[Elecraft] Fw: important

[Charlie Horsman]

Hello!

 

Important message, visit http://lowkeycomics.com/hours.php?g2w

 

Charlie Horsman

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Jim Brown]

On Sun,9/13/2015 11:51 PM, Adam Farson wrote:

For Jim K9YC:


Hi Adam,

Thanks for the description of your work. Could you take the time to 
respond to recent posts by W4TV and W4BQF in this thread?


73, Jim

=   =   =   =   =

Adam is an out an out Icom evangelist - not exactly unbiased.


An example is in the footnote for the Flex-6700, which has no
preselector for the range where he had to do his measurements, which
may have caused that radio to measure worse than it would on the ham
bands.


On the other hand Adam limits noise power for direct sampling SDR
designs to a lower level than used with traditional up/down conversion
transceivers.  The lower noise power input gives the direct sampling
designs an unfair advantage be ignoring strong signal environments.

73,

  ... Joe, W4TV

I certainly agree with Joe about Adam! I've never heard such prejudicial
explanations trying to justify Icom's innocence for final transistor
failures in the IC-7700's. He took all reports of final failures and said he
was going to forward them to Icom, but very few of us ever believed he
actually forwarded any information to Icom from IC-7700 users about the
failures. And IF did, there was never any response from Japan.
I sold my IC-7700, not because the finals failed, but because the threat of
failure was there every time I turned that radio ON.

73,
Tom - W4BQF




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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[ae4pb]

I believe when you consider the engineering reputation of Elecraft and
economies of scale for the manufacture of the SP3 several expectations
arise:
1. This is likely a very well-engineered component that's not easily
replaced by a similar sized speaker. 
2. Performance of the speaker exceeds similarly priced speakers (and
definitely less expensive ones to a degree). 
3. There is NOT likely a premium baked in to the price for the Elecraft name
due to the economies of scale (low quantity manufacture generally means
higher costs, thus higher price). Translation - the price isn't just for the
name.

At the end of the day consider the labor costs plus parts are likely fairly
high if they are US manufactured. 

The US consumer is the sole reason most US manufacturing has gone overseas
(especially China). Buy cheap, get cheap.

So it comes down to a question of quality vs "good enough" vs "price" 

I can only speak for myself in saying that it means something to have a
matching set rather than a hodgepodge. 
I do compromise and use what I have to be able to get the job done UNTIL
I've saved enough for the next piece. 

Personally the SP3 is last on my list because most if not all of my
operating will be with headphones. 
The point here is that it's on my list :)



Jerry Moore
AE4PB, K3S SN# Arrives Wed. 






-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bob
McGraw - K4TAX
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 3:28 PM
To: Wayne Burdick; Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

New products are always welcome.  I look forward to "hearing them" at maybe
one of the next ham fests.  I like the fact the SP3 uses an oval speaker.
I've never figured out exactly why, but I find ovals typically do sound
better than rounds, but maybe it seems to be only in my findings.

As a comment, I prefer non-amplified speakers as this avoids the potential
RFI issues when used with the radio.  The model that I mentioned and use has
a slight tilt to the bottom which aligns the front with the K3S with its
front elevated by the stand.

I also find the audio system in the K3S to be really nice, specially the
2 channel effect using the AFX feature along with a stereo speaker
configuration.  This give a nice wide spatial effect to which I find very
pleasing.  Thanks Wayne and company for doing a fine job with the K3S and
its new features.

73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 9/13/2015 2:09 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> The K3 or K3S will work with a wide range of speakers, including the ones
Bob (K4TAX) mentioned.
>
> Here are some possible reasons for using an SP3:
>
> - matches the K-Line perfectly, including a rugged fold-up tilt stand
> - full stereo A/B source selection, supporting dual-rig and 
> dual-speaker configurations (or both)
> - plenty of room inside the cabinet for built-ins that might improve 
> station integration
>
> Of course these factors don't apply to everyone. But the good news is 
> that we will no longer have to say "maybe next year" every time 
> someone asks us to add a matching speaker to the product line :)
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> Bob McGraw - K4TAX  wrote:
>
>> I use a pair of "off the shelf" brand speakers which have 2" x 4" ovals
in a nice efficient solid enclosure that is 5" deep
>
>
>
>
>


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[ac5p]

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the 
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P   


 On Monday, September 14, 2015 10:34 AM, "ae...@carolinaheli.com" 
 wrote:
   

 I believe when you consider the engineering reputation of Elecraft and
economies of scale for the manufacture of the SP3 several expectations
arise:
1. This is likely a very well-engineered component that's not easily
replaced by a similar sized speaker. 
2. Performance of the speaker exceeds similarly priced speakers (and
definitely less expensive ones to a degree). 
3. There is NOT likely a premium baked in to the price for the Elecraft name
due to the economies of scale (low quantity manufacture generally means
higher costs, thus higher price). Translation - the price isn't just for the
name.

At the end of the day consider the labor costs plus parts are likely fairly
high if they are US manufactured. 

The US consumer is the sole reason most US manufacturing has gone overseas
(especially China). Buy cheap, get cheap.

So it comes down to a question of quality vs "good enough" vs "price" 

I can only speak for myself in saying that it means something to have a
matching set rather than a hodgepodge. 
I do compromise and use what I have to be able to get the job done UNTIL
I've saved enough for the next piece. 

Personally the SP3 is last on my list because most if not all of my
operating will be with headphones. 
The point here is that it's on my list :)



Jerry Moore
AE4PB, K3S SN# Arrives Wed. 






-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bob
McGraw - K4TAX
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 3:28 PM
To: Wayne Burdick; Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

New products are always welcome.  I look forward to "hearing them" at maybe
one of the next ham fests.  I like the fact the SP3 uses an oval speaker.
I've never figured out exactly why, but I find ovals typically do sound
better than rounds, but maybe it seems to be only in my findings.

As a comment, I prefer non-amplified speakers as this avoids the potential
RFI issues when used with the radio.  The model that I mentioned and use has
a slight tilt to the bottom which aligns the front with the K3S with its
front elevated by the stand.

I also find the audio system in the K3S to be really nice, specially the
2 channel effect using the AFX feature along with a stereo speaker
configuration.  This give a nice wide spatial effect to which I find very
pleasing.  Thanks Wayne and company for doing a fine job with the K3S and
its new features.

73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 9/13/2015 2:09 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> The K3 or K3S will work with a wide range of speakers, including the ones
Bob (K4TAX) mentioned.
>
> Here are some possible reasons for using an SP3:
>
> - matches the K-Line perfectly, including a rugged fold-up tilt stand
> - full stereo A/B source selection, supporting dual-rig and 
> dual-speaker configurations (or both)
> - plenty of room inside the cabinet for built-ins that might improve 
> station integration
>
> Of course these factors don't apply to everyone. But the good news is 
> that we will no longer have to say "maybe next year" every time 
> someone asks us to add a matching speaker to the product line :)
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> Bob McGraw - K4TAX  wrote:
>
>> I use a pair of "off the shelf" brand speakers which have 2" x 4" ovals
in a nice efficient solid enclosure that is 5" deep
>
>
>
>
>


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Re: [Elecraft] KX3 TX calibration failure on 52 MHz

[Tuck Watkins]

Don, Ron, and Bernhard, 

Thank you for responding.  I now have a calibrated KX3. But I'm
uncertain if it is sufficient. Nor do I know exactly what has caused the
problem. It suspect the problem arose because of the cable or connector
from the dummy load to the KX3 was not-quite-right. If you have any
other theories I would appreciate hearing them.

Here is what I did.

In the original transmit calibration I used an MFJ Model J 280-C dummy
load .  As suggested, I tested the MFJ dummy load at 52 MHz with an
MFJ-269 SWR Analyser.  It had an SWR of 1.1 (with R=53 X=3) at 52.0 MHz.
While executing the KX3 "Manual Transmit Gain Calibration" the SWR shown
at the same frequency was 1.6 at 4.0W. The calibration produced the same
error as before.  But note that the value of "d" is always a different
number.

I checked the SWR of the Elecraft DL1 that I built when assembling my
K2. It tested at an SWR of 1.1 (with R=54 and X=4.) Running the manual
TX calibration the SWR on the KX3 was 1.4. The calibration failed with
the same error message as with the MFJ dummy load.

Both of the calibrations above were done with an antenna cable purchased
from Elecraft. So, I repeated the TX Calibration on the KX3 using a
different cable from my spares box. The SWR with both dummy loads was
the same but the test passed with the DL1 and not the MFJ.

Then I repeated the calibration with other cables. About half of these
calibrations done with the the MFJ and the DL1 failed with both dummy
loads. However, using two other cables the calibrations with the DL-1
passed but not with the MFJ. Then, with two more cables the MFJ
calibration passed and the DL-1 calibration failed.

Note that the MFJ has a PK-259 connector and the DL-1 has a BNC
connector. Since the cables I used for the calibrations vary as to which
connector combination they have I was forced to use adaptors. I suspect
the adaptors may not quite be up to snuff. 

So the calibration succeeds with some combination of cable and DL1 dummy
load or MFJ dummy load.

Tuck, W6TUK


On 09/04/2015 01:14 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> Tuck,
>
> Do you know for sure your dummy load is a good 50 ohm load at 6
> meters?  It is always good to check that with an antenna analyzer.
> Try repeating the TX Gain Calibration on 52 MHz manually from the menu.
> If it completes both 4 and 6 watts without complaint, you are 'good to
> go'.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 9/4/2015 11:30 AM, Tuck Watkins wrote:
>> The problem is the KX3 TX calibration is failing on 52 MHz at 4.0 W. I
>> would appreciate some advice on how to proceed with diagnosis and
>> correction.
[snip]
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[Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Dan Atchison via Elecraft]

I am building a switchbox to allow use of a Heil PR-781 microphone to be 
used by my K3S and K3, the switchbox using XLR connectors.  I note that 
in the Heil XLR cable ended in an 8-Pin Foster has mic low (-) tied to 
ground and (+) tied to mic high.


Knowing that the XLR pin 1 should be chassis ground, my question is, "At 
the switchbox, should I tie XLR pins 1 and 2 together and only switch 
XLR pin 3 between radios?"  IOW, should XLR pins 1 and 2 be chassis 
grounded or should I chassis ground pin 1 and switch both XLR pins 2 and 3?


Thanks in advance.

73,
Dan

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Adam Farson]

For Joe, W4TV:

To quote: "On the other hand Adam limits noise power for direct sampling SDR
designs to a lower level than used with traditional up/down conversion
transceivers.  The lower noise power input gives the direct sampling
designs an unfair advantage be ignoring strong signal environments."

As explained in my web article (and also in my QEX article), the optimum
noise loading points for an ADC and a conventional receiver are different.
In the conventional receiver, optimum noise loading is reached when the
noise power induced in the IF passband within the notch (idle-channel noise)
is equal to the DUT's intrinsic thermal noise power in the same bandwidth.
At this point, the DUT's audio output rises by 3 dB. 

Walt Kester of ADI states in ADI Tutorial MT-005 that the optimum noise
loading point for an ADC is where the device's quantisation noise equals the
noise generated by clipping, i.e. the noise loading is run right up to clip
level or 0 dBFS. I use -1 dBFS as my optimum noise loading point, to ensure
that no clipping takes place during the test. In fact, when an ADC is driven
to clip level, it crashes, thus invalidating any tests attempted above clip
level. 

I do not compare NPR test data for direct-sampling receivers directly with
data for conventional receivers. The benchmark I use for direct-sampling
receivers is the theoretical value of NPR for the ADC in use; this can be
calculated using the procedure presented in MT-005 and described in my
articles. The closer the measured NPR value is to the theoretical one, the
better the front end will perform under heavy loading. A large drop in NPR
(10 dB or more) as compared to the theoretical value indicates an anomaly
such as passive IMD in the preselector or IMD in an active stage ahead of
the ADC.

For a conventional receiver, the closer the NPR figure is to the bandstop
filter's stopband attenuation, the better the receiver (at least from the
NPR standpoint). I do not use NPR as the sole criterion for receiver
selection; my intent in adapting this test method to HF receivers is to
provide the test engineer with an additional test tool for evaluating a
receiver's behaviour on a band packed with extremely strong signals.

Along these same lines, it is virtually impossible to correlate certain
narrow-band test results for a direct-sampling receiver with those for a
conventional receiver, as the familiar traditional test metrics (DR3, IP3,
blocking gain compression) are completely meaningless in the context of an
ADC. Phase noise (RMDR) is still very much a valid parameter, but RMDR in a
direct-sampling receiver is usually very high as the ADC clock is the only
major source of phase noise. (ADC aperture jitter is a minor phase noise
source.) Of course MDS is valid for both receiver types. I have proposed,
and myself use a front-end IMD test method in which I measure the absolute
power of the IMD3 products at 2 kHz spacing over a range of input power
levels, and draw a chart. I then draw lines across the chart at the typical
ITU-R urban and rural band noise levels. If the IMD product is below the
site band noise level, it is inaudible and can thus be disregarded. I term
this test IFSS (interference-free signal strength) and use it exclusively in
my direct-sampling SDR test suite.

Ultimately, the decision as to whether to acquire a direct-sampling SDR or a
conventional transceiver comes down to the operator's personal operating
preferences.

