Re: Cypher piggie = JY = sea sea

[Steve Kinney]

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Hash: SHA1

+1 is my only comment, no need to read on.

:o)



On 09/24/2016 09:43 PM, rooty wrote:
>> On Sep 23, 2016 2:04 PM, "rooty" wrote:
>> 
>>> 
>>> I aint no troll!!
>> 
>>> Yes, you do are a troll.
>> 
>>> In your first message on this list, you used the nick "jaun"
>>> and
>> asked about John Young and Cryptome  (thread:  "Cryptome run by
>> feds").
>> 
>> its not rocket science to figure out that a site that hosts CIA
>> names and address and other confidental shit that there is some
>> sort of cooperation at some level -
>> 
>> 
>>> In another topic  (thread:  "Number of onions online", you
>>> mentioned
>> that "[Tor] is [used 99,9% for] illegal activity and drugs".  And
>> the rest is for your "honey pot"."
>> 
>> its all a bunch of sites promoting illigal activity. Go ahead and
>> run OnionScan see what you find - cloning and spoofing darknet
>> URL's is a favorite  he he!
>> 
>> 
>>> Your second message using the nick "rooty" was bizarre and
>> aggressive.  You posted the link for one of the most bizarre,
>> stupid and racist videos that I saw, on a thread named
>> "Niggers".
>> 
>> Hey - its created by a black man and is so true I posted the
>> link again -  Until we reconnize the difference we will never
>> solve the problem - https://www.youtube.com/embed/QwCCj8Dx-gk
>> 
>> 
>>> Being sincere, I had no stomach for watching this video, named
>>> "How
>> Savage Are Blacks In America & Why Is Everyone Afraid To Discuss 
>> It?".  It's disgusting, nasty, harmful to offend the black
>> people. Someone who judges a person for the melanin in their skin
>> doesn't deserve and doesn't have my respect.
>> 
>> Has nothing to do with the color of their skin - its probable a
>> good idea to obey orders when confronted by law -
>> 
>> "Cypher Piggie" wrote several times the word "nigga", very
>> racist. You have the Cypher Piggie from Hell patterns, not me and
>> never John Young.  I am not a "nigga", troll, I am a "Jap", but
>> offending my black bros is really to ask for being kicked right
>> in the balls. Remember it.
>> 
>>> dont know Cyper Piggie - my experience is its ok for blacks to
>>> use
>> the word nigga not whites!
>> 
>>> Your next thread was "Xorcist = Coderman".  Guy, Xorcist and
>>> Coderman
>> are different persons, with different styles and points of view.
>>  Horrible bet!  You just offended Xorcist and, if he is still
>> alive and reading the list, Coderman.
>> 
>> 
>> Coderman is locked up -
>> 
>>> And, finally, this absurd thread "Cypher piggie = JY = sea
>>> sea".
>> 
>> Cypher piggie disappeared - its not a good idea to put a hit out
>> on someones life -
>> 
>>> Get a life and go study, make something useful to the group and
>>> to
>> the world fair enough.
> 
>> sea sea
> 
> root root
> 
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Re: [From xorcist offlist] Cloudflare & NoDAPL again w/ a ROTF

[xorcist]

> On Sat, 24 Sep 2016 12:01:39 -
>   Well, I don't. And what hat are you wearing now? The
>   manipulative emotionalist, or the cold 'scientific' thinker?

I don't really care if you do, or don't. I have no vested interest in
changing your mind. I'm simply stating my views, and responding to your
questions, and assertions, about them.

I don't wear hats.

>   OK. You want to believe that your niece has 'autism'. I think
>   she should be left the fuck alone. Notice also how a couple of
>   days ago you apparently thought that conformity to 'social
>   norms' was a problem, but you've been taking the exact opposite
>   side here. You made excuses for the psychiatric mafia, and
>   ultimately you just believe in their nonsense.

