On Saturday, 3 April 2021 11:19:38 AM AEDT Craig Sanders wrote:
> The witch hunt is not within debian, debian's just being dragged into the
> angry mob.
Yes to everything you've said, Craig. And the attack on Debian has been
successful so far. So many man-hours were lost on this GR already in
the
On Friday, 2 April 2021 11:09:42 PM AEDT Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote:
> Thanks for arguing for my point: Communism was a beautiful theoretical
> idea which was implemented by humans and therefore was a miserable
> fuckup in the end.
>
> I still think the concept is really interesting, but I can't
> "Mathias" == Mathias Behrle writes:
>> But for a two option situation, option A do the thing and option
>> B FD, FD probably does map to no fairly well.
Mathias> I would really like to avoid this situation, where FD is
Mathias> expected to leave room for such wide
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 10:36:39PM +0200, Philip Hands wrote:
> My assumption would be that it was an allusion to McCarthyism, and the
> associated anti-communist moral panic in the 1950s that Arthur Miller
> dramatised in The Crucible.
yes.
It's also a tried and tested political tool used to
Short and simple:
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
Free Software Foundation.
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Description: PGP signature
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 08:43:15PM +0300, Adrian Bunk wrote:
> There is a common pitfall that uploads signed with a key that is expired in
> the keyring are silently dropped at some point during processing.
Thanks, i'll look into that. I'm pretty sure I signed it with my newest
(2015-ish) key,
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 09:07:15PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
> Yes, lets use that I am not native English speaker and drown the
> conversation with some pointless pedantic approaches now and bunch of words.
Oh, FFS! I was giving you a face-saving excuse for your ignorance, not using
it
Mathias Behrle writes:
> I consider the really great value of current option E that I can indeed
> vote explicitely that nothing should be done on behalf of the project
> and that further discussion is *not* needed.
I consider the naming of "further discussion" a wry joke on the fact that
the
* Pierre-Elliott Bécue: " Re: What does FD Mean" (Fri, 2 Apr 2021 23:29:58
+0200):
> > So, yeah, FD is complicated:-)
>
> I'd rather have a None of the Above default option all the time along
> with FD. It'd probably help.
+1
--
Mathias Behrle ✧ Debian Developer
PGP/GnuPG key
* Sam Hartman: " What does FD Mean" (Fri, 02 Apr 2021 16:57:28 -0400):
> > "Mathias" == Mathias Behrle writes:
>
> Mathias> I don't get that. Is this really common sense that FD
> Mathias> means/meant "preserve status quo"? For me voting this
> Mathias> option definitely
Hi,
On 2021-04-02 6:44 p.m., Salvo Tomaselli wrote:
>> I sincerely think debian-vote should be read-only for non-DDs because
> this person is not a DD (afaict) and is just polluting our list with
> such non-sense.
>
>
> There are non-DD people who maintain more packages and with higher total
>
> "Salvo" == Salvo Tomaselli writes:
>> I sincerely think debian-vote should be read-only for non-DDs
Salvo> because this person is not a DD (afaict) and is just
Salvo> polluting our list with such non-sense.
Salvo> There are non-DD people who maintain more packages and
> I sincerely think debian-vote should be read-only for non-DDs because
this person is not a DD (afaict) and is just polluting our list with
such non-sense.
There are non-DD people who maintain more packages and with higher total
popcon than DDs, but aren't DD because didn't bother to jump
b...@debian.org wrote:
>I can personally vouch for the fact that RMS can be very difficult. He
Thank you for this contribute.
--
ciao,
Marco
Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 16:57:28-0400, Sam Hartman a écrit :
> > "Mathias" == Mathias Behrle writes:
>
> Mathias> I don't get that. Is this really common sense that FD
> Mathias> means/meant "preserve status quo"? For me voting this
> Mathias> option definitely should mean
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 10:36:39PM +0200, Philip Hands wrote:
>
> You'll need to ask Craig what he actually meant by that.
>
> My assumption would be that it was an allusion to McCarthyism, and the
> associated anti-communist moral panic in the 1950s that Arthur Miller
> dramatised in The
On April 1, 2021 4:21:59 PM GMT+05:30, "Barak A. Pearlmutter"
wrote:
>He makes unwelcome sexual
>overtures to women, but backs off when turned down (with perhaps
>isolated exceptions decades ago). That's totally inappropriate
>behaviour. He seems unable to sense when someone finds him
> "Mathias" == Mathias Behrle writes:
Mathias> I don't get that. Is this really common sense that FD
Mathias> means/meant "preserve status quo"? For me voting this
Mathias> option definitely should mean that further discussion on
Mathias> the topic is needed.
So, that is
Hi,
On Fri, Apr 2, 2021 at 1:37 PM Philip Hands wrote:
>
> Is that really what we're seeing?