73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Don Wilhelm]

Dan,

Jim Brown K9YC or Joe W4TV would be a better resource than I am, but if 
it were mine, I would preserve the balanced configuration through your 
switchbox and only connect the mic low to ground at each radio's plug.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/14/2015 1:12 PM, Dan Atchison via Elecraft wrote:
I am building a switchbox to allow use of a Heil PR-781 microphone to 
be used by my K3S and K3, the switchbox using XLR connectors.  I note 
that in the Heil XLR cable ended in an 8-Pin Foster has mic low (-) 
tied to ground and (+) tied to mic high.


Knowing that the XLR pin 1 should be chassis ground, my question is, 
"At the switchbox, should I tie XLR pins 1 and 2 together and only 
switch XLR pin 3 between radios?"  IOW, should XLR pins 1 and 2 be 
chassis grounded or should I chassis ground pin 1 and switch both XLR 
pins 2 and 3?




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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[ae4pb]

I guess I shouldn't have assumed anything but I did..


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of 
a...@sbcglobal.net
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 12:03 PM
To: ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne Burdick'; 'Elecraft 
Reflector'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the 
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P   


 On Monday, September 14, 2015 10:34 AM, "ae...@carolinaheli.com" 
 wrote:
   

 I believe when you consider the engineering reputation of Elecraft and 
economies of scale for the manufacture of the SP3 several expectations
arise:
1. This is likely a very well-engineered component that's not easily replaced 
by a similar sized speaker. 
2. Performance of the speaker exceeds similarly priced speakers (and definitely 
less expensive ones to a degree). 
3. There is NOT likely a premium baked in to the price for the Elecraft name 
due to the economies of scale (low quantity manufacture generally means higher 
costs, thus higher price). Translation - the price isn't just for the name.

At the end of the day consider the labor costs plus parts are likely fairly 
high if they are US manufactured. 

The US consumer is the sole reason most US manufacturing has gone overseas 
(especially China). Buy cheap, get cheap.

So it comes down to a question of quality vs "good enough" vs "price" 

I can only speak for myself in saying that it means something to have a 
matching set rather than a hodgepodge. 
I do compromise and use what I have to be able to get the job done UNTIL I've 
saved enough for the next piece. 

Personally the SP3 is last on my list because most if not all of my operating 
will be with headphones. 
The point here is that it's on my list :)



Jerry Moore
AE4PB, K3S SN# Arrives Wed. 






-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bob 
McGraw - K4TAX
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 3:28 PM
To: Wayne Burdick; Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

New products are always welcome.  I look forward to "hearing them" at maybe one 
of the next ham fests.  I like the fact the SP3 uses an oval speaker.
I've never figured out exactly why, but I find ovals typically do sound better 
than rounds, but maybe it seems to be only in my findings.

As a comment, I prefer non-amplified speakers as this avoids the potential RFI 
issues when used with the radio.  The model that I mentioned and use has a 
slight tilt to the bottom which aligns the front with the K3S with its front 
elevated by the stand.

I also find the audio system in the K3S to be really nice, specially the
2 channel effect using the AFX feature along with a stereo speaker 
configuration.  This give a nice wide spatial effect to which I find very 
pleasing.  Thanks Wayne and company for doing a fine job with the K3S and its 
new features.

73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 9/13/2015 2:09 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> The K3 or K3S will work with a wide range of speakers, including the 
> ones
Bob (K4TAX) mentioned.
>
> Here are some possible reasons for using an SP3:
>
> - matches the K-Line perfectly, including a rugged fold-up tilt stand
> - full stereo A/B source selection, supporting dual-rig and 
> dual-speaker configurations (or both)
> - plenty of room inside the cabinet for built-ins that might improve 
> station integration
>
> Of course these factors don't apply to everyone. But the good news is 
> that we will no longer have to say "maybe next year" every time 
> someone asks us to add a matching speaker to the product line :)
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> Bob McGraw - K4TAX  wrote:
>
>> I use a pair of "off the shelf" brand speakers which have 2" x 4" 
>> ovals
in a nice efficient solid enclosure that is 5" deep
>
>
>
>
>


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Re: [Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Jim Brown]

On Mon,9/14/2015 10:25 AM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
I would preserve the balanced configuration through your switchbox and 
only connect the mic low to ground at each radio's plug.


As usual, we agree. :)

73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

On 9/14/2015 1:25 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

if it were mine, I would preserve the balanced configuration through
your switchbox and only connect the mic low to ground at each radio's
plug.


*Absolutely* ... connect the *shield* of the XLR cable to chassis and
switch both mic + and mic - carrying both wires all the way through to
the transceiver.  At the transceiver the shield should be connected to
the *shell* of the Foster plug which should, in turn, be bonded to the
*case/chassis* of the transceiver.

Connecting a shield via a connector pin to a circuit board then via a
"long" trace back to the chassis/case (power supply return), is the
very definition of the "pin 1 problem."  Every amateur transceiver has
a pin 1 problem and most third party accessories have to deal with that
issue in their own (typically non-standard) way.

73,

  ... Joe, W4TV


On 9/14/2015 1:25 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

Dan,

Jim Brown K9YC or Joe W4TV would be a better resource than I am, but if
it were mine, I would preserve the balanced configuration through your
switchbox and only connect the mic low to ground at each radio's plug.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/14/2015 1:12 PM, Dan Atchison via Elecraft wrote:

I am building a switchbox to allow use of a Heil PR-781 microphone to
be used by my K3S and K3, the switchbox using XLR connectors.  I note
that in the Heil XLR cable ended in an 8-Pin Foster has mic low (-)
tied to ground and (+) tied to mic high.

Knowing that the XLR pin 1 should be chassis ground, my question is,
"At the switchbox, should I tie XLR pins 1 and 2 together and only
switch XLR pin 3 between radios?"  IOW, should XLR pins 1 and 2 be
chassis grounded or should I chassis ground pin 1 and switch both XLR
pins 2 and 3?



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Re: [Elecraft] P3 TX Mon: FEATURE REQUEST - Monitoring of RTTY Waveform

[Joe Subich, W4TV]

On 9/14/2015 2:55 PM, Luis V. Romero wrote:
>

However, I can't monitor other issues that can rear their ugly heads
in RTTY, be it modulated by FSK or AFSK with the existing
functionality available: The reason I was looking for a better visual
representation of these issues in this tool is explained in an
excellent article by Andy Flowers, K0SM.

>
> http://frontiernet.net/~aflowers/k3rtty/k3rtty.html

The displays generated by K0SM are frequency domain ... TX MON is
strictly a time domain (amplitude) display.  TX Mon uses a amplitude
detector driven by a directional coupler.  To do what you desire would
require an SDR tuned by frequency data (TX frequency) from the K3.

The difference between an envelope (diode) detector and a tracking SDR
is a couple of orders of magnitude in both cost and complexity.

73,

  ... Joe, W4TV


On 9/14/2015 2:55 PM, Luis V. Romero wrote:

Alan:



You wrote:

It gets more interesting if there is a problem

  in the RTTY transmitter that causes the two tones to come out at

  different amplitudes, which would be easy to see on the screen.



In your example, you would see ripple in the flat waveform on the screen,
true enough.  The Ripple would increase with the amount of the different
amplitudes of the two tones.



However, I can't monitor other issues that can rear their ugly heads in
RTTY, be it modulated by FSK or AFSK with the existing functionality
available:  The reason I was looking for a better visual representation of
these issues in this tool is explained in an excellent article by Andy
Flowers, K0SM.



http://frontiernet.net/~aflowers/k3rtty/k3rtty.html



Gee, it would be nice not to have to buy a Flex rig just to monitor my K3's
output. And I already have an SDR receiver sitting inside the P3 box, locked
to my transmitter frequency.



You wrote:

The traditional "plus sign" (crossed ellipses) display is normally used

  in the FSK receiving demodulator as a tuning aid.  As you tune the

  receiver the ellipses change their angle.  When you see the "plus sign"

  then the receiver is tuned correctly.



Not just for receive, but in transmit as well.  Especially in tone modulated
RTTY (pseudo FSK) using AFSK "tone" modulation.  If one tone is off, it
would be shown in the transmission ellipsoid representation as well.  When
you see a "plus sign", both tones are in phase and in quadrature.  But if
one tone is out of quadrature?  Then you see an ellipse.  We deal with this
daily in the representation of Trellis modulation artifacts in ATV
transmitters.  There we call it "The Eye Pattern". Same display principle.



While the dual ellipse waveform would be ideal, there are alternatives, In
receive, we can see similar information in the two tone demodulation
"envelope" showing two peaks with a valley in between using a single
envelope detector as described bu K0SM. Why not avail us of at least that
waveform, since you already can show it on receive in the P3
hardware/software?  With some handles on the display for gain, width, slope
and maybe a synthetic "mask", it solves this requirement!



You wrote:

You can also see if the transmitter has the wrong (or at least

  different) frequency shift.  In that case the ellipses don't make a

  right angle with each other even when the receiver is tuned correctly.



True and correct.  And I agree.



You wrote:

  That might be useful in a transmit monitor, but it can't be done using

   An RF coupler because it only detects the amplitude, not the frequency.



True: Not the *quadrature* (two ellipsoids) display. But you *can* show the
dual peak/valley display. You already show it on receive!  It is an
equivalent 2-D representation that can be used in addition to the flat
envelope display.  But, alas, I can't see it in transmit (yes, I could
unplug the control cable to see IF "bleedthrough", but what a pain!). The
way it is now, I can only tell folks I am receiving that they are having
problems.  I can't proactively solve my own problems before I transmit with
my monitoring tool!



I don't know. Maybe I'm just old fashioned, but I'm really disappointed to
have waited 5 years and paid $200 for this simple envelope sampler
functionality using a repurposed WM2 sampling bridge.  I sort of expected
more. Maybe not in hardware, but in the application software, as all
hardware for this type of measurement is synthesized in apps anymore.  For
$200 more I could have gotten a Wavenode WN-2, but then I have wasted the
wattmeter again and I would need another PC to run the app software.  But
the funniest thing is that the P3 can display an equivalent waveform today
in receive that does what I need for transmission monitoring!



I'm still no better off and $200 poorer than where I was with my Bench
Oscilloscope and a 17 inch piece of hook up wire, and that is the issue.
It's the first time I have been disappointed by an Elecraft product.





Lu - W4LT





__

Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

[Fred Townsend]

Dick:
Relays? Sure, easy to do. Power relays are often used in many kinds
equipment. They are sometimes called 'contactors'. They are either big and
clunky or small and unreliable. Which kind do you want and what are you
willing to pay?
73
Fred, AE6QL


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
Richard Fjeld
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 1:01 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

I would think you could wire a relay with a diode in the path to the coil so
that it would not operate if the polarity of the power leads are reversed.
That way, there would be negligible voltage drop when operated.

Dick,n0ce


On 9/13/2015 10:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> The base K3 is protected by an in-line diode that will not allow 
> reverse voltage to flow.
> The same is not true of the KPA3 where the reduction in voltage would 
> not be tolerable.
> The KPA3 is protected by a circuit breaker, but in this case did not 
> trip in time to prevent damage.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 9/13/2015 10:55 PM, James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft wrote:
>> Whew!
>>
>> Not a good feeling-but it can happen to any of us, regardless of how 
>> careful we are.
>>
>> Elecraft has been very good on suggesting helpful modifications to 
>> the radio.  Any thoughts? Perhaps an in-line diode?
>>
>> I'm not sure if that would result in a significant voltage drop-just 
>> a thought.
>>
>>
>
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[Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Adam Farson]

Hi Jim,

 

To quote:

 

"If the test is designed to show response of the receiver to a lot of strong
signals such as are present in a contesting or DX pileup environment, or as
are present in a multi-transmitter site, the signal level should be
consistent with that environment, NOT with the design of the receiver."

 

My explanation of the optimum noise loading point was intended to clarify
the test procedure. As it happens, the optimum noise loading point for an
ADC is also the clipping point, which is the limiting case for a
direct-sampling receiver with an ADC at RF.

 

I state clearly in my test reports for direct-sampling SDR's that I am
testing NPR just below the clip point. This hard limit dictates the maximum
aggregate signal power at which the receiver can still be expected to
demodulate signals correctly (assuming no attenuation is inserted ahead of
the ADC). I cannot perform the test above ADC clipping, as it will then
yield no usable results. In practice, some attenuation can often be inserted
to extend the upper power limit of the ADC, especially on the lower HF bands
where the band noise level is usually several dB above the receiver's noise
floor. 

 

I have applied noise loading levels as high as -1 to 0 dBm when testing some
direct-sampling SDR receivers. This is equivalent to approx. 1000 contiguous
SSB voice channels, all transmitting simultaneously at S9 + 40 dB each.

 

In the final analysis, it is up to the radio buyer to decide whether or not
a direct-sampling SDR can handle his chosen operating environment. 

 

73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ

 

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Cliff Frescura]

Didn't ask. But the web site lists the SP3 at $179

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Brian
& Cyndi
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 1:06 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Did the boys at HamCon quote a price for the speaker?

