Re: A policy on use of AI-generated content in Debian

2024-05-03 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Tiago" == Tiago Bortoletto Vaz writes: Tiago> Hi Jose, Tiago> Thanks for you input, I have a few comments: Tiago> On Fri, May 03, 2024 at 11:02:47AM -0300, Jose-Luis Rivas wrote: >> On Thu May 2, 2024 at 9:21 PM -03, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz wrote: >> > Right, note that

Re: A policy on use of AI-generated content in Debian

2024-05-02 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Dominik" == Dominik George writes: Dominik> Generative AI tools **produce** derivatives of other people's copyrighted works. Dominik> That said, we already have the necessary policies in place: Russ pointed out this is a fairly complicated claim. It is absolutely true that

Re: A policy on use of AI-generated content in Debian

2024-05-02 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Ansgar" == Ansgar  writes: Ansgar> Hi, Ansgar> On Thu, 2024-05-02 at 14:01 -0400, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz wrote: >> I would like Debian to discuss and decide on the usage of AI- >> generated content within the project. Ansgar> It's just another tool that might or might

Re: Lack of replies

2024-01-02 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Scott" == Scott Kitterman writes: Scott> Alternatively, BTS users that are interested in others Scott> getting their emails might be better off posting from a Scott> domain that doesn't have a DMARC policy that's designed to be Scott> used for domains that send only

Re: Community renewal and project obsolescence

2023-12-29 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Daniel" == Daniel Gröber writes: Daniel> Hi, Daniel> On Fri, Dec 29, 2023 at 08:48:28AM -0800, Antonio Russo wrote: >> [...] my personal experience is that making contributions is like >> dropping a message in a bottle into the sea. It feels like a >> complete

Re: CVE Cross references

2023-09-20 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Mouer," == Mouer, Steve writes: Mouer,> https://www.debian.org/security/crossreferences Mouer,> Can you please advise if this will be restored and is this Mouer,> the best place for us to automatically pull this Mouer,> information? I'm not involved in Debian security

Re: [RFC] Extending project standards to services linked through Vcs-*

2023-08-30 Thread Sam Hartman
I tend to generally agree with Russ. But I wonder if there are things we could do on a technical front Are there things we could do to remove barriers and get to a point where we can make salsa a valid contribution channel? Things like * Add a way to mirror issues from salsa to github for

Re: Questionable Package Present in Debian - fortune-mod

2023-08-22 Thread Sam Hartman
I have a proposal. In writing the below, I realized that we may have reached the point of diminishing returns, and perhaps we should be done with this discussion. CONSENSUS IS NOT A REQUIREMENT HERE. In general, if someone wants to maintain something in Debian, and the ftp team does not object,

Re: Questionable Package Present in Debian: fortune-mod

2023-08-18 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Roberto" == Roberto C Sánchez writes: Roberto> sources." I mean, if you're going to wave the code of Roberto> conduct around (or Andy in the case of the initial report), Roberto> then perhaps we ought to distinguish between what the code Roberto> of conduct was very

Re: Brief update about software freedom and artificial intelligence

2023-02-28 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Roberto" == Roberto A Foglietta writes: Roberto> On Mon, 27 Feb 2023 at 19:08, Russ Allbery wrote: >> >> No. It's entirely possible that using databases as training sets >> for an AI/ML engine is fair use under existing United States law >> and precedent as long as

Re: Brief update about software freedom and artificial intelligence

2023-02-24 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Russ" == Russ Allbery writes: Russ> To add to this, I'm fairly sure that the companies that are Russ> training AI models on, say, every piece of text they can find Russ> on the Internet, or all public GitHub repositories, are going Russ> to explicitly argue that doing so

Re: SUMMARY [Was Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?]

2022-11-23 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Ansgar" == Ansgar writes: Ansgar> I would very much prefer explicit sexual content over Nazi Ansgar> symbols. So let me make a suggestion: As would I. If anyone wants to work on the challenges of adult content feel free to reach out and I'd be happy to spend some of my time on

Re: ITA: fortunes-mod (was: SUMMARY [Was Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?])

