Re: [DNG] ..another new(?) step towards Debian systemd: linux-image-4.6.0-1[-rt]-amd-signed, with MSTF keys...

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
who can install his own software via ./configure;make;make install, configure his applications, change window managers, etc, but is not a professional admin. SteveT SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb __

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
x27;d write a shellscript workalike for Suckless Init. In my opinion, once you've done that, you should publicize it like the Autumn leaves, because you've done a service to all of Linuxdom, and you've especially done a service to Devuan, whose root story is that init should be simple. I&#

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
t init, I'd have it *only* spawn /etc/rc and spin (and in real life listen for signals and act on them). Writing a PID1, writing the /etc/rc and the shutdown script, and connecting it to s6 or runit is quite enough work for a first stab. I'd keep PID1 ultra-simple on the first stab. Later you

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
f 'Entering interactive shell\n' > setsid /bin/sh -c 'exec bash /dev/tty1 2>&1' > done; > > Have fun. > Didier And later, when Edward makes a real PID1, everything before the line about /dev/console comprises the first few s

Re: [DNG] ..another new(?) step towards Debian systemd: linux-image-4.6.0-1[-rt]-amd-signed, with MSTF keys...

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
> workarounds, but there is no logic why it should fail. Try it. If it turns out to be that easy, all of Linuxdom will give you a tickertape parade. By the way, I'm pretty sure the Grub would need to be signed too. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother?

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 22:49:27 +0200 Irrwahn wrote: > On Mon, 13 Jun 2016 15:47:49 -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > [...] > > Then I'd write a shellscript workalike for Suckless Init. In my > > opinion, once you've done that, you should publicize it like the > > Au

Re: [DNG] package request

2016-06-13 Thread Steve Litt
way, thanks to emninger's post, I've been using Palemoon as my main browser for almost a week, and it's head and shoulders better than ALL the rest. It's less bloaty than the other XUL browsers, and it's more stable than the webkit based browser

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 05:44:27 +0100 KatolaZ wrote: > On Mon, Jun 13, 2016 at 09:37:11PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > [cut] > > > > > Right now, Felker's PID1 is the acknowledged "Hello World" PID1. > > But as I remember you have to add an #include

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
--- Define "didn't work." If you mean didn't compile, yeah, you need an additional include file: Urban said it's wait.h: I don't remember. If you mean it hung or something, make /etc/rc do nothing but run bash, and see if you get a command prompt.

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
l resources. It's fun and educational, but don't do it on a computer whose data you care about. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://ma

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
Edward, please comment the daylights out of it. Your shellscript might be used for education, proof of concept, and propaganda for years to come. If your shellscript had existed in the fall of 2014, I would have tried it before I tried Felker. SteveT On Tue, 14 Jun 2016 13:16:03 +0200 Edward Bart

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
that will be very hard to debug. If I were you, I'd find /bin/sh statements to substitute for ever statement Felker puts in his init. That way, when your init works *every time*, it will make Lennart and the Redhats, and all their screaming, adoring fans, look like the bozos they are.

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
ndational knowledge, it's probably the quickest way to acquire knowledge, and soon enough the foundational knowledge is acquired. Disclaimer: I have a dog in this fight because my book "Rapid Learning For the 21st Century" depends in large part on Curiosity Driven Learning. This is

Re: [DNG] Custom OS initiator. In need of some hints...

2016-06-14 Thread Steve Litt
ol group, and I think discussions like this one make us sharper every day. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-16 Thread Steve Litt
/osloader.sh"); > } Add in the turning on and turning off of signals, and by Jove, I think he's got it! Bear in mind that Perl is different on every computer due to CPAN. But as an educational thing, this is perfect. Make a simple /sbin/osloader.sh and let us know whe

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-16 Thread Steve Litt
If the machine were anything but a demonstration experimental machine, so would I contemplate suicide or systemd. Same with Python, Ruby, and (urk) Javascript. But truth be told, if PID1 were written in Lua, I would not be dismayed in the slightest. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-16 Thread Steve Litt
ould be spawned from PID2, the rc file. But nooo! Besides the doubleforked stuff, all the dbus related stuff has a PPID of 1. udevd -daemon likewise has PPID1, as does the background process for runit's process supervisor, runsvdir. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooti

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-17 Thread Steve Litt
compromise, and of course that getty will have the advantage of being an early getty. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-17 Thread Steve Litt
e author of Manjaro Experiments. The average DNG inhabitant who has been following along with this thread can now hold his own on the supervis...@list.skarnet.org list, and that's something quite impressive. I'd say this has been of tremendous educational value. I know I've been edu

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-17 Thread Steve Litt
ledge equivalent of pulling yourself up by your bootstraps, and when he's done documenting it anybody can follow in his footsteps. And those who *do* follow in his footsteps will find it easy to install something like runit or s6 to initialize their machine

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-17 Thread Steve Litt
x27;t be so sensitive. You can't please all the people all the time: Concentrate on what you're doing, and ignore the naysayers. This thread is too valuable, educationally, to get bound up in personal stuff. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://ww

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-17 Thread Steve Litt
ry somewhere of what system initialization > entails? Or is it dependent on accumulated experience and not > codified? The latter. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mail

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-17 Thread Steve Litt
On Fri, 17 Jun 2016 19:36:49 +0100 KatolaZ wrote: > On Fri, Jun 17, 2016 at 02:14:10PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Fri, 17 Jun 2016 15:31:28 +0200 > > Irrwahn wrote: > > > > > As for the educational value: I fail to see what good does > > &g

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-19 Thread Steve Litt
sion, I'd like to see the preceding quote on the Devuan website, complete with attribution. I do think Edward meant "NOT A" instead of "NO", but will let him talk. Nice quote, Edward! SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-19 Thread Steve Litt
for long enough to fire up a browser, find the problem, and > then recover. Sometimes, sometimes not. I think it was Centos where I found the initramfs sabotaged the user of init=/usr/bin/bash (Centos was the new symlinked thang, and you can't use the symlink name that early in the boot)

Re: [DNG] Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-19 Thread Steve Litt
lp from those who cooperate, and ignore those who issue personal accusations. I'd suggest you keep all emotional content out of your emails and stick to tech. All the drama in the world won't change the content of an integer. I'm one of those who appreciates what you do, and t

Re: [DNG] How to stop udev from re-ordering devices

2016-06-20 Thread Steve Litt
gt; * Don't know if that's "standard" or a Debian packaging thing. Of all the escapades of FreeDesktop.Org, managers of Lennart and the Redhats, these name thingies are some of the least onerous. I put a shellscript on the list a few months ago that delivers the wifi device n

Re: [DNG] [Completely OT] Re: Fwd: Mini init script written in Perl boots.

2016-06-20 Thread Steve Litt
weak_string(char * st){ maxsize=1000; if (strlen(st)> maxsize-20) return NULL; char buf[maxsize]; strcpy(buf, "pre_"); strncat(buf, st, maxsize-20); buf[strlen(st)+3] = '\0'; return(buf); } I should have gotten fired. It created an intermittent that to

Re: [DNG] [OT] Re: Fwd: Mini init script written in Perl, boots.

2016-06-20 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 20 Jun 2016 15:53:30 +0200 aitor_czr wrote: > Yes..., it's available in pdf. > > https://hassanolity.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/the_c_programming_language_2.pdf Is that legal? SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troub

Re: [DNG] How to stop udev from re-ordering devices

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 21 Jun 2016 08:14:57 +0100 Simon Hobson wrote: > Steve Litt wrote: > > > Of all the escapades of FreeDesktop.Org, managers of Lennart and the > > Redhats, these name thingies are some of the least onerous. I put a > > shellscript on the list a few months ag

[DNG] Menus: was package request

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
es UMENU substitute for XDG menu. You need both: UMENU for stuff you want to do your way and organize your way, XDG menu for stuff you seldom use but want to find, and Suckless Tools' dmenu for simple executables you use several times a week (or hundreds of times a day). SteveT Steve Litt Jun

Re: [DNG] A proposal for usability ;)

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
ot;$curstate" = "1"; then synclient TouchpadOff=0 else synclient TouchpadOff=1 fi ===== SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___

Re: [DNG] [OT] [Re: Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
e only games in town. Even when the second edition of this book was written in 1995, assuming ASCII was perfectly acceptable in the English speaking world, which at the time did most of the computing. When I learned Pascal at Santa Monica City College in 1983, teachers took special care to