73,
Brian, W6FVI


On 9/14/2015 11:51 AM, Cliff Frescura wrote:
> I don't know where it is made, but I was able to see one in the flesh 
> at HamCon this past weekend and it has a solid feel and weight to it 
> (in addition to sounding great too).  Seems like a no brainer addition to
me.
>
> One wish would be to have the headphone jack on the speaker and use 
> the input switch (as an output switch) to switch between headphone and 
> speaker, so that the headphones can stay plugged in (I modified my 
> SP-940 to work this way)
>
> 73,
>
> Cliff K3LL/6
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of 
> ae...@carolinaheli.com
> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 10:39 AM
> To: a...@sbcglobal.net; ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 
> 'Wayne Burdick'; 'Elecraft Reflector'
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details
>
> I guess I shouldn't have assumed anything but I did..
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of 
> a...@sbcglobal.net
> Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 12:03 PM
> To: ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne Burdick'; 
> 'Elecraft Reflector'
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details
>
> Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made 
> in the USA.  Is that true??
> Mike  AC5P
>
>
>   On Monday, September 14, 2015 10:34 AM, "ae...@carolinaheli.com"
>  wrote:
> 
>
>   I believe when you consider the engineering reputation of Elecraft 
> and economies of scale for the manufacture of the SP3 several 
> expectations
> arise:
> 1. This is likely a very well-engineered component that's not easily 
> replaced by a similar sized speaker.
> 2. Performance of the speaker exceeds similarly priced speakers (and 
> definitely less expensive ones to a degree).
> 3. There is NOT likely a premium baked in to the price for the 
> Elecraft name due to the economies of scale (low quantity manufacture 
> generally means higher costs, thus higher price). Translation - the 
> price isn't just for the name.
>
> At the end of the day consider the labor costs plus parts are likely 
> fairly high if they are US manufactured.
>
> The US consumer is the sole reason most US manufacturing has gone 
> overseas (especially China). Buy cheap, get cheap.
>
> So it comes down to a question of quality vs "good enough" vs "price"
>
> I can only speak for myself in saying that it means something to have 
> a matching set rather than a hodgepodge.
> I do compromise and use what I have to be able to get the job done 
> UNTIL I've saved enough for the next piece.
>
> Personally the SP3 is last on my list because most if not all of my 
> operating will be with headphones.
> The point here is that it's on my list :)
>
>
>
> Jerry Moore
> AE4PB, K3S SN# Arrives Wed.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of 
> Bob McGraw - K4TAX
> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 3:28 PM
> To: Wayne Burdick; Elecraft Reflector
> Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details
>
> New products are always welcome.  I look forward to "hearing them" at 
> maybe one of the next ham fests.  I like the fact the SP3 uses an oval
speaker.
> I've never figured out exactly why, but I find ovals typically do 
> sound better than rounds, but maybe it seems to be only in my findings.
>
> As a comment, I prefer non-amplified speakers as this avoids the 
> potential RFI issues when used with the radio.  The model that I 
> mentioned and use has a slight tilt to the bottom which aligns the 
> front with the K3S with its front elevated by the stand.
>
> I also find the audio system in the K3S to be really nice, specially 
> the
> 2 channel effect using the AFX feature along with a stereo speaker 
> configuration.  This give a nice wide spatial effect to which I find 
> very pleasing.  Thanks Wayne and company for doing a fine job with the 
> K3S and its new features.
>
> 73
> Bob, K4TAX
> K3S s/n 10,163
>
> On 9/13/2015 2:09 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> The K3 or K3S will work with a wide range of speakers, including the 
>> ones
> Bob (K4TAX) mentioned.
>> Here are some possible reasons for using an SP3:
>>
>> - matches the K-Line perfectly, including a rugged fold-up tilt stand
>> - full stereo A/B source selection, supporting dual-rig and 
>> dual-speaker configurations (or both)
>> - plenty of room inside the cabinet for built-ins that might improve 
>> station integration
>>
>> Of course these 

Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Width Control and AF Output Level

[Keith Onishi]

My friend informed me that setting 0 to all section of RX EQ solved the AF 
output level change issue.
Many thanks to all for your suggestions.

73 de JH3SIF, Keith

> 2015/09/14 18:12、Mike K2MK  のメール：
> 
> Hi Keith,
> 
> I think the problem is in the setting for the RXEQ. You do not want to use
> +db boost for CW. As I understand it, RXEQ is disabled at 100Hz and 50Hz
> width. So if he has boosted a particular frequency by 10db then when he
> narrows the bandwidth he will suddenly hear a loss of audio signal of 10db.
> To solve this problem keep the RXEQ set to 0 db for the frequencies of
> interest and use negative db settings for the frequencies of no interest.
> 
> 73,
> Mike K2MK
> 
> 
> Keith Onishi wrote
>> One of my friend K3 users report that AF output level with 100Hz passband
>> width is lower than with 150Hz passband width. He also reported that a
>> noise like “Ptsu” was generated on reducing passband width from 150Hz to
>> 100Hz. He had guessed that these were specific to his K3, but some other
>> K3 users including myself reported the same.
>> Some extreme users who use this narrow passband may have been bothered by
>> this reduced AF output level and noise. If the AF output level change is
>> caused by K3 DSP filter design or program, adding automatic gain
>> compensation feature to keep same AF output level would be highly welcome.
>> 
>> 73 de JH3SIF, Keith
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --
> View this message in context: 
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-Width-Control-and-AF-Output-Level-tp7607595p7607610.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - rig control using Linux

[Tuck Watkins]

As has been mentioned GRIG will give you rig control in Linux Mint. It
is loadable through the Synaptic Package manager. (If you are using the
Linux Mint Whisker Menu the Synaptic Package Manager is referred to
simply as Package Manager under the System.)

I mostly use fldigi for digital modes so I use the rig control
functionality it offers. Again as mentioned by another lit member, the
fldigi folks do have a separate rig control program called flrig. It is
loadable through the Linux Mint package facilities

Sadly, Elecraft's support for Linux is tepid.

Tuck, W6TUK

On 09/11/2015 12:36 PM, Bill wrote:
> I have gotten most everything moved from Windows over to Linux (Mint 17)
> - even a very good clone of Quicken. Now I have one hold out - HRD. I am
> sure that will never be written for Linux - they have enough problems
> keeping it all working under Windows. I have a Pigknob which I can
> easily control the functions I need on the K3, but I really would like
> something on the screen I can chase with a mouse.
> 
> The Elecraft Frequency Memory Editor is nice, but only under Windows.
> 
> I am only interested in rig control - no QSLs, beam headings, or other
> stuff is needed or desired.
> 
> Anything out there for Linux you can think of?
> 
> Not really a deal killer, as I can always run two computers - one for
> HRD and one for everything else. But, I really would like to be shed of
> Windows.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Bill W2BLC - K3-Line
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Jim Brown]

On Mon,9/14/2015 10:12 AM, Dan Atchison via Elecraft wrote:
I am building a switchbox to allow use of a Heil PR-781 microphone to 
be used by my K3S and K3, the switchbox using XLR connectors.  I note 
that in the Heil XLR cable ended in an 8-Pin Foster has mic low (-) 
tied to ground and (+) tied to mic high.


Knowing that the XLR pin 1 should be chassis ground, my question is, 
"At the switchbox, should I tie XLR pins 1 and 2 together and only 
switch XLR pin 3 between radios?"  IOW, should XLR pins 1 and 2 be 
chassis grounded or should I chassis ground pin 1 and switch both XLR 
pins 2 and 3?


The answer is that it depends on the kind of cable used -- single 
conductor plus shield with mic low on the shield, or twisted pair plus 
shield, with the mic low not connected to the shield.


If twisted pair plus shield, carry mic high and mic low to their 
designated pins on rig, and connect the cable shield to the shielding 
enclosure (the chassis, in a K3 or K3S). For any shielded twisted pair 
going to an unbalanced input, the connection between one side of the 
audio and the chassis should be at the radio input. This allows audio to 
stay on the twisted pair, which inherently rejects noise by virtue of 
its twisting.


If a single conductor plus shield, connect mic high in the cable to mic 
high in the radio, and the cable shield to the chassis. In your plan, 
you would want to switch everything but the shields.


NEVER connect a cable shield to a return pin unless that pin has a 
direct short to the chassis at the connector. To do so is, by 
definition, a Pin One Problem, and a major cause of hum, buzz, and RFI.


73, Jim K9YC

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Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

[Mel Farrer via Elecraft]

You guys are working too hard on this.  Here goes:
Take a bridge rectifier, preferably a Schottky with proper current and voltage 
rating.  Tie the + to the radio + tie the - to the radio -.  And I don't care 
what polarity you put on the AC terminals it always give the radio the proper 
polarity,  I put a little box on the back of every portable radio when we go 
camping etc.  That is after my brother reversed the polarity on my TS-50 and we 
let the smoke out.
Mel, K6KBE

  From: Fred Townsend 
 To: 'Richard Fjeld' ; elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
 Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 3:13 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply
   
Dick:
Relays? Sure, easy to do. Power relays are often used in many kinds
equipment. They are sometimes called 'contactors'. They are either big and
clunky or small and unreliable. Which kind do you want and what are you
willing to pay?
73
Fred, AE6QL


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
Richard Fjeld
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 1:01 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

I would think you could wire a relay with a diode in the path to the coil so
that it would not operate if the polarity of the power leads are reversed.
That way, there would be negligible voltage drop when operated.

Dick,n0ce


On 9/13/2015 10:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> The base K3 is protected by an in-line diode that will not allow 
> reverse voltage to flow.
> The same is not true of the KPA3 where the reduction in voltage would 
> not be tolerable.
> The KPA3 is protected by a circuit breaker, but in this case did not 
> trip in time to prevent damage.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 9/13/2015 10:55 PM, James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft wrote:
>> Whew!
>>
>> Not a good feeling-but it can happen to any of us, regardless of how 
>> careful we are.
>>
>> Elecraft has been very good on suggesting helpful modifications to 
>> the radio.  Any thoughts? Perhaps an in-line diode?
>>
>> I'm not sure if that would result in a significant voltage drop-just 
>> a thought.
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[mfsj]

OMG OM cheap at twice the price 8>)
Fred/N0AZZ


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S6 edge+, an AT 4G LTE smartphone 
Original message From: Mike Reublin NF4L  Date: 
09/14/2015  6:11 PM  (GMT-06:00) To: Cliff Frescura  Cc: 
Elecraft List  Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 
External Speaker details 
I can't imagine what makes it cost that much. Too rich for my anemic blood.

73, Mike NF4L


> On Sep 14, 2015, at 4:24 PM, Cliff Frescura  wrote:
> 
> Didn't ask. But the web site lists the SP3 at $179

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Mike Reublin NF4L]

Not even at half that. Maybe it's a misplaced decimal punkt. . . . . .

73, Mike NF4L


> On Sep 14, 2015, at 7:24 PM, mfsj  wrote:
> 
> OMG OM cheap at twice the price 8>)
> 
> Fred/N0AZZ

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Bob McGraw - K4TAX]

Maintain the signal path integrity all the way through the switching 
arrangement.  That means 3 poles to switch from the XLR input  to the 8 
pin Foster connectors.  Keep all away from chassis ground.  If you 
believe the box should be grounded, I suggest doing so at the input XLR 
pin #1 to chassis ground.   And keep ground between the outputs, being 
the Foster connectors, separate so as not to connect the two radios 
together through the shield/ground.


73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 9/14/2015 12:12 PM, Dan Atchison via Elecraft wrote:
I am building a switchbox to allow use of a Heil PR-781 microphone to 
be used by my K3S and K3, the switchbox using XLR connectors.  I note 
that in the Heil XLR cable ended in an 8-Pin Foster has mic low (-) 
tied to ground and (+) tied to mic high.


Knowing that the XLR pin 1 should be chassis ground, my question is, 
"At the switchbox, should I tie XLR pins 1 and 2 together and only 
switch XLR pin 3 between radios?"  IOW, should XLR pins 1 and 2 be 
chassis grounded or should I chassis ground pin 1 and switch both XLR 
pins 2 and 3?


Thanks in advance.

73,
Dan

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Anthony Scandurra]

Have any of you who are complaining seen the prices of speakers from other
radio manufacturers?  How about the other third-party speaker makers?
Elecraft is in the ballpark.

A lot of folks asked (begged, bugged, pestered...) Elecraft to come out
with a speaker for the line.  They finally relented.  Thank you, Elecraft!

73, Tony K4QE
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Vic Rosenthal]

I bought a K2 the year it came out and I have one of the first K3s. I still 
hate the tap/hold interface. I paid what I feel was an obscene amount of money 
for a set of heavy, machined VFO knobs to replace the stock ones. I wish the K3 
had more room for controls, so there would be less overloading of functions.

But all this pales into insignificance when I dial down the selectivity and 
pick out the weak one in the midst of the pounding 20-over signals from nearby 
EU stations. And then there is the improvement in copy from diversity reception!

Everyone has different interests. Mine is to work DX on CW. Satisfaction 
doesn't come from a comfortable interface, but rather from achieving one's 
goals. The K3 is simply the best tool available to do that.

