Re: improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
On Thu, May 16, 2019 at 08:43:46PM +0200, Christoph Berg wrote: > Re: Holger Levsen 2019-05-16 <20190516183802.uryz4rr7enuwp...@layer-acht.org> > > > Or should we focus on a way to announce process > > > changes once every other year? > > a mail to d-d-a with subject 'bits from the lts team' with these and other > > changes would probably be a good idea. > A single mail with "please update the webpages" would be (have been) > enough. I guess the other bits don't change that much. the problem is whom to mail. d-d-a I think is excessive for this single bit of information and mailing and... voila, I've added this to https://wiki.debian.org/DeveloperNews?action=recall=598 now. Further improvements to that text welcome. > Thanks for the Wiki updates! thanks for your feedback! -- tschau, Holger --- holger@(debian|reproducible-builds|layer-acht).org PGP fingerprint: B8BF 5413 7B09 D35C F026 FE9D 091A B856 069A AA1C signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
Re: Holger Levsen 2019-05-16 <20190516183802.uryz4rr7enuwp...@layer-acht.org> > > Or should we focus on a way to announce process > > changes once every other year? > > a mail to d-d-a with subject 'bits from the lts team' with these and other > changes would probably be a good idea. A single mail with "please update the webpages" would be (have been) enough. I guess the other bits don't change that much. Thanks for the Wiki updates! Christoph
Re: improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
On Thu, May 16, 2019 at 10:56:24AM +0200, Sylvain Beucler wrote: > On 16/05/2019 09:40, Christoph Berg wrote: > >> (and link to that TLDR page promininently from our other pages?) > > I'd recommend keeping that on the same page, or they will diverge. I've done this now: see https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development > I personally like the page the way it is. TIMTOWTDY! ;) > Though if we want a TLDR we can easily add another "checklist" section > like we did for the Front-Desk duties: > https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development#Checklist > at the end of the packaging section. thats basically what I've done too.. > Note that the root issue is missing the "please also update webml" step. yes. I think the above change addresses this. > People who missed this are doing DLAs occasionally (there are countless > mails about it on the mailing list). Would they remember to check > documentation anyway? most non regular contributors look up the documentation to see how it's done. > Or should we focus on a way to announce process > changes once every other year? a mail to d-d-a with subject 'bits from the lts team' with these and other changes would probably be a good idea. > Or should we simply notify people > individually like Holger just did? :) that also. -- tschau, Holger --- holger@(debian|reproducible-builds|layer-acht).org PGP fingerprint: B8BF 5413 7B09 D35C F026 FE9D 091A B856 069A AA1C signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
Hi, On 16/05/2019 09:40, Christoph Berg wrote: > Re: Holger Levsen 2019-05-15 <20190515130831.qcgsaiig3bh3b...@layer-acht.org> >> Should we maybe put just this on a page called >> https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development/TLDR >> which then people can look at when they occasionally do a DLA? >> >> (and link to that TLDR page promininently from our other pages?) > I'd recommend keeping that on the same page, or they will diverge. I personally like the page the way it is. Though if we want a TLDR we can easily add another "checklist" section like we did for the Front-Desk duties: https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development#Checklist at the end of the packaging section. Note that the root issue is missing the "please also update webml" step. People who missed this are doing DLAs occasionally (there are countless mails about it on the mailing list). Would they remember to check documentation anyway? Or should we focus on a way to announce process changes once every other year? Or should we simply notify people individually like Holger just did? :) - Sylvain
Re: improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
Re: Holger Levsen 2019-05-15 <20190515130831.qcgsaiig3bh3b...@layer-acht.org> > Should we maybe put just this on a page called > https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development/TLDR > which then people can look at when they occasionally do a DLA? > > (and link to that TLDR page promininently from our other pages?) I'd recommend keeping that on the same page, or they will diverge. Christoph
Re: improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
I think it would be an improvement, yes. // Ola On Wed, 15 May 2019 at 15:08, Holger Levsen wrote: > Hi Christoph, > > I'm taking this to the lts list, as I think this deserves more peoples > thoughts: > > On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 04:56:43PM +0200, Christoph Berg wrote: > > As said elsewhere [...] I think part of the problem is > > that https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development is way too long. It > > shouldn't try to tell newcomers how to test packages etc, but just > > list the necessary steps required to a DLA. At the moment the "please > > also update webml" is hidden in a wall of text. And because the text > > is meant for newcomers, I'm not going to read it again for each > > upload. > > I agree that page is too long, and that a shorter checklist would be > very nice to have. And then it just occurred to me that the table of > content > on that page *is* that: > > Contents: > 3. Prepare security updates for LTS > > 1. Claim the issue in the security tracker (in dla-needed.txt) > 2. Build the update > 3. Test the update > 4. Upload the update > 5. Claim an DLA ID in DLA/list > 6. Announce the update > 7. Prepare an update for the website > > > Should we maybe put just this on a page called > https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development/TLDR > which then people can look at when they occasionally do a DLA? > > (and link to that TLDR page promininently from our other pages?) > > do you think this would be an improvement? Do you have other ideas? > > > (At the very least it could have a visible note at the top > > that says there was a recent change.) > > I'm not sure this will help that much... a.) people miss these notes and > then b.) how long ago is 'recent'? > > > -- > tschau, > Holger > > > --- >holger@(debian|reproducible-builds|layer-acht).org >PGP fingerprint: B8BF 5413 7B09 D35C F026 FE9D 091A B856 069A AA1C > -- --- Inguza Technology AB --- MSc in Information Technology | o...@inguza.como...@debian.org| | http://inguza.com/Mobile: +46 (0)70-332 1551 | ---
improving https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development
Hi Christoph, I'm taking this to the lts list, as I think this deserves more peoples thoughts: On Tue, May 14, 2019 at 04:56:43PM +0200, Christoph Berg wrote: > As said elsewhere [...] I think part of the problem is > that https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development is way too long. It > shouldn't try to tell newcomers how to test packages etc, but just > list the necessary steps required to a DLA. At the moment the "please > also update webml" is hidden in a wall of text. And because the text > is meant for newcomers, I'm not going to read it again for each > upload. I agree that page is too long, and that a shorter checklist would be very nice to have. And then it just occurred to me that the table of content on that page *is* that: Contents: 3. Prepare security updates for LTS 1. Claim the issue in the security tracker (in dla-needed.txt) 2. Build the update 3. Test the update 4. Upload the update 5. Claim an DLA ID in DLA/list 6. Announce the update 7. Prepare an update for the website Should we maybe put just this on a page called https://wiki.debian.org/LTS/Development/TLDR which then people can look at when they occasionally do a DLA? (and link to that TLDR page promininently from our other pages?) do you think this would be an improvement? Do you have other ideas? > (At the very least it could have a visible note at the top > that says there was a recent change.) I'm not sure this will help that much... a.) people miss these notes and then b.) how long ago is 'recent'? -- tschau, Holger --- holger@(debian|reproducible-builds|layer-acht).org PGP fingerprint: B8BF 5413 7B09 D35C F026 FE9D 091A B856 069A AA1C signature.asc Description: PGP signature
