Re: [DNG] PC compatibility to non-Microsoft software

William C Vaughan wrote: > I have been flamed before because of my posts on this mailing list That's inexcusable. > I think that ultimately, EFF or the GNU folks will need to pursue lobbying > for legislation to prevent hardware companies from imposing restrictions

Re: [DNG] Runlevels (Was: Lead BusyBox developer on sysvinit)

Rainer Weikusat wrote: > The abstract definition of 'runlevel' is (as far as I'm aware of it): > "Set of processes supposed to be running". That's what I understand it to be. > Considering this, one can > safely conclude that whatever 'Dennys' did, he certainly

Re: [DNG] Systemd at work: rm -rf EFI

Jaromil wrote: > meanwhile, on the background, the usual bullying goes on among the > systemd hooligans, sarcastically liquidating the concern with some > cynical remarks, as if it would be a deserved punition for users > caught into a bricked laptop rather than an erased

Re: [DNG] Another multi-user issue

Rainer Weikusat wrote: > I'd still like an answer to this question: For the common use case of a > so-called "desktop system", why should system processes be hidden from > its owner by default unless said owner does something which is actively > discouraged, IOW,

[DNG] Ah, the joys of debugging SystemD

I thought having a "big binary blob" wasn't supposed to be a problem ;-) http://lists.xen.org/archives/html/xen-users/2016-04/msg00031.html > [Xen-users] Debian 8.4, EFI, and systemd = Tricky > ... > My problem is that it hangs when trying so init systemd on dom0 > ... > systemd is new to me. I

Re: [DNG] Delayed E-mails

Jim Murphy wrote: > Did anyone else notice that at about 0726 UTC today > the mail server, I believe, spit out 3 emails that have "been > in hiding" for a while. You are not alone in getting them. > If I'm reading the 3 attachments correctly, they were received > by the

Re: [DNG] ...and when trolling went too far

Boruch Baum wrote: > Sorry to ruin the party, but I'll object to it because its just not a > nice thing to do, and its an awful thing to mess up content on the fine > site that is wikipedia. +1 for that Regardless of what people think of him, it's not a grown up or pleasant

Re: [DNG] UEFI Secure Boot workaround?

Arnt Gulbrandsen <a...@gulbrandsen.priv.no> wrote: > Simon Hobson writes: >> Isn't it the bootloader that UEFI loads and runs, and as long as the >> bootloader (Grub) is signed, then UEFI should boot it and grub can boot >> anything you want. Kind of blasts th

Re: [DNG] UEFI Secure Boot workaround?

Arnt Gulbrandsen <a...@gulbrandsen.priv.no> wrote: > Simon Hobson writes: >> Not really, but I don't see any sign of that as a question in the post I was >> replying to ! > > You said secure boot's security is blown out of the water because it's > possible to ru

Re: [DNG] Digital camera management borked

Go Linux wrote: > As did mine. And then a genius of an udev developer took care of it and made > sure that the cameras ID_TYPE changed from "disk" to "generic", so no user > but root could use the camera. Now it works again, but ... Are, what you mean is "it worked until

Re: [DNG] Claywand dosplay bananager

Teodoro Santoni wrote: >> What did they replace X11 forwarding with? (I shudder to ask) > > Nothing afaik. That would be the "we don't use it, therefore we don't care if anyone else uses it - we'll just declare it broken behaviour and drop it" approach to backwards

Re: [DNG] X forwarding over SSH over ADSL (Was: Claywand dosplay bananager)

Rainer Weikusat wrote: >> I disagree. I've used remote X forwarding many times, and found it ran >> "quite nicely" with 400kbps upstream from my home ADSL. Obviously it >> depends what you are doing, and "graphics intensive" stuff slows >> enormously, but for

Re: [DNG] X forwarding over SSH over ADSL (Was: Claywand dosplay bananager)

Stephan Seitz wrote: > Äh, why do you need X11 forwarding for text work? For me text work is > shell/vi/mutt/screen. I’m using these programs daily without the need for X11 > forwarding. I don't, but sometimes it just happens that way. > And as far as I was

