Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Thomas Goirand]

On 12/20/2015 12:26 AM, Niels Thykier wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> As of today, dak supports the dbgsym packages built by debhelper and
> with debhelper/9.20151219 they are now built by default!  With this, a
> decade old idea is now implemented and available for general
> consumption[1]. :)
> 
>  * A huge thanks to Ansgar Burchardt for finishing up the remaining
>loose ends in dak today. :)
> 
>  * The debug symbols are available from debug.mirrors.debian.org
>- See also [APT-LINE] for installing them via APT
> 
>  * Currently only experimental and unstable will have dbgsym packages.
>- We need changes to Britney to add them to testing.
> 
> 
> Quick reminders
> ===
> 
> 
>  * The dbgsym packages are generated by debhelper and will now appear
>in (almost) all debhelper based packages.
> 
>  * You can disable dbgsym generation:
>- in your package by passing "--no-debs" to dh_strip
>- in your build by setting DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=noddebs
>- in your derivative by patching dh_strip.
> 
>  * You /can/ migrate your manual "-dbg" package to a "-dbgsym"
>- if/when it has no reverse (build-)depends.
>- it just requires you to replace "--dbg-package=pkg-dbg" with
>  "--ddeb-migration='pkg-dbg (<< ${VERSION}~)'
>- in a release from now, you can drop --ddeb-migration (and probably
>  also the "override_dh_strip" if you use the dh-sequencer)
> 
>  * You are *not* required to migrate your manual "-dbg" packages.
>- notably, you should *not* migrate them if they still have reverse
>  dependencies.
> 
>  * lintian/2.5.38.1 will complain about an unknown "auto-built-package"
>header in dbgsyms.  Known issue fixed in the next release of lintian.
> 
> Enjoy,
> ~Niels

Niels,

I was very surprised to see it appearing when building my packages. It's
really a super nice feature that we have, thanks for it!

Cheers,

Thomas Goirand (zigo)

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Peter Palfrader]

On Mon, 21 Dec 2015, Robert Edmonds wrote:

> Are the *-debug suites going to stay in a separate repository?  If so,
> is a separate mirror network being set up?  I help maintain a public
> mirror of the 'debian' repository, and if possible I'd like to setup a
> mirror of the 'debian-debug' repository as well.

I think the plan is to keep them separate.

We probably don't need it as widely mirrored as the main repository, but
there will be mirrors.

For north america, we are currently still blocking on getting a
dedicated IP addresses for the new sync-proxy...

Cheers,
-- 
|  .''`.   ** Debian **
  Peter Palfrader   | : :' :  The  universal
 https://www.palfrader.org/ | `. `'  Operating System
|   `-https://www.debian.org/

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Niels Thykier]

Anthony DeRobertis:
> Are there plans to teach httpredir.debian.org about the new debug mirror
> network?
> 
> http://httpredir.debian.org/debian-debug/dists/unstable-debug/main/binary-amd64/Release
>  is currently 404.
> 

Thanks for the suggestion.

I have filed a request for it in [1] - patches are (presumably) welcome. :)

Thanks,
~Niels


[1] https://github.com/rgeissert/http-redirector/issues/70





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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Anthony DeRobertis]

Are there plans to teach httpredir.debian.org about the new debug mirror
network?

http://httpredir.debian.org/debian-debug/dists/unstable-debug/main/binary-amd64/Release
 is currently 404.

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Robert Edmonds]

Paul Wise wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 20, 2015 at 10:07 AM, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:
> 
> > Will this eventually replace all the existing -dbg packages?
> 
> That is the plan, yes.
> 
> > And will this eventually become part of normal unstable/testing/etc.
> > and mirrors, or is it intended that people really always add e.g.
> > unstable-debug?
> 
> The latter.

Are the *-debug suites going to stay in a separate repository?  If so,
is a separate mirror network being set up?  I help maintain a public
mirror of the 'debian' repository, and if possible I'd like to setup a
mirror of the 'debian-debug' repository as well.

-- 
Robert Edmonds
edmo...@debian.org

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Ansgar Burchardt]

Vincent Bernat  writes:
> For experimental, would it be possible to set "Not-Automatic: yes", so
> that debug packages work in the same way than regular packages? Thanks!

This will happen with the next dinstall run.