2022-11-23 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Andrew" == Andrew M A Cater writes: Andrew> On Wed, Nov 23, 2022 at 03:05:29PM -0600, G. Branden Robinson wrote: >> [I'm using the pseudonymous respondent's message to reply to >> Mr. Cater as well. Mind the angle brackets for quotation >> context.] >> >> At

Re: ITA: fortunes-mod (was: SUMMARY [Was Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?])

2022-11-23 Thread Sam Hartman
n> "G" == G Branden Robinson writes: G> Neither you nor he, therefore, is well placed to present a G> (presumptively neutral) summary of the discussion. (Neither am G> I.) Branden, I'd like to push back on the idea that we want a summary from someone neutral. If we have that

Alternate Summary: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package

2022-11-23 Thread Sam Hartman
I call out one area where I think additional discussion is valuable; see after the underscores. I'd like to thank Andrew for posting his summary of the discussion. As I have said over the years, I think such summaries are a critical part of driving discussions forward. I didn't ever get a chance

Re: SUMMARY [Was Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?]

2022-11-23 Thread Sam Hartman
es with what that should be. Andrew> Notably, Sam Hartman and Branden Robinson have pointed up Andrew> flaws with the existing categorisations and with a blanket Andrew> removal based on preference. It's also noticeable that this Andrew> largely comes down to consideration

Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?

2022-11-21 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Jonathan" == Jonathan Dowland writes: Jonathan> Anyone who has a problem with what I did and believes I Jonathan> should be censured or subject to some other form of Jonathan> disciplinary process, please just go ahead and do it, Jonathan> don't beat about the bush. Hi. I

Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?

2022-11-21 Thread Sam Hartman
> "G" == G Branden Robinson writes: G> By your metric, so is the Hebrew Bible. For all the slaughter, G> xenophobia, and ethno-religious supremacism in it, there's some G> good stuff as well. I find the exasperated jeremiads of some of G> the later prophets relatable and

Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?

2022-11-20 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Steve" == Steve Langasek writes: Steve> This isn't Sodom and Gomorrah; the package shouldn't be Steve> spared from death because you found 5 good fortunes in it. Steve> This package is a fossilized collection of fortunes that some Steve> random people on Usenet found funny

Re: Removing software because we disagree with its values

2022-11-20 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Andrew" == Andrew M A Cater writes: Andrew> I'm not going to die in a ditch over this but I raised it as Andrew> a genuine query to the project in good faith and without any Andrew> agenda. I appreciate that. I hope my message was received in the spirit of an answer to the

Re: Removing software because we disagree with its values

2022-11-20 Thread Sam Hartman
TL;DR: I think that we need to be significantly more permissive of ideas expressed in software in our archive, especially for software that exhibits creative speech, than we do conduct in our community. I do not think that the Code of Conduct is an appropriate tool for judging software in

Re: Multi-package projects

2022-10-13 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Niels" == Niels Thykier writes: Niels> Indeed - I noted that. :) My answer to Sam's email was due Niels> how it went into details with why Sam saw the RT as a good Niels> candidate team for this role and I wanted to present a Niels> counterargument to Sam's email. I'd

Re: Multi-package projects

2022-10-07 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Luca" == Luca Boccassi writes: >> - After the merits and problems of the proposed new projects are >> discussed, the release team decides which projects are accepted >> for the next release. (I specifically do not mention what rules >> the release team should follow in

How to Move an Issue Forward When there is no Energy

2022-09-16 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Chuck" == Chuck Zmudzinski writes: Chuck> Debian processes: AFAIK there is no process for a user to Chuck> resort to when an important bug has been ignored for over a Chuck> year except to make some noise on mailing lists like Chuck> debian-user and debian-project. What

Re: Debian Updates

2022-06-08 Thread Sam Hartman
rstanding the problems/challenges you/they are facing. I'd like to see if there is anything I can do to help out. Sam Hartman Debian Developer signature.asc Description: PGP signature