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

Steve Litt wrote: > Why this is important is that, to the extent this is perceived as an > age thing (with the must-have pejorative "neckbeard" or "graybeard"), > you give PoetterPoser more credibility when he characterizes systemd > resistance as "you can't teach an

Re: [DNG] ...and when trolling went too far

Boruch Baum wrote: > Sorry to ruin the party, but I'll object to it because its just not a > nice thing to do, and its an awful thing to mess up content on the fine > site that is wikipedia. +1 for that Regardless of what people think of him, it's not a grown up or pleasant

Re: [DNG] Printing -- now even pdf works. I have no idea why.

Gregory Nowak wrote: > On a related note, I recently had to replace my almost 20-year-old hp > laserJet 5l because the part that broke couldn't be replaced. So, I > replaced it with a samsung m28253dw. I was struggling to configure > everything how I wanted through a less than

Re: [DNG] Printing -- now even pdf works. I have no idea why.

Didier Kryn wrote: > You can configure cups through the web interface or by editing the config > files. Editing the config files is easy, apart from understanding the meaning > of the variables from their names. But there are howtos. For one-time actions > like resuming

Re: [DNG] Brief OpenRC/Jessie Discussion on the linux-elitists lists

emnin...@riseup.net wrote: > Please do not take my question wrong (probably i am missing something): > If it's that way, how can devuan then rely on debian as for packages > etc.? At least in a forseeable future ... ? The thing is that Debian is already there, pretty well complete, and the

Re: [DNG] OpenRC and Devuan

Mitt Green wrote: >> The current init system is old. Ancient. >> We should all agree on it. Devuan is looking >> for a new init system that is not systemd and my >> personal choice for this task from now on is >> Gentoo's OpenRC. > ‎ > Unix is old. Ancient. We should all

Re: [DNG] OpenRC and Devuan

Jaromil wrote: >> Instead of an openRC effort at this point, I'd rather see a hook >> for apt-get / aptitude / etc, to move all files specific to init >> systems not being used to their own file hierarchies, eg. >> >> /var/cache/init-systems >>/sysvinit >> /etc >>

Re: [DNG] Debian Wheezy LTS until 2018

KatolaZ wrote: > Many people have kept wheezy on their production > servers to see what happens with systemd in Jessie. And might prefer > to migrate to Devuan eventually, if it has proved to be a credible > option. Put me down in that camp. I've a lot of systems on

Re: [DNG] OT: Why I was away.

Edward Bartolo wrote: > Some may think I am insane, but sometimes even the company of a four > legged friend can be beneficial. Not at all, ours is just coming up to 2 year old now. It's fairly widely accepted that pets can be very therapeutic.

Re: [DNG] Supervision scripts

Rainer Weikusat wrote: > But leaving these two general remarks aside, I don't quite understand > what you wanted to express. That "freedom of choice" is very important - as demonstrated by two posts setting out the reason why (for the poster's situation) the

Re: [DNG] Why I was away.

Go Linux wrote: > At the risk of dragging on this OT thread longer than it would have lasted ... I can understand that you consider the topic inappropriate for the list. But generally I'd considered this list a friendly place, where a certain amount of 'banter' would be

Re: [DNG] OpenRC and Devuan (and Windows)

Steve Litt wrote: > There's a special place in hell for people using ambiguous > abbreviations, acronyms, and nicknames. You mean, like the whole IT industry - and in fact pretty well any industry ? Such terms are routinely used because they make speech and writing

Re: [DNG] apt-get vs. aptitude ?

dev wrote: > I was wondering if anyone could offer some clarity on how best to apply > patches on Debian derived systems? There are so many options across apt-get > and aptitude... I cannot make sense of them all: > > apt-get upgrade > apt-get dist-upgrade > apt-get

Re: [DNG] What do we want for ascii ?