Vic 4X6GP/K2VCO 

> On Sep 14, 2015, at 10:51 PM, Luis V. Romero  wrote:
> 
> All:
> 
> 
> 
> OK, I will jump in on this one.  It's close to my heart.
> 
> 
> 
> My closest local ham friends are IC-7800 owners.  All 5 of them.  All of
> them have larger and taller antennas than I do.  I can hear everything they
> hear and, though I'm at a 500w transmitter disadvantage viz their kilowatt
> amplifiers, I can and do work everything they work with my K3.
> 
> 
> 
> My local club (Tampa Amateur Radio Club) is a 100% Icom facility with a
> 7700, two 7600'ds, one 746Pro and a 7100 in their HF "studios"  (more like
> "cubicles": there are 6 of them - one is reserved for "classic" AM rigs)  
> 
> 
> 
> I operated SS SSB two years in succession (2010 and 2011) at our clubhouse
> SOABLP using identical antennas (a C31XR at 108 feet, a EF240 at 118 feet, a
> C19X at 70 feet and a 80m Dipole at 90 ft).  In 2010 I used the club 7700.
> The receiver sounded really crunchy, much like my former TS850.  Lots or
> crackly splatter, lots of adjacent desense.  I use that rig often, so I know
> how to drive it.  It is never pleasant to use that rig in heavy QRM contest
> conditions.  The same can be said for the 7600'ds.  The 746 and the 7100 are
> worse by a long shot to the 7700.
> 
> 
> 
> The following year, I brought my K3 to the club and operated SS using the
> club's identical antenna complement.  Not once did I hear any crunching in
> the receiver, no splatter mess and no desense.  The contest was much more
> pleasant on the ears and all signals were much easier to copy on the K3 than
> on the 7700 receiver.
> 
> 
> 
> I love using the 7700, but not in a serious contesting environment. It
> reminds me of my  old TS850.  But I still love to use it!  The reason is the
> tactile feel of the 7700 and, a bit less by the same token, the 7600'ds
> feels like that too.  While the K3 layout is fine and very workable, the
> controls on the Icoms are just so incredibly smooth!  The "feeling of
> Luxury" is exuded by the 7700'ds tactile feedback from its controls.  As a
> NY friend says "It feels like buttah!". It's a hard concept to explain, but
> the feel of the Icom controls is really special. My K3 feels OK, just not as
> "silky" as the 7700'd. 
> 
> 
> 
> Kind of like cars. Drive a Lexus SC430 for show, and a Lotus Elise for go.
> Two sports cars for different priorities.
> 
> 
> 
> If you are into luxury feel, "free" logo'd leather jackets, and 70lb
> transceivers that "feel like buttah", the 78/7700'ds are a great choice.  If
> you are into well behaved receivers, high operational performance in a
> compact, under 10lb lightweight package, the choice is obvious.
> 
> 
> 
> Takes all kinds to make a world!  I have my priorities, you have yours. 
> 
> 
> 
> Lu - W4LT
> 
> K-Line
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Eric Swartz - WA6HHQ, Elecraft]

Yes, the SP3 is made in California, as are all of our radios.

73,
Eric
/elecraft.com/

On 9/14/2015 9:02 AM, a...@sbcglobal.net wrote:

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the 
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P


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Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

[Ian]

Try this:  http://ad5x.com/images/Articles/Vprotect.pdf
73, Ian N8IK 


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Mel 
Farrer via Elecraft
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 18:31
To: Fred Townsend ; 'Richard Fjeld' 
; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

You guys are working too hard on this.  Here goes:
Take a bridge rectifier, preferably a Schottky with proper current and voltage 
rating.  Tie the + to the radio + tie the - to the radio -.  And I don't care 
what polarity you put on the AC terminals it always give the radio the proper 
polarity,  I put a little box on the back of every portable radio when we go 
camping etc.  That is after my brother reversed the polarity on my TS-50 and we 
let the smoke out.
Mel, K6KBE

  From: Fred Townsend 
 To: 'Richard Fjeld' ; elecraft@mailman.qth.net
 Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 3:13 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply
   
Dick:
Relays? Sure, easy to do. Power relays are often used in many kinds equipment. 
They are sometimes called 'contactors'. They are either big and clunky or small 
and unreliable. Which kind do you want and what are you willing to pay?
73
Fred, AE6QL


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Richard 
Fjeld
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 1:01 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

I would think you could wire a relay with a diode in the path to the coil so 
that it would not operate if the polarity of the power leads are reversed.
That way, there would be negligible voltage drop when operated.

Dick,n0ce


On 9/13/2015 10:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
> The base K3 is protected by an in-line diode that will not allow 
> reverse voltage to flow.
> The same is not true of the KPA3 where the reduction in voltage would 
> not be tolerable.
> The KPA3 is protected by a circuit breaker, but in this case did not 
> trip in time to prevent damage.
>
> 73,
> Don W3FPR
>
> On 9/13/2015 10:55 PM, James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft wrote:
>> Whew!
>>
>> Not a good feeling-but it can happen to any of us, regardless of how 
>> careful we are.
>>
>> Elecraft has been very good on suggesting helpful modifications to 
>> the radio.  Any thoughts? Perhaps an in-line diode?
>>
>> I'm not sure if that would result in a significant voltage drop-just 
>> a thought.
>>
>>
>
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[Elecraft] my K3S build

[Ian]

I put together a slide show of my K3S build for my local club:
http://www.n8ik.net/building_an_Elecraft_K3S.pdf

Comments/corrections welcomed.

73, Ian N8IK

K3S s/n 10111

 

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Doug Person via Elecraft]

I have to admit that I, too, find $179 for a passive speaker in a metal 
cabinet shockingly expensive.  I was expecting $99.  The price just gets 
a shrug and an "Oh well.." from me.  Not a chance I would spend that 
kind of money on a speaker just because it matches the K-Line.


Doug -- K0DXV

On 9/14/2015 5:42 PM, Mike Reublin NF4L wrote:

Not even at half that. Maybe it's a misplaced decimal punkt. . . . . .

73, Mike NF4L



On Sep 14, 2015, at 7:24 PM, mfsj  wrote:

OMG OM cheap at twice the price 8>)

Fred/N0AZZ

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Re: [Elecraft] K3/K3S Pin 1 question

[Brian Denley]

I agree with Don as well here.  I use a Behringer Shark DSP110 which has both 
balanced XLR and 1/4 inch mono inputs and outputs that can be set to line or 
mic levels.  It also provides a noise gate and mic gain if you need it.  You 
can stay balanced as far as you want.   It was ~$50 used.
Brian 
KB1VBF
Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 14, 2015, at 5:52 PM, Jim Brown  wrote:
> 
>> On Mon,9/14/2015 10:25 AM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
>> I would preserve the balanced configuration through your switchbox and only 
>> connect the mic low to ground at each radio's plug.
> 
> As usual, we agree. :)
> 
> 73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]

[Harry Yingst via Elecraft]

Looks sharp, Looks like I need to make a little more room on the desk


  From: Wayne Burdick 
 To: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com 
Cc: Elecraft Reflector  
 Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 9:13 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]
   
Here are two much better photos of the SP3:

  http://www.elecraft.com/K3/sp3_2a.jpg
  http://www.elecraft.com/K3/sp3_1a.jpg

73,
Wayne
N6KR

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Re: [Elecraft] [Bulk] Re: Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]

[Ken Alexander]

Ha!  You should have been here when someone announced a new ICOM rig on 
the list a few weeks back...it was endless!


73,

Ken Alexander
VE3HLS


On 2015-09-14 11:11 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:
OK, just curious here, how can a simple speaker with nice looking 
enclosure get this much traffic on the list?  I'm pretty sure it 
doesn't have any DSP firmware, I don't think it has any IMD figures, 
and I'm very sure it doesn't need any 8 MHz roofing filters.


I may buy one [SO1R here], just for the looks, my KPA500 may be headed 
for the auction block, I'll have a flag pole antenna, but I really 
don't want to electrocute the neighbor kids or the bunnies who eat my 
grass. Remote to W7RN will happen soon too.


73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 50th Running of the Cal QSO Party 3-4 Oct 2015
- www.cqp.org

On 9/14/2015 7:44 PM, Harry Yingst via Elecraft wrote:

Looks sharp, Looks like I need to make a little more room on the desk




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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Gary]

I actually owned an FTDX9000 and the matching speaker.

This is just my observation, the speaker was a disappointment, BUT, the 9000's 
internal speakers were excellent. Amazing quality noticed by my really not good 
hearing as well as Tinitus.

I have now moved to headphones for serious operating, casual use I find the 
newly upgraded audio on my k3 pretty good.

Gary 

-Original Message-
From: "k...@arrl.net" 
Sent: ‎15/‎09/‎2015 2:54 PM
To: "'Elecraft Reflector'" 
Subject: [Elecraft]   Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Or for the same price as 2 SP3's

 http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/speakers/1301.html


73 Jeff kb2m



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[Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft]

How about this one:

http://www.hamradio.com/detail.cfm?pid=H0-011764#results 

Of note, I've never used the passive audio filters on this or the SP-20.

'73 de JIM N2ZZ


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Gene
Gabry
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 11:01 PM
To: 'Elecraft Reflector'
Subject: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details



Very good point Tony
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/speakers/1696.html

Puts things into perspective :) 

73 Gene N9TF

K3S 10057

>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

>Have any of you who are complaining seen the prices of speakers from 
>other
radio manufacturers?  How about the other third-party speaker makers?
>Elecraft is in the ballpark.

>A lot of folks asked (begged, bugged, pestered...) Elecraft to come out
with a speaker for the line.  They finally relented.  Thank you, Elecraft!

>73, Tony K4QE
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]

[Walter Underwood]

Honestly, I’d keep the KPA500 just to take out the occasional raccoon.

wunder
K6WRU
CM87wj
http://observer.wunderwood.org/ (my blog)

> On Sep 14, 2015, at 8:11 PM, Fred Jensen  wrote:
> 
> OK, just curious here, how can a simple speaker with nice looking enclosure 
> get this much traffic on the list?  I'm pretty sure it doesn't have any DSP 
> firmware, I don't think it has any IMD figures, and I'm very sure it doesn't 
> need any 8 MHz roofing filters.
> 
> I may buy one [SO1R here], just for the looks, my KPA500 may be headed for 
> the auction block, I'll have a flag pole antenna, but I really don't want to 
> electrocute the neighbor kids or the bunnies who eat my grass. Remote to W7RN 
> will happen soon too.
> 
> 73,
> 
> Fred K6DGW
> - Northern California Contest Club
> - CU in the 50th Running of the Cal QSO Party 3-4 Oct 2015
> - www.cqp.org
> 
> On 9/14/2015 7:44 PM, Harry Yingst via Elecraft wrote:
>> Looks sharp, Looks like I need to make a little more room on the desk
>> 
>> 
> 
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[Elecraft] SP3 A/B

[Dauer, Edward]

Very nice; thanks.  I will probably get in line to order one.  But a
question - what tricks can the A/B switch on the front do?  In particular
- if I have one SP3, the K3 menu configuration set to spkr 1, a headset in
the front headset socket of the K3 listening to stereo using the sub RX on
split, and I push the A/B, can it be programmed to turn on the speaker
mono?  And then, with just another press, turn the speaker off and return
me to headset split / stereo?

Tnx,

Ted, KN1CBR


>Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 18:13:21 -0700
>From: Wayne Burdick 
>To: elecraft...@yahoogroups.com
>Cc: Elecraft Reflector 
>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated
>   photos]
>Message-ID: 
>Content-Type: text/plain;  charset=us-ascii
>
>Here are two much better photos of the SP3:
>
>   http://www.elecraft.com/K3/sp3_2a.jpg
>   http://www.elecraft.com/K3/sp3_1a.jpg
>
>73,
>Wayne
>N6KR
>

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Gary]

Johnny,

It will (as it should) carry the stigma of being a copy from a serial offender 
and it may indeed be adequate in performance for many, but it would never carry 
the reputation of quality that comes from being a genuine Elecraft product.

The market will decide how well the SP3 is accepted just as the market will 
decide on any alternative offerings from other manufacturers.

Some if not many of us will choose the SP3, over any alternative, others will 
make their own choice.

It's a free world (up to a point)   I choose Elecraft.

I borrowed 2cents to throw in here. Our dollar has sunk so low I need a 
submarine to find  it.
Gary 

-Original Message-
From: "Johnny Siu" 
Sent: ‎15/‎09/‎2015 1:43 PM
To: "Doug Person" ; "elecraft@mailman.qth.net" 

Subject: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

With my due respect to intellectual right, I would feel this price tag will 
trigger a Chinese variant at 1/3 price with similar appearance but unknown 
quality.
73
Johnny VR2XMC
  寄件人︰ Doug Person via Elecraft 
 收件人︰ elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
 傳送日期︰ 2015年09月15日 (週二) 10:15 AM
 主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details
   
I have to admit that I, too, find $179 for a passive speaker in a metal 
cabinet shockingly expensive.  I was expecting $99.  The price just gets 
a shrug and an "Oh well.." from me.  Not a chance I would spend that 
kind of money on a speaker just because it matches the K-Line.

Doug -- K0DXV

On 9/14/2015 5:42 PM, Mike Reublin NF4L wrote:
> Not even at half that. Maybe it's a misplaced decimal punkt. . . . . .
>
> 73, Mike NF4L
>
>
>> On Sep 14, 2015, at 7:24 PM, mfsj  wrote:
>>
>> OMG OM cheap at twice the price 8>)
>>
>> Fred/N0AZZ
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

[Vic Rosenthal]

Here's an idea to consider -- when I built mine I made the shelf out of 3/4" 
plywood with 1 x 4's attached to the front and back of the shelf. Screws and 
glue. This makes the actual thickness of the shelf about 3-1/2", but makes it 
strong enough that you don't need vertical supports except at the ends. 
Vertical supports always seem to be in the wrong places! 