Re: Resignation from Trademark Team

2022-04-20 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Felix" == Felix Lechner writes: Felix> Dear Mr. Leader, Congratulations on your re-election as Felix> Project Leader. I wish you the best for your third term. Felix> Please accept herewith my resignation as your trademark Felix> delegate, effective immediately. Felix,

Re: History doesn't repeat itself, but it often rhymes

2022-02-22 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Paul" == Paul Tagliamonte writes: Paul> Hello, Debianites, Allow me, if you will, to talk a bit about Paul> something that's been on my mind a bit over the last handful Paul> of years in Debian. It's something that's pretty widely Paul> circulated in particular circles,

Re: Questions around Justice and Our Current CoC procedures

2022-02-21 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Scott" == Scott Kitterman writes: Scott> OTOH, I think a DAM warning for a single instance of someone Scott> losing their temper and calling someone an unfortunate name Scott> is like ringing a doorbell with a sledge hammer. I strongly agree. And I understand why it is that

Re: What does it mean to be inclusive

2022-02-21 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Gerardo" == Gerardo Ballabio writes: Gerardo> Debian is a community that strives to be open, fair and Gerardo> inclusive. That means that we have made a commitment to Gerardo> welcome everybody and not exclude anyone without good Gerardo> reasons. I agree that Debian has

Re: Questions around Justice and Our Current CoC procedures

2022-02-20 Thread Sam Hartman
>>>>> "Russ" == Russ Allbery writes: Russ> Sam Hartman writes: Russ> I dunno, I realize I may be being too cavalier here, but see Russ> the point above about making more decisions, faster, and Russ> accepting a few mistakes. If we end up wi

Re: Questions around Justice and Our Current CoC procedures

2022-02-20 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Felix" == Felix Lechner writes: Felix> Alas, I'll venture that the folks whose opinions you consider Felix> superior have never been punished. The word punished implies a framing of the problem I personally reject. But if for example you'd consider being banned from the BTS a

Questions around Justice and Our Current CoC procedures

2022-02-20 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Felix" == Felix Lechner writes: In the interest of full disclosure, I no longer have any affiliation with DAM. Felix> With regard to disciplinary proceedings, however, Debian has Felix> a long way to go in implementing basic precepts of Felix> justice. For example, it would

Polling informally Debian Contributors

2022-02-16 Thread Sam Hartman
While discussing secret ballots over on debian-vote, we got a little off topic and started discussing the value of a mechanism to express agreement/disagreement with messages in a mailing list thread. > "Russ" == Russ Allbery writes: Russ> Philip Hands writes: >> The bit that

Re: Debian python package bytecode compatibility

2021-09-29 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Paul" == Paul Wise writes: Paul> On Wed, Sep 29, 2021 at 8:25 AM Bastian Blank wrote: >> All Python source is compiled into bytecode during installation. Paul> Scripts in the bin/ directories are not compiled into Paul> bytecode, and there are a number of packages that do

Re: Debian python package bytecode compatibility

2021-09-28 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Manoj" == Manoj Singh writes: Manoj> Hi Team, For FIPS(federal information processing standards), Manoj> required all python code in bytecode format(.pyc) instead of Manoj> plain source .py. NIST publishes a lot of FIPS documents. Can you please point to the specific version

Re: DEP-16 Confidential votes

2021-04-19 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Timo" == Timo Röhling writes: Timo> * Stéphane Glondu [2021-04-16 17:12]: >> I would be glad to help :-) Timo> Great! >>> With all that being said and having made my case, I am open for >>> any reasonably secure solution (including Belenios) that we can >>> agree

Re: Tone policing by a member of the community team [Was, Re: Statement regarding Richard Stallman's readmission to the FSF board]

2021-04-15 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Steve" == Steve Langasek writes: Steve, I'm writing to confirm understanding of our disagreement and to acknowledge the point you made and explain why it is not persuasive to me. I'm not trying to convince you to change your mind, simply letting you know I've considered what you have to

