Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-09 Thread Stefan Monnier
>> > options snd_hda_intel id=[HDMI,PCH] index=1,0 >> Might be you need to write with dashes, as the module files is named >> with dashes. > Thank you for the reply. However, dashes and underscores can be > interchanged in these files. FWIW: That's been my experience for the `modprobe` command arg

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-07 Thread ael
On Fri, Sep 06, 2024 at 10:00:20AM +0700, Max Nikulin wrote: > > Have you read log messages reported by journalctl? There is a systemd unit > to load modules, but I expect that this one should be autoloaded in response > to an udev event. Yes, I did try to find anything relevant using journalctl.

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-07 Thread ael
On Thu, Sep 05, 2024 at 08:52:26PM +0200, Franco Martelli wrote: > > I am running debian testing, updated daily. > I'm on stable, so I can't help much > > > > > After yesterday's update, the kernel module snd_hda_intel is being > > loaded with the wrong (default) parameters. > Have you verified t

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-05 Thread Max Nikulin
On 03/09/2024 22:51, ael wrote: I have /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda.conf which specifies: options snd_hda_intel id=[HDMI,PCH] index=1,0 [...] Maybe there are some release notes that I have failed to read? Can anyone point me in the right direction? (If the direction is Devuan, I have already moved

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-05 Thread Franco Martelli
Hi, On 03/09/24 at 17:51, ael wrote: Hello, I am running debian testing, updated daily. I'm on stable, so I can't help much After yesterday's update, the kernel module snd_hda_intel is being loaded with the wrong (default) parameters. Have you verified this by running the following command

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-03 Thread ael
On Tue, Sep 03, 2024 at 04:51:02PM +0100, ael wrote: > Hello, > > I am running debian testing, updated daily. > > After yesterday's update, the kernel module snd_hda_intel is being > loaded with the wrong (default) parameters. > > I have /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda.conf > which specifies: > options

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-03 Thread ael
On Tue, Sep 03, 2024 at 08:33:54PM +0200, Nicolas George wrote: > ael (12024-09-03): > > options snd_hda_intel id=[HDMI,PCH] index=1,0 > > Might be you need to write with dashes, as the module files is named > with dashes. Thank you for the reply. However, dashes and underscores can be interchang

Re: Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-03 Thread Nicolas George
ael (12024-09-03): > options snd_hda_intel id=[HDMI,PCH] index=1,0 Might be you need to write with dashes, as the module files is named with dashes. Might be brackets are not the correct syntax for an array option. Regards, -- Nicolas George

Why are module parameters under /etc/modprobe.d not respected?

2024-09-03 Thread ael
Hello, I am running debian testing, updated daily. After yesterday's update, the kernel module snd_hda_intel is being loaded with the wrong (default) parameters. I have /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda.conf which specifies: options snd_hda_intel id=[HDMI,PCH] index=1,0 The details are very unlikely to b

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-08-18 Thread digitalmailing
> I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma 5 over X > desktop. Firefox 115.12.0esr is crashing multiple times per day. It > frequently happens when page I'm transfers to another page that creates > a PDF or just has a complicated link. It's annoying. > > To visit some pages, I

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-08-18 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-08-17 22:47, Jeffrey Walton wrote: On Sat, Aug 17, 2024 at 9:07 PM Gary Dale wrote: [...] Out of frustration with this and another problem, I did a complete fresh install yesterday - first to Bookworm then a full-upgrade to Trixie. I started with a new profile for Firefox then synced it

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-08-17 Thread local10
Aug 18, 2024, 01:07 by g...@extremeground.com: > Firefox ESR is still crashing intermittently. Again, I can trigger it fairly > consistently just by visiting some pages (usually ones that try to generate a > PDF, for example). At other times it just crashes for no apparent reason. > You're usi

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-08-17 Thread Jeffrey Walton
On Sat, Aug 17, 2024 at 9:07 PM Gary Dale wrote: > [...] > Out of frustration with this and another problem, I did a complete fresh > install yesterday - first to Bookworm then a full-upgrade to Trixie. I > started with a new profile for Firefox then synced it to restore my > passwords and bookmar