Yes, that is exactly what we are seeing. Thank you for explaining it.
Kind regards
Felix Lechner
Roberto C. Sánchez writes:
> On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:18:51PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
>>
>> On 4/2/21 16:56, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
>> > On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 03:49:04PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
>> > > On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
>> > > > TEXT OF OPTION 5
>> > > >
* Gunnar Wolf: " Re: Call for votes on «Statement regarding Richard Stallman's
readmission to the FSF board»" (Fri, 2 Apr 2021 12:57:09 -0600):
Thank you Gunnar for pushing this forward.
> Nicolas Dandrimont dijo [Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:27:48PM +0200]:
> > > (...)
> > > [A] Call for the FSF
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 09:53:30AM -0600, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
> Kurt Roeckx dijo [Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 09:29:06AM +0200]:
> > On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 01:06:49AM -0600, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
> > > Dear Debian Project Secretary,
> > >
> > > Given the DPL authorized a shortened discussion period, and
On 4/2/21 18:48, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:18:51PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
On 4/2/21 16:56, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 03:49:04PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
TEXT OF OPTION 5
On 4/2/21 19:09, Craig Sanders wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:18:51PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
[...] still not good enough to throw tantrums
around with "witch-hunt". Women in past were burnt alive on stakes, so stop
with extreme rhetoric when some expresses that they had it enough with
Nicolas Dandrimont dijo [Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:27:48PM +0200]:
> > (...)
> > [A] Call for the FSF board removal, as in rms-open-letter.github.io
> > (proposed by Steve Langasek, currently base proposal)
> >
> > [B] Call for Stallman's resignation from FSF all bodies
> > (proposed by
Le jeudi 01 avril 2021 à 21:48:53-0400, Tiago Bortoletto Vaz a écrit :
> On 2021-04-01 9:01 p.m., Dmitry Smirnov wrote:
> > defeat communism and prevent it from raising
> > its ugly head again.
>
> Option 6:
>
> "Debian will fight hard to defeat communism and prevent it from raising
> its ugly
Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 17:47:08+0300, Adrian Bunk a écrit :
> Hi Barak,
>
> thanks a lot for this nuanced view.
>
> On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 11:51:59AM +0100, Barak A. Pearlmutter wrote:
> >...
> > He’s remarkably stubborn in technical matters even when outside his
> > domain of expertise
On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 03:19:02AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
>...
> i'm down to one package these days, dlocate, which i work on when i'm able. i
> uploaded a new version of it a few months ago - the upload completed OK, but
> the new version never went into unstable. I have no idea why it just
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 07:30:58PM +0200, Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote:
> Ah I see!
>
> Thanks for this.
>
> I think your interpretation is the most relevant one for now but indeed
> there is some place here for improvements.
>
> I intend to propose a Constitution change taking into account the
Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 19:26:06+0200, Kurt Roeckx a écrit :
> On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 07:15:32PM +0200, Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote:
> > Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 08:56:33+0200, Kurt Roeckx a écrit :
> > > On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 09:11:29PM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
> > > > Phil Morrell
Kurt Roeckx writes:
> This is part where the constitution is really hard to parse, and it's
> something I've struggled with for a long time. The terms are used in
> conflicting ways. I hope someone will take the time to fix this.
Yeah, my apologies, I was going to fix this after the systemd GR
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 07:15:32PM +0200, Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote:
> Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 08:56:33+0200, Kurt Roeckx a écrit :
> > On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 09:11:29PM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
> > > Phil Morrell writes:
> > >
> > > > Do the additional proposals made in that week mean
Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 08:56:33+0200, Kurt Roeckx a écrit :
> On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 09:11:29PM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
> > Phil Morrell writes:
> >
> > > Do the additional proposals made in that week mean the discussion period
> > > has automatically been extended? Is the Secretary
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:18:51PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
> [...] still not good enough to throw tantrums
> around with "witch-hunt". Women in past were burnt alive on stakes, so stop
> with extreme rhetoric when some expresses that they had it enough with
> sexist behavior.
Witch-hunt is a
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 06:18:51PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
>
> On 4/2/21 16:56, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
> > On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 03:49:04PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
> > > On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > > > TEXT OF OPTION 5
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Debian
On Fri, Apr 2, 2021, at 17:53, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
> Better done with the morning coffee than late at night :-)
>
> I suggest the following options and ordering to appear on the ballot:
>
> [A] Call for the FSF board removal, as in rms-open-letter.github.io
> (proposed by Steve Langasek,
Adrian Bunk wrote:
> The traits that make RMS appear awkward are the same that made him
> create the GNU project and the FSF, and without RMS being the way he
> is Debian would not exist.
Yes!
