one. =)
D'oh! That's what I get for reading too fast.
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Current network information is available from the kernel and doesn't
require guessing. Why would you code something to talk to some random
daemon API (that may change) when you could talk directly to the source
via the kernel netlink API?
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of NM being able to go away is for static configurations, such
as servers, where there are no interfaces that don't exist. If it
matters, it is up, and there's already plenty of library access to DNS.
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of servers (with untold numbers of VMs), or any
complicated networking setups, are going to each have their network
configuration managed by a GUI?
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Once upon a time, Brendan Conoboy b...@redhat.com said:
Or does it mean x86 as PA is out of line? There are a lot more
people with ARM devices than x86. Sorry everybody, we're going to
have to demote x86. ;-)
And how many of those ARM devices are supported by Fedora ARM?
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Once upon a time, Richard W.M. Jones rjo...@redhat.com said:
Why?
http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/Fedora/19/html/Release_Notes/sect-Release_Notes-Changes_for_Sysadmin.html#idm263811933136
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irritating.
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Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering mzerq...@0pointer.de said:
(also: journalctl doesn't truncate lines when doing auto-paging)
It most certainly does, at least on an up-to-date F18 system. The
truncation behavior is even DIFFERENT between journalctl and
journalctl -f modes!
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Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering mzerq...@0pointer.de said:
On Mon, 15.07.13 16:31, Chris Adams (li...@cmadams.net) wrote:
Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering mzerq...@0pointer.de said:
(also: journalctl doesn't truncate lines when doing auto-paging)
It most certainly does
Once upon a time, Matthew Miller mat...@fedoraproject.org said:
On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 04:22:43PM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
So I went and tried journalctl, and immediately hit the same UI
stupidity as systemctl. Truncated lines, auto-paging, etc., unless I
pipe to something else
Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering mzerq...@0pointer.de said:
On Mon, 15.07.13 16:38, Chris Adams (li...@cmadams.net) wrote:
And, despite your statement to the contrary, journalctl (without -f)
does truncate long lines. The difference is that journalctl just
chops them off, while
either set, and I get
the same behavior.
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Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering mzerq...@0pointer.de said:
On Mon, 15.07.13 16:42, Chris Adams (li...@cmadams.net) wrote:
I assume you mean arrow key to the right, but that doesn't work when I
run journalctl. I get No next file (and No previous file for
left-arrow).
Yes
Once upon a time, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek zbys...@in.waw.pl said:
On Mon, Jul 15, 2013 at 05:43:43PM -0500, Chris Adams wrote:
No, the bug is journalctl, not less. If I run journalctl | less, I
get wrapped lines. If I run journalctl, I get truncated lines
(despite your repeated claims
that if somebody thought that was an important default, the
log format would have been updated years ago when rsyslog became the
default.
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, which can be shared among instances. Written log files cannot.
If it isn't too much of a thread-drift - this brings to mind another
question: how are the journal files rotated, archived, etc.? I don't
see anything in the man page.
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a journald.conf now. Another thing that would be
nice to add to the man page. Now that I know about it, I see the SEE
ALSO, but most things have a FILES section for that type stuff.
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/messages that can't be used for real logs with rsyslog.
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, and should not be done in regular programs.
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that. Even on other Unix OSes with a
/bin-/usr/bin symlink, all the shell scripts referenced /bin/sh.
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Once upon a time, Reindl Harald h.rei...@thelounge.net said:
Am 16.07.2013 22:18, schrieb Chris Adams:
#!/bin/sh is the cannonical first line for a Bourne(-compatible) shell
script, and nothing should change that. Even on other Unix OSes with a
/bin-/usr/bin symlink, all the shell scripts
or the high way.
That is Lennart's standard behavior.
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ntpdate for a long time
now, so I have no problem with it going away. However, while the
proposal subject is to remove ntpdate, you then go into changing the way
ntpd is used, which is bad (and not obvious from the subject).
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Once upon a time, Lennart Poettering mzerq...@0pointer.de said:
On Wed, 17.07.13 07:57, Chris Adams (li...@cmadams.net) wrote:
Once upon a time, Marc Deop i Argemí m...@marcdeop.com said:
That terribly sounds like my way or the high way.
That is Lennart's standard behavior
else. You just have to assume somebody
is telling the truth and move forward.
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)
If the root filesystem is ext4, you could use the last write time as a
starting point.
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-standard install; chrony is in the
Standard group in comps.
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systemd should NOT provide syslog, since it is not providing a syslog
service (it is an alternate system logging setup that can receive
messages via the syslog socket). That virtual provides makes it harder
for people that want a syslog service.
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importantly, those packages are creating their own logfiles and
have nothing to do with syslog and therefore nothing to do with this
proposal
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this with FUSE, it would be a
hack, and it would also interfere with other logs under /var/log that
are not syslog-related.
