Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-05 Thread Robert Finking
You are welcome. Figure 1 in [2] is the diagram I was thinking of. On 03-Nov-15 20:39, Tobias Pfeiffer wrote: This helps very much, thank you for taking the time to answer! You might be looking for for "Combining Online and

Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-04 Thread Urban Hafner
To make matters more difficult I assume that this also depends on the exact node evaluation you’re using. There’s UCT + RAVE, then there’s just RAVE (as used by Michi). And then you can add other things in there as well like criticality (like Pachi, and at least at one point CrazyStone). I

Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-04 Thread Stefan Kaitschick
The name "Monte Carlo" strongly seems to suggest, that randomness it at the core of the method. And randomness does play a role. But what really happend in the shift to MC, was that bots didn't try to evaluate intermediate positions anymore. Instead, all game knowledge was put into selecting

[Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-03 Thread Tobias Pfeiffer
Hi everyone, I haven't yet caught up on most recent go papers. If what I ask is answered in one of these, please point there. It seems everyone is using quite heavy playouts these days (nxn patterns, atari escapes, opening libraris, lots of stuff that I don't know yet, ...) - my question is how

Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-03 Thread David Fotland
(for example) both attack and defense moves in a situation. David From: Computer-go [mailto:computer-go-boun...@computer-go.org] On Behalf Of Tobias Pfeiffer Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 2015 12:39 PM To: r...@ffles.com; computer-go@computer-go.org Subject: Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy

Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-03 Thread robertfinkng...@o2.co.uk
You have to be careful what heuristics you apply. This was a surprising result: using a playout policy which in itself is a stronger go player can actually make MCTS/AMAF weaker. The reason is that MCTS depends entirely on accurate estimations of the value of

Re: [Computer-go] AMAF/RAVE + heavy playouts - is it save?

2015-11-03 Thread Tobias Pfeiffer
This helps very much, thank you for taking the time to answer! You might be looking for for "Combining Online and Offline Knowledge in UCT" [1] by Gelly and Silver. Silver Tesauroreference it in "Monte-carlo Simulation Balancing" [2] with "Unfortunately, a stronger simulation policy can actually