Re: [DNG] [OT] [Re: Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
') { >if (desc[i] == ' ') { >strncpy(&desc[i], &desc[i+1], > (strlen(desc)-i)); } // Redundant char copies, doesn't it? > } > } > return 0; &

Re: [DNG] [OT] [Re: Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
* random()/RAND_MAX; strncpy(pch, argv[i], strlen(argv[i])); pch += strlen(argv[i]); memset(pch, ' ', spaces); pch += spaces; *pch = '\0'; } printf("buf=>%s<\n", buf);

Re: [DNG] How to stop udev from re-ordering devices

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 21 Jun 2016 20:10:24 +0100 Rainer Weikusat wrote: > The nice thing about free software is that one may use it to solve > real problems the developers disapprove of. NICE QUOTE RAINER!!! SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother

Re: [DNG] package request

2016-06-21 Thread Steve Litt
op their menu entries. LOL, and people criticize me for my "anything but Debian" stance, and say I should just package-manager Debian into using a different init. Here's a new tagline for the Debian project: Works today, gone tomorrow! SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 feat

Re: [DNG] Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-22 Thread Steve Litt
rs.com/lpm/200610/200610.htm#_Computers_Ive_Known_and_Loved Input and programming via hexidecimal, output via six 7 segment LEDs. I soldered an amplifier onto one of the LED segments, programmed the computer to turn that segment on and off at programmed frequencies, and created a "computer guitar&quo

Re: [DNG] Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-22 Thread Steve Litt
nctions and variables descriptively. For instance, either you should rename times2() set_to_33(), or in its body you should put: i[0] = i[0] * 2; I wrote about readability here: http://troubleshooters.com/tpromag/199908/index.htm SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshoot

Re: [DNG] Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-24 Thread Steve Litt
often use continue and break, but every time I do, I make a mental note that I'm decreasing modularity and thus reducing the scalability of my code. Of course, I might have also increased my code's readability by reducing redundant indenta

Re: [DNG] Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-24 Thread Steve Litt
I'd personally de-prioritize the bit arithmetic stuff. You can learn it at any time. The other thing I'd de-prioritize is the question mark operator: It's just (sometimes confusing) shorthand for what if/else if/else can do. Save your brainpower for pointers to functions. That's

Re: [DNG] Studying C as told. (For help)

2016-06-25 Thread Steve Litt
a moveable label should explain in detail why he can't achieve the same result with structures such as break, continue, return, exit(), an exception, or the real structured solution: Loops with flags that can be turned false, and if statements such that nothing from the current loop is e

Re: [DNG] samba-libs package in Debian now depends on libsystemd0

2016-06-25 Thread Steve Litt
go forgotten most of the Samba I knew, but at the turn of the century I knew a fair amount about it: http://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/samba-unleashed-steve-litt/1100840306 Back in those days, the only Samba code I saw that could have related to the init was the init scripts, and those weren'

Re: [DNG] samba-libs package in Debian now depends on libsystemd0

2016-06-25 Thread Steve Litt
ould soon own the world. Now, 2 years later, Samba, a bedrock "killer app" for Linux, still has a --without-systemd compile option. If Redhat had truly succeeded in their plans, such an option would be unneeded and useless in 2016. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting

Re: [DNG] samba-libs package in Debian now depends on libsystemd0

2016-06-27 Thread Steve Litt
On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 21:01:28 +0200 Didier Kryn wrote: > Le 25/06/2016 18:34, Steve Litt a écrit : > > My suspicion is that the --without-systemd switch represents a huge > > defeat for Lennart and the Redhats. When Debian decided to switch in > > the summer of 2014, th

Re: [DNG] Firefox-ESR and XUL

2016-07-01 Thread Steve Litt
s browsers have a ridiculously massive attack surface. I thought the list had declared Palemoon a reasonable substitute for Firefox and Chromium. I've been using it ever since you guys started talking about it, and I'm quite pleased. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book:

Re: [DNG] Firefox-ESR and XUL

2016-07-01 Thread Steve Litt
rns to low RAM, low CPU. Unlike Firefox. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] Firefox-ESR and XUL