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-08-17 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-19 11:19, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-19 11:09, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-19 10:42, The Wanderer wrote: On 2024-07-19 at 10:34, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-18 09:52, Gary Dale wrote: Thanks for the tips guys, but I'm not going to switch to XFCE, I'm using an old AMD graphics car

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-30 Thread John Hasler
Children are taught in elementary school that computer == Windows. -- John Hasler j...@sugarbit.com Elmwood, WI USA

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-29 Thread tomas
On Tue, Jul 30, 2024 at 10:44:37AM +0800, hlyg wrote: [...] > PS: i am aware that linux has more success in server market ... and the mobile market. Android is, on its underbelly, Linux after all. So Linux might have the most installations out there, I guess. Not that Microsoft didn't try -- th

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-29 Thread hlyg
i realize i have asked hard question: why free OS hasn't beaten M$ in past 30 years? there's no easy answer, it requires years of experience in Windows and Linux 1st, programmers from proprietary software company are as clever as best from open source community. perhaps they

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share? [Dvorak]

2024-07-21 Thread Russell L. Harris
On Sun, Jul 21, 2024 at 07:55:29PM -0600, Shawn Jefferds wrote: Your final statement makes me curious about learning Dvorak. Shawn Jefferds ??n ??f?rdz Noli fovere canem ardentum Vote Vader 2024! On Sun, Jul 21, 2024, 11:37 Russell L. Harris wrote: On Sun, Jul 21, 2024 at 04:48:19PM +080

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Nicholas Geovanis
On Sun, Jul 21, 2024, 10:03 AM Joe wrote: > > > Basically, I think that with many more users, we would see more Windows > users and they would be less secure in their habits. We've already seen > this to some extent with Ubuntu. I don't think it's any more difficult > to write a virus for Li

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share? [Dvorak]

2024-07-21 Thread Russell L. Harris
On Sun, Jul 21, 2024 at 04:48:19PM +0800, hlyg wrote: On 7/21/24 02:33, Russell L. Harris wrote: The same reasons the standard typewriter keyboard is QWERTY rather than Dvorak: = The precedent set by the first to market is powerful. = The influence of advertising upon a populace lacking in di

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Jeffrey Walton
On Sun, Jul 21, 2024 at 12:19 PM Hans wrote: > > I do not agree to this. Updates should be installed as soon as they are > available. Especially security updates. It shows , that within 24 hours after > the release of an update, an exploit is available for this security hole. I think you may be c

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Dan Ritter
Stefan Monnier wrote: > > - software updates that run as root (including Debian updates) > > can run anything else as root > > So, maybe a more relevant discussion is: what will happen when a Debian > stable security update comes with a "big blunder" that crashes the most > machines in earl

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Anssi Saari
hlyg writes: > why free OS hasn't gained more share even after 30 years of development? But it has. The internet and what connects to it now mostly run Linux, other than Microsoft's single niche. Mobile phones run a Linux variant. The PC desktop is the only exception where they ha

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread The Wanderer
t;> organization deciding which of the most recent three versions each >> of their computers will get) but just with a data-files update >> (which, as we have seen here, appears to go out to all clients >> regardless of version). > > At minimum, it is negligence. Agreed.

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Hans
I do not agree to this. Updates should be installed as soon as they are available. Especially security updates. It shows , that within 24 hours after the release of an update, an exploit is available for this security hole. But you should do it corrdectly, like some hospitals did: First check wi

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread The Wanderer
gt;> >> Their is essentially no one in the linux arena to sue if things go >> south, so it doesn't take more than an eighth grade education to >> see why they won't ever recommend linux no matter how superior it >> may be at the end of a P&L report. They hav

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Richmond
Dan Ritter writes: > Richmond wrote: >> Jeffrey Walton writes: >> >> Yes the updates should be tested at every stage. Maybe people think that >> they cannot stop updates, but they can use Group Policy to stop Windows >> Update. Or maybe they are afraid if they don't allow virus updates then >>

