On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 22:52, Garrett Smith dhtmlkitc...@gmail.com wrote:
On 4/18/11, Claus Reinke claus.rei...@talk21.com wrote:
The only places where semicolons are ever used in the Node.js package
manager are in the 'for' loops headers and at the *beginning* of the lines
that would be
On Apr 18, 2011, at 10:52 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
[aside: it would be nice to know who the committee members
are, and what the process is for starting an official proposal]
Who are the committee members?
Ecma TC39 members, a bunch of us self-identify here.
Ecma is a standards body, you
On Apr 19, 2011, at 8:39 AM, Isaac Schlueter wrote:
This style is more easily
scanned. The important tokens are along the left edge, which forms a
straight line with logical and orderly breaks, and those tokens are
not overused, so their presence or absence is very noticeable. The
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 11:52 AM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
So ASI does *not* change program behavior from non-error behavior A to
non-error behavior B. It instead suppresses early SyntaxError with
successful evaluation, in a deterministic way.
Is that true even in the return
I hope this is the right place to ask this question:
When are LexicalEnvironment and VariableEnvironment ever not the same? My
understanding, derived from ECMA-262 is as follows:
(1) Mainly needed for with, because properties should be found during
identifier lookup, but new bindings should be
On 18/04/2011, at 16:37, Mike Ratcliffe wrote:
Jorge, I would opt in for warnings e.g. if I planned on minifying my web app
in the future. Most web apps will burn in hell if they are missing semicolons
when you minify them.
Indeed, for some minifiers it's a must.
These minifiers avoid
On 17/04/2011, at 19:44, Dmitry A. Soshnikov wrote:
(...) Since usually, a programmer puts a one logical sentences per line --
*for what* you need additional statement/expression termination besides the
new line itself? The useless actions in this case can be compared with
masochism. (...)
On Apr 19, 2011, at 9:37 AM, Axel Rauschmayer wrote:
I hope this is the right place to ask this question:
When are LexicalEnvironment and VariableEnvironment ever not the same? My
understanding, derived from ECMA-262 is as follows:
(1) Mainly needed for with, because properties should
On Apr 19, 2011, at 9:36 AM, John Tamplin wrote:
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 11:52 AM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
So ASI does *not* change program behavior from non-error behavior A to
non-error behavior B. It instead suppresses early SyntaxError with successful
evaluation, in a
2011/4/19 Bob Nystrom rnyst...@google.com:
On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 7:46 PM, Mike Samuel mikesam...@gmail.com wrote:
If I understand semicolon elision, then
myLabel:
for (;;) {}
would be interpreted as
myLabel: ;
for (;;) {}
I'm still learning to details of the ES grammar, but I didn't
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 09:57, Jorge jo...@jorgechamorro.com wrote:
Most web apps will burn in hell if they are missing semicolons when you
minify them.
Indeed, for some minifiers it's a must.
Which minifiers?
Closure, yuicompressor, jsmin, packer, and uglify all handle ASI
without so much
On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
On Apr 19, 2011, at 8:39 AM, Isaac Schlueter wrote:
This style is more easily
scanned. The important tokens are along the left edge, which forms a
straight line with logical and orderly breaks, and those tokens are
not overused, so their
2011/4/19 Bob Nystrom rnyst...@google.com:
On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 7:46 PM, Mike Samuel mikesam...@gmail.com wrote:
var x = foo
+ bar
That's true. I believe in languages that default to treating newlines as
significant, the style is to put a binary operator at the end of the line
and
On 19/04/2011, at 19:52, Isaac Schlueter wrote:
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 09:57, Jorge jo...@jorgechamorro.com wrote:
Most web apps will burn in hell if they are missing semicolons when you
minify them.
Indeed, for some minifiers it's a must.
Which minifiers?
I don't know, the ones that
I think there are a large number of programmers who, because of those
java style guidelines and the way ASI works, write javascript breaking
before operators except for comma operators.
http://www.google.com/codesearch?q=%5Cx20%5Cx20%5Cx20%5B%2B-%5D%5B
^%2B-%5D+lang%3Ajavascript
shows
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 11:02, Garrett Smith dhtmlkitc...@gmail.com wrote:
On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
I don't mean to annoy by repeating the same things, but here goes: Is
`()` Grouping Operator or Arguments? Is `[]` ArrayLiteral or Property
Accessor? Or do these cases
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 2:53 PM, Bob Nystrom rnyst...@google.com wrote:
I think there are a large number of programmers who, because of those
java style guidelines and the way ASI works, write javascript breaking
before operators except for comma operators.
var a = 1
+ 2
// a = 1
var a = (1
+ 2)
// a = 3
Ok, so you are advocating that adding extra parens is less typing and less
prone to error than adding semicolons?