I don't give a shit if she wears shoes or not, or wants to bolt when the
lawnmower comes around. I don't care if she throws 'tantrums' or gets
loud, or whatever. I took her to a museum once, and on the train ride home
she was talking a bit loud (normal for her). It wasn't particularly that
late at night, around maybe 8pm, on an otherwise noisy, rumbling train --
so speaking a bit loud was to be expected of anyone, anyhow. Some cunt
tried to "shush" her while she was talking. She got embarrassed, and
immediately started talking in a lower tone. My response was to motion to
her to hold on, and then loudly said "We're on a rumbling loud train,
lady, and the quiet car is two up. If you interrupt again, you'll have me
in your face."

I'm not taking any "exact opposite side" .. you seem to really be unable
to separate, as I'm mentioned before, idealistic principles from pragmatic
practice.

IDEALLY, I would like it if people treated her differently. I would like
very much if her parents and others saw her the way I do. An individual,
with tastes, needs, and challenges that are unique to her. Like everyone.

But that isn't REALITY. It doesn't fucking matter what people in the IDEAL
world would do, we don't live there.

So, PRAGMATICALLY speaking, I offer her advice on how to cope with, deal
with, and adapt to society around her, always emphasizing that to do so
should always be in her best interests, for things she wants or feels is
important, and not because of the expectations or desires of others.

Ideally, you don't want to pay taxes, but you do. It's no different.
You'll give me some line of bullshit about coercion, but in point of fact
you COULD simply steal goods, and not pay sales tax, and not pay other
taxes. You don't want the ramifications. So you deal, and cope.

No different.

>> I wouldn't consider it a problem.. and my understanding is that
>> because its biologically based,
>
>   I'm done with (your) pseudo science, sorry.

Go look it up, dude.


>> >In this case, it's the family. Which I think is some sort of
>> >model for the state...As in paternalistic governments, nanny
>> >states, founding fathers, the pope, patriotism (from
>> >pater)...that kind of thing...
>>
>> Ok, so we're talking models of the state, and not THE totalitarian
>> state.
>
>   Huh? All states are totalitarian, by definition.

Read. "IN THIS CASE ITS THE FAMILY WHICH IS ___SOME_SORT_OF_MODEL__ .."

You started out by saying that kids are forced into comformity by THE
TOTALITARIAN STATE. I said no, kids are forced into conformity by peer
pressure from other kids. To which you are said that ok, its the parents
that fail to suppress peer pressure and bullying, and that is somehow a
model for the state.

I'm not gonna bother with it.. because the point is simply, first.. you're
back-peddling here, and that's fine. And second, my point has been
affirmed.

The STATE. The functioning body of government does not, through law and
state officials, have much to do with the behavior patterns encouraged
upon children. As you said, that is ultimately the family, who fail to
raise proper kids, and those kids might be bullies or engage in peer
pressure.

Fine, good.


>> Greedy state-outlawed drug dealers, working as salesmen for out-lawed
>> cartels, selling outlawed, unpatentable freely reproduced and copied
>> products and other shit. Furthermore, they drug up children who are
>> just looking for an escape from the 'normal' savagery.
>
>   What point are you trying to make?

Nope. The point was that using your reasoning you can apply it to things
that government has no direct bearing on. That regardless of whether or
not it is legalized, and state-regulated, or unregulated and black market,
in either case -- greed comes to bear.

The state doesn't make people greedy. Greedy people don't necessarily,
even, make up the state.

The state IS. Greed IS. There is overlap.

Hey, state officials breathe too, I hear.

>   Unpatentable yes, freely reproduced, obviously not at all. The
>   products still need to be manufactured in a highly regulated
>   enviroment. That's why there's a black market...

Freely reproducible in the sense that customers 

Re: Cypher piggie = JY = sea sea

[rooty]

On Sep 23, 2016 2:04 PM, "rooty" wrote:

>
> I aint no troll!!

>Yes, you do are a troll.

>In your first message on this list, you used the nick "jaun" and asked about 
>John Young and Cryptome (thread: "Cryptome run by feds").

its not rocket science to figure out that a site that hosts CIA names and 
address and other confidental shit that there is some sort of cooperation at 
some level -


>In another topic (thread: "Number of onions online", you mentioned that "[Tor] 
>is [used 99,9% for] illegal activity and drugs". And the rest is for your 
>"honey pot"."

its all a bunch of sites promoting illigal activity. Go ahead and run OnionScan 
see what you find - cloning and spoofing darknet URL's is a favorite he he!