Re: DEP-16 Confidential votes

2021-04-13 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Timo" == Timo Röhling writes: Timo> * Pierre-Elliott Bécue [2021-04-13 11:19]: >> I would rather not reserve any DEP for this right now. We >> actually don't really know if any space for DEP text regarding >> secret voting will be left out. The voting procedure is >>

Re: Tone policing by a member of the community team [Was, Re: Statement regarding Richard Stallman's readmission to the FSF board]

2021-04-12 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Steve" == Steve McIntyre writes: Steve> On Mon, Apr 12, 2021 at 03:30:21PM +, Thaddeus H. Black wrote: Steve> Umm. Our diversity statement and CoC define agreed Steve> expectations of behaviour and communication within the Steve> project; people espousing fascist

Re: Tone policing by a member of the community team [Was, Re: Statement regarding Richard Stallman's readmission to the FSF board]

2021-04-11 Thread Sam Hartman
> "gregor" == gregor herrmann writes: I wrote a long post talking about an approach for possibly balancing these trade offs in Debian. Just my ideas, but perhaps reasonably well thought out. Then I realized that now is not the time to send that post. If in a month or so when things are

NVC or other Training at DebConf

2021-04-11 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Martin" == Martin Steigerwald writes: Martin> I remember that at the recent KDE Academy meetups, I think Martin> the last two, there has been some workshop about non-violent Martin> communication. Martin> Maybe it would be an idea to propose something like that for

Re: Abusive language on Debian lists

2021-04-11 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Eldon" == Eldon Koyle writes: Eldon> Thank you for your thoughtful reply. Eldon> I think I did a bad job of explaining. I'm talking about Eldon> English words that universally accepted as swearing. I have Eldon> not seen this class of words used constructively in lists,

When is a political view too strong to be compatible with Debian Participation

2021-04-09 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Thomas" == Thomas Goirand writes: Thomas> The point is: is there some restrictions on political views Thomas> that the Debian community/project would like to enforce? Yes, I think this is a topic worth discussing. There has been a motion in the free software community to focus

This is not the direction that will lead to hearing each other

2021-04-07 Thread Sam Hartman
I wasn't thrilled with Steve's message; I sent him what I hope are some constructive comments privately. Bringing up nazis is rarely going to calm things down or promote constructive discussion. And yes, he did that. But Adrian! You really doubled down on the tension. I appreciate that you

Re: General Resolution: Richard Stallman's readmission to the FSF board

2021-03-26 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Dominik" == Dominik George writes: Dominik> With all due respect to everyone who has been offended by Dominik> Richard Stallman, feels oppressed by him, or is negatively Dominik> affected by his views — every single such person has to be Dominik> heard, their fears and

Re: [External] Re: Debian and fingerprint readers

2021-03-05 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Mark" == Mark Pearson writes: Mark> It's just a case of needing the libfprint and fprintd packages Mark> installed and then under settings->user you can start Mark> registering your prints. Right, and the desktop maintainers could choose to make their desktop meta packages

Re: Debian and fingerprint readers

2021-03-04 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Mark" == Mark Pearson writes: Mark> Hi all, Not sure the right forum to raise this - please Mark> redirect me as appropriate :) Mark> I was checking Debian on my Lenovo P1 G3 today (using testing Mark> latest) and figured I'd have another stab at getting the Mark>

Re: Results of the salsa sprint

2020-12-02 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Bastian" == Bastian Blank writes: Bastian> Hi Steve Bastian> On Sun, Nov 29, 2020 at 03:53:24PM +, Steve McIntyre wrote: >> Have people been pushing the other way - to remove the suffix? >> Just curious. Bastian> That was me. It's because of the maintenance

Re: Results of the salsa sprint

2020-11-30 Thread Sam Hartman
For me as someone with a above average memory for these sorts of details and someone who types URIs into browsers and shells, -team is fie extra characters to type. It's also a naming restriction in a place where I'm not used to seeing naming restrictions onother gitlab sites. However, I too am

