Re: [CTRL] [Re: [CTRL] Undoing the Reformation -- Round Two: Pope 1, Luther 0]
-Caveat Lector- This article and your comments(Teo and Bob) are right on target. There is a strange rapport developing between Lutherans and Catholics...even noticeable out here in the heartland. At Concordia college, a Lutheran institution, most of the professors spend their summers traveling to Russia and Romeaccompanied by their students... They're fascinated with religious icons, the liturgy of the Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic faiths... There's been a plethora of quasi-mystical books written of late that push Marian devotion and "how to pray with icons." All of this is rather peculiar from a church which, presumably, was supposed to be a departure from Roman Catholicism. But the Lutheran church seems to heavily involved with the New World Order. Lutheran Social Services are actively helping the thousands of refugees who are expected to be brought here. Interestingly, Lutheran Social Services doesn't seem too concerned about the three thousand AMERICANS, many of them children, who permanently live in our city's homeless shelters. Similarly, in the Protestant Episcopal church seems to be moving in a similar direction. In conversation with a historian (who still is proud of his CIA connections), he informed me that the agency is interested in promoting religious mysticism in Europe by way of funding a variety of religious leaders who can keep the energies of the Slavic people directed towards religious mysticism and the return of the monarchy... He thought a return of the Romanovs to Russia would be a good thingand such a restoration of monarchy would be supported by the Russian Orthodox church. And so it goes.. On Fri, 4 Jun 1999, Robert Tatman wrote: -Caveat Lector- Teo One Thousand [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 6/3/99 5:19:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Vatican, Lutherans Resolve Dispute VATICAN CITY (AP) -- Coming to terms in a centuries-old dispute, Roman Catholic and Lutheran officials will release an accord next week on the means of salvation, both sides said Wednesday. The Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification is meant to resolve a doctrinal debate at the heart of the 16th-century Protestant Reformation, which split Western Christianity. These are ominous signs indeed. It seems that Rome is going to be THE religion of the coming New World Order. Teo1000 Hmm. A tentative prediction: we know that the Pope intends during the Year of Jubilee next year to formally declare the Virgin Mary Co-Redemptrix with Jesus. I expect the miraculous apparitions of Princess Diana to increase significantly, especially following the formal deification of Mary. People will inevitably identify Diana with Mary, and the Church will subsequently accept the "martyred princess" as an incarnation of the Mother of God, probably by the end of 2000. Note that the apparitions of Diana have occurred in the refugee camps in Albania and Macedonia, and that she has appeared not to Catholics but to Muslims and Orthodox Christians. Should we expect her to intervene in Kashmir next? Bob = Robert F. Tatman [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Remove "nospam" from the address to reply. NOTICE: In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, this material is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. For more information go to: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/107.shtml POSTING THIS MESSAGE TO THE INTERNET DOES NOT IMPLY PERMISSION TO SEND UNSOLICITED COMMERCIAL E-MAIL (SPAM) TO THIS OR ANY OTHER INTERNET ADDRESS. RECEIPT OF SPAM WILL RESULT IN IMMEDIATE NOTIFICATION OF THE SENDER'S ISP. Get your own FREE, personal Netscape WebMail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com. DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email:
Re: [CTRL] [Re: [CTRL] Undoing the Reformation -- Round Two: Pope 1, Luther 0]
-Caveat Lector- Martin Luther divided the Churchhe causes wars and more warshis red roses turned many a white rose red with blood. England has always been the Mother Land; and Germany, the Fatherlandthe royal families intermarried - and now they are to reunitedthe marriage of the lily and the rose Its about time because, in America how anyone can call Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggart, Tammy Bakker, and the lot Christians, or even Protestants, or whatever they think they all areare they what religion is all about - self-serving greedy bastards who beg from the poor in the Churches name to line their own pockets? Me, give me a real religion - Catholic, Jewish, Protestant, or Moslemso long as it is real and stands for something other than greedThe Church like government is to serve. At least that is what I think.but my memory seems not as good as it once was. Colleen DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] [Re: [CTRL] Undoing the Reformation -- Round Two: Pope 1, Luther 0]