Go Linux wrote: > This is putting the cart before the horse IMO. It would be nice to get the > beta out the door before focusing on ascii. Any chance some of that energy > could be directed towards the beta release? I'm kind-of on the fence here. Part of me is saying

Re: [DNG] booting old system on a different partition

Peter Olson wrote: > So I cleared out another partition and moved the backup of my Debian 8.3 onto > it. Ran update-grub, which found the backup in its new location. > > But, when I try to boot it grub is confused and is pinned to the old UUID of > the > root filesystem. (I

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is pointless

dev wrote: > I mention all this becuase I took the "deb 8" pinning challenge today > and it failed miserably. I tried something similar not long ago. It "almost" worked except that one component of Clamav that the server in question needs has a dependency on libsystemd0.

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > For completeness, I'll mention that, if a Debian 8 'Jessie' or Debian 9 > 'Stretch' system does end up suffering packager-caused intrusion of > systemd into important packages (for some value of 'important' ;-> ), > then I can confidently predict that

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: >> With a lib, is there any code or is it *JUST* a set of symbols ? > This is a pretty good introduction to how libraries work and what they > can contain: > http://www.skyfree.org/linux/references/ELF_Format.pdf Thanks, a bit heavy going for me at this

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

To expand a bit on what I wrote earlier - now it's finally condensed into something resembling a coherent thought. Suppose, with SystemD running they decided to break normal syslog calls. Ie, they made it so that a program could not call syslog, but instead had to use a SystemD call. Given the

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Hendrik Boom wrote: >> OK, so what makes libsystemd different from libc, which comes from the same >> source? libc is stored in the same directory on the same debian servers... > > It is a matter of trust, not of what is technically feasible. Exactly > Does one trust

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > I have a better question: Is there something about empiricism that many > people on this mailing list cannot cope with? > > Back when I had newly joined this mailing list and all of these idle > allegations and rhetorical questions started being posted,

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > If the above test works, and I strongly suspect it would, then it's > probably not hard to come up with smoother and more automatable ways. > However, if I _did_ need package clamav (which I don't), _and_ if I were > feeling paranoid about libsystemd0

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Steve Litt wrote: > Which brings us full circle. Simon doesn't want to keep playing these > games, wondering what kind of workaround he'll need next, as Lennart > decides to subsume yet another Linux functionality, or Debian's "DDs" > make yet another poor decision on

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > ... then I'll be replacing libsystemd0 with an 'equivs' > recipe about two minutes later. And won't you then find that all those packages with gratuitous libsystemd0 dependencies will stop working ? ___ Dng

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Arnt Gulbrandsen wrote: > A library can do anything the executable can. Which is what I thought. So when someone states that "it's just a library, it doesn't do anything" then that needs taking with a pinch of salt because once anything calls one of it's functions,

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

info at smallinnovations.nl wrote: >> Great, so answer me a question: How are you getting a system without >> libsystemd0 today? > Waiting for Devuan or using something else then Linux as i told in the part > of my message you did not quote. This. Plus in the

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

I wrote: > ... and in a place where "the IT world starts and ends with Windows" (or more > or less did when I started here) that's not a bad result. And bear in mind that when I started here and pointed out that as a Mac user, half of our internal systems didn't work properly* - the lead

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: >> OK, that's what I thought, which is at odds with some comments that have >> been made. > > Well, if you're referring to 'comments that have been made' about > libsystemd0, the more useful (IMO) comments characterised what is > actually present in that

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Rainer Weikusat (rweiku...@talktalk.net): > >> To re-iterate this: > > [more very strangely worded, difficult-to-parse prose, seemingly alleging > that library libsystemd0 can be used to insert 'calls' into unrelated > applications -- which

Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end

I wrote: > But reading the original links, he is clearly saying "I'll break stuff > whenever *I* think it's right and I don't care how much work it makes for > others in fixing the result". However ... It does sound like this was an area potentially in want of some looking at. However, the

Re: [DNG] Security news about TCP weakness

Go Linux wrote: > For those of you so inclined. Is this important, old news or just academic > posturing? I think it's all three ! It looks very much related to a CVE from 2004 https://web.nvd.nist.gov/view/vuln/detail?vulnId=CVE-2004-0230 Fundamentally, if someone can

Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end

dev wrote: >>Udev on non-systemd is a dead-end: > > So.. then.. basically any Linux distro which uses udev to populate /dev/ is > going to be S.O.L? Including Slackware presumably? That's about it - and I suspect that Poettering "isn't upset" by that. But reading the

Re: [DNG] Timezones: Was: Your computer clock: Was:Re: vdev

Hendrik Boom <hend...@topoi.pooq.com> wrote: > On Wed, Aug 10, 2016 at 10:59:07AM +0100, Simon Hobson wrote: >> Err, no it isn't - unless you've found the secret of time travel ! You're a >> day ahead of us. >> >> Your clock says 11th Aug, in the rest of

Re: [DNG] Security news about TCP weakness

I wrote: > Go Linux wrote: > >> For those of you so inclined. Is this important, old news or just academic >> posturing? > > I think it's all three ! > It looks very much related to a CVE from 2004 > https://web.nvd.nist.gov/view/vuln/detail?vulnId=CVE-2004-0230 OK, so

Re: [DNG] [OT] Microsoft Secure Boot key leaked

dev wrote: > Just ran across this. Not sure what it means for Open Source bootloaders. > > "The key basically allows anyone to bypass the provisions Microsoft has put > in place ostensibly to prevent malicious versions of Windows from being > installed, on any device

Re: [DNG] Bootloaders (was: SystemD's brownie points over non-systemd OSs)

Peter Olson wrote: > I have a machine in that state right now, and rather than try to debug it at > the Grub prompt, I am just going to reinstall the system. That's a bit like the old "I'm buying a new car because the ashtray is full" joke. If you've managed to screw up your

Re: [DNG] Politics of IT in the U.S. government

Steve Litt wrote: > At first I almost vomited when reading this sentence: > > > The Social Security Administration, for instance, has more than 60 > million lines of Cobol, >

Re: [DNG] Your computer clock: Was:Re: vdev

On 11 Aug 2016, at 14:39, aitor_czr wrote: > I'm not Steven Spielberg :) No, but you've time-warped into the future again ! From the vdev thread : > Received: from [*.*.*.*] (*.*.*.*.dynamic.clientes.euskaltel.es > [*.*.*.*]) (Authenticated sender: ***@***) > by

Re: [DNG] Your computer clock: Was:Re: vdev

aitor_czr wrote: > My clock is right: > > aitor@gnuinos:~$ date > Thu Aug 11 11:14:02 CEST 2016 Err, no it isn't - unless you've found the secret of time travel ! You're a day ahead of us. Your clock says 11th Aug, in the rest of the world it's still the 10th Aug. And

Re: [DNG] Systemd discussion on the Samba mailing list

Jaromil wrote: >> Hi, over on the Samba mailing list, somebody asked what '--with-systemd' was >> for. It has now degenerated into a discussion on how to get systemd to start >> the 'samba' deamon, There's also been a short thread on the MythTV mailing list about how to get

Re: [DNG] Helping (was: Why Debian 8 Pinning is pointless)

Jaromil wrote: > So if you visit daily this page https://distrowatch.com/devuan and > even set it as homepage on your computers, then this will definitely > help us putting the word out about Devuan. We can always use more > visibility and DW is an excellent avenue for that.

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > 'Doing' something that is functionally indistinguishable from doing > nothing. And a '000' rights mask would be fully effective paranoia > insurance. Present tense and gaffer tape. Of course, any libsystemd package update will rip that gaffer tape off

Re: [DNG] with or without libsystemd0

Rick Moen wrote: >> So it does look as if libsystemd0 does do something. > > That doesn't logically follow. My guesstimate is that some GNOME > plumbing is checking for some library function before it offers > the user 'removable drives [...] on the desktop'. For

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

Didier Kryn wrote: >I guess this is exactly what "multi-seat" means: severall keyboards and > severall grapical cards connected to the same host. It certainly does not > include serial terminals. Serial terminal fall in the category "multi-user", > like ssh connections, not