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Nicolas George
Joe (12024-07-21): > And the important phrase there is 'if you want to'. The point is that > many people, especially those accustomed to running with admin > privileges on their Windows computers, would continue to do that. No, they will not. They will continue to follow the system default, whate

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Nicolas George
Alain D D Williams (12024-07-21): > I only needed root as it was for another user. Exactly. On a computer with only one user account, once the pirate have access to that account, they can do everything that matters. Including spy the root password next time it is typed, but why waste the t

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Alain D D Williams
gle (but not keystrokes I think), MS Edge does likewise - which is why I stick to Firefox. But if you have root access it is easy, I did it on a Unix system V machine in the late 1980s, a few minutes work. I only needed root as it was for another user. -- Alain Williams Linux/GNU Consultant - Mail

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Nicolas George
Joe (12024-07-21): > I accept what you say, the point I was making is that the more users, > and they will be less IT-competent users, the more will login as root. No, they will not. And it does not matter, because on a personal computer the root account is not what matters, what matters is the u

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Joe
d it takes a bit of fiddling to set up an unprivileged user and *always* *use* *it*. It's inconvenient to keep entering the admin password (there's still no sudo, as far as I know), so people prefer to run with admin privileges. In most cases, nobody has ever told them why they shouldn

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Stefan Monnier
> - software updates that run as root (including Debian updates) > can run anything else as root So, maybe a more relevant discussion is: what will happen when a Debian stable security update comes with a "big blunder" that crashes the most machines in early boot? Admittedly, the wider vari

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Dan Ritter
Richmond wrote: > Jeffrey Walton writes: > > Yes the updates should be tested at every stage. Maybe people think that > they cannot stop updates, but they can use Group Policy to stop Windows > Update. Or maybe they are afraid if they don't allow virus updates then > they will allow a virus? Th

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-21 Thread Richmond
Jeffrey Walton writes: > This is alarming (to me) from the YC post: > > "we push software to your machines any time we want, > whether or not it's urgent, without testing it" seems to be > core to the model... > > Updates need to be tested inside an organization's lab, and then > test

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Nicholas Geovanis
On Sun, Jul 21, 2024, 12:40 AM wrote: > On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 03:27:17PM -0400, gene heskett wrote: > > [...] > > > And even you Hans, leave out the major, all encompassing, reason for the > > lack of market share, which is that most business that have a > computerized > > system to run things

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread George at Clug
Contrary to popular belief, the QWERTY layout was not designed to slow the typist down, but rather to speed up typing. Indeed, there is evidence that, aside from the issue of jamming, placing often-used keys farther apart increases typing speed, because it encourages alternation between the ha

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread Nicolas George
hlyg (12024-07-21): > is it possible to remap keyboard to Dvorak in X Window? Yes, of course. https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=Debian+dvorak > does anyone use it > to speed up typing? No, only to feel smug. # Later experiments have shown th

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-21 Thread hlyg
On 7/21/24 02:33, Russell L. Harris wrote: The same reasons the standard typewriter keyboard is QWERTY rather than Dvorak: = The precedent set by the first to market is powerful. = The influence of advertising upon a populace lacking in discernment and addicted to novelty is deadly. Add to t

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread Jeffrey Walton
was Linux deployed on > those machines. And nothing would be different if Crowdstrike didn't > exist, as some other equally useless vendor would be involved. > > There is a need to examine why companies are putting high privilege > junk software on their machines. It's got nothing to do with Linux > vs Windows. Jeff

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread Alain D D Williams
On Sun, Jul 21, 2024 at 08:17:54AM +0800, jeremy ardley wrote: > The CrowdStrike outage emulated the very thing it is alleged to protect > against - a zero day exploit. It was also a demonstration of a huge vulnerability. If $EvilActor were to get an agent employed at CrowdStrike/whoever then the

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Alain D D Williams
arch will tell you what to do but not why, I have sometimes found that the recommendation is wrong and that enabling something else is a better solution. -- Alain Williams Linux/GNU Consultant - Mail systems, Web sites, Networking, Programmer, IT Lecturer. +44 (0) 787 668 0256 https://www.phcomp