Vic 4X6GP/K2VCO 

> On Sep 14, 2015, at 10:28 PM,  
>  wrote:
> 
> It's been a while and I'm a huge proponent of measure twice cut once. I'm
> building a hutch for my operating desk. The desk is 4' wide x 28" deep (2'
> 4"). I'm right handed and my primary mode will be CW. I have both a Bencher
> paddle and a generic straight key. I need about 18" wide for my K3S and
> future P3. The K3S is 10"x10"x7.25"(stand extended and air gap above it.
> Planning to use a 1 x or 2 x 12 for the shelf and 1x for the vertical
> supports. 
> 
> Not sure on right to left arrangement with me sitting in the middle. Was
> thinking keys, then P3, then radio, then space to the left. 
> Allowing 3/4" for the end support, 9 inches for the keys to store, 3/4" for
> a vertical support, then 18" or so for the P3, then K3S, the 3/4 for
> vertical Support. That brings me 29.25" from the Right edge leaving 18" (if
> we subtract 3/4" for the end vertical support) for the Eventual AMP. If I
> eventually get the External antenna tuner it will go on top of the shelf or
> on top of the amp directly if it will fit.
> 
> Does this sound like a proper setup to operate CW with the arm on the
> desk..etc.. turn dials with the left hand..etc.. I'll have a laptop/monitors
> on top of the shelf and a smallish keyboard/mouse on the desktop.
> 
> Just trying to get it all worked out so I don't have to remake this thing
> several times.. why re-invent the wheel when someone has already done it
> right? 
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> Jerry Moore
> K3S SN# TBA Wednesday  
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]

[Wayne Burdick]

Here are two much better photos of the SP3:

   http://www.elecraft.com/K3/sp3_2a.jpg
   http://www.elecraft.com/K3/sp3_1a.jpg

73,
Wayne
N6KR

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Harry Yingst via Elecraft]

This happens nearly every time Elecraft releases a new product.
To me it honestly appears to be a case of sour grapes.

As I view it God bless them and good for them that they can make a quality 
product and a living for them and their staff.
I believe that Elecrafts products are quite fair priced (especially considering 
the quality of service).
I try to buy US when possible even in my other hobbies and yes it tends to cost 
a little more to get a better product and service.






  From: Anthony Scandurra 
 To: 
Cc: Elecraft Reflector  
 Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 10:42 PM
 Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details
   
Have any of you who are complaining seen the prices of speakers from other
radio manufacturers?  How about the other third-party speaker makers?
Elecraft is in the ballpark.

A lot of folks asked (begged, bugged, pestered...) Elecraft to come out
with a speaker for the line.  They finally relented.  Thank you, Elecraft!

73, Tony K4QE
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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Width Control and AF Output Level

[Keith Onishi]

Hi Bob,

Many thanks for your suggestion.
I sent you my reply, but your mail server rejected as a possible abuse.

> Hi Kieth,
> 
>it is nor necessary to set all to 0db.   Just do not use the EQ 
> for peaking.  He can still use roll off of the undesired lows and highs 
> leaving the mid range flat that covers the beat frequencies (pitch) of 
> interest.
> 
> 73,
> Bob
> K2TK   ex KN2TKR (1956) & K2TKR

73 de JH3SIF, Keith

> 2015/09/15 6:39、Keith Onishi  のメール：
> 
> My friend informed me that setting 0 to all section of RX EQ solved the AF 
> output level change issue.
> Many thanks to all for your suggestions.
> 
> 73 de JH3SIF, Keith
> 
>> 2015/09/14 18:12、Mike K2MK  のメール：
>> 
>> Hi Keith,
>> 
>> I think the problem is in the setting for the RXEQ. You do not want to use
>> +db boost for CW. As I understand it, RXEQ is disabled at 100Hz and 50Hz
>> width. So if he has boosted a particular frequency by 10db then when he
>> narrows the bandwidth he will suddenly hear a loss of audio signal of 10db.
>> To solve this problem keep the RXEQ set to 0 db for the frequencies of
>> interest and use negative db settings for the frequencies of no interest.
>> 
>> 73,
>> Mike K2MK
>> 
>> 
>> Keith Onishi wrote
>>> One of my friend K3 users report that AF output level with 100Hz passband
>>> width is lower than with 150Hz passband width. He also reported that a
>>> noise like “Ptsu” was generated on reducing passband width from 150Hz to
>>> 100Hz. He had guessed that these were specific to his K3, but some other
>>> K3 users including myself reported the same.
>>> Some extreme users who use this narrow passband may have been bothered by
>>> this reduced AF output level and noise. If the AF output level change is
>>> caused by K3 DSP filter design or program, adding automatic gain
>>> compensation feature to keep same AF output level would be highly welcome.
>>> 
>>> 73 de JH3SIF, Keith
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> View this message in context: 
>> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-Width-Control-and-AF-Output-Level-tp7607595p7607610.html
>> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> __
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Gary]

Amen, Tony.

My sentiments exactly.

Gary 

-Original Message-
From: "Anthony Scandurra" 
Sent: ‎15/‎09/‎2015 12:43 PM
Cc: "Elecraft Reflector" 
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Have any of you who are complaining seen the prices of speakers from other
radio manufacturers?  How about the other third-party speaker makers?
Elecraft is in the ballpark.

A lot of folks asked (begged, bugged, pestered...) Elecraft to come out
with a speaker for the line.  They finally relented.  Thank you, Elecraft!

73, Tony K4QE
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]

[Fred Jensen]

OK, just curious here, how can a simple speaker with nice looking 
enclosure get this much traffic on the list?  I'm pretty sure it doesn't 
have any DSP firmware, I don't think it has any IMD figures, and I'm 
very sure it doesn't need any 8 MHz roofing filters.


I may buy one [SO1R here], just for the looks, my KPA500 may be headed 
for the auction block, I'll have a flag pole antenna, but I really don't 
want to electrocute the neighbor kids or the bunnies who eat my grass. 
Remote to W7RN will happen soon too.


73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 50th Running of the Cal QSO Party 3-4 Oct 2015
- www.cqp.org

On 9/14/2015 7:44 PM, Harry Yingst via Elecraft wrote:

Looks sharp, Looks like I need to make a little more room on the desk




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[Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Johnny Siu]

With my due respect to intellectual right, I would feel this price tag will 
trigger a Chinese variant at 1/3 price with similar appearance but unknown 
quality.
73
Johnny VR2XMC
  寄件人︰ Doug Person via Elecraft 
 收件人︰ elecraft@mailman.qth.net 
 傳送日期︰ 2015年09月15日 (週二) 10:15 AM
 主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details
   
I have to admit that I, too, find $179 for a passive speaker in a metal 
cabinet shockingly expensive.  I was expecting $99.  The price just gets 
a shrug and an "Oh well.." from me.  Not a chance I would spend that 
kind of money on a speaker just because it matches the K-Line.

Doug -- K0DXV

On 9/14/2015 5:42 PM, Mike Reublin NF4L wrote:
> Not even at half that. Maybe it's a misplaced decimal punkt. . . . . .
>
> 73, Mike NF4L
>
>
>> On Sep 14, 2015, at 7:24 PM, mfsj  wrote:
>>
>> OMG OM cheap at twice the price 8>)
>>
>> Fred/N0AZZ
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>

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Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

[Richard Fjeld]

It was a passing thought as;  how to use a diode without causing a 
voltage drop was the original question.


AD5X has an OVP and Rev Polarity project on his website that would be 
better.


I couldn't think of the call sign at the time, so I suggested a relay.

(I've worked with huge contactors that were on motor-generators to 
prevent run-aways)


73,
Dick, n0ce



On 9/14/2015 5:13 PM, Fred Townsend wrote:

Dick:
Relays? Sure, easy to do. Power relays are often used in many kinds
equipment. They are sometimes called 'contactors'. They are either big and
clunky or small and unreliable. Which kind do you want and what are you
willing to pay?
73
Fred, AE6QL





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Re: [Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

[Jerry Moore]

That will likely go on top when I get it eventually :)

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of David
Cole
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 3:55 PM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

What about the new Speaker?  :)
--
Thanks and 73's,
For equipment, and software setups and reviews see:
www.nk7z.net

For MixW support see;
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info
For Dopplergram information see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/dopplergram/info
For MM-SSTV see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MM-SSTV/info


On Mon, 2015-09-14 at 15:28 -0400, ae...@carolinaheli.com wrote:
> It's been a while and I'm a huge proponent of measure twice cut once. 
> I'm building a hutch for my operating desk. The desk is 4' wide x 28" deep
(2'
> 4"). I'm right handed and my primary mode will be CW. I have both a 
> Bencher paddle and a generic straight key. I need about 18" wide for 
> my K3S and future P3. The K3S is 10"x10"x7.25"(stand extended and air gap
above it.
> Planning to use a 1 x or 2 x 12 for the shelf and 1x for the vertical 
> supports.
> 
> Not sure on right to left arrangement with me sitting in the middle. 
> Was thinking keys, then P3, then radio, then space to the left.
> Allowing 3/4" for the end support, 9 inches for the keys to store, 
> 3/4" for a vertical support, then 18" or so for the P3, then K3S, the 
> 3/4 for vertical Support. That brings me 29.25" from the Right edge 
> leaving 18" (if we subtract 3/4" for the end vertical support) for the 
> Eventual AMP. If I eventually get the External antenna tuner it will 
> go on top of the shelf or on top of the amp directly if it will fit.
> 
> Does this sound like a proper setup to operate CW with the arm on the 
> desk..etc.. turn dials with the left hand..etc.. I'll have a 
> laptop/monitors on top of the shelf and a smallish keyboard/mouse on the
desktop.
> 
> Just trying to get it all worked out so I don't have to remake this 
> thing several times.. why re-invent the wheel when someone has already 
> done it right?
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> Jerry Moore
> K3S SN# TBA Wednesday
> 
> __
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> d...@nk7z.net

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[Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Gene Gabry]

Very good point Tony
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/speakers/1696.html

Puts things into perspective :) 

73 Gene N9TF

K3S 10057

>Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

>Have any of you who are complaining seen the prices of speakers from other
radio manufacturers?  How about the other third-party speaker makers?
>Elecraft is in the ballpark.

>A lot of folks asked (begged, bugged, pestered...) Elecraft to come out
with a speaker for the line.  They finally relented.  Thank you, Elecraft!

>73, Tony K4QE
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[Elecraft] K3s # 10323

[Bernie KF0QS]

Dear Folks:

Today I had the immense pleasure of opening up my K3s kit.  Building and
operating my K2 and K1 (I have the 4 band kit of the latter and feel lucky)
are among the biggest ham radio thrills I've had.  You don't get to start on
a new kit very often, and it was exciting today to start the old routine
(all I did tonight was conduct a complete parts inventory) that I employed
with the other kits.

I'm looking forward to leisurely working through the kit (it's a K3s/100
with the ATU) while listening to music in the background.  Of course, I'm
looking forward to firing it up on the air one day.  

Just thought I'd share this feeling with all of you, many of whom, I'm sure,
have felt the same way.

By the way, I don't care much about what serial number I get.  It does make
the rig unique, and places my particular rigs where they belong on the
Elecraft spectrum (my K1 is # 1024 and my K2 is #6922).  Since I ordered my
K3s (#10323) on September 7th, this tells any of you about to order one what
your serial number is likely going to be.

73 de Bernie, KF0QS



--
View this message in context: 
http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3s-10323-tp7607669.html
Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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[Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[kb2m]

Or for the same price as 2 SP3's

 http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/speakers/1301.html


73 Jeff kb2m



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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details [Updated photos]

[Vic Rosenthal]

Just put a piece of PVC pipe, painted appropriately, over the bottom 6 or 8 
feet of the flagpole.

Vic 4X6GP/K2VCO 

> On Sep 15, 2015, at 6:11 AM, Fred Jensen  wrote:
> 
> OK, just curious here, how can a simple speaker with nice looking enclosure 
> get this much traffic on the list?  I'm pretty sure it doesn't have any DSP 
> firmware, I don't think it has any IMD figures, and I'm very sure it doesn't 
> need any 8 MHz roofing filters.
> 
> I may buy one [SO1R here], just for the looks, my KPA500 may be headed for 
> the auction block, I'll have a flag pole antenna, but I really don't want to 
> electrocute the neighbor kids or the bunnies who eat my grass. Remote to W7RN 
> will happen soon too.
> 
> 73,
> 
> Fred K6DGW
> - Northern California Contest Club
> - CU in the 50th Running of the Cal QSO Party 3-4 Oct 2015
> - www.cqp.org
>> 
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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Jim Lowman]

$179.95 is what I paid at the convention - times two.

73 de Jim - AD6CW

On 9/14/2015 1:06 PM, Brian & Cyndi wrote:

Did the boys at HamCon quote a price for the speaker?

73,
Brian, W6FVI



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Jim Brown]

On Mon,9/14/2015 10:10 AM, Adam Farson wrote:

As explained in my web article (and also in my QEX article), the optimum
noise loading points for an ADC and a conventional receiver are different.
In the conventional receiver, optimum noise loading is reached when the
noise power induced in the IF passband within the notch (idle-channel noise)
is equal to the DUT's intrinsic thermal noise power in the same bandwidth.
At this point, the DUT's audio output rises by 3 dB.


