Scripsit Benjamin Seidenberg [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm wrote:
What does it even mean then? Which legal consequences does it have for
me to acknowledge that law? Why would the licensor want me to do so
- he must have _some_ purpose in requiring such an acknowledgement,
which indicates
Scripsit Matthew Garrett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You seem to be saying that I can agree with the law even though I
completely disagree with it
Please quote the section of the license that states that.
# LICENSEE AGREES THAT THE EXPORT OF GOODS
Scripsit Matthew Garrett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Scripsit Matthew Garrett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Please quote the section of the license that states that.
# LICENSEE AGREES THAT THE EXPORT OF GOODS AND/OR TECHNICAL DATA FROM
# THE UNITED STATES MAY REQUIRE SOME
to those who agree
with the law? That would not be free.
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Scripsit Matthew Garrett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
7. LICENSEE AGREES THAT THE EXPORT OF GOODS AND/OR TECHNICAL DATA FROM THE
UNITED STATES MAY REQUIRE SOME FORM OF EXPORT CONTROL LICENSE FROM THE
U.S. GOVERNMENT AND THAT FAILURE TO OBTAIN SUCH EXPORT
Scripsit Matthew Garrett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
And if that fact is not agreeable to me, I may not copy the software?
If you're unwilling to agree to truth statements, then yes, I'm entirely
happy with you not being permitted to copy the software
it for the source code.
In order to _enforce_ the offer legally, one would of course need a
way to prove that it exists. But I am not sure that the vendor can
demand that such proof should take exactly the form of a photocopy of
the original document.
--
Henning Makholm
Scripsit Steve Langasek [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Mon, Jul 17, 2006 at 11:48:05PM +0200, Henning Makholm wrote:
You never said how comes that something labeled Debian should *not* be
available as free download, as long as debian.org says Debian GNU/Linux
is available for free download
. In particular, the original
poster clearly shows in his very first post that he is aware that the
contents is not the official version.
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briefing slides instead of technical papers
to
anything.
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something else. Nobody is
putting it on anybody.
Owning a brand incurs some responsibilities.
Please provide legal references for the responsibilities that you
persist in claiming someone has. To whom do you think those
responsibilities are owed?
--
Henning Makholm We
Scripsit Radu-Cristian FOTESCU [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Mon, 2006-07-17 at 19:54 +0200, Henning Makholm wrote:
You are the only one who thinks that a trademark is being misused.
You are wrong.
You are not in court. Neither of us has the right to declare the other
is wrong.
You can be wrong
in the iso9660
images they offer, which would also statisfy the license.
I downloaded an image to check, but most data are compressed in a
format (squashfs) that I don't have the tools to read.
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, and as
such it is a legal no-op - a license that did not say this explicitly
would not be a trademark license either.
The problematic kind of trademark clauses is the one that says you
lose your _copyright_ license if you use our trademark in ways we're
not happy with.
--
Henning Makholm
restrained
and is within what we generally consider fair self-defense.
--
Henning Makholm... it cannot be told in his own
words because after September 11 he
forgot about keeping his diary for a long time
, making in particular available to all
third parties the source code of the Software;
No right to sell. I think this isn't good.
Huh? What the quote says is just that the redistributed software must
be _licensed_ at no charge, which is just your run-of-the-mill
copyleft construction.
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Henning
Scripsit Andrew Donnellan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 6/4/06, Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Scripsit Josselin Mouette [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Le vendredi 02 juin 2006 à 16:44 +0200, Francesco Poli a écrit :
6. Compliance with Laws; Non-Infringement. Recipient shall comply with
all
to distribute their software in non-free
on the parts of the FAQ that directly contradicts the license is not a
reasonable position.
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leve vor Buxgører Sansibar Bastelvel
Scripsit Josselin Mouette [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Le dimanche 04 juin 2006 à 13:13 +0200, Henning Makholm a écrit :
6. Compliance with Laws; Non-Infringement. Recipient shall comply with
all applicable laws and regulations in connection with use and
distribution of the Subject Software
the *legal* penalties for violating US embargo laws, I
do *not* consider it free if a copyright holder tacks its own penalties on
top of that.
Well said, and a good argument that my previous comments in this
thread actually miss the point. I stand corrected.
--
Henning Makholm
think so?
Not everyone here find such clauses to be non-free.
Those who don't are wrong.