>Your second message using the nick "rooty" was bizarre and aggressive. You 
>posted the link for one of
the most bizarre, stupid and racist videos that I saw, on a thread named 
"Niggers".

Hey - its created by a black man and is so true I posted the link again - Until 
we reconnize the difference we will never solve the problem -
https://www.youtube.com/embed/QwCCj8Dx-gk


>Being sincere, I had no stomach for watching this video, named "How Savage Are 
>Blacks In America & Why Is Everyone Afraid To Discuss It?". It's disgusting, 
>nasty, harmful to offend the black people. Someone who judges a person for the 
>melanin in their skin doesn't deserve and doesn't have my respect.

Has nothing to do with the color of their skin - its probable a good idea to 
obey orders when confronted by law -

"Cypher Piggie" wrote several times the word "nigga", very racist. You have the 
Cypher Piggie from Hell patterns, not me and never John Young. I am not a 
"nigga", troll, I am a "Jap", but offending my black bros is really to ask for 
being kicked right in the balls. Remember it.

>dont know Cyper Piggie - my experience is its ok for blacks to use the word 
>nigga not whites!

>Your next thread was "Xorcist = Coderman". Guy, Xorcist and Coderman are 
>different persons, with different styles and points of view. Horrible bet! You 
>just offended Xorcist and, if he is still alive and reading the list, Coderman.


Coderman is locked up -

>And, finally, this absurd thread "Cypher piggie = JY = sea sea".

Cypher piggie disappeared - its not a good idea to put a hit out on someones 
life -

>Get a life and go study, make something useful to the group and to the world
fair enough.

>sea sea

root root

Re: Pike Committee

[Razer]

On 09/24/2016 02:48 PM, Ryan Carboni wrote:
> https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=145022#relPageId=20=page
> 
> "First it suggests that the NSA is able to monitor virtually every
> international communication entering or leaving the United States. At
> present, some 24 million telegrams and 50 million telex (teletype)
> messages enter, leave, and transit the United States annually,"
> 


That's the Diego Garcia, Global Crossings, always a US Navy hardhat
diver-down doing something JamesBond-ish, international cable chokepoint.

What they did to the indigenous peeps of Diego Garcia to turn it into
one giant antenna farm/Naval/Airbase near the cable is nothing short of
genocide too.

It was a stop-over point for Rendition flights too.

http://auntieimperial.tumblr.com/search/diego+garcia

Julian Assange on Rubber-hose proof (cryptographically deniable) file-systems (1997)

[John Young]

Date: 6 Dec 1997 05:49:19 -
Message-ID: <19971206054919.5142.qm...@iq.org>
From: Julian Assange 
To: coderpu...@toad.com
cc: cryptogra...@c2.net, cypherpu...@toad.com
Subject: Rubber-hose proof (cryptographically deniable) file-systems.
Sender: owner-cypherpu...@toad.com
Precedence: bulk



Here's a copy of some correspondence in relation to my implementation
of a `rubber hose proof' (cryptographically deniable) file system
(actually implimented as a block device on which you can mount any
file system). I'm happy with the cryptographic strength of the system
(but feel free to comment anyway). That said, I'm not convinced that
my avoidance of media (i.e disk surface) analysis attacks (which could
potentially show the pre-sense or otherwise of cryptographic file
systems other than the "duress" ones) is entirely effective. I'd like
some comment from gauss-ridden declassification guru's here :)

[...]

Here's how I'm implementing `aspects' in Rubberhose/marutukku;
`aspect' is the term I'm using to refer to the
cryptographically-deniable (i.e rubber-hose-proofed) "portion", of a
maru extent i.e it's a different _aspect_ (view) of the same
underlying physical block extent.