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread tomas
On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 03:27:17PM -0400, gene heskett wrote: [...] > And even you Hans, leave out the major, all encompassing, reason for the > lack of market share, which is that most business that have a computerized > system to run things also value what their MBA says. And since there is no

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread Andy Smith
ing in this story would be different if it was Linux deployed on those machines. And nothing would be different if Crowdstrike didn't exist, as some other equally useless vendor would be involved. There is a need to examine why companies are putting high privilege junk software on their machine

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread Bret Busby
On 21/7/24 10:07, Jeffrey Walton wrote: All this points to an incompetent board. If someone's head is going to be taken (figuratively), then it should start with the CEO and other executives. Yes. But, the people who should be sacked, with loss of benefits, are the board members and the CE

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread Jeffrey Walton
goes through a release cascade, with > each organization deciding which of the most recent three versions each > of their computers will get) but just with a data-files update (which, > as we have seen here, appears to go out to all clients regardless of > version). At minimum, it is neg

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread jeremy ardley
On 21/7/24 07:28, Nicholas Geovanis wrote: Again lacking data center experience? Every server in your data center that is outward-facing will be contacted by intruders on its open ports. That includes your Debian servers. If your apache server or application server running on Debian is vulne

Re: CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread jeremy ardley
On 21/7/24 06:38, The Wanderer wrote: The first would be poor institutional practice; the others would be potentially-questionable software design, although it's hard to know without seeing the internal architecture of the software in question and understanding*why* it's designe

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread gene heskett
Windows For this specific issue, if Linux were used at the same scale and for the same purposes as these affected Windows machines, then a similar issue would affect Linux sooner or later. The reason why this is the case is that the current motivation for the use of Crowdstrike's softwa

CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread George at Clug
ual new client version (which goes through a release cascade, with > each organization deciding which of the most recent three versions each > of their computers will get) but just with a data-files update (which, > as we have seen here, appears to go out to all clients regardless of > ver

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Nicholas Geovanis
On Sat, Jul 20, 2024, 2:09 PM Joe wrote: > > You missed one: Linux is virtually a virus-free environment, and a > large user base would mean many more people running as root, and it > would become worth the time of malware writers to target Linux. Linux > would become as virus-ridden as Windows.

CrowdStrike and drivers (was Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?)

2024-07-20 Thread The Wanderer
with a data-files update (which, as we have seen here, appears to go out to all clients regardless of version). The first would be poor institutional practice; the others would be potentially-questionable software design, although it's hard to know without seeing the internal architecture

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread hlyg
Thank Clug and all that reply ! On 7/20/24 18:36, George at Clug wrote: Do you think Windows is not reliable? Why is that? Windows used to crash often, i rarely use it now, they say it's more stable these day Do you use Linux yourself? surely i use as this is debian user list Hav

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Nicolas George
Andy Smith (12024-07-20): > And yes here in the UK where we allowed the Post Office to pay > billions to Fujitsu to develop the Horizon IT system that > incorrectly accused hundreds of postmasters of fraud, resulting in > criminal prosecutions and at least one case of suicide. That was not a bug,

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Andy Smith
Hi, On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 09:44:52PM +0100, debian-u...@howorth.org.uk wrote: > It seems clear to me that what's needed is a change in the law. At the > moment here in the UK we have national news services explaining that > airline passengers won't be able to get compensation because the > 'even

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread debian-user
e reliable than Windows > > For this specific issue, if Linux were used at the same scale and > for the same purposes as these affected Windows machines, then a > similar issue would affect Linux sooner or later. > > The reason why this is the case is that the current motivation

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Jeff Pang
I would think linux is better as server OS due to reasons of security, performance and Operability etc. Once aol mail was running on windows. But now aol is merged into yahoo mail which was originally run on freebsd but now linux mostly. And the initial hotmail was running on freebsd too IIRC

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Andy Smith
sed at the same scale and for the same purposes as these affected Windows machines, then a similar issue would affect Linux sooner or later. The reason why this is the case is that the current motivation for the use of Crowdstrike's software on those Windows machines would be exactly the sam