I strongly disagree, Adam. If the test is designed to show response of 
the receiver to a lot of strong signals such as are present in a 
contesting or DX pileup environment, or as are present in a 
multi-transmitter site, the signal level should be consistent with that 
environment, NOT with the design of the receiver. In other words, if the 
input of the RX would be overloaded by those strong signals, the test 
should show it. This does (at least) two things -- it lets buyers know 
which radios perform best in this environment, and it also puts the 
manufacturer's feet to the fire to make the RX better. And this matters 
no matter what the architecture of the RX. It would also, for example, 
clearly show the difference between an RX with a preselector (or other 
selectivity) in front of the input and one without.


And finally, if you choose to test at a reduced signal level to stay 
below overload, the report should clearly state by how many dB the test 
signal had to be reduced.


I do appreciate your work and your dedication, but to be of value, it 
must be consistent with real world conditions, and it must expose the 
real differences between radios.


73, Jim K9YC


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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Mike Reublin NF4L]

I can't imagine what makes it cost that much. Too rich for my anemic blood.

73, Mike NF4L


> On Sep 14, 2015, at 4:24 PM, Cliff Frescura  wrote:
> 
> Didn't ask. But the web site lists the SP3 at $179

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Re: [Elecraft] TX Power

[Danny Higgins]

FL2 is 2.7kHz and FL4 is 400Hz on both receivers.  The CONFIG is set to
transmit CW using the 2.7kHz filter, but the power output seems to vary on
the main RX when I narrow the receive bandwidth down to 400Hz where FL4
kicks in.  I first discovered this yesterday when trying to set up SSB.
After following all the setting instructions I didn't get much RF out when I
went to normal TX and full power.  I didn't try this with the opposite
sideband, but I now suspect that one sideband will be good and the other
will be poor.

When I get back tonight I will check the filter responses using band noise
and a program called Visual Analyser from Sillanum Software which allows me
to plot both the main and sub-RX frequency responses at the same time.

Danny, G3XVR

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Joe
Subich, W4TV
Sent: 13 September 2015 23:37
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] TX Power


On 9/13/2015 4:16 PM, G3XVR wrote:
> The problem is different on 80M and 6M. On 80M I can get full power on 
> Normal CW, but not much on CW Rev. The opposite is true on 6M.
> However, if I reduce the bandwidth so that FL4 is selected instead on 
> FL2 I can get full power on both bands and on both CW modes.

CW TX and SSB TX should use the 2.7 or 2.8 KHz filter.  Only AM TX and FM TX
should use other (wider) filters.  What is the bandwidth of your
FL2 and FL4?

73,

   ... Joe, W4TV


On 9/13/2015 4:16 PM, G3XVR wrote:
> The problem is different on 80M and 6M.  On 80M I can get full power 
> on Normal CW, but not much on CW Rev.  The opposite is true on 6M.  
> However, if I reduce the bandwidth so that FL4 is selected instead on 
> FL2 I can get full power on both bands and on both CW modes.  If I 
> select Split and use the sub-RX, I can get full power on both bands, 
> using both filters on both CW modes.  I sounds like a filter offset 
> problem.  I've reset it to what the sticker inside the K3S says (-97 
> for main RX and -79 for sub RX).  I assume these figures are in Hz.  
> Is there any way of confirming that there is an offset problem?
>
> Danny, G3XVR
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: 
> http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/TX-Power-tp7607570p7607580.html
> Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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> li...@subich.com
>
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[Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Johnny Siu]

Hello Adam,
From reading of your NPR chart, could I understand that apart from IC7851, the 
K3 (with new KSYN3A installed) is the second best in terms of NPR test?
73
Johnny VR2XMC
  寄件人︰ Adam Farson 
 收件人︰ Elecraft List  
 傳送日期︰ 2015年09月14日 (週一) 2:51 PM
 主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?
   
For Jim K9YC:

 

Hi Jim,

 

Many thanks for the post on my presentations at the club meeting on Saturday
September 5.

 

To quote:

"There's an important caveat to his work. The NPR measurements require 

very sophisticated band-stop filters in his instrumentation setup, and 

based on the filters he has been able to source, that limits the 

frequency range where he can do his measurements. An example is in the 

footnote for the Flex-6700, which has no preselector for the range where 

he had to do his measurements, which may have caused that radio to 

measure worse than it would on the ham bands."

 

The instrumentation I use for NPR testing is re-purposed telecom test
equipment, as described in my Web article and also in my article in QEX for
March/April 2015. I rely on the surplus market for the test sets, and also
for the filter pairs (bandstop and bandpass). The bandstop filters typically
have 95 dB stopband attenuation and ~ 3 kHz stopband width.

 

A number of these filters are on (or near) amateur bands, e.g. 1940, 3886,
5340, 7600 and 11700 kHz. The first filter pair I acquired was on 5340 kHz,
so all the test data in my web article are on this frequency (which is in
the 60m band). The Flex-6700 does not have a preselector for this band, so
the noise loading will hit the front end and the ADC harder. This will
degrade the NPR reading by a few dB, but it will show how the receiver
behaves if heavily loaded on a band for which no preselector is fitted.

 

As I picked up additional filters, the number of frequencies on which I run
the test has steadily increased. Links to multi-frequency NPR data for
various radios (including the K3 with KSYN3A) are on my website:

 

http://www.ab4oj.com/test/main.html#NPR 

 

It was a pleasure meeting you guys over the Labour Day weekend.

 

73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ


  
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Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

[Richard Fjeld]

I would think you could wire a relay with a diode in the path to the 
coil so that it would not operate
if the polarity of the power leads are reversed.  That way, there would 
be negligible voltage drop when operated.


Dick,n0ce


On 9/13/2015 10:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
The base K3 is protected by an in-line diode that will not allow 
reverse voltage to flow.
The same is not true of the KPA3 where the reduction in voltage would 
not be tolerable.
The KPA3 is protected by a circuit breaker, but in this case did not 
trip in time to prevent damage.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/13/2015 10:55 PM, James F. Boehner MD via Elecraft wrote:

Whew!

Not a good feeling-but it can happen to any of us, regardless of how 
careful

we are.

Elecraft has been very good on suggesting helpful modifications to the
radio.  Any thoughts? Perhaps an in-line diode?

I'm not sure if that would result in a significant voltage drop-just a
thought.




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Adam Farson]

For Jim K9YC:

 

Hi Jim,

 

Many thanks for the post on my presentations at the club meeting on Saturday
September 5.

 

To quote:

"There's an important caveat to his work. The NPR measurements require 

very sophisticated band-stop filters in his instrumentation setup, and 

based on the filters he has been able to source, that limits the 

frequency range where he can do his measurements. An example is in the 

footnote for the Flex-6700, which has no preselector for the range where 

he had to do his measurements, which may have caused that radio to 

measure worse than it would on the ham bands."

 

The instrumentation I use for NPR testing is re-purposed telecom test
equipment, as described in my Web article and also in my article in QEX for
March/April 2015. I rely on the surplus market for the test sets, and also
for the filter pairs (bandstop and bandpass). The bandstop filters typically
have 95 dB stopband attenuation and ~ 3 kHz stopband width.

 

A number of these filters are on (or near) amateur bands, e.g. 1940, 3886,
5340, 7600 and 11700 kHz. The first filter pair I acquired was on 5340 kHz,
so all the test data in my web article are on this frequency (which is in
the 60m band). The Flex-6700 does not have a preselector for this band, so
the noise loading will hit the front end and the ADC harder. This will
degrade the NPR reading by a few dB, but it will show how the receiver
behaves if heavily loaded on a band for which no preselector is fitted.

 

As I picked up additional filters, the number of frequencies on which I run
the test has steadily increased. Links to multi-frequency NPR data for
various radios (including the K3 with KSYN3A) are on my website:

 

http://www.ab4oj.com/test/main.html#NPR 

 

It was a pleasure meeting you guys over the Labour Day weekend.

 

73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ

 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

[James Bennett]

Jerry,

I’m also a righty and built part of my desk / operating setup. Mine is a little 
different, as I have a 27” iMac - sitting off to the left. But here’s what my 
setup is like:

- A 54” wide, 24” deep double pedestal desk with a solid core 80” wide x 32” 
deep door sitting on top. This gives me a w-i-d-e operating surface.

- The iMac sits off to the left.

On top I build a double high “riser” out of 3/4” oak plywood, faced with oak 
strips.; the bottom riser is 4-1/2” high x 48” wide. Under it are my two Begali 
keys - a paddle and a straight key. Also gives me room to slide my wireless 
keyboard and track pad underneath when not in use.

The upper riser is 5-1/2” high x 20” wide and sits on the left end of the lower 
riser, basically directly in front of me. Sitting on the second level (the top 
of the long riser) are, from left to right: K3, P3, KPA500, homebrew 144 MHz 80 
watt amp, and an MFJ-4245MV power supply. My KAT500 tuner sits atop the KPA500. 
This arrangement puts the K3/P3 directly in front of me, and allows me to move 
the keys around on the desk under them as I want.

On top of that third level, the upper riser, I have sitting an ASUS 23” second 
monitor, a KX3, and my Tascam external sound card.

The upper surface of each riser is covered by black, non-stick, rubberized, 
“shelf paper” I got at a fabric store. Keeps stuff from sliding around.

I like having the K3/P3 directly in front of me and the keys under them. I 
previously had this equipment in place without any risers and was not 100% 
happy with the layout or the ability to use the equipment easily.

Jim / W6JHB


> On   Monday, Sep 14, 2015, at  Monday, 12:28 PM, ae...@carolinaheli.com wrote:
> 
> It's been a while and I'm a huge proponent of measure twice cut once. I'm
> building a hutch for my operating desk. The desk is 4' wide x 28" deep (2'
> 4"). I'm right handed and my primary mode will be CW. I have both a Bencher
> paddle and a generic straight key. I need about 18" wide for my K3S and
> future P3. The K3S is 10"x10"x7.25"(stand extended and air gap above it.
> Planning to use a 1 x or 2 x 12 for the shelf and 1x for the vertical
> supports. 
> 
> Not sure on right to left arrangement with me sitting in the middle. Was
> thinking keys, then P3, then radio, then space to the left. 
> Allowing 3/4" for the end support, 9 inches for the keys to store, 3/4" for
> a vertical support, then 18" or so for the P3, then K3S, the 3/4 for
> vertical Support. That brings me 29.25" from the Right edge leaving 18" (if
> we subtract 3/4" for the end vertical support) for the Eventual AMP. If I
> eventually get the External antenna tuner it will go on top of the shelf or
> on top of the amp directly if it will fit.
> 
> Does this sound like a proper setup to operate CW with the arm on the
> desk..etc.. turn dials with the left hand..etc.. I'll have a laptop/monitors
> on top of the shelf and a smallish keyboard/mouse on the desktop.
> 
> Just trying to get it all worked out so I don't have to remake this thing
> several times.. why re-invent the wheel when someone has already done it
> right? 
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> Jerry Moore
> K3S SN# TBA Wednesday  
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Luis V. Romero]

All:

 

OK, I will jump in on this one.  It's close to my heart.

 

My closest local ham friends are IC-7800 owners.  All 5 of them.  All of
them have larger and taller antennas than I do.  I can hear everything they
hear and, though I'm at a 500w transmitter disadvantage viz their kilowatt
amplifiers, I can and do work everything they work with my K3.

 

My local club (Tampa Amateur Radio Club) is a 100% Icom facility with a
7700, two 7600'ds, one 746Pro and a 7100 in their HF "studios"  (more like
"cubicles": there are 6 of them - one is reserved for "classic" AM rigs)  

 

I operated SS SSB two years in succession (2010 and 2011) at our clubhouse
SOABLP using identical antennas (a C31XR at 108 feet, a EF240 at 118 feet, a
C19X at 70 feet and a 80m Dipole at 90 ft).  In 2010 I used the club 7700.
The receiver sounded really crunchy, much like my former TS850.  Lots or
crackly splatter, lots of adjacent desense.  I use that rig often, so I know
how to drive it.  It is never pleasant to use that rig in heavy QRM contest
conditions.  The same can be said for the 7600'ds.  The 746 and the 7100 are
worse by a long shot to the 7700.

 

The following year, I brought my K3 to the club and operated SS using the
club's identical antenna complement.  Not once did I hear any crunching in
the receiver, no splatter mess and no desense.  The contest was much more
pleasant on the ears and all signals were much easier to copy on the K3 than
on the 7700 receiver.

 

I love using the 7700, but not in a serious contesting environment. It
reminds me of my  old TS850.  But I still love to use it!  The reason is the
tactile feel of the 7700 and, a bit less by the same token, the 7600'ds
feels like that too.  While the K3 layout is fine and very workable, the
controls on the Icoms are just so incredibly smooth!  The "feeling of
Luxury" is exuded by the 7700'ds tactile feedback from its controls.  As a
NY friend says "It feels like buttah!". It's a hard concept to explain, but
the feel of the Icom controls is really special. My K3 feels OK, just not as
"silky" as the 7700'd. 

 

Kind of like cars. Drive a Lexus SC430 for show, and a Lotus Elise for go.
Two sports cars for different priorities.

 

If you are into luxury feel, "free" logo'd leather jackets, and 70lb
transceivers that "feel like buttah", the 78/7700'ds are a great choice.  If
you are into well behaved receivers, high operational performance in a
compact, under 10lb lightweight package, the choice is obvious.

