Re: Fw: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-20 Thread Jan Erik Moström
Paola Kathuria [EMAIL PROTECTED] 08-01-19 16.00 behalf of PPIG admin, I don't think anyone's gonna object! I would ... I wouldn't visit yet another forum, takes way too much time. jem -- Jan Erik Moström, www.mostrom.pp.se

Re: Fw: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-20 Thread Robin Jeffries
+1 Robin On Jan 20, 2008 12:14 PM, Jan Erik Moström [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Paola Kathuria [EMAIL PROTECTED] 08-01-19 16.00 behalf of PPIG admin, I don't think anyone's gonna object! I would ... I wouldn't visit yet another forum, takes way too much time. jem -- Jan

Fw: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-19 Thread Richard Bartlett
- Original Message - From: Richard Bartlett [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Luke Church [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, January 18, 2008 10:57 PM Subject: Re: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be Hi PPIG people. This is a topic very dear to my heart at the moment,

Re: Fw: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-19 Thread Paola Kathuria
Richard Bartlett wrote: I think I would be tempted in more if the PPIG communications system wasn't so unattractive, inefficient and clunky.. why can't it be a normal bulletin board? Oh, but it can. PPIG has had two mailing lists since 1997; they're hosted for free by the company I used to

FW: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-18 Thread Walter Milner
I think Steven's analysis is very perceptive. A couple of comments 1. These are types of programming activity, not types of people. 2. Many people who carry out one of these activities during their career also engage in at least one other. I know quite a few people who work as IT consultants

FW: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-15 Thread Walter Milner
Here are a few assertions, all with no evidence 1. Java is an excellent language 2. Java is a product of a history of programming language design ideas which now stretches back around 50 years 3. If an undergrad with no previous knowledge of programming can get the idea of Java/OOP in a few

FW: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-15 Thread Walter Milner
Yes, and you can do the equivalent of malloc/calloc by asking for new arrays or whatever at run-time. The point is that the student should do this eg they should write their own implementations of a linked list, tree, stack etc before they use Sun's implementations of the container classes.

FW: PPIG discuss: Programmer education ain't what it used to be

2008-01-15 Thread Walter Milner
This highlights the issue of individual differences. I would guess most of those Cambridge undergrads got 3 (or 4) As at A level. I'm coming across American High School students who are being taught Java and can make no sense of it. I'm not really bothered about able students, who will