Re: [DDN] Re: The digital divide and the idea of public computing
Taran, You've clearly described one technical outworking of the idea of public computing. There was an influential book some years ago titled IDEAS HAVE CONSEQUENCES. We need technical outworkings of the idea of public computing such as you propose. Perhaps we need separate attention to how we get attention and support for the idea of public, rather than private and personal, computing. To pick a controversial example: I go to Ghana on March 9 . Everywhere in Ghana, and Africa in general, religion is exploding. Churches and mosques springing up everywhere, with clergy and congregations committed to public service as well as to faith. These churches often have connections to world networks of their denomination; many of the churches in the richer countries provide support of various kinds for the emerging churches in the Third World. If those churches could be influenced to see themselves as part of the answer to the digital divide, we might find computers and training and software and maintenance installed in little churches in the Third World. The larger question becomes: how do we get churches, and schools, and libraries, and NGO's to see that they have a role in shrinking the digital divide, and becoming the scene of public computing? Steve Eskow [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: The Digital Divide Network discussion group [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, February 28, 2005 9:33 PM Subject: [DDN] Re: The digital divide and the idea of public computing Steve Eskow wrote: A hypotheis: The digital divide will not be solved by personal computers, and the emphasis on private ownership of the new communication technologies, but by the social comnputesr, computers shared by many people in a public setting. The intention of the terminology is to switch some attention away from the box, container of the new technology--the center, as in :telecenter--and to raise connsciousness of the need for sharing the technology and its maintenance. If there is merit to this proposition,--if we need to talk of publci computing much in the same way that we advocate for public transportation, then our Digital Divide Network might take leadership in creating the new discou\rse that emphasizes the sharing and collaborative use of the new technologies. The public computer can be in a school, an office, a library, a business, a church, or a van. Where it is housed will of course depend on the variables of community and culture: in some cases one computer in a church basement will be the center, in another there will many machines and staff. Perhaps we need a $500 dollar public computer more than we need a $100 private computer. Steve Eskow [EMAIL PROTECTED] You exactly described a content management system/community weblog as a social computer - which it is! Because you're not staring at it in your office or home doesn't make it less of a computer. $15 for a domain name in most parts of the world (less in some), figure up to $300 hosting fees for a year. It's as public as you want it to be. The trick is having it easily accessible for the community - and this can be done very cheaply with the Linux Terminal Server Project (LTSP), which allows a central server to 'drive' lower end machines for this purpose. Low cost hardware, low cost software. Run some wires and you're almost done. Then we're left with connecting the LTSP server to the social computer - the server. That's really the biggest problem around the world - and that's the common denominator. P.S. All over the commercial world, people are going crazy about the 'Desktop'. Folks, the desktop is nowhere near as important as the Server - no matter what anyone tells you. In a lot of ways, the computer you are reading this on is probably what would have been called a server a few years ago. I'm not saying that the desktop is dead - by no stretch. What I am saying is that the desktop is now the server. And the server aspect of your computer is the most important aspect right now - as are the internet servers we avail ourselves of. -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net Criticize by creating. Michelangelo -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.5.2 - Release Date: 2/28/2005 ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message. ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
[DDN] Tampa region meetup? [was Re: [WWWEDU] DDN Boston Meetup Group]
I'm in Florida for at least another week. Anyone around the Tampa area for a meetup? From there, I'll be in the Caribbean. Perhaps a few will happen down there. -- Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linuxgazette.com http://www.a42.com http://www.knowprose.com http://www.easylum.net Criticize by creating. Michelangelo ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
[DDN] World Bank draft report on digital divide online (fwd)
fyi... -ac To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: bcc: Subject:[WSIS CS-Plenary] World Bank draft report on digital divide online Ralf Bendrath [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 03/01/2005 04:57 PM CET Please respond to plenary font size=-1/font The report was released as a draft yesterday and is available at http://info.worldbank.org/ict/. Probably a reaction to the reuters story, otherwise they would not release a draft, would they? Interesting paragraph from the press release: But even with greater private involvement, gaps will remain. Two competing assumptions regarding the buildout of information and communications infrastructure (ICI) in developing countries are that 'the private sector alone is enough' and 'the government must take the lead role.' In fact, both have crucial roles to play, states Mohsen Khalil, Director of the World Bank Group's Global ICT Department, in the preface to the report. Ralf ___ Plenary mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://mailman.greennet.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/plenary ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] Re: The digital divide and the idea of public computing