Re: Funding Debian projects with money from Freexian's LTS service

2020-11-10 Thread Sam Hartman
I think it is really important that we find a way to accept funding like this. I'm fine if we as a community have concerns about the specifics. But free software isn't supposed to mean developers don't get paid, or the software doesn't get funded (or even the software itself isn't expensive

Re: Fwd: protontypes wants to support the Debian Project with LibreSelery

2020-10-14 Thread Sam Hartman
Hi. With respect, I'd like to challenge the idea that integrating more ways to get funded would undermine some core aspect of Debian. I think there are two aspects that I consider when I think about the idea that Debian is not funded by a particular company: 1) Independence. Many people join

Re: Debian.net Team

2020-09-02 Thread Sam Hartman
I've been thinking about your question about alternate names for the debian.net team. Everything I come up with would be confusing with regard to DSA--like the Debian services team. Perhaps something like Services Facilitators. Or just go with debian.net team and be clear in the description

Re: Debian.net Team

2020-09-01 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Lucas" == Lucas Nussbaum writes: Lucas> I think that this proposal combines two quite different Lucas> aspects, and that it might be better to keep them separate. Lucas> 1. Maintaining contacts with infrastructure providers that Lucas> are willing to help Debian. That's

Re: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-13 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Paul" == Paul Wise writes: Paul> On Wed, Aug 12, 2020 at 3:27 PM Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote: >> I'd rather try to solve the issue in a more sensible way : lower >> the number of expected GPG signatures to 0 temporarily, and ask >> for two or three advocacies from DDs.

Re: Expressing regrets for how I handled the transition to Identity Verification in times of COVID-19

2020-08-12 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Jonathan" == Jonathan McDowell writes: Jonathan> It's worthwhile stating the actual problem that is trying Jonathan> to be solved here. Jonathan> I believe that is: "Given difficulties with keysigning in Jonathan> the modern environment, what does the project believe is

Re: Potential Summary: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-12 Thread Sam Hartman
Enrico, I find that the sorts of discussions that you've started are more valuable if someone goes back later and tries to summarize what we've learned. So I'm going to take a stab at that. I don't think we were seeking a consensus, and we didn't find one. What we did find is a number of

How to Value a Community

2020-08-10 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Holger" == Holger Levsen writes: Holger> Sam, you accused Olek of derailing the situation, which Holger> (AFAICS) he disagrees with, and now you are "offering" to Holger> solve this problem by Olek investing more time to solve a Holger> problem that doesnt also in my book

Re: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-09 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Olek" == Olek Wojnar writes: Olek>Sam, I do not appreciate your aspersions and I think your Hi. It sounds like you are hearing me as disagreeing with *you* and not with some combination of your ideas and how they are presented. I'd like to offer to sit down virtually and work

Re: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-08 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Olek" == Olek Wojnar writes: > TL;DR: While there may be improvements to be found in a > completely different approach to identity, let us not let the > scope of the discussion broaden that far, so we can make > progress today. Olek>I respectful disagree on this point. This

Re: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-08 Thread Sam Hartman
TL;DR: While there may be improvements to be found in a completely different approach to identity, let us not let the scope of the discussion broaden that far, so we can make progress today. > "Olek" == Olek Wojnar writes: Olek> TL;DR: I think without some link back to real world

Re: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-07 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Jonas" == Jonas Smedegaard writes: Jonas> I feel that you are somewhat quoting me out of context: Jonas> For the record, I do *not* find "several months of [remote] Jonas> collaboration" adequate for trusting an identity. I simply Jonas> repeated that criterium from the

Re: Keysigning in times of COVID-19

2020-08-07 Thread Sam Hartman
tive reputation and 2) That it would be costly for them to burn that reputation to maount an attack. In this model the advantage of trying to tie a key back to a real-world identity is that we only get one of those. No matter how much good work I do in the future, I cannot escape a betrayal of tr

a New GDPR Resource

2020-06-13 Thread Sam Hartman
Hi. While DPL, I established a relationship with a GDPR lawyer to help the data protection team and myself with some questions. They forwarded along the following information about a new guide for GDPR implications for developers. The data protection team members were also copied.

