Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
Bastian Blank wrote: On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). Oh, no. Not again. It does not yet properly work without the new memory manager (#538442). And KMS is completely unusable currently on this kernels. And in 2.6.31-rc6, KMS is not stable enought to be used for my day-to-day work. It even leads to data corruption. See #545517 Since I remove KMS (ie since my bug report), I had no problem at all (with many many suspend-resume cycles) KMS should improve a lot before we use it by default. Regards, Vincent -- Vincent Danjean GPG key ID 0x9D025E87 vdanj...@debian.org GPG key fingerprint: FC95 08A6 854D DB48 4B9A 8A94 0BF7 7867 9D02 5E87 Unofficial pacakges: http://moais.imag.fr/membres/vincent.danjean/deb.html APT repo: deb http://perso.debian.org/~vdanjean/debian unstable main -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 09:07:34AM +0200, Vincent Danjean wrote: Bastian Blank wrote: On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). Oh, no. Not again. It does not yet properly work without the new memory manager (#538442). And KMS is completely unusable currently on this kernels. And in 2.6.31-rc6, KMS is not stable enought to be used for my day-to-day work. It even leads to data corruption. See #545517 Since I remove KMS (ie since my bug report), I had no problem at all (with many many suspend-resume cycles) Results vary, then; with my Intel 945, KMS in 2.6.31-rc8 is much more stable than EXA has been in the recent past. -- Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world. Ubuntu Developerhttp://www.debian.org/ slanga...@ubuntu.com vor...@debian.org signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 09:07:34 +0200, Vincent Danjean wrote: And in 2.6.31-rc6, KMS is not stable enought to be used for my day-to-day work. It even leads to data corruption. See #545517 Since I remove KMS (ie since my bug report), I had no problem at all (with many many suspend-resume cycles) Please file that as a bug on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=DRIcomponent=DRM%2FIntel There's no way it's going to get fixed otherwise. I haven't used suspend to disk in years, eg... See also http://intellinuxgraphics.org/how_to_report_bug.html Thanks, Julien -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
Julien Cristau wrote: On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 09:07:34 +0200, Vincent Danjean wrote: And in 2.6.31-rc6, KMS is not stable enought to be used for my day-to-day work. It even leads to data corruption. See #545517 Since I remove KMS (ie since my bug report), I had no problem at all (with many many suspend-resume cycles) Please file that as a bug on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=DRIcomponent=DRM%2FIntel There's no way it's going to get fixed otherwise. I haven't used suspend to disk in years, eg... See also http://intellinuxgraphics.org/how_to_report_bug.html Done as https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23836 However, as explained in the bug report, I do not use KMS anymore and I will not retry it for now because I have not enough time if I need to recover again from data corruption. So my bug report is not as complete as it should (no Xorg.0.log for example) Regards, Vincent Thanks, Julien -- Vincent Danjean Adresse: Laboratoire d'Informatique de Grenoble Téléphone: +33 4 76 61 20 11ENSIMAG - antenne de Montbonnot Fax:+33 4 76 61 20 99ZIRST 51, avenue Jean Kuntzmann Email: vincent.danj...@imag.fr 38330 Montbonnot Saint Martin -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 14:41:24 +0200, Marc Brockschmidt wrote: * How many big transitions will the upcoming changes cause? When should those happen? Can we do something to make them easier? One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). This means the intel X driver won't work with lenny's kernel, so we might have to figure out an upgrade path somehow (which might be to make the driver fall back to the vesa driver if it doesn't find a modesetting-capable kernel). This might also mean that we'll want to turn kms on by default in the debian kernel, or have xserver-xorg-video-intel install a file in /etc/modprobe.d/ to set i915.modeset. cc:ing debian-kernel as a heads-up. Cheers, Julien -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). Oh, no. Not again. It does not yet properly work without the new memory manager (#538442). And KMS is completely unusable currently on this kernels. This might also mean that we'll want to turn kms on by default in the debian kernel, Is KMS backward compatible with older versions of the intel driver? Does not looks like: | bool Enable modesetting on intel by default | depends on DRM_I915 | help | Choose this option if you want kernel modesetting enabled by default, | and you have a new enough userspace to support this. Running old | userspaces with this enabled will cause pain. Note that this causes | the driver to bind to PCI devices, which precludes loading things | like intelfb. Bastian -- I'm a soldier, not a diplomat. I can only tell the truth. -- Kirk, Errand of Mercy, stardate 3198.9 -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:36:58 +0200, Bastian Blank wrote: On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). Oh, no. Not again. It does not yet properly work without the new memory manager (#538442). And KMS is completely unusable currently on this kernels. This might also mean that we'll want to turn kms on by default in the debian kernel, Is KMS backward compatible with older versions of the intel driver? No :/ I guess we could also decide to freeze on the intel Q3 bits, but then we're likely to be on our own for new hardware support and stuff like that. Cheers, Julien -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
