Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
It's good to look at 9-11 like a mystery movie. It would be like one of those movies were a dirty cop kills some innocent person and an equally corrupt police force covers up for him. In the process private detectives and journalists begin to uncover what really went on. Of course the corrupt police hassles them and try to throw them off as they get too close to the truth. Likewise if 9-11 were an inside job then of course they it would make perfect sense that the perpetrators would use disinformation to throw 9-11 truthers off course. Many of the 9-11 truth people go to great pains to filter out disinformation and incorrect evidence. They're not going to be perfect but neither are the perps. Time will tell. authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Actually, Ari Fleischer, the press secretary, revealed it the next day at a press conference. It was relayed to the Bush folks after Air Force One had taken off, not at the school. And the code name wasn't secret; it had been published numerous times. Whatever. It was around that time. Neither did I say it was a secret code word. No, you didn't, but Tarpley does, and administration shills do as well. On what page of 9/11 Synthetic Terror does Tarpley say that? I don't see it. Moreover, it turned out to have been a misunderstanding all along, in the chaos after the attacks. The White House has promoted it as an excuse for Air Force One's aimlessness and for Bush not coming back to D.C. right away. So much for your guy's thorough documentation. So you believe the Bush administration? Huh? Do I believe it was a legitimate threat? Did you read what I wrote? Did you read what I wrote? The source on that would have had to be the Bush administration which is known for cover-ups and lies. Find those WMDs yet? Complete non sequitur. Am I making you a little nervous? No it isn't a non sequitur. It is a joke, obviously. You make me nervous? Hardly, you're being delusional. I can understand that some people don't want to entertain the idea that official 9-11 was cover because that would mean they are living under a hostile regime. Guess what, Bhairitu? Some of us have been well aware for some years that we're living under a hostile regime, and we *still* think the 9/11 conspiracy theories are bunkum. Those two ideas are not mutually exclusive, sorry. This is like reviewing a movie without actually seeing it. I beg your pardon? Most of the people here have only read short accounts and really don't have that much knowledge of the 9-11 truth movement. How much of the movie have you seen? Quite a bit. I've spent many hours on the various Web sites, watched several of the films. For awhile I thought there was something to it, but then I began to find some very good debunking sites, and most of the claims just don't hold up under examination. Care to share with us just what those debunking sites are (so I can debunk them)? I just can't believe you fall for the official story. It's a lot more than just the official story. You don't have to depend on what the government says--or on Popular Mechanics, for that matter-- to figure out that the conspiracy theories are bunk. That is bunk. Conspiracies are a part of history. For some bizarre reason you don't like to admit to them. Duh. Even without 9-11 we have the most corrupt government in the history of the nation. If you can't see that then you're part of the problem and obviously taking (to use the Matrix movie analogy) the blue pill. We *do* see that, Bhairitu. We just don't find the conspiracy theories about 9/11 convincing. Who's we? Do you have multiple personality syndrome? :D There are several people on FFL who are skeptical of the conspiracy theories. So you speak for them? There are many others here who aren't so skeptical. Again I have my doubts that you've looked into it that much. I've been very interested in it ever since it happened and have read everything I could find on it. How do you think I know the Popular Mechanics debunking was so poor and simplistic if I haven't looked into the theories in some detail? You don't seem to see the contradictions in your own arguments. There are no contradictions in my arguments. You're just making that up.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've read a ton about the 9-11 inside-job concept, and it is very hard to keep from getting enraged when the material is gone over. But that's just me. To me there are certain big issues that seem to be inadequately explained by the anti-conspiracy explanations. Just off the top of my head, here's the issues that most bother me even after all my research lite. 1. The pancaking of the floors happened so well that any demolition company that had had the job would have been given an extra bonus for not harming the surrounding buildings by having a whole tower fall like a tree -- sideways. Both towers fell straight down for the most part. Probably designed to collapse like that rather than fall over and possibly killing millions. The reverse implication being that people had got inside the building and wired it to collapse as in a proper demolition job, I think those working inside might have noticed the cables pulling the alls together and asked a few questions about the explosives needed. 2. This pancaking is seen to be perfectly happening in the fall of Building Seven also. After Building Seven fell, an official being interviewed admits ON CAMERA that yeah, we pulled it. But no one can pull a building and have it pancake down like Building Seven without MONTHS OF PLANNING. A few fire officials and firemen/women could NEVER have put anything in place that would have allowed for the building to be imploded -- and they're firemen/women NOT explosives experts. Again, vibrations in the superstructure damaged the metal frame and it collapsed, it looks suspicious but if it was part of an inside jbo why bother with that building? why not just be happy that the WTC fell down as planned? 3. The hole in the Pentagon walls all the way to the inner rings can't be explained by ANY large aircraft, but is easily explained by a rocket attack. A lot of people saw the plane hit, it wasn't a rocket. The wings were blown off backwards by the force of the impact, they are there in the wreckage of the plane. 