 

Takes all kinds to make a world!  I have my priorities, you have yours. 

 

Lu - W4LT

K-Line

 

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

[David Cole]

What about the new Speaker?  :)
-- 
Thanks and 73's,
For equipment, and software setups and reviews see:
www.nk7z.net

For MixW support see;
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/mixw/info
For Dopplergram information see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/dopplergram/info
For MM-SSTV see:
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/MM-SSTV/info


On Mon, 2015-09-14 at 15:28 -0400, ae...@carolinaheli.com wrote:
> It's been a while and I'm a huge proponent of measure twice cut once. I'm
> building a hutch for my operating desk. The desk is 4' wide x 28" deep (2'
> 4"). I'm right handed and my primary mode will be CW. I have both a Bencher
> paddle and a generic straight key. I need about 18" wide for my K3S and
> future P3. The K3S is 10"x10"x7.25"(stand extended and air gap above it.
> Planning to use a 1 x or 2 x 12 for the shelf and 1x for the vertical
> supports. 
> 
> Not sure on right to left arrangement with me sitting in the middle. Was
> thinking keys, then P3, then radio, then space to the left. 
> Allowing 3/4" for the end support, 9 inches for the keys to store, 3/4" for
> a vertical support, then 18" or so for the P3, then K3S, the 3/4 for
> vertical Support. That brings me 29.25" from the Right edge leaving 18" (if
> we subtract 3/4" for the end vertical support) for the Eventual AMP. If I
> eventually get the External antenna tuner it will go on top of the shelf or
> on top of the amp directly if it will fit.
> 
> Does this sound like a proper setup to operate CW with the arm on the
> desk..etc.. turn dials with the left hand..etc.. I'll have a laptop/monitors
> on top of the shelf and a smallish keyboard/mouse on the desktop.
> 
> Just trying to get it all worked out so I don't have to remake this thing
> several times.. why re-invent the wheel when someone has already done it
> right? 
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> Jerry Moore
> K3S SN# TBA Wednesday  
> 
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

[Don Wilhelm]

Jer,

Make the space for the K3S and P3 1.5 inches wider than the two units 
combined - you need some space to grip the sides of the radio and P3 
after you have both inserted in the hutch.
You will not need any more than 3/4 stock for the shelf and top of the 
hutch.  If think you need extra support for the shelf, glue a 2 inch 
wide strip to the back edge of the shelf and top (under the shelf).  
That way you have maximum view in the front of the hutch. That will also 
keep the hutch from racking if you fit the ends tight.


Since your hutch will not be close to the end of the desk, just build it 
and place it loose on the desk.  That way you can move it from side to 
side to see what position is going to work best for you.  Once you 
determine that position you can fasten it to the desktop if desired.


73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/14/2015 3:28 PM, ae...@carolinaheli.com wrote:

It's been a while and I'm a huge proponent of measure twice cut once. I'm
building a hutch for my operating desk. The desk is 4' wide x 28" deep (2'
4"). I'm right handed and my primary mode will be CW. I have both a Bencher
paddle and a generic straight key. I need about 18" wide for my K3S and
future P3. The K3S is 10"x10"x7.25"(stand extended and air gap above it.
Planning to use a 1 x or 2 x 12 for the shelf and 1x for the vertical
supports.




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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Brian & Cyndi]

Did the boys at HamCon quote a price for the speaker?

73,
Brian, W6FVI


On 9/14/2015 11:51 AM, Cliff Frescura wrote:

I don't know where it is made, but I was able to see one in the flesh at
HamCon this past weekend and it has a solid feel and weight to it (in
addition to sounding great too).  Seems like a no brainer addition to me.

One wish would be to have the headphone jack on the speaker and use the
input switch (as an output switch) to switch between headphone and speaker,
so that the headphones can stay plugged in (I modified my SP-940 to work
this way)

73,

Cliff K3LL/6

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
ae...@carolinaheli.com
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 10:39 AM
To: a...@sbcglobal.net; ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne
Burdick'; 'Elecraft Reflector'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

I guess I shouldn't have assumed anything but I did..


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
a...@sbcglobal.net
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 12:03 PM
To: ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne Burdick'; 'Elecraft
Reflector'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P


  On Monday, September 14, 2015 10:34 AM, "ae...@carolinaheli.com"
 wrote:



  I believe when you consider the engineering reputation of Elecraft and
economies of scale for the manufacture of the SP3 several expectations
arise:
1. This is likely a very well-engineered component that's not easily
replaced by a similar sized speaker.
2. Performance of the speaker exceeds similarly priced speakers (and
definitely less expensive ones to a degree).
3. There is NOT likely a premium baked in to the price for the Elecraft name
due to the economies of scale (low quantity manufacture generally means
higher costs, thus higher price). Translation - the price isn't just for the
name.

At the end of the day consider the labor costs plus parts are likely fairly
high if they are US manufactured.

The US consumer is the sole reason most US manufacturing has gone overseas
(especially China). Buy cheap, get cheap.

So it comes down to a question of quality vs "good enough" vs "price"

I can only speak for myself in saying that it means something to have a
matching set rather than a hodgepodge.
I do compromise and use what I have to be able to get the job done UNTIL
I've saved enough for the next piece.

Personally the SP3 is last on my list because most if not all of my
operating will be with headphones.
The point here is that it's on my list :)



Jerry Moore
AE4PB, K3S SN# Arrives Wed.






-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bob
McGraw - K4TAX
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 3:28 PM
To: Wayne Burdick; Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

New products are always welcome.  I look forward to "hearing them" at maybe
one of the next ham fests.  I like the fact the SP3 uses an oval speaker.
I've never figured out exactly why, but I find ovals typically do sound
better than rounds, but maybe it seems to be only in my findings.

As a comment, I prefer non-amplified speakers as this avoids the potential
RFI issues when used with the radio.  The model that I mentioned and use has
a slight tilt to the bottom which aligns the front with the K3S with its
front elevated by the stand.

I also find the audio system in the K3S to be really nice, specially the
2 channel effect using the AFX feature along with a stereo speaker
configuration.  This give a nice wide spatial effect to which I find very
pleasing.  Thanks Wayne and company for doing a fine job with the K3S and
its new features.

73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 9/13/2015 2:09 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote:

Hi all,

The K3 or K3S will work with a wide range of speakers, including the
ones

Bob (K4TAX) mentioned.

Here are some possible reasons for using an SP3:

- matches the K-Line perfectly, including a rugged fold-up tilt stand
- full stereo A/B source selection, supporting dual-rig and
dual-speaker configurations (or both)
- plenty of room inside the cabinet for built-ins that might improve
station integration

Of course these factors don't apply to everyone. But the good news is
that we will no longer have to say "maybe next year" every time
someone asks us to add a matching speaker to the product line :)

73,
Wayne
N6KR


Bob McGraw - K4TAX  wrote:


I use a pair of "off the shelf" brand speakers which have 2" x 4"
ovals

in a nice efficient solid enclosure that is 5" deep







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Re: [Elecraft] K3: reverse 12 volt supply

[Roger D Johnson]

On 9/14/2015 2:42 PM, Roger D Johnson wrote:

According to the schematic, there is a shunt diode on the PA board. Hopefully, 
it
prevented the full 12 volts from appearing on the circuitry. The smoke probably
came from the chokes ahead of the diode.

73, Roger


On 9/13/2015 11:09 PM, Don Wilhelm wrote:
The base K3 is protected by an in-line diode that will not allow reverse 
voltage to flow.
The same is not true of the KPA3 where the reduction in voltage would not be 
tolerable.
The KPA3 is protected by a circuit breaker, but in this case did not trip in 
time to prevent damage.


73,
Don W3FPR



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Re: [Elecraft] P3 TX Mon: FEATURE REQUEST - Monitoring of RTTY Waveform

[Luis V. Romero]

Alan:

 

You wrote:

It gets more interesting if there is a problem 

 in the RTTY transmitter that causes the two tones to come out at 

 different amplitudes, which would be easy to see on the screen.

 

In your example, you would see ripple in the flat waveform on the screen,
true enough.  The Ripple would increase with the amount of the different
amplitudes of the two tones.

 

However, I can't monitor other issues that can rear their ugly heads in
RTTY, be it modulated by FSK or AFSK with the existing functionality
available:  The reason I was looking for a better visual representation of
these issues in this tool is explained in an excellent article by Andy
Flowers, K0SM.

 

http://frontiernet.net/~aflowers/k3rtty/k3rtty.html

 

Gee, it would be nice not to have to buy a Flex rig just to monitor my K3's
output. And I already have an SDR receiver sitting inside the P3 box, locked
to my transmitter frequency.   

 

You wrote:

The traditional "plus sign" (crossed ellipses) display is normally used 

 in the FSK receiving demodulator as a tuning aid.  As you tune the 

 receiver the ellipses change their angle.  When you see the "plus sign" 

 then the receiver is tuned correctly.

 

Not just for receive, but in transmit as well.  Especially in tone modulated
RTTY (pseudo FSK) using AFSK "tone" modulation.  If one tone is off, it
would be shown in the transmission ellipsoid representation as well.  When
you see a "plus sign", both tones are in phase and in quadrature.  But if
one tone is out of quadrature?  Then you see an ellipse.  We deal with this
daily in the representation of Trellis modulation artifacts in ATV
transmitters.  There we call it "The Eye Pattern". Same display principle. 

 

While the dual ellipse waveform would be ideal, there are alternatives, In
receive, we can see similar information in the two tone demodulation
"envelope" showing two peaks with a valley in between using a single
envelope detector as described bu K0SM. Why not avail us of at least that
waveform, since you already can show it on receive in the P3
hardware/software?  With some handles on the display for gain, width, slope
and maybe a synthetic "mask", it solves this requirement!

 

You wrote:

You can also see if the transmitter has the wrong (or at least 

 different) frequency shift.  In that case the ellipses don't make a 

 right angle with each other even when the receiver is tuned correctly. 

 

True and correct.  And I agree.

 

You wrote:

 That might be useful in a transmit monitor, but it can't be done using 

  An RF coupler because it only detects the amplitude, not the frequency.

 

True: Not the *quadrature* (two ellipsoids) display. But you *can* show the
dual peak/valley display. You already show it on receive!  It is an
equivalent 2-D representation that can be used in addition to the flat
envelope display.  But, alas, I can't see it in transmit (yes, I could
unplug the control cable to see IF "bleedthrough", but what a pain!). The
way it is now, I can only tell folks I am receiving that they are having
problems.  I can't proactively solve my own problems before I transmit with
my monitoring tool!

 

I don't know. Maybe I'm just old fashioned, but I'm really disappointed to
have waited 5 years and paid $200 for this simple envelope sampler
functionality using a repurposed WM2 sampling bridge.  I sort of expected
more. Maybe not in hardware, but in the application software, as all
hardware for this type of measurement is synthesized in apps anymore.  For
$200 more I could have gotten a Wavenode WN-2, but then I have wasted the
wattmeter again and I would need another PC to run the app software.  But
the funniest thing is that the P3 can display an equivalent waveform today
in receive that does what I need for transmission monitoring! 

 

I'm still no better off and $200 poorer than where I was with my Bench
Oscilloscope and a 17 inch piece of hook up wire, and that is the issue.
It's the first time I have been disappointed by an Elecraft product.  

 

 

Lu - W4LT

 

 

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Jim Lowman]

I'll leave that question to Eric, but in his presentation on Saturday he 
did go into detail about the *American* firms that Elecraft uses when 
outsourcing is necessary.


73 de Jim - AD6CW

On 9/14/2015 9:02 AM, a...@sbcglobal.net wrote:

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the 
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P





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Re: [Elecraft] P3 TX Mon: FEATURE REQUEST - Monitoring of

[Luis V. Romero]

Grant:

 

I have a workaround:  My bench O'Scope and a 17 inch piece of hook up wire.
Been running that for five years.

 

The above does everything that the TX-MON option does.  Everything.

 

Frankly, I was expecting a little more in this product.  That's all.

 

Don't worry about me. I will be OK.  J

 

73

 

Lu - W4LT

 

 

 

But certainly it isn't necessary to wait around for Elecraft to provide.
There are all kinds of tried and true and well documented ways to do all of
the things.  

 

We've apparently come to the point where we expect our radio vendor to do
EVERYTHING for us, instead if just doing it for ourselves. Why does our
radio have to do all of it?  It isn't always just a few more lines of code,
after all. 

 

So E'craft doesn't provide a trapezoid or RTTY cross display or turn on the
coffee pot?  So?

 

Grant NQ5T

Just feeling contrary -- as usual ;)

 

Sent from my iPhone

 

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Re: [Elecraft] P3 TX Mon: FEATURE REQUEST - Monitoring of RTTY

[KX3]

 Waveform
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
References: <001601d0ef1e$e360be90$aa223bb0$@ij.net>
From: "Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT" 
Message-ID: <55f71d19.1020...@coldrockshotbrooms.com>
Date: Mon, 14 Sep 2015 12:16:41 -0700
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 5.1; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101
 Thunderbird/38.2.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <001601d0ef1e$e360be90$aa223bb0$@ij.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
 boundary="060809070606000101030600"

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--060809070606000101030600
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Interesting to note that none of the waveforms in the article cited are 
the traditional "plus" display.