Re: [DNG] with or without libsystemd0

Rick Moen wrote: > Remember that bit I posted about how /usr/bin/ssh makes dynamic library > calls to sonames of two Kerberos libraries, even on the overwhelming > majority of systems that do not implement Kerberos? ... > 'Trust' in the sense you use the word just isn't in

Re: [DNG] "soft" dependencies on libraries (was: with or without libsystemd0)

Rick Moen wrote: > This is a bit silly TBH, I'm finding most of your argument a bit silly too. So we might as well drop it >> It comes back to - how much is it "programmers are lazy" vs how much >> is "well actually it is real work". > > Please figure that out and

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

Didier Kryn wrote: >I don't understand all your explanations, sorry :-) . I understood the > concept of "seat" as the combo you describe (graphics-keyboard-mouse). > > If the concept of "seat" includes serial terminals, I see no reason to not > include remote logins:

Re: [DNG] "soft" dependencies on libraries (was: with or without libsystemd0)

Jaromil wrote: >> So, does anyone know if it's "hard" to use a library in a "see if >> it's there and don't use it if it isn't" way rather than "just use >> it and blow up if it's not there" which seems to be the norm ? > > it is not hard at all. in fact one can simply

Re: [DNG] Systemd discussion on the Samba mailing list

On 15 Jul 2016, at 18:10, Emiliano Marini wrote: > Are you serious network isn't started before user login? This is... You can't > be serious. Link please? Ah, I'd mis-rembered the thread. The frontend was consistently not starting.

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: I think we're arguing in violent agreement - there is more than one way to approach the issue, more than one attitude to "risk", and what works for one person isn't necessarily what works for someone else. Isn't that a key tenet of the FOSS way - the

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Rick Moen wrote: > An unused, inert library is a trojan? You didn't read what I wrote did you ? It may be "inert" now - well actually it isn't completely inert if it's being called by packages with gratuitous dependencies on it* - but as I said, there is zero guarantee

[DNG] An amusing swipe at SystemD

http://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/1/2016/07/13/automotive_grade_linux_version_/#c_2916902 In the comments to this article : http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/07/13/automotive_grade_linux_version_/ > Pimp your ride with new Linux for cars and an rPi under the hood > Automotive Grade Linux

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Hendrik Boom wrote: > That said, I find it immensely convenient that someone else is > providing me with a systemd-free distro that's a natural > continuation of the Debian I've been using for years. +1 > What's left is a matter of taste. > There's no point arguig

Re: [DNG] Gaffer tape: was Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

Steve Litt wrote: >> Gaffer tape and {duct|duck} tape are different products. Gaffer tape >> is less adhesive and is designed to be removed easily. It is more >> expensive :-) Ah yes, you are correct - but few sellers give enough information to decide what is what.

Re: [DNG] Studying C as told. (For help)

Peter Olson wrote: > What happens with > > a = b((7, c[3)]) Unless it's a really strange syntax, IMO that should throw up an error when it hits the ")" after the "3". Taking a step back a few messages, under what conditions would it not work to recurse down each time an

Re: [DNG] Bootloaders (was: SystemD's brownie points over non-systemd OSs)

Peter Olson wrote: > My principal complaint about GRUB is that it works very well until one day > when it doesn't, when it now provides the minimal help conceivable to boot > your machine. INdeed, and IMO the use of UIDs is something of a PITA - great for working around the

Re: [DNG] SystemD's brownie points over non-systemd OSs.

Edward Bartolo wrote: > Considering the fact that many Linux users moan about not being able > to run the latest "shiny" software, and sometimes even complain and > insist they want their MS Windows applications on their Linux > machines, I have to concede them, that this time

Re: [DNG] Bootloaders (was: SystemD's brownie points over non-systemd OSs)

Rick Moen wrote: > ... before reading ... documentation You expect people to do what ? :-) As you point out, there's a lot going for LILO - really simple as long as you don't break it. And if it is working, it shouldn't break itself.