I decided that random split lengths don't add to the security of the
scheme - only 2x from my calculations - which isn't enough to warrant
the increase in memory use and complexity involved.  The extent is
simply divided up into n splits (say 1024 or one every 256k, whichever
is smaller). Each aspect has an encrypted 32bit block remap list
(which is simply a linear array because of the fixed split size).  A
split avoidance bit-map is created from these per-aspect remap lists
on instantiation of the aspects. An individual aspect looks like so
(when saved):

typedef struct
{
m_u32 keySum; /* key checksum */
u_char masterKey[MAX_KEY];
u_char latticeCipherType, blockCipherType;
u_char pad[MAX_BLOCK - (4 + MAX_KEY + 1 + 1) % MAX_BLOCK]; /* 
block align */

} maruCycle;

typedef struct
{
maruCycle cycle;
u_char keySalt[MAX_PASSPHRASE];
maruLatticeKey latticeKeySalt[2];
u_char blockIV[MAX_FS_BLOCK_SIZE];
u_char latticeSalt[2*MAX_LATTICE_DEPTH*MAX_BLOCK_KEY]; /* must 
be 64 aligned */

m_u32 remap[MAX_SPLITS];
m_u32 iterations;
maruCipher keyCipherType;
} maruHeaderAspect;

There are an array of (8 by default) of these constructs in a maruHeader.

The smap accessor macros are simple:

#define	SMAP_SET(p, n) (((p))[(n)/(sizeof(maruSmap)*8)] |= (1 << ((n) 
% (sizeof(maruSmap)*8
#define	SMAP_CLR(p, n) (((p))[(n)/(sizeof(maruSmap)*8)] &= ~ (1 << 
((n) % (sizeof(maruSmap)*8
#define	SMAP_ISSET(p, n) (((p))[(n)/(sizeof(maruSmap)*8)] & (1 << 
((n) % (sizeof(maruSmap)*8


By default, each unused maruHeaderAspect struct contains random noise
(except for keyCipherType, which defaults to being the same for all
aspects) and is of course indistinguishable from a valid maruAspect
without the associated key.

Instantiation example:

Say you have three valid aspects, a1, a2 and a3. Arbitrarily, you have
chosen a1 to be the simple duress aspect (i.e ``you expect us to
believe you have solitary letter of donation to the Polit Bureau Ball
in your entire encrypted file system?! Do you know what this is Nikov?
. THIS is the finest cryptanalytic device known to
man. THIS is a RUBBERHOSE! *thwap* *thwunk* *boink*. Now... what's the
*real* key Nikov... or should we call you... Nikolay Bukharin?''), a2 to
be the limited disclosure aspect ("Dear diary. Nikita, Ivan, Boris and

came over today and smoked a *shit load* of hash. Not wanting to
offend, I had a toke, but like that capitalist dog
^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H illustious leader of the freeworld, was
careful not to inhale.") and a3 has your ice-9 formula nicely tucked
away.

You decide one fine morning that you want to add an ATP pre-cursor as
a catalyst to your ice-9 recipe of destruction (ostensibly, you plan
to generate this stuff from cultures of genetically modified mouse
liver cell mitochondria), and provide the a1, a2 and a3 pass-phrases.

a1, a2 and a3 are decrypted. the aspect remap is parsed and used to
create the physical block "avoidance" map (checking for conflicts
along the way).

Joyous about the frozen seas to come, you copy the ATP pre-cursor
catalyst into a3 and the file system tries to write a new block - e.g
b28 - to a3.  b28 is translated through the a3 remap table to b-1
(unallocated). A random block remap number is generated e.g b595 and
tested against the avoidance smap. If free, it is marked and chosen to
be the new a3 mapping, otherwise the algorithm simply does a circular
hunt for the next free entry in the avoidance smap.

Naturally, reading only requires the key of the aspect you are
interested in (divulging). Writing to one aspect without the keys to
the other aspects will randomly trash them as new splits are assigned.

Timer remaps, reads and re-writes:

This would be the simple end of it, were it not but for 

Re: [From xorcist offlist] Cloudflare & NoDAPL again w/ a ROTF

[xorcist]

> On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 05:50:00 -
>   Psychiatry is radically different. Being 'mentally healthy'
>   simply means being 'well adapted' to a society of crazies.

I get where you are coming from. I've often said, "Being well-adapted to a
sick culture is no sign of health."

>   The fact that psychiatrists and the like may sometimes say some
>   sensible things doesn't counter this other fact : they also
>   say very crazy things. And do very criminal things.

Agreed.

I see. So, correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me more like your main
criticism is of the establishment of psychiatry, and not so much with the
study of the mind, personality, and so on as such?