Ansgar

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Sebastian Ramacher]

Hi

a big thank you for all invovled implementhing this feature!

On 2015-12-19 23:26:09, Niels Thykier wrote:
>  * You /can/ migrate your manual "-dbg" package to a "-dbgsym"
>- if/when it has no reverse (build-)depends.
>- it just requires you to replace "--dbg-package=pkg-dbg" with
>  "--ddeb-migration='pkg-dbg (<< ${VERSION}~)'
>- in a release from now, you can drop --ddeb-migration (and probably
>  also the "override_dh_strip" if you use the dh-sequencer)

So how will we deal with the migration from -dbg to -dbgsym for jessie ->
stretch?

* Should we keep transitional -dbg packages around even if the -dbgsym packages
  are in another archive?

* Are we going to tell people in the release notes that we expect
  'apt dist-upgrade' to remove plenty of -dbg packages and if they still need
  them to reinstall the -dbgsym version?

Does someone else have any other ideas?

Cheers
-- 
Sebastian Ramacher


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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Bernd Zeimetz]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA256

Hi,

> So how will we deal with the migration from -dbg to -dbgsym for
> jessie -> stretch?
> 
> * Should we keep transitional -dbg packages around even if the
> -dbgsym packages are in another archive?
> 
> * Are we going to tell people in the release notes that we expect 
> 'apt dist-upgrade' to remove plenty of -dbg packages and if they
> still need them to reinstall the -dbgsym version?

* And what do with -dbg packages which no not only contain debug
symbols from dh_strip, but also debug information from/for other
languages/interpreters?

Cheers,

Bernd


- -- 
 Bernd ZeimetzDebian GNU/Linux Developer
 http://bzed.dehttp://www.debian.org
 GPG Fingerprint: ECA1 E3F2 8E11 2432 D485  DD95 EB36 171A 6FF9 435F

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Niels Thykier]

Bernd Zeimetz:
> Hi,
> 

Hi,

>> So how will we deal with the migration from -dbg to -dbgsym for
>> jessie -> stretch?
>>
>> * Should we keep transitional -dbg packages around even if the
>> -dbgsym packages are in another archive?
>>

To be honest, I do not think this will make sense/work (for that purpose
at least).  Either you end up with:

 * an transitional package that will *not* bring in the dbgsym
   package, OR
 * a transitional package that *cannot* be installed/upgraded without
   the user having enabled the debug archive.

Though, it is entirely possible that we need to keep transitional
packages for -dbg packages if apt have issues coping with the upgrade path.

>> * Are we going to tell people in the release notes that we expect 
>> 'apt dist-upgrade' to remove plenty of -dbg packages and if they
>> still need them to reinstall the -dbgsym version?
> 

Of the two ideas you proposed, this is the one that makes most sense to
me.  Though, I have not thought that long about it. :)

> * And what do with -dbg packages which no not only contain debug
> symbols from dh_strip, but also debug information from/for other
> languages/interpreters?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Bernd
> 
> [...]

I would be interested in working people on extending the existing debug
symbols packages to be able to include such, when it can be done
completely automatically (in the general case) via build helper tools. :)

Thanks,
~Niels





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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Zlatan Todoric]

On 12/20/2015 02:13 AM, Michael Biebl wrote:
> Am 20.12.2015 um 00:26 schrieb Niels Thykier:
>> Hi,
>>
>> As of today, dak supports the dbgsym packages built by debhelper and
>> with debhelper/9.20151219 they are now built by default!
> 
> This is awesome.
> Huge thanks to everyone involved. That's a nice, early christmas present!
> 

It's also St.Nicholas here (Serbs are mostly Orthodox and church uses
Julian calendar so..) - yay! (btw, it's my family slava so all are
invited to it ;)


Again, such an awesome news this is and I am joining all the thanks to
everyone involved!

Cheers,

zlatan



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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Paul Wise]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2015 at 10:07 AM, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:

> Will this eventually replace all the existing -dbg packages?

That is the plan, yes.

> And will this eventually become part of normal unstable/testing/etc.
> and mirrors, or is it intended that people really always add e.g.
> unstable-debug?

The latter.

> Last but not least, what about security support?

None of the suites available on it (unstable/experimental) recieve
security updates.

