Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-29 Thread dan
You may want to read The End of Money, David Wolman, 240 pp, Da Capo Press, 14 February 2012 insofar as it suggests that turning your smartphone into a branch bank makes all other forms of money irrelevant. Perhaps especially digital cash. --dan

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-27 Thread lodewijk andré de la porte
1. No offline transactions, which makes Bitcoin useless for a large class of transactions. On Mon, 27 Feb 2012, James A. Donald wrote: Smartphones. The implicit assumptions here, namely that * everyone who wants to make financial transactions carries a smartphone * smartphones never

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-27 Thread James A. Donald
[Another key bitcoin flaw is that it's not particularly anonymous in the face of NSA-level network surveillance. Cash *is* (remains) under these conditions.] On 2012-02-27 10:26 PM, lodewijk andré de la porte wrote: Working on this. And the network problem. What is the plan? Seems to me

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-27 Thread Natanael
Hmm... Where have I heard of that idea before... http://disattention.com/78/digital-currencies-crypto-finance-and-open-source/#ot https://github.com/FellowTraveler/Open-Transactions https://github.com/FellowTraveler/Open-Transactions/wiki/FAQ UNTRACEABLE DIGITAL CASH? … FOR REAL? Is this the

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread Benjamin Kreuter
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 08:48:05 -0500 d...@geer.org wrote: Well put, James. Warren Buffet's arguments are, to my eye, aligned with yours. He argues that gold has no intrinsic value, unlike farmland or a company like Coca Cola. In that way, his evaluation is as instrumentalist as is yours,

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread Benjamin Kreuter
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 17:57:14 +1000 James A. Donald jam...@echeque.com wrote: On 2012-02-26 1:18 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote: The demand for Bitcoin as a currency is driven by its properties as a digital cash system; people still need to get their nation's currency at some point Frau

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread Benjamin Kreuter
On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 11:00:15 -0500 Bill St. Clair billstcl...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Feb 26, 2012 at 10:08 AM, Benjamin Kreuter brk...@virginia.edu wrote: On Sun, 26 Feb 2012 08:48:05 -0500 d...@geer.org wrote: Money and government go hand in hand.  Governments need money in order

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread ianG
On 27/02/12 03:00 AM, Bill St. Clair wrote: You've just made a very good argument for eliminating money, at least government issued money. Yes, governments just love to assess taxes, fees, and fines. No, I have no need of any of that. Maybe, maybe not. The princes, bandits argument is not

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread James A. Donald
d...@geer.org wrote: Warren Buffet's arguments are, to my eye, aligned with yours. He argues that gold has no intrinsic value, unlike farmland or a company like Coca Cola. In that way, his evaluation is as instrumentalist as is yours, to the extent that I understand the both of you. His

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread James A. Donald
See 2011 shareholder letter www.berkshirehathaway.com/letters/2011ltr.pdf Warren Buffet's argument leads to the conclusion that had Roman in the time of Caesar invested a talent in land, or deposited some money with the money lenders to earn interest, his descendents would now be worth

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread James A. Donald
On 2012-02-27 1:28 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote: If the US Dollar were to fail, Bitcoin would be the last thing on anyone's mind; we would probably wind up switching to some other government's currency while we sorted out the mess (Yuan perhaps), or we would just spend our time killing each other

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread James A. Donald
On 2012-02-27 1:28 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote: If the US Dollar were to fail, Bitcoin would be the last thing on anyone's mind; we would probably wind up switching to some other government's currency while we sorted out the mess (Yuan perhaps), or we would just spend our time killing each

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-26 Thread Randall Webmail
From: James A. Donald jam...@echeque.com Warren Buffet correctly argues that gold will, on average, lose value. However there is a significant risk that everything except gold will lose value. There is no risk that potable water or salt or (properly maintained) rifles with ammunition will lose

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-25 Thread James A. Donald
On 2012-02-26 1:18 AM, Benjamin Kreuter wrote: The demand for Bitcoin as a currency is driven by its properties as a digital cash system; people still need to get their nation's currency at some point Frau Eisenmenger writes in her 1919 diary:

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-24 Thread James A. Donald
On 2012-02-25 12:53 PM, ianG wrote: It is also a singular lesson in the emotive power of cryptography to encourage large numbers of people to hash their intelligent thought processes. What we are seeing is otherwise rational people invest much time effort into what amounts to a ponzi or

Re: [cryptography] (off-topic) Bitcoin is a repeated lesson in cryptography applications - was endgame

2012-02-24 Thread John Levine
Then you'll find out about Santayana's curse - those that don't study history are doomed to repeat it. For reference, start with read John MacKay, _Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds_. MacKay turns out not to be all that accurate. The definitive work on financial