Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-22 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 05:35:03PM -0500, christopher sullivan wrote: and Julian your definition was perfect, towering over all other possible attempts, you must understand the small mind I have to work with.. Chris. Chris I liked your definitions, certainly far more fun/complex than what I

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-21 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 06:07:24PM -0500, christopher sullivan wrote: definitions, I think we are not all talking about the same thing. so here are my worst case and best case definitions of prototyping. [..] what is your definition? (earlier) Prototyping is any test of expectation

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-21 Thread adrian
The software might be free and the prototype might be free, but you, the creator are not. You are bound in a panopticon where anonymous others can observe and scrutinize your creative output. How can you not mediate your behavior aware of this scrutiny? Is the prototype a tentative confirmation of

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-21 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Sat, Mar 20, 2010 at 11:34:49PM -0700, adr...@cnmat.berkeley.edu wrote: The software might be free and the prototype might be free, but you, the creator are not. You are bound in a panopticon where anonymous others can observe and scrutinize your creative output. How can you not mediate

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-21 Thread christopher sullivan
and Julian your definition was perfect, towering over all other possible attempts, you must understand the small mind I have to work with.. Chris. Quoting Julian Oliver jul...@julianoliver.com: ..on Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 06:07:24PM -0500, christopher sullivan wrote: definitions, I think we

[-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-20 Thread Cynthia Beth Rubin
svd and all .. a few thoughts - I offered the critique system of artist-to-artist discussion as evidence that the artist dialogue is generally based on Prototypes, and generally Open Source. Art, in any format, real or virtual, can be considered as a manifestation of ideas and the

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-20 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Fri, Mar 19, 2010 at 06:07:24PM -0500, christopher sullivan wrote: definitions, I think we are not all talking about the same thing. so here are my worst case and best case definitions of prototyping. Chris dictionary, Prototype A prototype is an original type, form, or instance of

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-20 Thread Rob Myers
On Fri, 19 Mar 2010 08:54:37 +, s...@krokodile.co.uk s...@krokodile.co.uk wrote: cynthia/all The logic of open-source seems to work in subsidized environment like academia where they are paid for teaching and perhaps a little research - but external to the academy how would an

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-20 Thread adrian
It's a cliche but its true - the problem is not piracy, it's obscurity. what is the problem of obscurity? Free culture helps to address that. by giving everyone a minute of fame? ___ empyre forum empyre@lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-19 Thread Lynn Hershman
Actually the Art Colider is a joint project with the San Francisco Art Institute begun nearly 2 years ago. http://theartcollider.org/ l On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:12 PM, Renate Ferro wrote: Thanks Cynthia for sharing. I've been lurking this month, enjoying Adrienne's posts and others. I just

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-19 Thread s...@krokodile.co.uk
cynthia/all The logic of open-source seems to work in subsidized environment like academia where they are paid for teaching and perhaps a little research - but external to the academy how would an open-source artist survive ? I can see how the economics of it would work in West, with a false

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-19 Thread davin heckman
I ran into the case of the disposable diaper and the result it has had in increasing by an average of several years now how long it takes for children to be potty trained. On the surface it is valuable to eliminate children's discomfort by optimizing the diaper. In fact current diapers

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-19 Thread Renate Ferro
Yes of course, I believe it is a collaboration as I said. Are there not many collaborators, Lynn? Actually the Art Colider is a joint project with the San Francisco Art Institute begun nearly 2 years ago. http://theartcollider.org/ l On Mar 18, 2010, at 9:12 PM, Renate Ferro wrote:

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-19 Thread christopher sullivan
definitions, I think we are not all talking about the same thing. so here are my worst case and best case definitions of prototyping. Chris dictionary, Prototype A prototype is an original type, form, or instance of something serving as a typical example, basis, or standard for other things of

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-19 Thread christopher sullivan
also, if the diaper is comfortable, there is no incentive for the child to become potty trained. Chris Quoting davin heckman davinheck...@gmail.com: I ran into the case of the disposable diaper and the result it has had in increasing by an average of several years now how long it takes

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-18 Thread Johannes Birringer
it is disturbing and yet now apparently more acceptably commonplace to think (in the era of current culturally mediated narcissisms) progressively of self modifications and enhancements, and as Stelarc might phrase it, having done the Extra Ear project or doing it as we speak, of operational

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-18 Thread Julian Oliver
..on Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 03:10:01PM -, Johannes Birringer wrote: Davin wrote: At one point in time, discrete objects were things that were considered prototypes that could be thrown into an existing system and tested. Increasingly, it seems like the prototypes are geared to test

[-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-18 Thread Cynthia Beth Rubin
Wow - I love the concept that we are all changing and that each of us an ongoing prototype for the next generation of ourselves At the CAA session on Open Source (chaired by Patrick Lichty), Michael Mandiberg gave a presentation arguing for giving away Design ideas, for making practical

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-18 Thread adrian
On the other hand, there are technologies that seem to be introduced with the stated purpose of achieving one objective, yet have the larger objective of changing human populations. Take, for instance, the infamous case of Nestle's infant formula strategy in Africa. Company reps

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-18 Thread Renate Ferro
Thanks Cynthia for sharing. I've been lurking this month, enjoying Adrienne's posts and others. I just wanted to add that the new media artist and designer Maurice Benayoun visited our Cornell Art Department this week where he shared with our students his open source website of ideas and

Re: [-empyre-] seeing yourself a prototype - the limits of open source

2010-03-18 Thread Renate Ferro
Adrienne, But what is unusable you some may be usable by others, no? I agree though that the idea finding phase is more nuanced but am not convinced that there must be implementation. Renate always giving away our ideas, our sense of how art works, what it can do, or what it might be in a