The packages on it are ones produced at the same time as the other
packages. So when testing gets added and there is a testing security
update (almost never happens), the security update will also
automatically build -dbgsym packages as long as the relevant debhelper
version is installed. Once stretch is released as stable, the same
applies. jessie/wheezy/etc will of course not get -dbgsym packages.

-- 
bye,
pabs

https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Vincent Bernat]

 ❦ 19 décembre 2015 23:26 GMT, Niels Thykier  :

> As of today, dak supports the dbgsym packages built by debhelper and
> with debhelper/9.20151219 they are now built by default!  With this, a
> decade old idea is now implemented and available for general
> consumption[1]. :)

That's great! Many thanks for your work!
-- 
Terminate input by end-of-file or marker, not by count.
- The Elements of Programming Style (Kernighan & Plauger)


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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Christoph Anton Mitterer]

On Sat, 2015-12-19 at 23:26 +, Niels Thykier wrote:
> As of today, dak supports the dbgsym packages built by debhelper and
> with debhelper/9.20151219 they are now built by default!
Awesome, thx to all.

Will this eventually replace all the existing -dbg packages?

> deb http://debug.mirrors.debian.org/debian-debug/ unstable-debug main
> Note the use of "unstable-debug" instead of "unstable".
And will this eventually become part of normal unstable/testing/etc.
and mirrors, or is it intended that people really always add e.g.
unstable-debug?

Last but not least, what about security support?


Cheers,
Chris.

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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Vincent Bernat]

 ❦ 19 décembre 2015 23:26 GMT, Niels Thykier  :

>  * Currently only experimental and unstable will have dbgsym packages.
>- We need changes to Britney to add them to testing.

For experimental, would it be possible to set "Not-Automatic: yes", so
that debug packages work in the same way than regular packages? Thanks!
-- 
Make sure comments and code agree.
- The Elements of Programming Style (Kernighan & Plauger)


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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Paul Wise]

On Sun, Dec 20, 2015 at 11:10 AM, Christoph Anton Mitterer wrote:

> Hmm when people then have a lot suites, like stable, stable-updates,
> stable-proposed updates, *-backports... that will quit blow up
> sources.lists when in principle they'd need to add according *-debug
> lines for each.

Not if one uses the new Deb822 sources format:

$ cat /etc/apt/sources.list.d/04-debian-debug.sources
Types: deb
URIs: http://debug.mirrors.debian.org/debian-debug/
Suites: unstable-debug experimental-debug
Components: main

-- 
bye,
pabs

https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise

Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Markus Koschany]

Am 20.12.2015 um 00:26 schrieb Niels Thykier:
> Hi,
> 
> As of today, dak supports the dbgsym packages built by debhelper and
> with debhelper/9.20151219 they are now built by default!  With this, a
> decade old idea is now implemented and available for general
> consumption[1]. :)

Chapeau to you and everyone who was involved in implementing this
feature. Finally the days of manual debug packages are over. :-)

Regards,

Markus




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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Michael Biebl]

Am 20.12.2015 um 00:26 schrieb Niels Thykier:
> Hi,
> 
> As of today, dak supports the dbgsym packages built by debhelper and
> with debhelper/9.20151219 they are now built by default!

This is awesome.
Huge thanks to everyone involved. That's a nice, early christmas present!

Regards,
Michael

-- 
Why is it that all of the instruments seeking intelligent life in the
universe are pointed away from Earth?



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Re: Automatic dbgsym packages built by default as of today!

[Christoph Anton Mitterer]

On Sun, 2015-12-20 at 10:57 +0800, Paul Wise wrote:
> > Last but not least, what about security support?
> None of the suites available on it (unstable/experimental) recieve
> security updates.
Sure, but I guess, sooner or later testing/stable would be secured as
well?


> The packages on it are ones produced at the same time as the other
> packages. So when testing gets added and there is a testing security
> update (almost never happens), the security update will also
> automatically build -dbgsym packages as long as the relevant
> debhelper
> version is installed. Once stretch is released as stable, the same
> applies. jessie/wheezy/etc will of course not get -dbgsym packages.
Hmm when people then have a lot suites, like stable, stable-updates,
stable-proposed updates, *-backports... that will quit blow up
sources.lists when in principle they'd need to add according *-debug
lines for each.


Cheers,
Chris.

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