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something that handles the syslog() library call (and
so /dev/log) to be enough of the traditional Unix core that it shouldn't
need a requires.
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the journalctl output, options, etc.
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functionality.
Well, you are wanting two different things: a clock manager and a
one-shot NTP server tester.
You could always use check_ntp from Nagios plugins for the one-shot. :)
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some kind of issue with Red Hat and its employees. I
don't know (or really care) why, but please stop throwing rocks at them
on the Fedora mailing lists.
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Once upon a time, Jóhann B. Guðmundsson johan...@gmail.com said:
On 07/22/2013 06:52 PM, Chris Adams wrote:
Once upon a time, Jóhann B. Guðmundsson johan...@gmail.com said:
On 07/22/2013 03:38 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
On Mon, Jul 22, 2013 at 02:28:52PM +, Jóhann B. Guðmundsson wrote
to touch them again for a long
time.
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with additional configuration, and that
configuration will vary widely between setups and MTAs.
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sponsors, we can achieve great things.
If that doesn't agree with your goals, then IMHO you should find another
distribution.
This will be my only post in this thread.
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patched it.
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=465859
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reports logs files as using twice as much space.
How is _anything_ (programs, users, admins) supposed to know how much
free space is left on btrfs? This behavior seems like an admin's
nightmare.
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and
install additional packages. Core hasn't changed much in a while; if
you want vim-enhanced (vim-minimal is in Core), screen, etc., then
install more than just Core.
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. I'm not sure why it wasn't just orphaned, since AFAIK
it still works, still maintained, and there's no direct replacement.
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root) that doesn't match the login user for this TTY; on Linux this
can be as easy as the following bit of bash:
local user=
if [ $UID != 0 -a ! -O /proc/self/fd/0 ]; then
user='\u@'
fi
PS1=$user'\h \W\$ '
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with Github. It is SourceForge
2.0 as far as I can tell, and I'm sure something will come along
eventually and replace it as the new hotness. I can see putting
projects that even might have some non-Fedora interest on
non-Fedora-hosted platforms, if only to try to attract other interest.
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on Windows
before it does anything. How could a default install of a DHCP
service possibly know what to do without configuration?
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vendor
that I think helped write some of the UEFI spec - I need to bug him on
that one. :)
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available (or planned)?
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anyway built into the kernel is slightly more efficient and more
convenient.
If we have a split between filesystems between products, then it
probably doesn't make sense to build any of them into the kernel
anymore (well, assuming they all use the same kernel RPMs).
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with only a root user
created).
Fedora still allows root SSH logins by default; how is that more secure
than the console?
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of the code, and other system
tools will still use the bzip2 library.
I think the right way to move forward is to make a library that is at
least API-compatible with the current libbz2.so.1, make all the tools
use it, and just replace bzip2 with lbzip2.
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Once upon a time, quickbooks office quickbooks.off...@gmail.com said:
This change will not affect logging into the console using the local
account and then doing su to get root privileges.
The only local account on many (most?) systems with network
authentication is root.
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needed
it), it really is a meaningless check.
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Once upon a time, Paul Wouters p...@nohats.ca said:
On Wed, 9 Apr 2014, Chris Adams wrote:
Once upon a time, Matthew Miller mat...@fedoraproject.org said:
On Wed, Apr 09, 2014 at 10:20:36PM +0200, Lennart Poettering wrote:
[technical reasoning snipped]
Hence: please let's just remove
(because of license),
and perl linked with libdb-6, mod_perl would be broken.
If there are any conflicts because of the license incompatibility, then
moving to libdb-6 may not be a good idea.
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server that will work, there may be
private DNS info not available anywhere else, etc.
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Once upon a time, Bruno Wolff III br...@wolff.to said:
The advantage of using your dns server is that you know what you're
getting.
You'll also lose almost all content-delivery network advantages (most of
that is mapped to close servers with DNS).
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is that it is fairly tolerant to dataloss.
Yes, and there are multiple solutions to that issue. TCP syslog,
rsyslog's replication protocol, etc. It would be good if systemd could
use or extend an existing logging protocol, rather than invent yet
another method.
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, much like sql injection. In those cases,
one could craft URLs to run wget or any other tool that may help the
intruder get even more inside.
Down that path lies madness. Are you going to remove /bin/sh? If not,
virtually anything else is possible.
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can remove network access,
remove local write access, etc. However, that is separate from removing
arbitrary binaries from the system/image. Removing non-privileged
binaries from the image does _nothing_ for security (as claimed
up-thread).
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other part of the system, not the binary.
I can (unless severely locked down, which is difficult-to-impossible to
do in practice) download another non-privileged binary and achieve the
same privilege escalation.
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to and show how it is wrong.
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).
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that are
needed is not practical.
Spending a whole bunch of effort to allow you to remove systemd (again,
just the files, it isn't running) seems excessive. There are some basic
things that RPMs expect; installing a service expects that the service
management tools are present.
