Re: [Snowdrift-design] "History" or "Payment History" page content
On 08/31/2016 11:48 PM, Bryan Richter wrote: > On Wed, Aug 31, 2016 at 09:32:12AM -0600, Michael Siepmann wrote: >> >> On 08/31/2016 05:57 AM, Bryan Richter wrote: >>> There are three classes of information: >>> >>> 1. Current pledge information >>> 2. Historic payment information >>> 3. Historic pledge information >>> >>> These forms of information should be made available as separate >>> pages, with the given ordering being used as implementation >>> priority. >> This approach sounds fine to me from a prioritization perspective. >> However, as soon as we're aiming to support more than a small number >> of "insider" users, I think we will need an effective explanation >> of *why* the historic payments were what they were, which means >> showing how historic payment information relates to historic pledge >> information, including edge case complexities where a month's payment >> was not the same as that month's pledge total. > To be clear, I am saying that we should use both Robert's and Michael's > visions, but on separate pages. Robert's "Where did my money go?" is > payment history. If we allow a page to be JUST payment history, that > page can be as simple as we please. It can skip months and provide > opaque totals. It does not need to carefully explain each month's > pledge/crowdmatch activity. It has just one purpose. > > With that out of the way, we can provide a more robust pledge history, > which is Michael's "effective explanation of *why* history payments > were what they were". Pledge history will *include* payment history. > But the user won't be forced to parse payment history out of pledge > history. Payment history information will be separately available in > unambiguous simplicity. This will allow that information to FACILITATE > the explanation of pledge history, rather than be dependent on it. > > I agree with mray that we need a simple, clear, unambiguous description > of payment history, and I agree with Msiep that such information is not > sufficient for selling Snowdrift to the world at large — and the whole > is greater than the sum of its parts. Sounds good to me. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Design mailing list Design@lists.snowdrift.coop https://lists.snowdrift.coop/mailman/listinfo/design
Re: [Snowdrift-design] "History" or "Payment History" page content
On 29.08.2016 22:27, Michael Siepmann wrote: > On 08/29/2016 01:45 PM, mray wrote: > >> The last meeting made clear we need to settle on what we expect the page >> to do for a user. >> >> My impression was always that MVP needs a page to satisfy the basic need >> of people to see where there money goes in a system that is really "half >> baked". There may be more need for many other visualizations, but for >> this one it boils down to: >> >> "Where did my money go?" >> >> (Aaron supposed to rename the tab to "Payment History" to somewhat >> clarify its purpose.) >> >> @Michael: >> What is your opinion on that matter? - What do you think the MVP page >> should do for the user. > > I think it includes "Where did my money go?" but also, importantly, > "What's been happening with my pledges?". People will pledge on > Snowdrift.coop because they want to support projects, so it's important > for the history page to show them what's happened each month with regard > to their support for projects, whether or not any of their money went > anywhere that month. I don't know what you mean by "happening" in the question: "What's been happening with my pledges?" We don't decide what happens with money, but maybe you mean what your current relation to projects you support/not support? Giving money away is all there happens, the how & why should not be explained via accounting. To me this feels like "Reverse engineering" that might shed light on what our mechanism is. Having a dedicated page to approach this issue seems a better solution. I understand that the question "What's been happening with my pledges?" can arise *nevertheless* and people may indeed find themselves trying to understand it while looking at the payment history. But if we accept the challenge to explain the mechanism there, it comes at the cost of more complexity. This opposes our efforts to keep things simple; the mechanism and its explanation. > > I don't think it's OK in mid-May 2016, for example, as illustrated in > the attached, to have the history tell them nothing about April and > March other than that spending got carried over because the payment > processing fee would make up more than 10%. Agreed. This can be a problem. But all information is present always – only in the "Matches" tab. Linking there would make sense in the case of the last month being a carryover-month. Any other month can not suffer that problem. > >> I think any discussion about page mockups only makes sense in the >> specific context of what needs to be solved by them. >> > > Agreed. > > signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Design mailing list Design@lists.snowdrift.coop https://lists.snowdrift.coop/mailman/listinfo/design
Re: [Snowdrift-design] "History" or "Payment History" page content
On 08/29/2016 02:35 PM, Aaron Wolf wrote: > On 08/29/2016 01:27 PM, Michael Siepmann wrote: >> On 08/29/2016 01:45 PM, mray wrote: >> >>> The last meeting made clear we need to settle on what we expect the page >>> to do for a user. >>> >>> My impression was always that MVP needs a page to satisfy the basic need >>> of people to see where there money goes in a system that is really "half >>> baked". There may be more need for many other visualizations, but for >>> this one it boils down to: >>> >>> "Where did my money go?" >>> >>> (Aaron supposed to rename the tab to "Payment History" to somewhat >>> clarify its purpose.) >>> >>> @Michael: >>> What is your opinion on that matter? - What do you think the MVP page >>> should do for the user. >> I think it includes "Where did my money go?" but also, importantly, >> "What's been happening with my pledges?". People will pledge on >> Snowdrift.coop because they want to support projects, so it's important >> for the history page to show them what's happened each month with regard >> to their support for projects, whether or not any of their money went >> anywhere that month. >> >> I don't think it's OK in mid-May 2016, for example, as illustrated in >> the attached, to have the history tell them nothing about April and >> March other than that spending got carried over because the payment >> processing fee would make up more than 10%. >> >>> I think any discussion about page mockups only makes sense in the >>> specific context of what needs to be solved by them. >>> >> Agreed. >> >> > I think two pages for "payment history" and "pledge history" should be > considered. They each solve separate questions: (A) "where did my money > go?" and (B) "How does this crowdmatch thing work in terms of my place > in it and the projects I support?" (i.e. understand the system via > reviewing your history as a patron). Both do seem relevant to MVP. > Combining them may make it harder than designing to separately answer > each question… > I don't see that they're so distinct. If we completely remove "what happened with my pledges?" from the "payment history" view then all that's left is a list of credit card charges. That really only answers "how much of my money went, and when?" but leaves out "where". We can't answer "where" without showing how pledges, payment fees, and carryovers (when applicable) led to the amount charged. I'm not convinced that "How does this crowdmatch thing work" is really a suitable purpose to assign to the history. Certainly it should ideally help you understand it if you don't already. But the primary purpose is to show you want happened in your specific case, over the past months. If we wanted a compact view that really is just "how much, when", then we could potentially have a checkbox at the top of the page that optionally hides everything except the amount charged each month, collapsing each month-box in a view like https://snowdrift.sylphs.net/seafhttp/files/4dc06a75-af0f-4577-99da-b501c00b4f12/website_mvp_dashboard_history_MSiep1.4.svg.png. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Design mailing list Design@lists.snowdrift.coop https://lists.snowdrift.coop/mailman/listinfo/design
[Snowdrift-design] "History" or "Payment History" page content
The last meeting made clear we need to settle on what we expect the page to do for a user. My impression was always that MVP needs a page to satisfy the basic need of people to see where there money goes in a system that is really "half baked". There may be more need for many other visualizations, but for this one it boils down to: "Where did my money go?" (Aaron supposed to rename the tab to "Payment History" to somewhat clarify its purpose.) @Michael: What is your opinion on that matter? - What do you think the MVP page should do for the user. I think any discussion about page mockups only makes sense in the specific context of what needs to be solved by them. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Design mailing list Design@lists.snowdrift.coop https://lists.snowdrift.coop/mailman/listinfo/design