Re: libAWSL: Improving Human Efficiency for debian/copyright Reviewer

2020-05-26 Thread Sam Hartman
>>>>> "Michael" == Michael Lustfield writes: Michael> On Tue, 26 May 2020 08:13:24 -0400 Michael> Sam Hartman wrote: >> Unfortunately, being a member of Debian, I find myself getting >> stuck in the details and think yo

Re: libAWSL: Improving Human Efficiency for debian/copyright Reviewer

2020-05-26 Thread Sam Hartman
Hi. I've reviewed most of the spec you point to on salsa. I think you might be getting some of the details before the basic principles. I agree with the principles you state, but would probably state them differently: * Incremental review is valuable and is likely to improve our processes *

Re: Final Bits from the Outgoing DPL

2020-04-20 Thread Sam Hartman
In my last bits mail I talked about two sets of messages from Russ. The first talks about the importance of actually leaving room for disagreement. THe second talks about hostility in handling new proposals. Here are pointers. Russ's Debian vote messages were: [9]:

Re: [Summary] Discourse for Debian

2020-04-16 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Scott" == Scott Kitterman writes: Scott> Sam, Scott> I think you've missed the mark here, except perhaps the why Scott> another service section at the end. Scott> Personally I'm in the "I think it's unsuitable for Debian" Scott> camp and I see my concerns

Re: Draft Delegation for the Community Team

2020-04-14 Thread Sam Hartman
Absolutely, the DPL, or DAM, or others may forward to the CT. That would count as it being directed their way.

Re: Draft Delegation for the Community Team

2020-04-14 Thread Sam Hartman
TL;DR: As Tina points out, this delegation does not accomplish everything. It is an incremental step forward, one of many we've taken this last year. Tina brings up a number of points where there might be value in revising text if we get the support to do so. I welcome such proposals for

Re: [Summary] Discourse for Debian

2020-04-14 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Ihor" == Ihor Antonov writes: Ihor> I want to leave this as is without final verdict. Everyone Ihor> should make their own. I really appreciate the idea of summarizing the thread; I agree with you it has gotten long. A good summary is one where people on all sides of the issue

Re: Testing Discourse for Debian - Moderation concepts

2020-04-14 Thread Sam Hartman
I'd like to echo the comment that requiring people to regularly visit the site does not seem to meet Debian's needs very well for trust. I'd imagine there are a number of people in our community who will tend to read things via email, but who would only visit the site to help moderate--splitting

Re: Discourse usability

2020-04-13 Thread Sam Hartman
Martin, Neil has said that he wants to put his effort into Discourse. It sounds like you'd try something else. I'll admit to wanting to see an attempt at mailman3 or something like that but not having the energy to put into it. I wonder if you or some of the people who would like to try something

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-13 Thread Sam Hartman
>>>>> "Peter" == Peter Palfrader writes: Peter> On Mon, 13 Apr 2020, Sam Hartman wrote: >> >>>>> "Luca" == Luca Filipozzi writes: >> Luca> This is why having a central approach to account creation, Luca>

Re: Draft Delegation for the Community Team

2020-04-13 Thread Sam Hartman
AS I understand it the only open issue preventing a delegation is the following; we need to find wording that makes it clear you can write to parties other than the CT. > >> * To respond to concerns raised by members of the project or > >> people interacting with them, working with

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-13 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Luca" == Luca Filipozzi writes: Luca> This is why having a central approach to account creation, Luca> rather than distributed, is worth considering. I'm in favour Luca> of usernames not changing because one's role changes but that Luca> does not mean I'm favour of

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-11 Thread Sam Hartman
ture over the years. Independently of Enrico's proposal, and unremarked by everyone who is in this discussion, debian.social has adopted the same strategy. Even if nm.debian.org, contributors.debian.org and sso.debian.org were not going to use salsa, we'd already have salsa being used as a sso soluti