RMS is one stubborn guy.
Fifty years ago a laserprinter didn't work right because of some
software
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 10:56:42AM -0400, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
> debian-keyring (1998.09.27) unstable; urgency=low
>
> * Mon Sep 7 14:13:23 EDT 1998: [PGP/IG] Updated the key of Dima Barsky
> * Thu Sep 10 18:10:03 EDT 1998: [PGP/IG] Added the key of Craig Sanders
>
> So, to summarize:
On 4/2/21 16:56, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 03:49:04PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software
Kurt Roeckx dijo [Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 09:29:06AM +0200]:
> On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 01:06:49AM -0600, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
> > Dear Debian Project Secretary,
> >
> > Given the DPL authorized a shortened discussion period, and that, while
> > said discussion period allowed for a wide range of voting
Hi Barak,
thanks a lot for this nuanced view.
On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 11:51:59AM +0100, Barak A. Pearlmutter wrote:
>...
> He’s remarkably stubborn in technical matters even when outside his
> domain of expertise and completely wrong.
>...
The traits that make RMS appear awkward are the same
On 4/2/21 4:07 PM, Charles Plessy wrote:
> Dear Jonathan and Sruthi,
>
> I recently wrote on my blog « Like many GRs, it will divide Debian and
> leave scars, at least a tally sheet of who voted what, and who voted
> like whom. » I would like to elaborate and ask you:
>
> Would you as a
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 03:49:04PM +0200, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
>
> On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > TEXT OF OPTION 5
> >
> >
> > Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against
> > Richard
> > Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the
On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 11:20:03PM +0200, Wouter Verhelst wrote:
>...
> The open letter does not state that RMS should be ejected from the free
> software movement in general, or from the FSF specifically. Were that
> the case, I would agree with you that it was wrong. Instead, it merely
> states
Dear Jonathan and Sruthi,
I recently wrote on my blog « Like many GRs, it will divide Debian and
leave scars, at least a tally sheet of who voted what, and who voted
like whom. » I would like to elaborate and ask you:
Would you as a developer agree to have all votes secret, and would you
as a
On 2 Apr 2021, at 14:49, Zlatan Todoric wrote:
> On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
>> TEXT OF OPTION 5
>>
>>
>> Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
>> Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
>>
On 4/2/21 09:20, Craig Sanders wrote:
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
Free Software Foundation.
I sincerely think
On Sat, Apr 03, 2021 at 12:08:02AM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> 1. Most importantly - what happens if the witch-hunt is successful and rms and
> the entire FSF board are sacked/forced to resign? Who replaces them? Who gains
> control over the FSF and the text of the GPL?
It's a broader question
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 05:07:59AM +0100, Phil Morrell wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Apr 2021, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against
> > Richard Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the
> > board of the Free Software Foundation.
>
Le vendredi 02 avril 2021 à 12:01:39+1100, Dmitry Smirnov a écrit :
> On Thursday, 1 April 2021 7:56:12 PM AEDT Pierre-Elliott Bécue wrote:
> > Freedom of speech is one of the theoretically most beautiful ideas
> > Humans ever created. So is Communism.
>
> Communism (i.e. fascism + marxism) is an
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 01:06:49AM -0600, Gunnar Wolf wrote:
> Kurt Roeckx dijo [Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 08:56:33AM +0200]:
> > There is also this in 4.2:
> > 4. The minimum discussion period is 2 weeks, but may be varied by up
> >to 1 week by the Project Leader. The Project Leader has a
TEXT OF OPTION 5
Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
Free Software Foundation.
signature.asc
Description: PGP signature
Kurt Roeckx dijo [Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 08:56:33AM +0200]:
> There is also this in 4.2:
> 4. The minimum discussion period is 2 weeks, but may be varied by up
>to 1 week by the Project Leader. The Project Leader has a casting
>vote. There is a quorum of 3Q.
>
> The DPL changed
On Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 09:11:29PM -0700, Russ Allbery wrote:
> Phil Morrell writes:
>
> > Do the additional proposals made in that week mean the discussion period
> > has automatically been extended? Is the Secretary simply being pragmatic
> > here, executing discretion before announcing the
On Fri, Apr 02, 2021 at 12:08:52PM +1100, Craig Sanders wrote:
> Short and simple:
>
> TEXT OF OPTION 5
>
>
> Debian refuses to participate in and denounces the witch-hunt against Richard
> Stallman, the Free Software Foundation, and the members of the board of the
> Free
Santiago R.R. dijo [Thu, Apr 01, 2021 at 10:11:54AM +0200]:
> > > * A developer proposes an issue with a signed message on
> > >debian-vote@lists.debian.org .
> > >
> > > * Anyone can express their consent or dissent by replying to the
> > >message.
> > >
> > > * When the discussion
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