Taran, you've found and stated all the issues and objections to using churches as telecenters. Just a few comments. As you point out, religion separates people. And: Schooling separates people. Politics separates people. Tradition separates people. Income separates people. Geography separates people. Language separates people: perhaps we should insist that all who want to cross that divide learn a common language. English? In brief, all of the aspect of that amorphous stuff we call culture separates people So: if we are realists, we begin with the world as it is--separated--and not how we would like to remake it in our own image of what a better world would be like.. That is: if those now on the wrong side of the digital divide are already separated, and we care about doing something substantial about that divide, we can denounce the separation, propose new institutional forms of togetherness (which in short order will also separate people), or we can begin by recognizing these islands of separation and asking how we can work with them so as to make a difference.. That is: we work with schools, although they separate people into those groups that can pay tuition and those that can't. We put public computers in libraries, although libraries--and computers--separate people into those that can read and those that can't, and tend to put resources like computers where they benefit the readers and leave the nonreaders untouched. We put computers into churches, and hope (some of us) that we can use those computers to begin to encourage interfaith dialog as well as economic development. I do want to challenge your reliance on an Ayn Randian version of the human condition: In the end, I really think that the Digital Divide can only be bridged by individuals acting in their own interest - taking ownership of their lives. When it comes to infrastructural issues, governments are responsible - but in any democracy, ultimately the individual is responsible. This is actually Randian in a way, but I think it's respectful To be equally direct: it is this crude philosophy of every man or woman for himself/herself that is the problem, not the solution. There is much dying in Africa from AIDS, to pick one social problem where computers and churches can make a difference, and the dying will not stop by urging a kind of crude capitalist ideal of selfishness. The genius of the computer is that it is the first dialogic medium in history, unlike the broadcast media such as television. The computer makes it possible for people in Trinidad to converse easily with people in California, so that they become a group, a potential collaborative. You and I are separated: by age, experience, education, nationality, perhaps race and religion, or nonreligion. We can't wait until those cultural differences are set aside to begin to search for ways to work together. I appreciate your willingness to take clear and strong positions: that willingness makes for good challenge and response.. Steve Eskow [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Taran Rampersad [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Steve Eskow [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: The Digital Divide Network discussion group [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 1:06 PM Subject: Re: [DDN] Re: The digital divide and the idea of public computing Steve Eskow wrote: Taran, You've clearly described one technical outworking of the idea of public computing. There was an influential book some years ago titled IDEAS HAVE CONSEQUENCES. I shall have to find this book and read it. We need technical outworkings of the idea of public computing such as you propose. Perhaps we need separate attention to how we get attention and support for the idea of public, rather than private and personal, computing. To pick a controversial example: I go to Ghana on March 9 . Everywhere in Ghana, and Africa in general, religion is exploding. Churches and mosques springing up everywhere, with clergy and congregations committed to public service as well as to faith. No puns intended, I'm sure. These churches often have connections to world networks of their denomination; many of the churches in the richer countries provide support of various kinds for the emerging churches in the Third World. If those churches could be influenced to see themselves as part of the answer to the digital divide, we might find computers and training and software and maintenance installed in little churches in the Third World. The larger question becomes: how do we get churches, and schools, and libraries, and NGO's to see that they have a role in shrinking the digital divide, and becoming the scene of public computing? Sorry about the long response. This is a topic I have actually thought about quite a bit. I don't think I wrote anything offensive (it's hard to tell on religious topics), so if I did, please understand that it was not intentional. Now that I have
[DDN] admin: please don't cc members when replying
Hi everyone, When replying to messages on the list, please don't cc the person who wrote the original message. Not to single you guys out, Taran, Steve Eskow and John Hibbs, but your recent posts have been cc'ed to each other, and you're replying faster than I can post. Also, they are not appearing on the list in the order you wrote them, because mailman's admin interface doesn't show them to me chronologically. This makes your conversations hard to follow. So please pace your conversations by posting to the list only; otherwise, please post off-list only. thanks, ac -- --- Andy Carvin Program Director EDC Center for Media Community acarvin @ edc . org http://www.digitaldivide.net http://www.tsunami-info.org Blog: http://www.andycarvin.com --- ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] Research on Community Technology needs - request for links to articles