I can agree with this. I think a great deal of psychiatry, as a discipline,
is half-assed, and generally speaking am critical of institutions generally.

But in terms of explaining common aspects of human behavior, I find
psychological models fairly accurate.

>   Maybe she doesn't like gym class. And maybe the tantrums are
>   caused by some other reason.

No, she won't wear shoes if she can help it. "Pathologically" prefers bare
feet, or socks.. and can accept sandals. She really does get a
panic-attack type response to it.

Some autism is characterized by tactile response things like that. She
used to flinch at touch very easily too. As in, she could be sitting on
the couch, ask you to come over, see you coming over and you could gesture
out your hands to indicate touch.. but she would still jump a little if
you touched her shoulder or whatever. She's basically over that, now
though.

That example is like a weird "two-fer" .. Aspies (affectionate name for
those with Asperger's) tend to not understand body language well, so the
gesture of oncoming touch wouldn't necessarily be interpreted correctly.

>   So, the issue is not any mental problem on her part, but
>   having to deal with less than fully civilized people...

I wouldn't consider it a problem.. and my understanding is that because
its biologically based, its not considered mental illness, or a disease of
the mind. It's a condition. Like being quite short.. a "little person"
it's no disease, it's just them. CAN that condition be a problem to deal
with? Of course.

She has real issues coping with things that 'normal' people tend to have
zero issue with. She's different.. very much like being quite short, and
having issues coping in the world with average sized people.

How "normal" people treat her causes far more problems than her condition
causes her on its own, by far. I imagine that is true for little people as
well.

>   In this case, it's the family. Which I think is some sort of
>   model for the state...As in paternalistic governments, nanny
>   states, founding fathers, the pope, patriotism (from
>   pater)...that kind of thing...

Ok, so we're talking models of the state, and not THE totalitarian state.
Yeah, authoritarianism has bad effects, for sure.

>
>   Exactly. Greedy STATE LICENSED doctors working as salesmen for
>   the greedy pharmaceutical mafia that exists only thanks to
>   STATE GRANTED patents and other IP shit. Furthermore, they drug
>   up children who are not 'normal', i.e. they are actually
>   healthy children who don't get along with 'normal' savagery.
>
>   So the state seems to play some sort of role in all that...

Greedy state-outlawed drug dealers, working as salesmen for out-lawed
cartels, selling outlawed, unpatentable freely reproduced and copied
products and other shit. Furthermore, they drug up children who are just
looking for an escape from the 'normal' savagery.

So the state seems to have little role, in all of that...

Greed will always be around, man. Greed will infect any system you have,
or don't have. Greed infected monarchies, modern nation-states, churches,
personal relationships.. I mean.. name it, and if it involves humans,
greed has been a problem for it somehow, somewhere I'd wager.

>> If people were so fundamentally, at their core, rational -- why does
>> this irrational thing exist?
>
>
>   Because there are well organized 'minorities' who are able to
>   impose their views on the rest.

But it isn't rational to allow a minority to impress its will on the
majority.

So we're back to square one.


>   Even if we were cleverer than the rest, it doesn't follow
>   we should be in charge. And a group of stupid people controlled
>   by a minority of marginally less stupid people is a recipe for
>   tyranny and disaster.

Why not? If rational is the metric for good, then the most rational people
can do the most good. They'll seek to do the most good.

It may still be a recipe for disaster, but it would seem to be a smaller
disaster, or take a longer time, or SOMETHING positive compared to those
that can't reason to the same level of complexity.

Society is complex. There are a lot of moving parts. Irrational people
running the show 

Re: [From xorcist offlist] Cloudflare & NoDAPL again w/ a ROTF

[juan]

On Thu, 22 Sep 2016 05:50:00 -
xorc...@sigaint.org wrote:

> > On Wed, 21 Sep 2016 14:35:31 -
> > Yes indeed. But there are very important differences between
> > physics - a 'hard science', medicine which could be
> > 'scientific' but since it deals with incredibly complex systems it
> > is mostly a joke (and fraud) at the moment, and then psychiatry
> > which is just...an attemtp to give a 'scientific' veneer to
> > witch-burning.
> 
> In my experience, the people who are so rabidly anti-medicine, and
> anti-psychiatry are usually ridiculously religious, or fearful they
> are mentally ill. 