--
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occasionally unplug their fiber connector and look
directly into it to watch
copyright blurb *itself* is retained with all derivates.
Everybody seems to agree that this does not make the BSD license
viral, and that a derivor is free to give fewer rights to his part of
the copyright in the derived work than the original BSD author gave to
his part.
--
Henning Makholm
Scripsit Wolfgang Lonien [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Please CC me when answering; I'm not subscribed to Debian-legal.
What was your question? The three licenses you quote are all ordinary
3-clause BSD licenses, which are nice and free.
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DRM. Strange).
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code on demand
for up to three years (see 3b) if the code is distrbuted in binary form.
No it does not. Read the GPL. Clause 3(b) is a non-free option but
fortunately the GPL also allows a distributor to use the free clause
3(a) instead.
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to Gervase Markham.
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.
If you have a fourth option that I have overlooked, I would love to
hear about it.
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GR which gives the
developers the option of choosing betwen different interpretations.
I think that this very thread is an attempt to construct some
reasonably self-consistent interpretations that we can ask the
developers to decide between.
--
Henning Makholm The compile-time
cannot be written in any other way),
then it is not subject to copyright, no matter what the author claims
or does not claim.
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Corporation. All rights
reserved.
...
Any distribution of this software or derivative works must comply
with all applicable United States export control laws.
This is a non-free condition.
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Scripsit Raul Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Same thing goes for the atlantic ocean -- the atlantic ocean can prevent
unauthorized copying, in the sense you're using.
Are you arguing that the GFDL is free because it says that copying is
forbidden if the Atlantic Ocean exists?
--
Henning Makholm
holder's legal rights on the recipient of the copy.
Where did you get the idea that the measures that the GFDL forbids are
only those that enforce copyright? The GFDL forbids *all* measures
that obstruct or restrict copying, no matter whether they, in doing
so, enforce copyrights.
--
Henning Makholm
Scripsit Benjamin A'Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Wed, 2006-03-15 at 12:22 +0100, Henning Makholm wrote:
Scripsit Jesse van den Kieboom [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Copyright (c) 1992, 1995, 1996 Xerox Corporation. All rights
reserved.
...
Any distribution of this software or derivative works must
Scripsit Glenn Maynard [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Wed, Mar 15, 2006 at 06:28:37PM +0100, Henning Makholm wrote:
I assert that this interpretation is most faithful to the arguments
presented by proponents of Amendment A during the discussion. In
particular, when confronted by arguments
Scripsit Jeremy Hankins [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Therefore my proposal is to narrow the licensor's-intent principle to
clauses of the general kind that are problematic in the GFDL. The
description in point (a) above is my best attempt to define
Scripsit Anthony DeRobertis [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm wrote:
You may not use technical measures to obstruct or control the
reading or further copying [by the intended recipient] of [all] the
copies you make or distribute [to him]
But how can we explain away make or?
I'm
.
Heck, even *on* debian-legal there were a long time where many people
thought that invariant sections were the only issue with the GFDL. It
took some time and some close reading to realize that the minor points
are actually freedom issues.
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Henning Makholm Gå ud i solen eller regnen
supermajority to achieve (just like Amendment B),
and the ballot option did not require that.
However, the Project did not tell us what the required supermajority
was. The Secretary made that decision, based on his best personal
judgement.
--
Henning Makholm*Vi
for invariant sections are ones that we
traditionally do accept for license texts.
--
Henning Makholm It will be useful even at this
early stage to review briefly the main
features of the universe as they are known
]
But how can we explain away make or?
--
Henning Makholm Den nyttige hjemmedatamat er og forbliver en myte.
Generelt kan der ikke peges på databehandlingsopgaver af
en sådan størrelsesorden og af en karaktér, som berettiger
forestillingerne
from source using tools in main.
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think the you in the question was meant in the How does one fix
errors sense.
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/2004/05/msg00955.html).
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with the cluebat. Unfortunately, it was
not as effective as whacking someone else.
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not normally care much about such until and unless they
happen.
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useful. In the wrong setting, though, it is destructive...
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trademark
commercially. Permitting usage like that seems like it may be
something that Debian would want to require.
I don't think that this is a required freedom.
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Henning Makholm Det er du nok fandens ene om at
mene. For det
license? I know
that it certainly does not in Denmark, but of course that does not say
anything about the rest of the world.
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Henning MakholmI have seen men with a *fraction* of
your trauma pray to their deity for death's
of the
work is OK.