2016-07-01 Thread Steve Litt
On Sat, 02 Jul 2016 01:15:42 +0200 Svante Signell wrote: > On Fri, 2016-07-01 at 11:23 -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Fri, 1 Jul 2016 04:04:35 +0200 > >  > > I thought the list had declared Palemoon a reasonable substitute for > > Firefox and Chromium. I've b

Re: [DNG] Azadi, or: the art of civil-isation

2016-07-05 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 5 Jul 2016 12:08:20 +0200 Didier Kryn wrote: > I hope the reasons for Sdexit (Systemd Exit) sdexit. You just made me laugh and made my mood so much better today. Thanks. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technolog

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-05 Thread Steve Litt
;s heart breaking :-( . > > An arrogant asshole (sorry, hey, but i do not know another term) with > a bottle of beer in his hand and backed up by the power of What's this bottle of beer thing? I've watched that video several times and never saw beer or a reference to beer.

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-06 Thread Steve Litt
. "Do you hate disabled people?" Really shows off potterpuff for the strutting little cluck he is. If there's anyone on this list who hasn't seen this video, you should watch it. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Succ

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-08 Thread Steve Litt
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016 02:14:44 +0200 wrote: > Am Thu, 07 Jul 2016 12:00:02 + > schrieb Steve Litt : > > Hi Steve! > > > The whole systemd thing is one big propaganda war. It's not about > > tech. Saying systemd is about tech is like saying a Moloto

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-08 Thread Steve Litt
On Fri, 8 Jul 2016 16:34:27 +0900 Simon Walter wrote: > Absolutely. Lennart's attitude of "it's free, so don't complain" I'm going to go to the lake nearest Lennart's house, and dump a ton of mercury into it. When he complains, I'll say "it&#

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-08 Thread Steve Litt
ation, the world is still asking "what's wrong with systemd?" Redhat wants to consolidate their gains and move on, the community won't let it. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshoo

Re: [DNG] Netinstall iso

2016-07-10 Thread Steve Litt
. What I can add to this discussion is back when I was a Wheezy user, I was *never* able to successfully install from anything but a network installation. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techn

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-11 Thread Steve Litt
e other hand, a lot of people I respect (including emninger) love Slackware specifically because it leaves figuring dependencies to the user, leading to a relatively dependency-lean environment. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Tech

[DNG] Devuan discussion on SVLUG mailing list

2016-07-11 Thread Steve Litt
Hi all, There's a protracted, and naturally hot, Devuan discussion on the mailing list of Silicon Valley Linux User Group. See the thread startig here: http://lists.svlug.org/archives/svlug/2016-July/062070.html Hope you enjoy it. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troublesho

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-11 Thread Steve Litt
ention I write > > books for a living?). > > ..so which do you prefer, Slackware wee mess, > or being at the mercy of Poettering & Co? My research has found the following systemd-free systems capable of running my business: * Devuan * Void * PC-BSD * Funtoo There are prob

[DNG] Which license for Devuan documentation?

2016-07-11 Thread Steve Litt
Hi all, Which license does the Devuan project prefer for its documentation? Which format does the Devuan project prefer for its documentation? HTML? Plan text? PDF? Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http

[DNG] Can't connect to Amprolla?

2016-07-11 Thread Steve Litt
? I'd give you the Devuan version, but both /etc/issue and uname -a give me only kernel version. Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techn

Re: [DNG] systemd==bad

2016-07-11 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 11 Jul 2016 16:00:55 -0400 Hendrik Boom wrote: > On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 12:33:43PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > > > I don't use Slackware because their package manager won't figure out > > dependencies for me, causing me to need 10x the time to install s

Re: [DNG] tools for writing

2016-07-12 Thread Steve Litt
On Mon, 11 Jul 2016 23:10:57 -0400 Hendrik Boom wrote: > On Mon, Jul 11, 2016 at 10:19:03PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > I'm kind of curious about the format you seem to be designing or > developing. Let me start with my priorities: 1) Fast, easy authoring, from a text editor.