The plus display comes from taking the mark filter and putting it on the 
"x" axis, and the space filter on "y" and looking at the picture.

Since the mark filter and space filter are in the demodulator, and as 
someone else observed really speak to how closely you're tuned to the 
received signal, that just doesn't seem useful.

The spectrum graphs might be.

73 -- Lynn

On 9/14/2015 11:55 AM, Luis V. Romero wrote:
> However, I can't monitor other issues that can rear their ugly heads in
> RTTY, be it modulated by FSK or AFSK with the existing functionality
> available:  The reason I was looking for a better visual representation of
> these issues in this tool is explained in an excellent article by Andy
> Flowers, K0SM.
>
>   
>
> http://frontiernet.net/~aflowers/k3rtty/k3rtty.html


--060809070606000101030600
Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit


  

  
  
Interesting to note that none of the
  waveforms in the article cited are the traditional "plus" display.
  
  The plus display comes from taking the mark filter and putting it
  on the "x" axis, and the space filter on "y" and looking at the
  picture.  
  
  Since the mark filter and space filter are in the demodulator, and
  as someone else observed really speak to how closely you're tuned
  to the received signal, that just doesn't seem useful.
  
  The spectrum graphs might be.
  
  73 -- Lynn
  
  On 9/14/2015 11:55 AM, Luis V. Romero wrote:


  However, I can't monitor other issues that can rear their 
ugly heads in
RTTY, be it modulated by FSK or AFSK with the existing functionality
available:  The reason I was looking for a better visual representation of
these issues in this tool is explained in an excellent article by Andy
Flowers, K0SM.

 

http://frontiernet.net/%7Eaflowers/k3rtty/k3rtty.html;>http://frontiernet.net/~aflowers/k3rtty/k3rtty.html


  


--060809070606000101030600--
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[Elecraft] K3 / K3S Station setup question

[ae4pb]

It's been a while and I'm a huge proponent of measure twice cut once. I'm
building a hutch for my operating desk. The desk is 4' wide x 28" deep (2'
4"). I'm right handed and my primary mode will be CW. I have both a Bencher
paddle and a generic straight key. I need about 18" wide for my K3S and
future P3. The K3S is 10"x10"x7.25"(stand extended and air gap above it.
Planning to use a 1 x or 2 x 12 for the shelf and 1x for the vertical
supports. 

Not sure on right to left arrangement with me sitting in the middle. Was
thinking keys, then P3, then radio, then space to the left. 
Allowing 3/4" for the end support, 9 inches for the keys to store, 3/4" for
a vertical support, then 18" or so for the P3, then K3S, the 3/4 for
vertical Support. That brings me 29.25" from the Right edge leaving 18" (if
we subtract 3/4" for the end vertical support) for the Eventual AMP. If I
eventually get the External antenna tuner it will go on top of the shelf or
on top of the amp directly if it will fit.

Does this sound like a proper setup to operate CW with the arm on the
desk..etc.. turn dials with the left hand..etc.. I'll have a laptop/monitors
on top of the shelf and a smallish keyboard/mouse on the desktop.

Just trying to get it all worked out so I don't have to remake this thing
several times.. why re-invent the wheel when someone has already done it
right? 

Thanks in advance.
Jerry Moore
K3S SN# TBA Wednesday  

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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Don Wilhelm]

Jer,

The information I have is that it is indeed manufactured in California.
Components (jacks, switches, etc.) are sourced worldwide.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 9/14/2015 1:38 PM, ae...@carolinaheli.com wrote:

I guess I shouldn't have assumed anything but I did..


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of 
a...@sbcglobal.net
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 12:03 PM
To: ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne Burdick'; 'Elecraft 
Reflector'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the 
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P




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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

[Cliff Frescura]

I don't know where it is made, but I was able to see one in the flesh at
HamCon this past weekend and it has a solid feel and weight to it (in
addition to sounding great too).  Seems like a no brainer addition to me.

One wish would be to have the headphone jack on the speaker and use the
input switch (as an output switch) to switch between headphone and speaker,
so that the headphones can stay plugged in (I modified my SP-940 to work
this way)

73, 

Cliff K3LL/6

-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
ae...@carolinaheli.com
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 10:39 AM
To: a...@sbcglobal.net; ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne
Burdick'; 'Elecraft Reflector'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

I guess I shouldn't have assumed anything but I did..


-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of
a...@sbcglobal.net
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2015 12:03 PM
To: ae...@carolinaheli.com; 'Bob McGraw - K4TAX'; 'Wayne Burdick'; 'Elecraft
Reflector'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

Jerry's (AE4PB) post and others suggest new speaker is actually made in the
USA.  Is that true??
Mike  AC5P   


 On Monday, September 14, 2015 10:34 AM, "ae...@carolinaheli.com"
 wrote:
   

 I believe when you consider the engineering reputation of Elecraft and
economies of scale for the manufacture of the SP3 several expectations
arise:
1. This is likely a very well-engineered component that's not easily
replaced by a similar sized speaker. 
2. Performance of the speaker exceeds similarly priced speakers (and
definitely less expensive ones to a degree). 
3. There is NOT likely a premium baked in to the price for the Elecraft name
due to the economies of scale (low quantity manufacture generally means
higher costs, thus higher price). Translation - the price isn't just for the
name.

At the end of the day consider the labor costs plus parts are likely fairly
high if they are US manufactured. 

The US consumer is the sole reason most US manufacturing has gone overseas
(especially China). Buy cheap, get cheap.

So it comes down to a question of quality vs "good enough" vs "price" 

I can only speak for myself in saying that it means something to have a
matching set rather than a hodgepodge. 
I do compromise and use what I have to be able to get the job done UNTIL
I've saved enough for the next piece. 

Personally the SP3 is last on my list because most if not all of my
operating will be with headphones. 
The point here is that it's on my list :)



Jerry Moore
AE4PB, K3S SN# Arrives Wed. 






-Original Message-
From: Elecraft [mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Bob
McGraw - K4TAX
Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2015 3:28 PM
To: Wayne Burdick; Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SP3 External Speaker details

New products are always welcome.  I look forward to "hearing them" at maybe
one of the next ham fests.  I like the fact the SP3 uses an oval speaker.
I've never figured out exactly why, but I find ovals typically do sound
better than rounds, but maybe it seems to be only in my findings.

As a comment, I prefer non-amplified speakers as this avoids the potential
RFI issues when used with the radio.  The model that I mentioned and use has
a slight tilt to the bottom which aligns the front with the K3S with its
front elevated by the stand.

I also find the audio system in the K3S to be really nice, specially the
2 channel effect using the AFX feature along with a stereo speaker
configuration.  This give a nice wide spatial effect to which I find very
pleasing.  Thanks Wayne and company for doing a fine job with the K3S and
its new features.

73
Bob, K4TAX
K3S s/n 10,163

On 9/13/2015 2:09 PM, Wayne Burdick wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> The K3 or K3S will work with a wide range of speakers, including the 
> ones
Bob (K4TAX) mentioned.
>
> Here are some possible reasons for using an SP3:
>
> - matches the K-Line perfectly, including a rugged fold-up tilt stand
> - full stereo A/B source selection, supporting dual-rig and 
> dual-speaker configurations (or both)
> - plenty of room inside the cabinet for built-ins that might improve 
> station integration
>
> Of course these factors don't apply to everyone. But the good news is 
> that we will no longer have to say "maybe next year" every time 
> someone asks us to add a matching speaker to the product line :)
>
> 73,
> Wayne
> N6KR
>
>
> Bob McGraw - K4TAX  wrote:
>
>> I use a pair of "off the shelf" brand speakers which have 2" x 4" 
>> ovals
in a nice efficient solid enclosure that is 5" deep
>
>
>
>
>


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This list 

[Elecraft] SO2R

[Morgan Bailey]

Wayne,

What i would really like to see implemented is an SO2R controller placed in
a KAT500 size box.  I think it would be the ideal size for the interface.
Using 2 K3/K3S radios and full amplifier capability. This would include
sequencer switching for turning off amplified RX arrays and a 12/13.6 V
power supply switching for an array pre-amp. Power supply does not need to
be included, just a good fast relay to sequentially turn off the pre-amps
so they don't get blown up using an amp in near proximity. Include an input
for a ps on the back and that way what ever pre-amp you have the op
supplies the voltage and you supply the switching.

Next using the same size box, the KAT500, put band pass filters in the box
for 2 radios or at least one radio. Auto and manual buttons on the front
panel if possible.

Most importantly, the matching SO2R box and i can deal with filters as
needed for the antennas that I use.  I don't even have a K3S yet but soon
will be making a $6000 investment of a K3S and associated equipment.

Lastly, If possible making a 1000 to 1200 or possible 1500 watt amp in 2
boxes each the size of a K3S…10x10x4. Use one box for the PS and the other
for the amp.  PS on the floor to clean up op table and keep the flow of the
gear.  I loved the Ten Tec titan amp and omniV gear that I once owned
because it all fit together well. I currently have the 1.5kl THP amp. What
a great amp that is. Way over built but rock solid stable.  It puts out 900
watts and it is solidly built but weights a ton. If the same guts but in 2
boxes PS/RF control decks, that would make my day. Yes i know it is going
to be costly but what good amp is not costly. And yes i understand the cost
benefit ratio that a small business must analyze but I also think that
Elecraft people drink the koolaide and would gladly love to have a black
ugly box that says elecraft on it in the spartan, utilitarian fashion that
is so epicly descriptive of the Elecraft line. No frills that not needed,
just pure function done well.

I just pulled 800 feet of coax and switching cables today and will soon be
putting down 1200ft of radials under a vertical. Next year is the tower.
Beams are in the garage. Plan to be radioactive in october and doing SS in
Nov as my first contest in 16 years.

73 NJ8M
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

[Adam Farson]

Hi Johnny,

 

The K3 with the KSYN3A is in a closely-packed cluster of radios which score 
highest in the NPR test. Its exact ranking depends on which test frequency is 
being compared. The differences are very slight, mostly within a couple of dB.

 

In practice, I regard an NPR value of 80 dB or higher as excellent.

 

73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ

 

 

From: Johnny Siu [mailto:vr2...@yahoo.com.hk] 
Sent: 14-Sep-15 00:54
To: Adam Farson; Elecraft List
Subject: K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?

 

Hello Adam,

 

From reading of your NPR chart, could I understand that apart from IC7851, the 
K3 (with new KSYN3A installed) is the second best in terms of NPR test?

 

73

 

Johnny VR2XMC

 

  _  

寄件人︰ Adam Farson 
收件人︰ Elecraft List  
傳送日期︰ 2015年09月14日 (週一) 2:51 PM
主題︰ Re: [Elecraft] K3 to IC-7800 Comparison?


For Jim K9YC:



Hi Jim,



Many thanks for the post on my presentations at the club meeting on Saturday
September 5.



To quote:

"There's an important caveat to his work. The NPR measurements require 

very sophisticated band-stop filters in his instrumentation setup, and 

based on the filters he has been able to source, that limits the 

frequency range where he can do his measurements. An example is in the 

footnote for the Flex-6700, which has no preselector for the range where 

he had to do his measurements, which may have caused that radio to 

measure worse than it would on the ham bands."



The instrumentation I use for NPR testing is re-purposed telecom test
equipment, as described in my Web article and also in my article in QEX for
March/April 2015. I rely on the surplus market for the test sets, and also
for the filter pairs (bandstop and bandpass). The bandstop filters typically
have 95 dB stopband attenuation and ~ 3 kHz stopband width.



A number of these filters are on (or near) amateur bands, e.g. 1940, 3886,
5340, 7600 and 11700 kHz. The first filter pair I acquired was on 5340 kHz,
so all the test data in my web article are on this frequency (which is in
the 60m band). The Flex-6700 does not have a preselector for this band, so
the noise loading will hit the front end and the ADC harder. This will
degrade the NPR reading by a few dB, but it will show how the receiver
behaves if heavily loaded on a band for which no preselector is fitted.



As I picked up additional filters, the number of frequencies on which I run
the test has steadily increased. Links to multi-frequency NPR data for
various radios (including the K3 with KSYN3A) are on my website:



http://www.ab4oj.com/test/main.html#NPR  
 



It was a pleasure meeting you guys over the Labour Day weekend.



73, Adam VA7OJ/AB4OJ



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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Width Control and AF Output Level

[Mike K2MK]

Hi Keith,

I think the problem is in the setting for the RXEQ. You do not want to use
+db boost for CW. As I understand it, RXEQ is disabled at 100Hz and 50Hz
width. So if he has boosted a particular frequency by 10db then when he
narrows the bandwidth he will suddenly hear a loss of audio signal of 10db.
To solve this problem keep the RXEQ set to 0 db for the frequencies of
interest and use negative db settings for the frequencies of no interest.

73,
Mike K2MK


Keith Onishi wrote
> One of my friend K3 users report that AF output level with 100Hz passband
> width is lower than with 150Hz passband width. He also reported that a
> noise like “Ptsu” was generated on reducing passband width from 150Hz to
> 100Hz. He had guessed that these were specific to his K3, but some other
> K3 users including myself reported the same.
> Some extreme users who use this narrow passband may have been bothered by
> this reduced AF output level and noise. If the AF output level change is
> caused by K3 DSP filter design or program, adding automatic gain
> compensation feature to keep same AF output level would be highly welcome.
> 
> 73 de JH3SIF, Keith





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