Re: [EVDL] new battery technology moving past the labs
If you want to see a battery technology that is proven, safe, can take 50,000 cycles without much degradation and survive recharge cycles of 8 minutes, then look at Natron with their Sodium-Ion battery. Prussian Blue and seawater is essentially what their battery is made of. Unfortunately the energy identity is not ideal for cars, but Datacenters are very happy with their high cycle life battery! They are only a few miles from me and I visited them a few years ago, unfortunately it never came to a cooperation, not due to Natron. Cor. On Wed, Jul 13, 2022 at 3:39 PM Mr. Sharkey via EV wrote: > > > ... politicians waving flags and clubs and pushing > > their nationalist belligerence. Present batteries > > use raw materials that raise political concerns. ... instead > > of worrying so much about charging speed, electrochemists > > should be concentrating their efforts on developing batteries > > that use raw materials that are more plentiful, more > > widely distributed, and less expensive. > > Proposed solution that hits all your points, except one: > > Hot Air Batteries! > > No shortage of that on the world stage today, or ever. > > Sorry, no way can I see anything that involves politicians as being > less expensive!! > > Think of the possible spin-off products: > > Bluster Batteries > Chest-Pounding Cells > Flag-Waving Supercapacitors > Back-Room Deal BMS's > Filibuster Charge Monitors > Voter Fraud Warranty Extension Policies > Stop The Steal Smart Phone Security Apps > > Many more to come! > > ___ > Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org > No other addresses in TO and CC fields > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/sub/index.html > CONFIG: http://lists.evdl.org/options.cgi/ev-evdl.org > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ > INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/sub/index.html CONFIG: http://lists.evdl.org/options.cgi/ev-evdl.org ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] new battery technology moving past the labs
> ... politicians waving flags and clubs and pushing > their nationalist belligerence. Present batteries > use raw materials that raise political concerns. ... instead > of worrying so much about charging speed, electrochemists > should be concentrating their efforts on developing batteries > that use raw materials that are more plentiful, more > widely distributed, and less expensive. Proposed solution that hits all your points, except one: Hot Air Batteries! No shortage of that on the world stage today, or ever. Sorry, no way can I see anything that involves politicians as being less expensive!! Think of the possible spin-off products: Bluster Batteries Chest-Pounding Cells Flag-Waving Supercapacitors Back-Room Deal BMS's Filibuster Charge Monitors Voter Fraud Warranty Extension Policies Stop The Steal Smart Phone Security Apps Many more to come! ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/sub/index.html CONFIG: http://lists.evdl.org/options.cgi/ev-evdl.org ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] new battery technology moving past the labs
EV List Lackey via EV said (in small part): > If you can get it! As I see it, the infrastructure required to blast that > much power into multiple vehicles at a motorway charging stop is the big > challenge. It's not the battery's ability to accept a charge. Not hardly. Supplying a couple megawatts to a charging stop is just not that big of a deal. Your average shopping mall takes more than that, and even most residential distribution circuits carry more than that. 73 - Jim Walls - K6CCC j...@k6ccc.org ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/sub/index.html CONFIG: http://lists.evdl.org/options.cgi/ev-evdl.org ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
Re: [EVDL] new battery technology moving past the labs
> hundreds of thousands of cells allowing cars to recharge in less than > 10 minutes. It seems as if almost every electrochemist and lab working on batteries puts this at the top of the feature list. Why? Isn't fast charging at up to 350kW already possible with existing batteries? That much power can charge a 100kWh battery from 20% to 80% in 10 minutes. If you can get it! As I see it, the infrastructure required to blast that much power into multiple vehicles at a motorway charging stop is the big challenge. It's not the battery's ability to accept a charge. It's been a rule of thumb since about forever that with proper management an EV battery can charge about as quickly as it can discharge. So if you can send 350kW to the wheels, you can put 350kW back into the battery. But perhaps I'm missing something. We also already have capacity that we hardly dreamed of even a decade ago. Heck, back in 2000, 15kWh was a big battery. Today around 50-60kWh is common in garden variety EVs, and in the ignorant behemoths that the irresponsible car companies are pushing (just as they do in ICEVs), batteries are more like 70-90kWh, with some at least proposed that are over 100kWh. So I don't see that capacity is such a big problem any more. But again, maybe there's something here that I don't see. The world is growing more unstable by the day, with politicians waving flags and clubs, and pushing their nationalist belligerence. Present batteries use raw materials that raise political concerns. It seems to me that instead of worrying so much about charging speed, electrochemists should be concentrating their efforts on developing batteries that use raw materials that are more plentiful, more widely distributed, and less expensive. David Roden, EVDL moderator & general lackey To reach me, don't reply to this message; I won't get it. Use my offlist address here : http://evdl.org/help/index.html#supt = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = In our obscurity, in all this vastness, there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves. -- Carl Sagan, "Pale Blue Dot" = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/sub/index.html CONFIG: http://lists.evdl.org/options.cgi/ev-evdl.org ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
[EVDL] new battery technology moving past the labs
I think, the move to "mass" production is very encouraging. In this case "mass" means production-like trials, so this is still in the "we promise" stage. The article mentions several companies which have backing from and trials with auto manufacturers. Peri Advanced E.V. Batteries Move From Labs to Mass Production https://www.nytimes.com/2022/07/12/business/electric-vehicle-batteries.html Now a few of those scientists and the companies they founded ... are building factories to produce next-generation battery cells, allowing carmakers to begin road testing the technologies and determine whether they are safe and reliable. ... The factory operations are mostly limited in scale, designed to perfect manufacturing techniques. ... Producing battery cells by the millions in a factory is vastly more difficult than making a few hundred in a clean room ... Adding to the risk, the slump in tech stocks has stripped billions of dollars in value from battery companies that are traded publicly. It will not be as easy for them to raise the cash they need to build manufacturing operations and pay their staff. ... After years of experimentation, QuantumScape developed a ceramic material — its exact composition is a secret ... technology makes it possible to substitute a solid material for the liquid electrolyte ...Though technically a “pre-pilot” assembly line, the QuantumScape factory in San Jose is almost as big as four football fields. ... “We are confident that the remaining challenges are engineering in nature,” said Doug Campbell, chief executive of Solid Power, ... said in June that it had installed a pilot production line that would begin supplying cells for testing purposes to its automotive partners by the end of the year. ... The drawback of silicon is that it swells to three times its size when charged, potentially stressing the components so much that the battery would fail. ... << Annoyed by leaf blowers ? https://quietcleanseattle.org/ >> ___ Address messages to ev@lists.evdl.org No other addresses in TO and CC fields UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/sub/index.html CONFIG: http://lists.evdl.org/options.cgi/ev-evdl.org ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/ INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org