Medicine and psychiatry are conceptually different. The problem
with medicine is that knowledge in the field is very limited,
but at least in theory, knowledge is possible. Also, not much
debate is needed regarding what being healthy means - it's a
physical condition. 

Psychiatry is radically different. Being 'mentally healthy'
simply means being 'well adapted' to a society of crazies. For
instance, so called western 'civilization' is choke full with
religious lunatics who think that blowing brown children up is
their sacred duty. And those people are not locked up in a
nuthouse. They are the ones running the show. 



> You don't strike me as either, so this seems really
> odd to me. Obviously, psychiatry is mis-used by the state, but I just
> cannot fathom this idea of a "scientific veneer" .. certainly, there
> is a great amount to question in what the doc's say.. but.. certain
> things seem obvious?
> 
> Like the idea that people tend to operate from a position of
> protecting the ego. That just seems so.. obvious.. I don't know, I
> just don't know what else to say.


The fact that psychiatrists and the like may sometimes say some
sensible things doesn't counter this other fact : they also
say very crazy things. And do very criminal things. 


> 
> > Treating shy people taking into account their shyness seems
> > like common sense and decency to me. You don't need the
> > psycho-charlatans to teach you that.
> 
> You obviously know shit about autism. She is.. oddly sensitive to
> certain things, and prone to emotionally crippling "tantrums" because
> of it. Certain smells, the smell of freshly cut grass, makes her
> slightly ill feeling. She doesn't like things around her feet, like
> normal shoes or sneakers, and its genuinely distressing, not just a
> matter of preference. Consequently, the sight of lawnmowers, and the
> need to wear sneakers for gym glass, can cause her to get panic
> attacks, basically, which result in those tantrums.


Maybe she doesn't like gym class. And maybe the tantrums are
caused by some other reason. 


> 
> It isn't just a matter of her being shy, and needing to take shyness
> into account. Those differences, and people looking at her like she's
> all fucked up, made her shy. When she was much younger, she was very
> curious and outgoing. People treating her like a weirdo because she
> IS different, made her shy.

So, the issue is not any mental problem on her part, but
having to deal with less than fully civilized people...

> 
> She really does have different neurology.

...whatever that means.


> 
> > And that's what really should be called fucking crazy.
> > Poisoning people because they are not comfortable with their
> > 'peers' who do conform to totalitarian 'social' 'norms'.
> 
> Sorry, but this is idiotic. It's not about fucking "totalitarian"
> norms. When a kid freaks out about the smell of grass, its normal for
> other kids to tease, thinks she's weird, and so on. This is +not
> impressed on them by the fucking state.


It is impressed by parents not really caring for their
children, sorry to break it to you. Some children may tease of
bully other children sometimes but one would expect their
parents to teach them not to.


> 
> It's how primate humans treat people who they see as different and
> not in their in-group.
> 
> But since that's all bullshit, sure.. it's the government.

In this case, it's the family. Which I think is some sort of
model for the state...As in paternalistic governments, nanny
states, founding fathers, the pope, patriotism (from
pater)...that kind of thing...

> 
> C'mon. Granted, we agree on the silver-bullet drug thing. Drugs are
> over prescribed. I don't see that as state totalitarianism, and the
> "veneer" of science on a sham discipline.
> 
> That's economic corruption. Doctors getting kick-backs from drug
> companies, and shit. That's just good old fashion greed at work.


Exactly. Greedy STATE LICENSED doctors working as salesmen for
the greedy pharmaceutical mafia that exists only thanks to
STATE GRANTED patents and other IP shit. Furthermore, they drug
up 

Re: [RUS] Putin - the most moderate Russian politician acceptable to the Russian public

[xorcist]

> First you raised a straw man "Putin good man/ bad man", then you raise a
> dichotomy "the wrong question vs the right question".

Straw man implies I'm arguing with you, or trying to refute your opinion.
I'm just having a discussion, and the "Putin good man / bad man" thing was
mostly to clarify my own position, as I had just stated my opinion of some
of his positive qualities.