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Hans
> You missed one: Linux is virtually a virus-free environment, and a > large user base would mean many more people running as root, and it > would become worth the time of malware writers to target Linux. Linux > would become as virus-ridden as Windows. > > It would also become a target for data h

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread gene heskett
take more than an eighth grade education to see why they won't ever recommend linux no matter how superior it may be at the end of a P&L report. They have to have someone to sue. Bill Shakespear said it best when he wrote "first, we kill all the lawyers." But MBA's

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Joe
On Sat, 20 Jul 2024 15:59:14 +0200 Hans wrote: > Hello, > > well, the thing is: Do we really want to go to more market share? > > Let's imagine, Debian becomes market relevant, what will happen? > Sure, more developers get paid, what is very nice. But not all > developers will. > > Many good d

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Russell L. Harris
The same reasons the standard typewriter keyboard is QWERTY rather than Dvorak: = The precedent set by the first to market is powerful. = The influence of advertising upon a populace lacking in discernment and addicted to novelty is deadly. Add to that extortion and bribes and a compromised leg

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Nicholas Geovanis
On Sat, Jul 20, 2024, 12:16 AM wrote: > On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 02:45:37PM +1000, David wrote: > > On Sat, 2024-07-20 at 11:54 +0800, hlyg wrote: > > [...] > > > > why free OS hasn't gained more share even after 30 years of > > > development? > >

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Hans
Which is not quite correct. As a hamradio (I am one), you are allowed to develop your very owh rf-devices. Transceivers, measure equipment, whatever you like. Many things, we are using today in consumer devices are first developed by radio amateurs (example shorthand "packet radio", which is da

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread gene heskett
On 7/20/24 09:58, Larry Martell wrote: I’ve never owned a machine running windows in my life. I've owned one. I needed a lappy I could use with a gps for roadmap, had the then new XP on it, cleared the disk a week later and put mandrake on it because XP had no drivers that could run the broadco

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Nicolas George
gene heskett (12024-07-20): > > If they were, you'd have support for software-defined radio signal > > processing in FFmpeg, for example. > Which the current rules for such does not allow, by FCC edicts, only sealed > FCC approved blobs are allowed to play in the rf field. > So don't blame the code

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread George at Clug
On Saturday, 20-07-2024 at 23:59 Hans wrote: > Hello, > > well, the thing is: Do we really want to go to more market share? > > Let's imagine, Debian becomes market relevant, what will happen? Sure, more > developers get paid, what is very nice. But not all developers will. > > Many good dev

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread gene heskett
On 7/20/24 04:28, Nicolas George wrote: hlyg (12024-07-20): Thank David! market share is important though it isn't "reliable recommendation for quality": more users attract more programmers, who develop more apps, The programmers who are attracted by market share are not necessarily the ones w

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Hans
Hello, well, the thing is: Do we really want to go to more market share? Let's imagine, Debian becomes market relevant, what will happen? Sure, more developers get paid, what is very nice. But not all developers will. Many good developers will not be paid and when the market will rule things,

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Larry Martell
I’ve never owned a machine running windows in my life.

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread jeremy ardley
On 20/7/24 18:35, George at Clug wrote: On Saturday, 20-07-2024 at 13:54 hlyg wrote: > crowdstrike makes news headlines, many Windows become blue screens The CrowdStrike issue was not a Windows issue, it was a CrowdStrike issue. The problem did not affect our Windows computers as we have no

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Jeff Pang
My reason to keep windows is that I can’t play Starcraft under Linux. -- Jeff Pang jeffp...@aol.com

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Michel Verdier
On 2024-07-20, Michael Kjörling wrote: > On 20 Jul 2024 16:57 +0800, from hlyg2...@outlook.com (hlyg): >> statistics about market share might come from web servers and game servers, >> they know how many users use linux and Windows. > > No. They at most can know what platform user agents report.