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TeX or METAFONT.9
`
But _methods_ and _ideas_ were never protected by copyright in the
first place.
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evidence that TeX comes with a license to
create modified versions under different names? The copyright notice
at the top of tex.web presents only the patch option, and
/usr/share/doc/tetex-bin/copyright is not of much help.
--
Henning Makholm Ambiguous cases are defined as those for which
required by GPL #2(c) - notice in particular that 2(c) does not
require any specific wording of the notice. There seems to be nothing
in 2(c) that implies that the notice cannot be given in the user's
preferred language.
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Henning MakholmDetta, sade de, vore rena sanningen
Scripsit Andrew Donnellan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 1/17/06, Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Technically, the statement we're talking about is probably the one
required by GPL #2(c) - notice in particular that 2(c) does not
require any specific wording of the notice. There seems
do such-and-such,
or else!.
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EFFECTIVELY UNREADABLE. PERHAPS THE PRESENCE OF LOWERCASE
LETTERS IN THIS PARAGRAPH IS JUST AN EDITING MISTAKE? SURELY IT CANNOT
BE MEANT TO READ THAT WAY IN THE FINAL LICENSE.
--
Henning MakholmBut I am a Sunni Muslim, the bemused Arab said.
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a convincing argument
for independent creation.
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that such a requirement should be considered free.
Why on earth do they not just license it as GPL straight away? That
would not prevent them from offering other license terms in addition
for a fee (or without one) as they see fit.
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Scripsit Arnoud Engelfriet [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm wrote:
Why on earth do they not just license it as GPL straight away? That
would not prevent them from offering other license terms in addition
for a fee (or without one) as they see fit.
They may be worried about whether dynamic
change from time to time).
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.
Of course, the license must not be so specific to Debian that the
mirror operators cannot distribute the software.
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be possible to sell copies of
Debian packages.
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on this list.
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Epimenides of that false sentence could imply the
existence of some Cretan who is not a liar is rather unsettling.
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.
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conversations. Do I get credit for that?
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Scripsit Simon Josefsson [EMAIL PROTECTED]
What about changing the PR, so that FROM NOW ON, the debian-private
list will be made public after, say, one year?
There's an amendment proposal on the ballot that will do roughly
this.
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Henning Makholm I tried whacking
is part of point 4 of the Social Contract. Its
interpretation is not a matter for debian-legal.
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Henning Makholm First chapter, the plot advances,
second chapter, Ayla makes a discovery that
significantly enhances
Scripsit Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I think -legal is the wrong list. Is the license status of the
software in question? Not as far as I can see from the build log.
s/build/bug/, of course.
--
Henning Makholm Need facts -- *first
the exception,
then the no-removal-of-exception is _itself_ a restriction that is not
allowed by the GPL.
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to modify the
| terms applicable to covered code created under this License.
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den store regnekunst her, men jeg vil foreslå, at vi fra
Kulturministeriets side sørger for at fremsende tallene
copyright holder.
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Scripsit Andrew Donnellan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 11/22/05, Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
These sloppities lend support to the hypothesis that the exception was
not drafted by the FSF's usual license advisors. Is it really FSF
software?
Don't think so. For two main reasons:
3
the code.
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learned early in marriage by internists' wives, but
still hidden from the general public, is that most things get
better by themselves. Most things, in fact
the changed text.
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selskab med forgreninger i hele verden, som
arbejder i det skjulte for at udsprede det rygte at
der eksisterer en
work clause using the words the GPL software
infects yours.
Indeed.
These sloppities lend support to the hypothesis that the exception was
not drafted by the FSF's usual license advisors. Is it really FSF
software?
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Henning Makholm Det er du nok fandens ene om
, distributing both results
to the customer in a single transaction.
Given the wording of DFSG #1, I don't think we should consider the
Silly Required Bundling a real freedom problem.
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very different for me.
Agreed.
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kommet vel ombord i den grønne dobbeltdækker.
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between main and
non-free in the OS serves to help people make decisions about which
software to base their systems on, but who would make decisions about
which presentation to _hear_ based on whether the _paper_ can be
modified?
--
Henning Makholm Ambiguous cases are defined as those
as a compilation product of the Debian project?
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).
That, for the record, goes for all packages that just provide
user-level content, where the data are not behind-the-scenes
requirements for making actual software run correctly. Just put
the stuff on a bloody website!