> There are actions in the world.

Truly.

> Some exhibit what I name as evil intentions.
> Others actions exhibit good intentions.

Right. You name them. It's your opinion. I may even agree with that
opinion. But I am operating from the standpoint where I understand that
others have different opinions, and may name things in exactly the reverse
order.

That's why I meant by there are no good guys and bad guys in geopolitics.

American's are going to (on the whole) support America. Russians are, on
the whole, going to support Russia.

As I understand it, people tend to support their local sports teams too.

> Soros' emails show he wanted to break up Russia (not just the USSR) to
> ultimately create a one world hegemon.

Surely. My point was more in regards to the "since perestroika" part.
Mainly that, since those times, Russian/American opinions of each have
been up, and been down; whereas it sounded like you are presenting the
idea that Russian's opinion of America has steadily declined.

>From my understanding, that is not the case.

> Putin decided Russia was a nation of 170 million people who deserve
> better than Soros "break up Russia" intention, and set about doing many
> good actions in support of that nationalistic position.

Agreed. He is playing for his team.

I'm sure someone like Kissinger would argue Soros is playing for the other
team.

> "The West" has time and again demonstrated utter contempt for anything
> actually worth regarding.

I tend to agree. We have similar definitions of worth.

>
> Russians have seen this, and of course the Russian media does its level
> best to draw this out, and boost their ratings from such madness as is
> so regularly displayed in the West and by Westerners, and as a result of
> seeing this, Russians now have a, rather low, regard for "the West".

Depends on who you talk to. Russians in the West certainly don't, that
I've talked to.

> This is a healthy development :)

It's a development.

Some years ago, I was living in New York City. I sat in a bar once,
talking the piss with a couple of guys that were older than I. One, a
former U.S. marine. The other, a former Russian soldier. We sat around,
getting a bit tossed, telling jokes and having a good time.

The conversation turned to their pasts, when the subject of their military
backgrounds came up, and it turned out that they had both served in their
respective forces at the same time. I shut the fuck up, first, not having
any inclinations to military type loyalties, and because I was curious how
this whole thing was going to go down now that we'd both had a good number
of drinks.

The American observed that, he was glad the world turned out the way it
did and that we were all having a good laugh, and that a "bunch of rat
bastard politicians" didn't make him have to kill the Russian guy. The
Russian poked back in good nature, saying he was glad that he didn't have
to try, because the American would surely have lost, sort of thing. Just a
bit of guy bravado and joshing around.

Just as they started to move the conversation away from all that .. I
piped back up and offered:

Yeah, but think back to your time in the service. Think back to when you
were in it. Back then, you would have never believed you'd be sitting here
having a drink together, laughing. Back then, they had you hating each
other before you even met.

They got quiet. Somber. I let them stew for a bit, and then ordered
another round and offered a toast 'So here's to the rat bastards who are
smart enough to trick us all, but not smart enough to run the world like a
proper clock.. at least the cunts haven't fucked up the booze yet!'

Which brought back around the revelry.

THAT was a positive development.

Re: [RUS] Putin - the most moderate Russian politician acceptable to the Russian public

[xorcist]

>
> GOOD and bad, RIGHT and wrong - are THE ONLY VARIABLES in this equation.

 I disagree.

On a personal level, right and wrong certainly exist. I believe this is
the only plane where morality has any real meaning.

On a geopolitical level, good and evil are meaningless, UNLESS you make
the simple statement that ALL states are evil. That I can agree with. Like
street gangs, for instance.

But once you're IN that game, there is no more good and evil. There is our
gang, and their gang. We compete, and that's the game.

Like chess.

I was never much a fan of chess. Simulated war game silliness. Nor sports
like football where you're running back and forth towards opposing goals,
and playing at invading territory.

Cricket and baseball are more my speed. You share the field, and take
turns being on the top of the mound, and getting shit thrown at you. It
has an element of team play, and an element of one-on-one competition
while the team stands around.

Re: JY vs Sea Sea vs Actual Discussion

[xorcist]

> That is /very/ clever indeed.

Why thank you.