-Caveat Lector- According to Webster G. Tarpley (what a wonderful WASP name!), Luther was a puppet of Venetian financial interests interested in destroying the power of Rome. Protected by the German princes, Luther's ideas would be taken further by the reformers, but once some of the more savvy theologians realized the true revolutionary potential of the Christian message, (I'm thinking of Thomas Muntzer--leader of the Peasant's Revolt), Luther began condemning his contemporary rival "reformers." After all, with just a little shift in emphasis, if the power of the Church can be questioned, why not question the power of civil authority as well. Fearing that things had gotten out of hand, Luther condemned anyone who would challenge the authority of the princes to rule over the people. God had ordained the social order. If the princes were corrupt, well, the injustices that they visit on the poor are a judgment on the poor for their many sins. Stated differently, if you don't like your ruler, tough! Let God chastize the rulerspeasants should shut up and go back to work. Thomas Muntzer, once a follower of Luther, saw things differently. He argued that if the princes were corrupt, they should be removed. Well, Muntzer was hunted downtortured and executed. His wife was handed over to a German lord to be raped. And, in what must be one of the less sterling chapters in German history, Muntzer's followers, many of whom were women and children, were hunted down and slaughtered by the armies of the princes. Needless to say, Muntzer's name is still anathema in the Lutheran Church today. ...His "leveling ideas" still scare the hell out of the powers that be. On Fri, 4 Jun 1999, Colleen Jones wrote: -Caveat Lector- Martin Luther divided the Churchhe causes wars and more warshis red roses turned many a white rose red with blood. England has always been the Mother Land; and Germany, the Fatherlandthe royal families intermarried - and now they are to reunitedthe marriage of the lily and the rose Its about time because, in America how anyone can call Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggart, Tammy Bakker, and the lot Christians, or even Protestants, or whatever they think they all areare they what religion is all about - self-serving greedy bastards who beg from the poor in the Churches name to line their own pockets? Me, give me a real religion - Catholic, Jewish, Protestant, or Moslemso long as it is real and stands for something other than greedThe Church like government is to serve. At least that is what I think.but my memory seems not as good as it once was. Colleen DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Undoing the Reformation -- Round Two: Pope 1, Luther 0
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 6/3/99 5:19:38 AM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Vatican, Lutherans Resolve Dispute VATICAN CITY (AP) -- Coming to terms in a centuries-old dispute, Roman Catholic and Lutheran officials will release an accord next week on the means of salvation, both sides said Wednesday. The Joint Declaration on the Doctrine of Justification is meant to resolve a doctrinal debate at the heart of the 16th-century Protestant Reformation, which split Western Christianity. These are ominous signs indeed. It seems that Rome is going to be THE religion of the coming New World Order. Teo1000 DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Undoing the Reformation -- Round Two: Pope 1, Luther 0
-Caveat Lector- - Original Message - From: Teo One Thousand [EMAIL PROTECTED] Vatican, Lutherans Resolve Dispute These are ominous signs indeed. It seems that Rome is going to be THE religion of the coming New World Order. Imperial Orthodoxy broke with Nazarene Xianity around CE 500; Roman Catholicism broke with Byzantine Orthodoxy around CE 1000; Protestantism broke with Catholicism roughly around CD 1500. If history plays out, Xianity is now undergoing, or is about to experience, another schism of equal significance. Maybe Mormons will become the Dominant Heresy; maybe, when Pope John Paul II proclaims the divinity of Mary, Catholicism will split into pro- and anti-Marian factions; maybe a Yeshua/UFO cult will sweep the Xian world. Whatever the details, it's unlikely that Rome will monopolize the spirit biz. Consider how factions of Mormons, Moonies, LaRouchites, Scientologists and Old Catholics are vying for control of the US national security apparatus - watch this struggle VERY closely, for a hint at what's to come. Are any of these groups just fronts, or are Illuminati, Bilderbergers, Old Freemasons, fronts for yet other groups? Peel back the layers - what's at the heart of the onion? *IS* there a heart, or are there only more layers, more layers... ?? DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion and informational exchange list. Proselyzting propagandic screeds are not allowed. Substancenot soapboxing! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory', with its many half-truths, misdirections and outright frauds is used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRL gives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credeence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://home.ease.lsoft.com/archives/CTRL.html http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