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-11 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Julien" == Julien Cristau writes: Julien> On Sat, Apr 11, 2020 at 10:04:55AM +0300, Andrei POPESCU wrote: >> Julien> f...@salsa.debian.org and f...@debian.org both existing and Julien> referring to different people risks causing confusion. I'd Julien> like to

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-10 Thread Sam Hartman
>>>>> "Russ" == Russ Allbery writes: Russ> Luca Filipozzi writes: >> On Fri, Apr 10, 2020 at 11:48:22AM -0400, Sam Hartman wrote: >>> * Note that if you want to you can host accounts in gitlab and >>> have keycloak act as an

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-10 Thread Sam Hartman
Hi. Speaking very much as an individual. I just spoke to someone who runs a keycloak and gitlab instance for a group of about 1000 users. I wanted to inject their experience into the discussion, because having operational experience is useful in such situations. * The thing they like about

Re: Draft Delegation for the Community Team

2020-04-10 Thread Sam Hartman
TL;DR: The concern Scott raises is a good one, and I think he caught me out on a wording problem in the delegation text. > "Scott" == Scott Kitterman writes: Scott> Constitution 5.1.4 give the DPL the power to "Make any Scott> decision for whom noone else has responsibility." Some

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-10 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Luca" == Luca Filipozzi writes: [All my statements in this thread have been as an individual, not as DPL. I've offered to help Enrico facilitate consensus calling in this discussion, and if he takes me up on that, such facilitation might not entirely be separable from the DPL role when

Re: Draft Delegation for the Community Team

2020-04-09 Thread Sam Hartman
Sigh. I propose delegating the following developers as members of the Community Team.: > - Pierre-Elliott Bécue (peb) > - Luke Faraone (lfaraone) > - Steve McIntyre (93sam) > - Jean-Philippe Mengual (jpmengual) Sigh. Steve pointed out that I left off a name in review comments and I missed

Draft Delegation for the Community Team

2020-04-09 Thread Sam Hartman
I'm pleased to finally be able to propose a Community Team delegation for discussion. During the last year it has become clear that we can accomplish more at lower emotional cost when we have the Community Team, Account Managers and DPL working together, supporting each other. It's become

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-09 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Tollef" == Tollef Fog Heen writes: Tollef> ]] Enrico Zini >> For guest accounts opened by DSA directly, it can be pretty much First, at this point in time I would be very skepticle of someone contributing to Debian enough to need porter box access but not having a salsa account.

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-08 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Enrico" == Enrico Zini writes: Enrico> I agree that with the current proposal, the use case of Enrico> "grant a person permission based on their status, which is Enrico> somehow revoked or blocked if the status goes away" becomes Enrico> something we might not be able to

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-08 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Enrico" == Enrico Zini writes: Enrico> On Wed, Apr 08, 2020 at 08:45:32PM +0800, Shengjing Zhu wrote: >> Sigh, but it makes sense too. Will nm.d.o have a field which >> reflects the username on salsa? Enrico> It finally will, yes! \o/ Enrico> It's been quite painful

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-08 Thread Sam Hartman
TL;DR: In Enrico's terms I'm an ACK not a NACK. I'm also trying to help people considering whether they have blocking objections think about the problems actually facing Debian. I'm noticing a bit of a conflict here between people who are familiar with Debian and people who are familiar with

Re: Salsa as authentication provider for Debian

2020-04-07 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Xavier" == Xavier writes: Xavier> Le 07/04/2020 à 17:20, Paul Wise a écrit : >> On Mon, Apr 6, 2020 at 3:58 PM Bastian Blank wrote: >> >>> ## Highlevel plan >> >> I'd like to learn a bit about what the effects for Debian account >> holders and service admins