> Or just make them believe you gave up something "personally
> embarrassing" but not actionable under duress.  Got to give them a win
> to report.
>
> :o)

Yeah, I was always partial to having something personally embarrassing as
a first level involving weird porn, and then a richly eloquent "fuck you"
letter to whoever is reading it chastising, basically saying "if you made
it this far, you must be a sick pervert looking for more porn", as a
second level.

That might be fun for certain circumstances.

But for covert agents, criminals, terrorists, shit like that.. if you're
being interrogated, they probably have good evidence to hold you beyond
wanting to look at your plaintext. That's the case where one needs the
strategy angle.

Not that I personally need to concern myself with such things.. but I find
mathematics and game theory fascinating, so.. it passes the time and keeps
me from drinking or watching TV. That's a plus.

Re: JY vs Sea Sea vs Actual Discussion

[Cecilia Tanaka]

On Sep 23, 2016 3:13 PM, "David Smith"  wrote:
>
> Not little boy and girl posers who like the idea of tangentially
associating themselves with a movement that changed the world.

I am just a lawyer, who loves Technology and Science a lot.  I am not a
good cypherpunk.  I am not a good anarchist.  I am not a good coder.  I am
still learning about all these subjects and about real privacy, security, a
lot of things.

I make part of crypto and privacy groups, cryptoraves and cryptoparties
without being a good crypto activist yet, because, someday, I swear I will
be a really good one and the people who knows me, feel it very well.

I need more time, studies and, uff, much more material resources, but I
will learn and, in the future, I will teach people like me, trying to learn
alone.  I swear I am trying to learn, to study in my free time, even some
people say I am too retard for it or just a "little girl poser".  I never
said "I am cypherpunk" to any person in this world.  I am not using the
movement in any sense, don't worry.

sea sea

Re: [RUS] Putin - the most moderate Russian politician acceptable to the Russian public

[Zenaan Harkness]

On Sat, Sep 24, 2016 at 01:29:33AM -, xorc...@sigaint.org wrote:
> > What many in the West don't get is that many Russians are a patriotic
> > lot, and hardy in their nationalism, and with the history of the world
> > since perestroika, they carry now a not insignificant disdain for "the
> > West".
> >
> 
> Meh. Early in Putin's reign, when eastern bloc countries were all joining
> NATO, there was a widely done poll amongst Russians in their attitude
> towards the West. I forget the exact numbers, but it was generally
> favorable overall, with support for Russia joining the EU "some day." The
> results went up dramatically when focusing on younger generations.
> 
> Years later, it's a whole different story. For that matter, Americans had
> generally favorable view of Russia back then, too. Relentless state
> propaganda is quite effective.
> 
> And I don't fault Putin for the propaganda, nor his distrust of the West.
> I'd distrust an alliance that is putting rockets withing striking distance
> of  my capital as well. Largely, I think he's a very smart man, and a good
> statesman.
> 
> But Putin isn't the good guy. There are no fucking good guys and bad guys.
> There are just guys, playing chess. White moves first, then black. Rooks.
> Queens. Castling. Good and bad, right and wrong, don't enter the equation.
> 
> Whose the good guy, and whose the bad guy is the wrong question.
> 
> The appropriate question is: are these players actually trying to win
> against each other, or is it an exhibition match for show, to keep people
> glued to the board while each side sells merchandising, and makes movies
> about who is, or is not, the good guy.

First you raised a straw man "Putin good man/ bad man", then you raise a
dichotomy "the wrong question vs the right question".


There are actions in the world.

Some exhibit what I name as evil intentions.

Others actions exhibit good intentions.

Others still exhibit blind faith in the empire, self interest and all
manner of other things.


Soros' emails show he wanted to break up Russia (not just the USSR) to
ultimately create a one world hegemon.


Putin decided Russia was a nation of 170 million people who deserve
better than Soros "break up Russia" intention, and set about doing many
good actions in support of that nationalistic position.


"The West" has time and again demonstrated utter contempt for anything
actually worth regarding.

Russians have seen this, and of course the Russian media does its level
best to draw this out, and boost their ratings from such madness as is
so regularly displayed in the West and by Westerners, and as a result of
seeing this, Russians now have a, rather low, regard for "the West".


This is a healthy development :)