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Michel Verdier
On 2024-07-20, Michael Grant wrote: > OpenOffice is quite featureful, it is not 100% bug for bug compatible with > real MS Office products. I failed to read an old version word file on a newer word. And succeed with libreoffice. So yes it's not 100% bug compatible :) > choices. There is no clea

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Michael Kjörling
On 20 Jul 2024 16:57 +0800, from hlyg2...@outlook.com (hlyg): > statistics about market share might come from web servers and game servers, > they know how many users use linux and Windows. No. They at most can know what platform user agents report. Which isn't necessarily the same thing at all.

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Michael Kjörling
On 20 Jul 2024 17:25 +0800, from jeremy.ard...@gmail.com (jeremy ardley): >> A lot of paid-for programmer time isn't necessarily for what the >> individual programmer_wants_ to do. If one's employer dictates that >> their products should support Mac OS and Windows, for example, then >> there's usu

why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread DdB
Am 20.07.2024 um 05:54 schrieb hlyg: > why free OS hasn't gained more share even after 30 years of development? I want to kickoff by reminding, that WHY questions are rarely useful, it is what small kidz are asking, when they want to learn, how to argue with adults. ;-) But approaching t

Re: Re[2]: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread George at Clug
t for almost every tool like Gimp for Photoshop but > it's not Photoshop. Most photographers have heard of or used Photoshop, > but not many know or know about Gimp. These are just a few examples, > there are many others. This effect has a knock-on effect of lower > uptake

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread George at Clug
ays with. > > it is evident that many people around still use Windows I would agree that Windows is the most used OS for desktop PCs. > > i wonder if linux is more reliable than Windows Do you think Windows is not reliable?  Why is that? > > according to some statistics linu

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread hlyg
On 7/20/24 15:02, Michel Verdier wrote: Linux is not on the market. I buy M$ but download debian. How can you say how many people is using debian? Once upon a time there was a linuxcounter... Thank tomas, Verdier and George! statistics about market share might come from web servers and game

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread jeremy ardley
On 20/7/24 16:56, Michael Kjörling wrote: On 20 Jul 2024 10:28 +0200, fromgeo...@nsup.org (Nicolas George): Thank David! market share is important though it isn't "reliable recommendation for quality": more users attract more programmers, who develop more apps, The programmers who are attra

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Michael Kjörling
On 20 Jul 2024 10:28 +0200, from geo...@nsup.org (Nicolas George): >> Thank David! market share is important though it isn't "reliable >> recommendation for quality": more users attract more programmers, who >> develop more apps, > > The programmers who are attracted by market share are not necess

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Nicolas George
hlyg (12024-07-20): > Thank David! market share is important though it isn't "reliable > recommendation for quality": more users attract more programmers, who > develop more apps, The programmers who are attracted by market share are not necessarily the ones who are interested in developing qualit

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread hlyg
Thank David! market share is important though it isn't "reliable recommendation for quality": more users attract more programmers, who develop more apps, which attract more users. e.g. many vpn providers support Windows and android, not linux. linux can get distributed by word-of-mouth if it i

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-20 Thread Michel Verdier
On 2024-07-20, hlyg wrote: > i wonder if linux is more reliable than Windows no doubt :) > according to some statistics linux has only 4% desktop market, 73% for MS, 15% > for MacOS Linux is not on the market. I buy M$ but download debian. How can you say how many people is using debian? Once u

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-19 Thread tomas
On Sat, Jul 20, 2024 at 02:45:37PM +1000, David wrote: > On Sat, 2024-07-20 at 11:54 +0800, hlyg wrote: [...] > > why free OS hasn't gained more share even after 30 years of > > development? > > Because people don't have it hammered into them via the educati

Re: why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-19 Thread David
nly 4% desktop market, 73% > for > MS, 15% for MacOS Market share is not a reliable recommendation for quality. How much market share do Rolls Royce or Bugatti have? > why free OS hasn't gained more share even after 30 years of > development? Because people don't have it ham

why reliable linux hasn't gained more market share?

