a starting point though - you can use opkg to install packages from the repositories, or by URL as used for tangoGPS. None of the images I've tried so far (up to builds via mokomakefile on the 25th) will resume reliably if you go for the full power management (Dim first, then lock). If you look at the kernel mailing list it seems like good progress is being made increasing the speed and reliability of resumes, so with luck that'll hit the mainstream builds soon. The FSO image does what it says on the wiki page. It will ask for your PIN then connect to the GSM network, and make and receive calls. That's about it. As I understand things this is intended for demonstration and development of the freesmartphone.org APIs rather than a usable image, though the usable image may be a happy byeproduct in the future milestone releases. The ASU (openmoko-qtopia-x11-image) has the qtopia dialer, contacts and messaging apps with enlightenment-based apps for preferences, package management and basic mapping. I rather like it, but the qtopia apps don't start if I have the SIM in the phone. I'm about to look at this more closely. It also has a qwerty-style input method. The GTK-based openmoko-devel-image is more or less what the phone came preloaded with. This is what I've used most so far, adding gpsd and tangogps, a couple of scripts to make it easier to start and stop the wifi, and adding useful characters to the multi-tap keyboard to make the terminal more usable. There is also one ScaredyCat image for the Freerunner which is the GTK image with a bunch of config tweaks and handy extra apps. It mostly works on the Freerunner, but bits of it are clearly set up for the Neo1973. It wouldn't take many changes to make it as usable on the Freerunner as it looks like it would be on the Neo1973. I can certainly see why siome have described it as the most usable image for the Neo1973. Finally there's the qtopia image, or rather, as far as I can tell, there isn't. I expect Lorn will post an image as soon as Trolltech release the sources again. I certainly hope so as I was looking forward to trying it. Many thanks to everyone involved in getting the hardware and software this far. It's a great start, and the FSO has great potential for simplifying some real GUI innovation. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