Yes, adding extra parens where needed and omitting ; is less typing. To
verify, I just went through a bunch of
On Mon, Apr 18, 2011 at 7:38 PM, David Bruant david.bru...@labri.fr wrote:
Thus, it seems to me that storing
anything in handlers besides existing traps is likely to cause future
headaches, and should be avoided.
That's an excellent point. It sounds to be a safe idea to consider the
handler
The reason === comes up with value types/proxies is the goal of supporting
decimal and other number types, where 1.1m ===
something_computing_fresh_1_1m() must be true.
If 1.1m was defined as singleton proxy, then === would work correctly,
because both 1.1m and give_new_1_1() return the same
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 11:53, Jorge jo...@jorgechamorro.com wrote:
Which minifiers?
I don't know, the ones that make web apps burn in hell if they are missing
semicolons.
Until someone can point to an actual minifier that's actually affected
by this, I think the whole minification requires
Hey list,
just wanted to ask what's going to happen with typeof null, i am a lot
in the favor of changing it to say null. Changing this was discussed
here http://wiki.ecmascript.org/doku.php?id=strawman:object_isobject
and http://wiki.ecmascript.org/doku.php?id=proposals:typeof. I think
´typeof
I think there is pretty broad consensus that this will affect the web. To what
extent is unclear. I would be willing to take our nightly testers for a test
drive for a couple days to see how badly things break if TC39 is leaning
towards making such a change. Before we do that maybe you want to
On Apr 19, 2011, at 2:20 PM, Adam Stankiewicz wrote:
The reason === comes up with value types/proxies is the goal of supporting
decimal and other number types, where 1.1m ===
something_computing_fresh_1_1m() must be true.
If 1.1m was defined as singleton proxy, then === would work
On 4/19/11, Isaac Schlueter i...@izs.me wrote:
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 11:02, Garrett Smith dhtmlkitc...@gmail.com wrote:
On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
I don't mean to annoy by repeating the same things, but here goes: Is
`()` Grouping Operator or Arguments? Is `[]`
Hang on. The proposal is to change typeof null == null only under opt-in to
Harmony.
http://wiki.ecmascript.org/doku.php?id=strawman:object_isobject
I'll rewrite this as a harmony:typeof proposal for the next TC39 meeting, but
it's already harmonious in concept.
/be
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:03
On Apr 19, 2011, at 11:02 AM, Garrett Smith wrote:
I don't mean to annoy by repeating the same things, but here goes: Is
`()` Grouping Operator or Arguments? Is `[]` ArrayLiteral or Property
Accessor? Or do these cases depend on the preceding token?
It depends on the context, but ASI does not
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 6:22 PM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
Yes. We've discussed this. It's not a change in semantics due to the
error-correction aspect of ASI. There is no ASI on this concatenated input!
Yes, but given that ASI encourages developers to omit semicolons except
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
On 4/19/11, Isaac Schlueter i...@izs.me wrote:
ASI didn't change the program behavior. ASI didn't happen in that example.
Isaac is correct.
Newline elision changed the program behavior.
Or newlines being insignificant whitespace, let's
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:27 PM, John Tamplin wrote:
On Tue, Apr 19, 2011 at 6:22 PM, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
Yes. We've discussed this. It's not a change in semantics due to the
error-correction aspect of ASI. There is no ASI on this concatenated input!
Yes, but given that ASI
Oh missed that wiki page. Good to see this going, created
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=651251 anyways.
(Sorry brendan, didn't meant to write to you, post mailing list generation here)
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On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
On 4/19/11, Isaac Schlueter i...@izs.me wrote:
ASI didn't change the program behavior. ASI didn't happen in that
example.
Isaac is correct.
Newline elision changed the program behavior.
On 4/19/11, Garrett Smith dhtmlkitc...@gmail.com wrote:
On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
On 4/19/11, Isaac Schlueter i...@izs.me wrote:
ASI didn't change the program behavior. ASI didn't happen in that
example.
Isaac is
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:54 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
On Apr 19, 2011, at 3:08 PM, Garrett Smith wrote:
On 4/19/11, Isaac Schlueter i...@izs.me wrote:
Newline elision changed the program behavior.
Or newlines being insignificant whitespace,
On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
[...]
But good point. Indeed, feel free to file a bug at
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org asking for such a warning. I'll support it.
I'll do it.
--
Garrett
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On 4/19/11, Brendan Eich bren...@mozilla.com wrote:
[...]
You are asking for an warning when a file ends without a semicolon required
by the grammar, and ASI kicks in. Fair point, good idea. It's not going to
do enough by itself, since warnings are easy to miss, and often annoy the
wrong party
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