[DNG] Devuan docs for dmenu

2016-07-12 Thread Steve Litt
Hi all, As promised, I created a documentation page for using dmenu in Devuan: http://troubleshooters.com/linux/devuan_docs/devuan_dmenu.html I licensed it GPL2. Hope you like it, use it to best advantage. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
on Devuan. Which reminds me of this little quote from a great person: "First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Which in turn makes me think of another little quote from another great person: "Don't Panic and Keep Forking Debian"

Re: [DNG] Systemd discussion on the Samba mailing list

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
ying to fight a community that needs no money to code, or to remove their booby traps? I think Red Hat lives in interesting times. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques __

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 16:05:44 -0700 Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com): > > > Deeeude, that's not what you're saying over on SVLUG. I quote: > > > > * Far as I can tell, Devuan was a operatic overreaction, and by no > &

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
until the systemd thing, but now no longer trusts Debian, Devuan fits their use case well. I'm not asking *you* to use Devuan, or recommend Devuan to your friends, or contribute to Devuan. Just admit that for former Debian users who no longer trust Debian, and don't want to keep undoing

[DNG] Devuan dmenu docs complete

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
Hi all, I just added the dmenu hotkey instructions for Xfce and Openbox to the existing instructions for LXDE. The document's now useable to the majority of Devuan users (I think). SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist

[DNG] Need for documentation

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
tree. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation

2016-07-13 Thread Steve Litt
On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 22:39:34 -0400 Steve Litt wrote: > Hi all, > > When installing, you get to pick which window manager you want. > Trouble is, there's no obvious way to change your window manager > after the fact. Somebody needs to document how to do this, and keep

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation

2016-07-14 Thread Steve Litt
On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 17:33:26 +1200 Daniel Reurich wrote: > On 14/07/16 17:27, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 22:39:34 -0400 > > Steve Litt wrote: > > > >> Hi all, > >> > >> When installing, you get to pick which window manager you

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation

2016-07-14 Thread Steve Litt
On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 12:44:35 + (UTC) Go Linux wrote: > On Thu, 7/14/16, Steve Litt wrote: > > Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation > To: dng@lists.dyne.org > Date: Thursday, July 14, 2016, 12:27 AM > > On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 22:39:34 -0400 > Steve Li

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-14 Thread Steve Litt
calls me "neckbeard" or "graybeard" I'll turn around and call him "Clearasil Boy!" And the next time someone refers to people with more than a week's experience as "neckbeards" or "graybeards", I'll let him know he's one of the

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation

2016-07-14 Thread Steve Litt
On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 14:50:25 + (UTC) Go Linux wrote: > On Thu, 7/14/16, Steve Litt wrote: > > Subject: Re: [DNG] Need for documentation > To: dng@lists.dyne.org > Date: Thursday, July 14, 2016, 9:07 AM > > On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 17:33:26 +1200 > Daniel Reurich wr

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (Steve Litt)

2016-07-14 Thread Steve Litt
eboot: reboot the system > > > golinux Cool! Like F1, these four things should be discoverable from text on the login screen. Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://w

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

2016-07-15 Thread Steve Litt
processing continues without regard to the dialog box. The microsecond I press Ctrl+Shift+G, this dialog appears. Even if I have 27 Firefox windows open, each with its own script. Even if something later in the script will fail. The user will never wonder whether he didn't click hard enough, or

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
sn't created exclusively for technological reasons. Read https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20141127.212941.f55acc3a.en.html , which to me is Devuan's Declaration of Independence. Read the paragraph starting with "The problem is obviously not just technical" and the paragrap

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
eing enumerated on the login screen. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.o

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (Steve Litt)

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
of lxdm (as a graphical login manager). > It's only insignificantly heavvier than slim but it offers all the > options cleanly you're looking for. I'd prefer a display manager that isn't associated with a window manager or desktop environment. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 f

[DNG] Gaffer tape: was Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
es for safety, I think this is ontopic. Where can one get gaffer tape especially created to tape cables to the carpet for safety purposes? I've used wide clear cellophane tape up to now, but that's not really as safe. Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 fe

Re: [DNG] Need for documentation (golinux)

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
age, and clearly a lot of people won't be using LXDE on Devuan. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.

