RE: Natural Order & Belief

2006-11-18 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
Brent Meeker writes: > You mean like this: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12345b.htm That reference has an interesting take on prayer: "In hearing our prayer God does not change His will or action in our regard, but simply puts into effect what He had eternally decreed in view of our prayer.

Re: Natural Order & Belief

2006-11-18 Thread Bruno Marchal
Le 17-nov.-06, à 20:35, Brent Meeker a écrit : > > Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> Historically the "theo" was referring to gods, by the greek >> intellectuals. From their writing you can see that "gods" could refer >> to "concepts" as well as images to figure out abstract recurring >> patterns i

Re: Natural Order & Belief

2006-11-18 Thread John M
Stathis, I enjoy your (Brent, Bruno, etc.) religion-class. What you quoted about prayer, is in the ballpark of what I say always, except for the addition: 'does what was to be done anyway'. IOW: he doesn't care. Why do the religions (almost all of them) depict a god after the worst human char

UDA revisited

2006-11-18 Thread Russell Standish
I had a thought about an alternative way of expressing the UDA (universal dovetailer argument). Computationalism is the statement that "I am a computation". To use the RITSIAR acronym, computations are real in the sense I am real. But the Church-Turing thesis gives a particular model of a computa

Re: UDA revisited

2006-11-18 Thread Colin Geoffrey Hales
> Since it makes no difference in any observable respect whether we are living in a computer simulation running on a bare substrate, as one that is incidently computated as part of a universal dovetailer, or an infinite chain of dovetailers, we really can make use of Laplace's ripost to Napoleon

RE: UDA revisited

2006-11-18 Thread Stathis Papaioannou
Russell Standish writes: > I had a thought about an alternative way of expressing the UDA > (universal dovetailer argument). > > Computationalism is the statement that "I am a computation". To use > the RITSIAR acronym, computations are real in the sense I am real. But > the Church-Turing thesi

Re: UDA revisited

2006-11-18 Thread Russell Standish
On Sun, Nov 19, 2006 at 02:36:04PM +1100, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: > > But if a physical universe is needed to run the UD, without a physical > universe > there is no UD. It's a circular argument unless you have some other argument > showing a computation can run without physical hardware. >

Re: UDA revisited

2006-11-18 Thread Stephen Paul King
Hi Russel, Are you assuming non-well founded sets? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-well-founded_set_theory Onward! Stephen - Original Message - From: "Russell Standish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Sent: Saturday, November 18, 2006 3:12 AM Subject: Re: UDA revisited > > On Sun, No