Re: FTP Team -- call for volunteers

2020-03-16 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Neil" == Neil McGovern writes: Neil> I think my point is that we should strive to reach the point Neil> where it's not inevitable, and that our reality can change. It Neil> should never be the case that making a hard decision leads to Neil> abusive messages, and I believe

Authority behind Banning Someone from the Project

2020-03-08 Thread Sam Hartman
TL;DR: I decided to ban someone from the project completely. Members of ftpmaster, DAM, and the community team all agree. The person had already been banned from our lists and expelled from the project as a developer. This is an explanation of how that decision fits with our constitution. If

Re: delegation for the Anti-Anti-Harassment team

2020-03-03 Thread Sam Hartman
‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐ On Wednesday, March 4, 2020 12:35 AM, Sam Hartman wrote: > > > > > > "Sam" == Sam Hartman hartmans.debian@protonmail.com writes: > > Sam> I hereby appoint everybody who was harassed by the > > Sam> Anti-Hara

Re: delegation for the Anti-Anti-Harassment team

2020-03-03 Thread Sam Hartman
>>>>> "Sam" == Sam Hartman writes: Sam>I hereby appoint everybody who was harassed by the Sam> Anti-Harassment team to be the new Anti-Anti-Harassment team For the avoidance of doubt, the mail I am replying to was forged and was not sent by me.

delegation for the Anti-Anti-Harassment team

2020-03-03 Thread Sam Hartman
I hereby appoint everybody who was harassed by the Anti-Harassment team to be the new Anti-Anti-Harassment team If the Anti-Harassment team backstabs you, the Anti-Anti-Harassment team is on your side. Now everybody will feel safe somewhere in Debian but maybe not everywhere at once Sent

The Debian Trademark Team needs Your Help

2020-03-01 Thread Sam Hartman
hi. Just before I went on vacation, the trademark team let me know that they need more energy. That team involves: 1) Answering questions about use of our trademark 2) Following up on infringement of our trademark. 3) Working with the DPL to decide on whether proposed uses of our

Summary of debian-private discussion: list moderation

2020-03-01 Thread Sam Hartman
I've just returned from vacation and taken a couple of hours to catch up on mail I missed. It was nice to be entirely without email for a week. During that week, there was a discussion on debian-private about how to handle abuse and harassing email both on debian-project and in general. The

Re: Request to Mini DebConf Montreal Organizers: Fight Israel not the DC20 Team

2020-02-20 Thread Sam Hartman
[This will be my last message on this thread. I go away on vacation tomorrow.] > "Didier" == Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes: Didier> The crux of my strong disagreement is here: as DPL, you just Didier> _framed_ the Montreal miniDebConf as a protest. This is a case where perception

Re: Request to Mini DebConf Montreal Organizers: Fight Israel not the DC20 Team

2020-02-19 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Didier" == Didier 'OdyX' Raboud writes: still saying "one way is to withdraw your budget Didier> request (…); if that is not your choice, I _ask_ you to find Didier> some other way". So what happens if they put your request to Didier> /dev/null, if you're not withdrawing the

Request to Mini DebConf Montreal Organizers: Fight Israel not the DC20 Team

2020-02-19 Thread Sam Hartman
for the volunteers putting on DebConf 20. Your contributions to the Debian community are greatly appreciated. Thanks for your understanding and hard work. Thanks for your Consideration, Sam Hartman Debian Project Leader signature.asc Description: PGP signature

Re: Announcing miniDebConf Montreal 2020 -- August 6th to August 9th 2020

2020-02-17 Thread Sam Hartman
> "Jerome" == Jerome Charaoui writes: Jerome> Following the announcement of the DebConf20 location, our Jerome> desire to participate became incompatible with our Jerome> commitment toward the Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions Jerome> (BDS) campaign launched by Palestinian

Re: Using Debian OS on a custom commercial device

2020-02-13 Thread Sam Hartman
You are of course welcome to download Debian and use it under the conditions of the licenses for the various components of Debian. License compliance is a complex field and for any mass-produced commercial product you're going to need to retain the services of a professional qualified in that

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