Re: [DNG] some fun

emnin...@riseup.net wrote: > Since we're so serious may be some fun is nice, making life > easier ... :) I stumbled upon this by chance and i liked it a lot (I > post the link although i think probably many of you know it already): > > http://systemd-free.org/img/systemd-can.jpg That lightened

Re: [DNG] How to stop udev from re-ordering devices

Rainer Weikusat wrote: > This is published here in the hope that it is useful for someting. > > The basic design of udev is similar to that of a forking server: There's > a parent process listening for uevents from the kernel on a netlink > socket which passes these

Re: [DNG] inittab question

emnin...@riseup.net wrote: > Dealing with a login (manager) problem, i looked into my /etc/inittab > and i found this: > > --- > # Note that on most Debian systems tty7 is used by the X Window System, > # so if you want to add more getty's go ahead but skip tty7 if you run > X. # >

Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end

Nate Bargmann wrote: > Second, clone that repository locally (dead easy with Git). Which is what I was thinking ... In an almost exact parallel, at a previous employer they used a business system which was effectively bespoke and written in Cobol. The history was that it had

Re: [DNG] Time sync at startup (was: vdev)

richard lucassen wrote: >> And what I was saying is: You should run one on modern networked *ix >> machine generally. Because it's 2016. > > I do not agree. +1 > If the local machine generates quite a bunch of queries > than you're right. So, if you have (in 2016)

Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end

Rick Moen wrote: > And this is because too many people are just relying on it continuing to > be there. They really ought to stop thinking that way. I'll admit that I haven't given too much thought to who owns what when it comes to the likes of SF - but I do frequently

Re: [DNG] systemd greybeards

Brian Nash wrote: > It's the same with operating systems: > > Windows agressively claws it's way to the top, doing all it can to > destroy competition, while Linux minds it's own, content to let it's own > merits speak for it. There's more to it than that. Windows, like

Re: [DNG] lilo development has ended

Hendrik Boom wrote: >> I don't understand this. My understanding of lilo is that is just finds >> the blocks where the kernel is, and usually the kernel file is not placed >> in any superblock or signature; shouldn't the file system driver ensure >> that ? > > It has to

Re: [DNG] lilo development has ended

And also see http://lilo.alioth.debian.org/olddoc/html/tech_21-5.html ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] OT: true read-only disk

info at smallinnovations.nl wrote: > Your right, even with the ro flag the mounting pc would try to repair the > filesystem. For more information and the solutions see > http://forensicswiki.org/wiki/Forensic_Live_CD_issues. Well that's a facepalm moment. Very

Re: [DNG] OT: true read-only disk

Adam Borowski wrote: > You can't mount ext4 as ext2 because of extents and a bunch of other > features. I found that out this morning ;-) I'd forgotten that I'd used ETX4 on this drive - I'm one of those "why change if it aint broke" people still using EXT3. > To disable

Re: [DNG] OT: disk recovery software (was: true read-only disk)

While watching the disk struggle reading bits of metadata that's been read before, it gave me an idea for a tools - I just wish I even had a fraction of the skills needed to build it. While the "image the whole thing and work form the image" does work - it doesn't work for disks like these

Re: [DNG] vdev - udev is a dead end

Rick Moen <r...@linuxmafia.com> wrote: > [Sorry, this ended up being longer than I'd hoped.] That's OK - it's worth the read. > Quoting Simon Hobson (li...@thehobsons.co.uk): > >> There was one other thing that came to mind earlier ... >> If ${company} decid

Re: [DNG] OT: true read-only disk

Adam Borowski wrote: > To disable journal recovery mount with -oro,norecovery, ... Just an update on how things are going. I've been using -o ro,noatime,nodiratime,norecovery as mount options, and that seems to work well. Took my disks home (been using a PC I have at work

Re: [DNG] Which license for UMENU2?