* Bastian Blank (wa...@debian.org) [090909 12:37]: On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). Oh, no. Not again. It does not yet properly work without the new memory manager (#538442). And KMS is completely unusable currently on this kernels. If not at X side, is it a possibility to either (a) add the new memory manager to lenny (I assume not), or (b) tell the users you need to upgrade your kernel first (and make the new X pre-depending somehow on the kernel). Of course, this sounds to me like people need to do updates in console mode, which ... isn't the best either. Cheers, Andi -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 14:42:52 +0200, Xavier Bestel wrote: On Wed, 2009-09-09 at 13:31 +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:36:58 +0200, Bastian Blank wrote: On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: This might also mean that we'll want to turn kms on by default in the debian kernel, Is KMS backward compatible with older versions of the intel driver? No :/ Running the kernel with intel.modeset=0 doesn't help ? Yeah that works (with s/intel/i915/), but it's not quite user friendly to crash unless that's manually added to the kernel command line. So it's probably better to default kms off in the kernel, and have the new userspace turn it on via /etc/modprobe.d/. Cheers, Julien -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Wed, 2009-09-09 at 13:31 +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:36:58 +0200, Bastian Blank wrote: On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 11:37:18AM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: One more thing. Intel plans to deprecate userspace mode setting with their Q4 2009 release (meaning December this year, so probably something we'll want for squeeze, depending on the freeze date you pick). Oh, no. Not again. It does not yet properly work without the new memory manager (#538442). And KMS is completely unusable currently on this kernels. This might also mean that we'll want to turn kms on by default in the debian kernel, Is KMS backward compatible with older versions of the intel driver? No :/ Running the kernel with intel.modeset=0 doesn't help ? Xav -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
Le mercredi 09 septembre 2009 à 14:04 +0200, Andreas Barth a écrit : If not at X side, is it a possibility to either (a) add the new memory manager to lenny (I assume not), or (b) tell the users you need to upgrade your kernel first (and make the new X pre-depending somehow on the kernel). This sounds like the udev case for the sarge → etch upgrade. This was solved with a big hack in the preinst, that surprisingly turned out to work. If there is no other way, this is an option. Of course, this sounds to me like people need to do updates in console mode, which ... isn't the best either. Not necessarily. The only thing is that people must not restart X before rebooting. This will, of course, cause trouble with (at least) GDM, which will restart itself and re-launch X when you log out after an upgrade. Having the driver fall back to vesa when no kernel support is found, as Julien proposed, sounds like a more reliable solution. -- .''`. Josselin Mouette : :' : `. `' “I recommend you to learn English in hope that you in `- future understand things” -- Jörg Schilling signature.asc Description: Ceci est une partie de message numériquement signée
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
[ Remove -release, this is technical stuff. ] On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 01:31:36PM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:36:58 +0200, Bastian Blank wrote: Is KMS backward compatible with older versions of the intel driver? No :/ What happens when a old driver runs on a KMS enabled system? I don't think it have an automatic fallback to the fb device. Bastian -- Oblivion together does not frighten me, beloved. -- Thalassa (in Anne Mulhall's body), Return to Tomorrow, stardate 4770.3. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
Re: X.org plans for the squeeze cycle
On Wed, 2009-09-09 at 18:05 +0200, Bastian Blank wrote: [ Remove -release, this is technical stuff. ] On Wed, Sep 09, 2009 at 01:31:36PM +0200, Julien Cristau wrote: On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 12:36:58 +0200, Bastian Blank wrote: Is KMS backward compatible with older versions of the intel driver? No :/ What happens when a old driver runs on a KMS enabled system? I don't think it have an automatic fallback to the fb device. Both try to access the registers for modesetting. Everything can happen afterwards (nothing, crash, lock, corruption ..) Xav -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-kernel-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org