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Once upon a time, Reindl Harald h.rei...@thelounge.net said:
however, thank you to show me that any discussion with you is worthless
Right back at you.
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that, the PATH order shouldn't
matter.
To the OP: I'd suggest checking your .bash_profile to see if something
has changed the PATH there.
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bother again
about $PATH orders and namespace collisions...
As I said before, there's still some consolehelper stuff that requires
entries in both /usr/bin and /usr/sbin to work.
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with the licenses of software already using BDB-5.
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interest
in forking libdb-5 (or just picking up maintenance if/when upstream
drops it).
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with iptables, rather than
forking sshd processes only to close the connection.
Also, if you want, you can configure fail2ban with escalating length
blocks (so first offense is 5 minutes, then 3 strikes gets you an
hour, etc.).
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to the number of x86 machines that can
run F20.
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the name.
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haven't wanted to remove all the kernels in a while (I guess since
before this was added); is the only way to bypass yum and use rpm?
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request that you really
want to do that.
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be based on the number of
affected dependent packages (and/or maybe a percentage of installed
packages).
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in the setterm man page to stop it.
:-(
Are you calling it from your .bashrc? A simple thing like this should
do (basically, only run setterm when connected to /dev/tty[0-9]*):
tty=$(tty)
[ $tty != ${tty#/dev/tty[0-9]} ] setterm your setterm args
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in a network
environment, having differing versions of UID_MIN (where recompilation
is required to change) is just wrong. As the message above sys, yes,
that is actually used and needed. I see no valid justification for
removing that functionality.
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, as his playing field is significantly reduced.
There's very little he can do.”
How is that different from an SELinux policy? How is the additional
resitrction handled (if it isn't SELinux, what mechanism is used to do
the restriction)?
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of /usr/lib/systemd/system?).
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, with an
rsync-service subpackage that has all the systemd integration.
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Once upon a time, Josh Boyer jwbo...@gmail.com said:
Would you be willing to craft a patch and send it to the rsync
maintainer to do that?
I believe (later in this thread) someone said that has already been
done, as rsync-daemon.
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a problem with _any_ company with corporate involvement with
Fedora having the same ability to say this email is no longer valid
and triggering an immediate unresponsive maintainer process. It is
just that Red Hat is the prime example.
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it is time to knock it down and start over).
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this be handled through the alternatives system, so that
admins could choose bash vs. dash vs. whatever? In theory now, /bin/sh
is not as critical to system startup with systemd (although I expect
there are still scripts that called in various places).
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/bash).
In general, I am pretty sure that except a couple of programming
language or UNIX aficionades very few people can actually correctly
separate bashisms from true bourneshellisms.
It isn't that hard.
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/Ubuntu (and *BSD, etc.). The remaining scripts are largely going
to be Fedora-specific, and that's not nearly as big of pile of code as
you imply.
It is also funny to hear the systemd author talk about not breaking
things and creating lots of work.
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Unix-like systems (e.g. *BSD, Solaris, etc.) have
ever used bash as /bin/sh.
To say it is a lot of work or is going to break the world, the
requirement for proof is on you.
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for the
POSIX-compliant scripting shell on Unix-like systems.
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?
To be fair, portable programs wrap GCCisms in #ifdefs.
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stop caching man pages at all, or at
least make that functionality optional (and non-default)?
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). The RPM maintainers as well as Perl
maintainers seems to be in favor of this change.
One other thing to check for is spec files that use perl (maybe when the
resulting package does not). I know I've written spec files that use
perl to fix things and what not.
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). There is no reason for any other permissions.
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policies, so please stop bringing up that red
herring.
Security-by-obscurity also doesn't help setuid binaries in the normal
install paths (e.g. /usr/bin), because an attack could easily just
switch over to metadata (file size, timestamps, etc.).
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Once upon a time, Florian Weimer fwei...@redhat.com said:
Do we even use the DHCP NTP server assignment?
I believe it is used for chrony and ntpd, don't know about sysmted's new
implementation.
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Once upon a time, Tomasz Torcz to...@pipebreaker.pl said:
On Wed, Nov 26, 2014 at 08:01:37AM -0600, Chris Adams wrote:
Once upon a time, Florian Weimer fwei...@redhat.com said:
Do we even use the DHCP NTP server assignment?
I believe it is used for chrony and ntpd, don't know about
(always helpful to
include)? Are you linking with -lm (the math library)?
Also, just FYI: this list is intended for developing Fedora, not really
developing _on_ Fedora (so unless you are working on F21 or rawhide, you
should use us...@lists.fedoraproject.org in the future).
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, you just use spamassassin directly.
Aside from that, I don't know if someone has set up socket activation
for anything in perl. I guess it is using file descriptor passing? I
haven't done that in perl before (although shouldn't be too hard).
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.
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