Rick Moen wrote: > OK, please cite me even a single judge's opinion in any copyright case > that says that linking (e.g., dynamic linker calls to an ELF library) > automatically creates a derivative work based on the linked code (which > IIRC is the view expressed in the GPL

[DNG] OT: On the subject of learning how to use what you have

It's come up a few times that a lot of problems "with" ${package} aren't actually problems with the package, but people who didn't bother to learn how to use it properly. Today's XKCD seems to fit in with that quite nicely - especially the rollover popup :-) http://xkcd.com/1728/

Re: [DNG] lilo development has ended

k...@aspodata.se wrote: > Next scenario is if you have the bootloader on a different media, say > e.g. a floppy. Then, will lilo load the kernel from disk 2 when disk 1 > fails (assuming mirrored /boot) ? Do grub handle that ? With Grub you can specify the disk/partition by system device name

[DNG] OT: true read-only disk

OT, but there seem to be a few people who understand such in-depth stuff here ;-) I'm in the process of recovering (with ddrescue) files of a failing drive - no backups as "it's only TV" recordings and I can't afford the disk space anyway. It's going better than I expected with most of the

Re: [DNG] OT: true read-only disk

Rob Owens wrote: > I don't know the answer to your read-only question. But having done some > data recovery in the past, I've found that attaching the drive via USB and > sitting the drive in the freezer during recovery can help in situations like > this. I have

Re: [DNG] What does Devuan expect from a boot-loader?

Steve Litt wrote: >> And what about RAID? I need it. And I like also Reiserfs, maybe >> not the fastest but rock-solid; is it supported by Lilo? > > Wait a minute. Couldn't you have an ext4 root directory, and have all > data on RAID mounts? Doesn't need that, it

Re: [DNG] Why does systemd do such stupid things

Rowland Penny wrote: > I stuck another motherboard in and started up the machine again ... > Finally, in desperation, I ran 'dmesg | grep eth0' and found my problem: > > root@server:~# dmesg | grep eth0 > [0.921998] r8169 :02:00.0 eth0: RTL8168b/8111b at

Re: [DNG] Why does systemd do such stupid things

Nate Bargmann wrote: > After I thought about it some, there is a certain logic to udev's > behavior but it would seem to make more sense if the network adapter is > on a hot-pluggable interface (PCMCIA, USB, etc.), or is in addition to > the adapter already assigned to eth0 on a

Re: [DNG] Refracta on Distrowatch

Robert Storey wrote: > I can't remember the last time I saw an actual CD drive (as opposed to a DVD > drive). OK, I guess you can still find CD music players, but on computers, > CD-only drives are a blast from the past. I think they'll soon be to the youngsters, what

Re: [DNG] devuan-discuss is not useful, quite the opposite

hellekin wrote: > ... nobody cares As someone who is not really in a position to contribute much at all, let me say that I'm grateful to all who are working towards making Devuan "happen" - regardless of the size of their contribution. I watch (or at least, skim) most of

Re: [DNG] Networking on installation: was Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

Clarke Sideroad wrote: > I believe software should not be patent-able ... And this is part of the "system is broken" - especially in the USA. A novel business process which happens to use computers/software should (IMO) be patentable under the same rules of prior

Re: [DNG] Networking on installation: was Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

Alessandro Selli wrote: >> That's a non sequitur >> The ONLY, and I mean ONLY bit that's relevant is the one about licence terms >> - and that's *relatively* easy to deal with one way or another as the >> licence terms are there to be read (either there are terms

Re: [DNG] Networking on installation: was Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

KatolaZ wrote: > All very good points, indeed, which unfortunately become automatically > nonsense in the case of software. 17 or 25 years are the blink of an > eye for hardcore 19th centrury industrial innovation, when the patent > system was invesned, but correspond to

Re: [DNG] Networking on installation: was Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

Renaud (Ron) OLGIATI wrote: > No, they were introduced to guarantee the inventor the exclusivity of his > invention for a certain time, so he alone could profit from it during that > time. > > Introduced to make research economically viable. And the flip side

Re: [DNG] Networking on installation: was Devuan GNU+Linux Beta2 release

Alessandro Selli wrote: >> OK fine, just have this yes or no question early in the install: >> >> = >> Are you willing to have the install try non-free drivers and firmware >> for your network, video,

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