In the Fall of 2001 PolicyLink (www.policylink.org) published a report titled Bridging the Organizational Divide: Toward a Comprehensive Approach to the Digital Divide. It may still be on their web site. The gist of this was that non profits are further behind business in strategic uses of technology because of a lack of funds to invest in innovation. That would be most true in small non profits where there may be great ideas, but there are few dollars and not enough volunteer hours or talent to implement the great ideas. Dan Bassill Tutor/Mentor Connection www.tutormentorconference.bigstep.com on 2/28/05 10:53 AM, Toby Beresford at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone have any useful links to research on the technology needs of small local community organisations (~$25k turnover)? The sort of thing I am looking for (and these are all made up statistics!) are: i.e. 35% of US local non-profits have their own web site/ 75% use email i.e. 80% of youth clubs in Toronto are now online although only 11% send out a newsletter to supporters, and 1% manage their organisation online. i.e. The top technology priorities for local residents associations in the UK are Email account, Internet cafe, web site, ICT training, online fundraising tools. All links / articles gratefully accepted - you'll even get a thank you mention in our monthly newsletter! If there's a lot that come in I'll be happy to add them as a list on the Community Technology part of the digitaldividenetwork site too so others can benefit from them Thanks Toby ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] Yale Global Flow of Information Conference - Apr.1-3, 2005
Dr. Eskow: Are you saying that reviewing the text of the proposed lecture - or keynote speech - in advance of same is a bad idea? Are you also saying that in today's college (100) classes it is NOT common that there is little or no Question and Answer by the students of the person at the lectern? If on the second question, you disagree, I encourage you to visit Eugene and see what I have frequently seen here on the Oregon campus. As to the first question, if you are opposed to the idea of students or conference attendees reviewing the materials in advance, then perhaps you could delineate supporting arguments why this is a bad idea? Please try to be direct and on-point. None of us need a reminder there are no silver bullets --- Most of us, even outside of the robed world, gave up on silver bullets at about age 12. However, we do happen to believe that the new tools offer new opportunities; and these should not be easily or quickly disregarded just because they come from people who don't wear robes and headgear of high distinction. At 9:44 AM -0800 2/8/05, Steve Eskow wrote: Mr. Hibbs is apparently confused by my gender as well as by the dynamics of good instruction: perhaps the lady doth protest too much? He asked: and answered his own question: Would the students (attendees) have learned more if they had listened, in advance, to the lecture at a time convenient to them? Or if they had read the text commentary and looked at the links provided - all well in advance of the physical meeting place? ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] Re: The digital divide and the idea of public computing
Steve Eskow wrote: Taran, You've clearly described one technical outworking of the idea of public computing. There was an influential book some years ago titled IDEAS HAVE CONSEQUENCES. I shall have to find this book and read it. We need technical outworkings of the idea of public computing such as you propose. Perhaps we need separate attention to how we get attention and support for the idea of public, rather than private and personal, computing. To pick a controversial example: I go to Ghana on March 9 . Everywhere in Ghana, and Africa in general, religion is exploding. Churches and mosques springing up everywhere, with clergy and congregations committed to public service as well as to faith. No puns intended, I'm sure. These churches often have connections to world networks of their denomination; many of the churches in the richer countries provide support of various kinds for the emerging churches in the Third World. If those churches could be influenced to see themselves as part of the answer to the digital divide, we might find computers and training and software and maintenance installed in little churches in the Third World. The larger question becomes: how do we get churches, and schools, and libraries, and NGO's to see that they have a role in shrinking the digital divide, and becoming the scene of public computing? Sorry about the long response. This is a topic I have actually thought about quite a bit. I don't think I wrote anything offensive (it's hard to tell on religious topics), so if I did, please understand that it was not intentional. Now that I have your attention... This is a tough topic, mainly because many religions - or better, many followers of religions - don't 'play well with' other religions. A look at the latest headlines in any part of the world confirms this. Using religious pretexts bothers me because of this. What happens if I live in a country where - for the sake of discussion - Paganism is the State religion (official or otherwise, does it really matter?) and I'm a Hindu. Must I become a Pagan to pull myself onto the other side of the Digital Divide? I cringe at the thought that people would even think of giving up their personal beliefs to simply get enough inductive kick to get to the other side of the Digital Divide. I'm a strong advocate for perseverance of culture and identity of the individual. Of course, that might be an interesting thing to look at - teledensity and religion. But what all of this does is it separates people. It's bad enough that there are enough denominations of major religions, where wars have been waged over differences of opinion of interpretation. Now, what