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with the presentation.
And this requirement would be a no-op under your theory that a
DFSG-free license for the papers is required. Therefore I conclude
that your theory is wrong.
What I suggest is simply adding one further condition.
For the record, I oppose this suggestion.
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Henning Makholm Science
to allow derived works for
conference papers. That does not conflict with the SC, because the
papers are not going to be part of our operating system.
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with a subject
through Md's usenet gateway...
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that). However, if you offer your modifications
under the MPL, you get a right to distribute the modified work,
because you can choose to exercise the rights you got from the MPL.
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formats, keeping the source
code a trade secret while still purporting to license the raw binary
under the terms of the GPL.
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. In particular, he can offer the general public
a licence under terms that he does not himself comply with.
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planmæssigt om sig, så er vi endnu ikke nået dertil hvor
ordentlige mennesker
that _verbatim_, with whatever
warts it has - unless it is actually false. He is _not_ supposed to
try to do his on sanitizing of the _form_ of the copyright notice.
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spagat. Du
Scripsit Måns Rullgård [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I'd certainly expect a program as expensive and with such ambitions
as Adobe Illustrator to have it.
On the contrary - a specific spiral template sounds like an extremely
arcane and particular feature
Scripsit Måns Rullgård [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
There are millions of *possible* spiral shapes that one could
draw. Elektrostore chose the *exact same* spiral shape as the Debian
swirl, and positioned the stock brush at the *exact same* point on the
spiral
in a program.
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Henning Makholm Der er ingen der sigter på slottet. D'herrer konger agter
at triumfere fra balkonen når de har slået hinanden ihjel.
Scripsit MJ Ray [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
2. Swedish law provides protection agains confusingly similar
trademarks only when the two marks in question denote goods of
the same or similar kinds. (Varumärkeslag 1960:644, 6
§). This
is not the case here.
3. That leaves the copyright to the swirl, regarded as a work of
art. However, it appears to be unknown whether that copyright was
transferred to the SPI or still resides with the artist, Raul
Silva.
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Henning Makholm
Scripsit Amaya [EMAIL PROTECTED]
/me wonders...
Isn't the Debian swirl logo just a very basic Adobe Illustrator
template?
The stroke is, but the particular way it swirls is not.
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Henning Makholm Det er trolddom og terror
Scripsit Måns Rullgård [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Scripsit Amaya [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Isn't the Debian swirl logo just a very basic Adobe Illustrator
template?
The stroke is, but the particular way it swirls is not.
Looks like a pretty standard spiral to me
such a right subject to an conditions.
Therefore if you use this description to write a program, you must
release your program as GPL.
That is at best a horrible misunderstanding, at worst an outright lie.
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Henning Makholm ... not one has been remembered from the time
as necessary for
distributability and freedom.
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Scripsit Joe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Henning Makholm [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message
It's a reasonable interpretation. The problem is that there are
_other_ reasonable interpretations as well; in particular one easily
imagines a court that would find that the limited-scope identifier
defense
the licensor, we should not include
software in Debian if the freedoms it comes with is there only under
the assumption that the license is interpreted particularly favourably
(where there are other reasonable but less free interpretations
available).
--
Henning Makholm
).
Licenses with patch clauses are widely considered bad even though
they are explicitly free according to the DFSG.
--
Henning Makholm ... not one has been remembered from the time
when the author studied freshman physics. Quite the
contrary: he
. As long as there is any
risk that it _will_ make a difference in court, it constitutes a
burden for the licensee and should be considered non-free.
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Henning Makholm The burning swoosh shall be our emblem, and
we shall laugh in the face of trademark
.
The difference is that if you have accepted a choice-of-venue license,
the sociopath can present his local venue with proof that it has
jurisdisction. That makes a difference, however much you try to deny it.
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Henning Makholm Al lykken er i ét ord: Overvægtig!
Scripsit Matthew Garrett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 07:31:39PM +0200, Henning Makholm wrote:
The difference is that if you have accepted a choice-of-venue license,
the sociopath can present his local venue with proof that it has
jurisdisction. That makes a difference, however
the choice-of-venue
clause.
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-specific parts
of the discussion at
http://people.debian.org/~asuffield/licenses/cddl/summary.html.
Apart from the choice-of-venue clause, the most prominent showstopper
seems to be that the license does not allow the distribution of
anonymously modified versions.
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