2024-07-19 Thread hlyg
crowdstrike makes news headlines, many Windows become blue screens it is evident that many people around still use Windows i wonder if linux is more reliable than Windows according to some statistics linux has only 4% desktop market, 73% for MS, 15% for MacOS why free OS hasn't gained

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-19 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-19 11:09, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-19 10:42, The Wanderer wrote: On 2024-07-19 at 10:34, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-18 09:52, Gary Dale wrote: Thanks for the tips guys, but I'm not going to switch to XFCE, I'm using an old AMD graphics card, it's a desktop machine, and the prob

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-19 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-19 10:42, The Wanderer wrote: On 2024-07-19 at 10:34, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-18 09:52, Gary Dale wrote: Thanks for the tips guys, but I'm not going to switch to XFCE, I'm using an old AMD graphics card, it's a desktop machine, and the problem isn't specific to PDFs - although t

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-19 Thread The Wanderer
On 2024-07-19 at 10:34, Gary Dale wrote: > On 2024-07-18 09:52, Gary Dale wrote: >> Thanks for the tips guys, but I'm not going to switch to XFCE, I'm >> using an old AMD graphics card, it's a desktop machine, and the >> problem isn't specific to PDFs - although that seems to be one of >> the ma

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-19 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-18 09:52, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-17 21:25, Gary Dale wrote: I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma 5 over X desktop. Firefox 115.12.0esr is crashing multiple times per day. It frequently happens when page I'm transfers to another page that creates a PDF

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-18 Thread mick.crane
getting elderly is brilliant. After getting everything just nice, experienced several system crashes. "I'll install the nvidia driver and see if that fixes it." Then I remember why I tried to remove the nvidia driver. an upgrade caused X to refuse to start. Install No3 and halfway

Re: Nvidia chipsets and Debian 12 [WAS Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?]

2024-07-18 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-18 13:51, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 10:41:50AM -0700, Van Snyder wrote: On Thu, 2024-07-18 at 07:55 +, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: HOW did you upgrade? Did you go via 11? Fresh install on reformatted boot and root partitions. OK I can't do that with my o

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-18 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-18 09:52, Gary Dale wrote: On 2024-07-17 21:25, Gary Dale wrote: I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma 5 over X desktop. Firefox 115.12.0esr is crashing multiple times per day. It frequently happens when page I'm transfers to another page that creates a PDF

Nvidia chipsets and Debian 12 [WAS Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?]

2024-07-18 Thread Andrew M.A. Cater
On Thu, Jul 18, 2024 at 10:41:50AM -0700, Van Snyder wrote: > On Thu, 2024-07-18 at 07:55 +, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: > > > > HOW did you upgrade? Did you go via 11? > > > Fresh install on reformatted boot and root partitions. > OK > > > I can't do that with my old Dell Vostro 1700 because

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-18 Thread Van Snyder
On Thu, 2024-07-18 at 07:55 +, Andrew M.A. Cater wrote: > On Wed, Jul 17, 2024 at 08:00:06PM -0700, Van Snyder wrote: > > On Wed, 2024-07-17 at 22:17 -0400, e...@gmx.us wrote: > > > On 7/17/24 21:25, Gary Dale wrote: > > > > I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma > > > >

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-18 Thread Sven Joachim
On 2024-07-17 21:25 -0400, Gary Dale wrote: > I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma 5 over > X desktop. Firefox 115.12.0esr is crashing multiple times per day. It > frequently happens when page I'm transfers to another page that > creates a PDF or just has a complicated li

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-18 Thread Gary Dale
On 2024-07-17 21:25, Gary Dale wrote: I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma 5 over X desktop. Firefox 115.12.0esr is crashing multiple times per day. It frequently happens when page I'm transfers to another page that creates a PDF or just has a complicated link. It's an

Re: Why is Firefox crashing so much lately?

2024-07-18 Thread mick.crane
On 2024-07-18 04:00, Van Snyder wrote: On Wed, 2024-07-17 at 22:17 -0400, e...@gmx.us wrote: On 7/17/24 21:25, Gary Dale wrote: > I'm running Debian/Trixie on an AMD64 system, using the Plasma 5 > over X > desktop. Firefox 115.12.0esr is crashing multiple times per day. It > frequently happens w

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