might be nice is if the various religions in an area can bite their tongues in a geographic area long enough to get to know each other. And if the people of all these religions can get along and build something for the greater community, such that even an atheist would feel comfortable in going there, then we might have something. Sadly, I believe that this is unrealistic. I have lots of personal anecdotes on this, but none life threatening (knock on wood). There are parts of the world where even being a different religion is very similar to being a part of a different gang. On the flip side, community centers could be operated with funding from various religious institutions as long as they don't consider the land 'Holy'. In the end, I really think that the Digital Divide can only be bridged by individuals acting in their own interest - taking ownership of their lives. When it comes to infrastructural issues, governments are responsible - but in any democracy, ultimately the individual is responsible. This is actually Randian in a way, but I think it's respectful. The Digital Divide has individual context for each one of us - from expensive Wi-Fi in Parisian hotels to not even having access in parts of Africa. One of the things that has struck me in my latest travels is bandwidth; in Trinidad and Tobago I paid about $100 US/month for a phone and 256 ADSL (which is very undependable, shame on the government monopoly). On the flip side, I stayed at a Howard Johnson in Hialaea, Miami, and had more bandwidth than I could shake a stick at. I am writing this using my mother's Verizon DSL, and it still amazes me at how fast stuff happens. When I get back to the Caribbean next week, I shall be very disappointed. But it's that disappointment that drives - we have to strive to expect more in many parts of the world. Where 256K ADSL is crappy in Trinidad and Tobago, nobody has effectively voiced the problems there. They just live with it, and even the leaders in ICT from the region don't publicly expect better from the governmental monopoly. 5 years of promises about the privatization of the telecommunications industry will stretch into 6, maybe even 10, because people just don't expect anything better. I think that this paralysis is one of the greatest problems of the
Re: [DDN] APT Calls for Restoration of TOP Funding
In a message dated 3/1/05 9:24:12 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Who are the key Senators APT is working with on 06 TOP line item? Which Republicans? Sen. Durbin from IL is on Appropriations Committee, and thus we would like a copy of letter and timing of hearings. These are three of the people · Senator Conrad Burns (R-MT), United States Senate, for his authorship of Section 706 of the Telecommunications Act, and his leadership in promoting advanced telecommunications capability to improve life in rural areas and revitalize communities across the nation. He was just honored for this work. These two are also Carolyn Breedlove, Senior Professional Associate, National Education Association, \ Raul Yzaguirre, National Council of La Raza, There were some wonderful applications of public technology, that were funded by TOPS that were featured on 2/11/ as examples of what has been done. I should have typed them in.. but I am in Phoenix and the reports are in Washington. I copied Karen Buller to the discussion, because she may be able to locate the descriptions of the projects shown and shared at the meeting. Capsule La Raza , helping Hispanics to gain home ownership by leading them through the paperwork. Edgewood Terrace - That is a special project in which the whole community is connected and working on line. There is a doctor who has trained people in a part of Georgia, to react to victims of stroke, and to get them treatment within that special time that keeps them alive and able to live. There was a report of the fact that Native Americans are under funded and that there are possibilities that this is the kind of ... funding that would help. Karen can give you more information on this. Accessibility for the handicapped was also an issue. I am sure that Karen will connect you to the APT people who can give you more information. [EMAIL PROTECTED] AOL would not let me send the mail to undisclosed recipients so , Please resend. Bonnie Bracey bbracey at aol com ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
Re: [DDN] Research on Community Technology needs - request for links to articles
I would be grateful also if anyone would be able to share information along these lines. Oliver Moran --- Digital Media Centre Dublin Institute of Technology on 2/28/05 10:53 AM, Toby Beresford at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Does anyone have any useful links to research on the technology needs of small local community organisations (~$25k turnover)? The sort of thing I am looking for (and these are all made up statistics!) are: i.e. 35% of US local non-profits have their own web site/ 75% use email i.e. 80% of youth clubs in Toronto are now online although only 11% send out a newsletter to supporters, and 1% manage their organisation online. i.e. The top technology priorities for local residents associations in the UK are Email account, Internet cafe, web site, ICT training, online fundraising tools. All links / articles gratefully accepted - you'll even get a thank you mention in our monthly newsletter! If there's a lot that come in I'll be happy to add them as a list on the Community Technology part of the digitaldividenetwork site too so others can benefit from them Thanks Toby -- This message has been scanned for content and viruses by the DIT Information Services MailScanner Service, and is believed to be clean. http://www.dit.ie ___ DIGITALDIVIDE mailing list DIGITALDIVIDE@mailman.edc.org http://mailman.edc.org/mailman/listinfo/digitaldivide To unsubscribe, send a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word UNSUBSCRIBE in the body of the message.