[DNG] libsx-dev and libsx0 packages don't work

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
x/libsx.html Unfortunately, I can't find the source code anywhere. Does anyone know how to get libsx running correctly on Devuan? SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http:/

Re: [DNG] Why Debian 8 Pinning is (or isn't) pointless

2016-07-16 Thread Steve Litt
le. If, by hanging out here, I can in some little ways help the cause, that makes me very happy. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng

[DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-18 Thread Steve Litt
onsole appears, asking you for username and password. When you exit the console via the exit command or Ctrl+d on the console, you go back to the login screen. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/

Re: [DNG] Open-RC on devuan - some questions

2016-07-18 Thread Steve Litt
: runit, Epoch, and maybe s6 or s6-rc come to mind. runit and Epoch have amazingly tiny and simple run scripts and process configs, respectively. Runit always respawns its later processes, and Epoch gives you the choice to respawn any process it runs. Epoch and runit have such simple process configs

Re: [DNG] Open-RC on devuan - some questions

2016-07-18 Thread Steve Litt
to dismiss the dialogue with current > maintainer in Debian and deciding to scratch that package entirely. True! A second reason is that if a Devuan person created and maintained a Devuan package, Debian couldn't pull the rug out from under us. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
it wrong" comes to mind. > There is this guy named Lennart who might agree with you. :-) Before Adam pronounces "multiseat" "bullshit", and before you associate him with poetterputz, I think an agreement needs to be reached on the exact meaning of "multiseat."

Re: [DNG] Open-RC on devuan - some questions

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
get confusing when things don't go just right. The older I get, the more I think the easiest route is to use wpa_passphrase, then, as root, append its output into /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf. Crude but effective. Travelling wifi on laptops is a mess, always has been. SteveT Steve

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
computers during high > school: A modern revival of that computing model using Linux might > make money sense or might not, depending. Otherwise, I wouldn't say > today that it'll necessarily be 'unimportant' in years to come. Where does Linux Terminal Server Pr

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
tence really means a (perhaps very low horsepower) computer sans hard disk and CD, right? SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques ___ Dng

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:08:01 -0700 Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com): > > > Where does Linux Terminal Server Project (LTSP, > > http://www.ltsp.org/) fit into this discussion? > > It fits logically into the 'effective use

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:59:26 -0700 Rick Moen wrote: > Quoting Steve Litt (sl...@troubleshooters.com): > > > On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:08:01 -0700 > > Rick Moen wrote: > > > > > It fits logically into the 'effective use of autonomous host > > >

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
h they could just access xterm within X anyway). Personally, I always boot to CLI and startx to GUI. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-19 Thread Steve Litt
ddled with security holes (including systemd). I'm > > open though to changing to something better, if there is something > > better. > > > > cheers, > > Robert > > I find it good enough :) > >Aitor. I've got no problem with slim. Especially if

Re: [DNG] Cannot install Samba on Jessie

2016-07-20 Thread Steve Litt
th the > subject ? So he can start an argument on a list including people from widely varying nations, religions, and politics. But hey, he's cute and funny, right? SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http://w

[DNG] Wirth's law

2016-07-20 Thread Steve Litt
etter get some programs that use it all. * Look at this simple operating system on this powerful, capable hardware. I'd better make more complex software because I can. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist http:/

Re: [DNG] F1 and special usernames on the login screen

2016-07-21 Thread Steve Litt
x27;s like to be among the lucky 10,000! > https://xkcd.com/1053/ For the past 25 years, I shake my head in amazement at the profound stupidity of myself at an age five years earlier. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful Technologist

Re: [DNG] Dng Digest, Vol 22, Issue 80

2016-07-22 Thread Steve Litt
e > Netherlands you must search for a not US-Keyboard. > > Grtz. > > Nico LOL, for the first time in history, a "Digest" subject better represents the current thread than the original subject. SteveT Steve Litt July 2016 featured

Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan

2016-07-23 Thread Steve Litt
On Sat, 23 Jul 2016 23:36:06 +0200 aitor_czr wrote: > Help, Steve Litt !! > >Aitor. I think a separate theme is needed for people with fuzzy vision. PRIORITIES: * Readability over pretty. * Quick Contextual recognition over pretty. * Readability over real estate efficiency of t

Re: [DNG] Gtk-theme for Devuan

2016-07-23 Thread Steve Litt
On Sat, 23 Jul 2016 23:11:17 -0400 Hendrik Boom wrote: > On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 11:02:19PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Sat, 23 Jul 2016 23:36:06 +0200 > > aitor_czr wrote: > > > > > > > Help, Steve Litt !! > > > > > >Aitor.

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