4. The reactions of Bush when the news got to him. Shock is my guess, lets be honest, how many here didn't stand slack jawed for a minute or two when they heard the news. Imagine being the guy who has to sort it out and come up with some sort of response, I don't like him but I don't envy him either. 5. The non-reactions of shoot 'em down warcraft that didn't scramble in any fashion I would call what the Air Force is supposed to do. That's an easy one, they didn't know what was going on til it was all over. If you missed the movie United 93 watch it as it stars, playing themselves, all the people from airtraffic control in new york, you really get an idea of the confusion and shock, it's all taken from recordings of what happened. It's a superb film anyway, both depressing yet uplifting in it's depiction of true bravery. 6. The Saudi family being allowed to fly a plane when all the other planes were grounded. Money talks. Too much is made of the fact it was relatives of Bin Laden being flown out, he had been exiled from Saudi for a while by this time. The thing stinks with muddy issues. But 9-11 was merely a blip on Evil's radar screen. The one thing that Bill Maher and Bill Clinton have not addressed in their debunking efforts is the fact that the USA is a country that tortures whole nations with carnage upon the innocents. The idea that Americans in high places could never do such a thing as an inside job, is so unbelievably untrue given even the history allowed to be reported in the USA. We kill anything in our way and never take names. Everyday headlines, right? So Clinton's shame on you, how dare you anger at a back of the crowd, conspiracy-nut, is a very strong tell that if he were in office again, he'd do the same ice-cold-heart stuff, and his wife, by all accounts, would be even worse. To me, Clinton is clearly protecting whomever is holding his leash. We're Americans -- we kill for sport, kill for money, and even genocide cannot make us squirm with shame. Ask any Native American. Ask any African-American. Ask any illegal immigrant. Ask the Japanese-Americans in 1944. Ask the slaves that Columbus brought back to Europe. Genocide R Us. No, Bills, shame on you guys for not recognizing evil's history. The face of evil stares at us all, unblinking and forthright. Yes, you have no power, no access, no social structures, nothing that can touch BigMoney that soulessly sucks profits from every sort of misery. Kennedy after Chappaquiddick, Clinton during The Rwandan genocide, Bush reading children a story while towers fell, Cheney after shooting a guy in the face, that bulldozer guy who SLOWLY RAN OVER A WHITE CHRISTIAN AMERICAN BEAUTIFUL YOUNG WOMAN WHILE CAMERAS ROLLED IN FRONT OF A
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
Duveyoung wrote: I've read a ton about the 9-11 inside-job concept, and it is very hard to keep from getting enraged when the material is gone over. But that's just me. You? Popular Mechanics examines the evidence and consults the experts to refute the most persistent conspiracy theories of September 11. Read more: Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report: http://tinyurl.com/nsvar
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
On Oct 29, 2007, at 12:01 PM, Richard J. Williams wrote: Duveyoung wrote: I've read a ton about the 9-11 inside-job concept, and it is very hard to keep from getting enraged when the material is gone over. But that's just me. You? Popular Mechanics examines the evidence and consults the experts to refute the most persistent conspiracy theories of September 11. And the Nova special on PBS, which I believe is available online. It's the unique design of the WTC (supported by outside skeleton) that made it's collapse so unique.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't claim anything about 9-11 -- rocket attack included. I merely reported where I still had open questions. Willy sent me to an excellent debunking site, but you're avoiding the big issues and trying to make me out to a conspiracy nut about a small blip, when the larger issues of evil are ignored by you. You are refusing to show your cards and not answer the accusations I've made about you. Who would you vote for? Show us you heart. When you do, Curtis, don't forget to wear it on your sleeve and milk it for all the sappy emotion you can. If you work at it, you can probably work up some decent right- eous anger to go along with the sappy emotion. As I said before, and still think I'm right about, Righteous anger is the closest that some people can get to feeling righteous. They milk the heavy emotional issues to try to get themselves to *feel* something. They use these heavy emotion issues the same way that a sloppy drunk uses alcohol, to work themselves up to a good cry, or a good rant. Meanwhile, most of the other patrons at the bar have learned to just move to the other end of the bar after the drunk orders his or her third beer. Is this harsh of me? Possibly. But I'm getting really tired of people getting a Righteous Anger Jones on and trying to convince others that they're actually *doing something* about any of the things they're using as an excuse for ranting. I think they're just ranting because that's the only time they feel alive.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
Edg, I don't think you're arguing so much for a 9/11 conspiracy as you are suggesting that there's so much other dirt we'll miss if we become preoccupied exclusively with 9/11. On that point I agree. However, I have a couple of factual corrections and comments on specifics. (Note: If all I get back from you is one of your denunciations, the hell with you. If you'd like to actually respond and discuss anything I've said, I'll be happy to do so. But please do me the courtesy of quoting whatever you're responding to.) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip 2. This pancaking is seen to be perfectly happening in the fall of Building Seven also. After Building Seven fell, an official being interviewed admits ON CAMERA that yeah, we pulled it. FWIW, here's what he actually said: I remember getting a call from the fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse. From everything I've read, pull the building is firefighter's shorthand for Pull everybody out of the building (i.e., because it's too dangerous for them to stay). It's *also* demolition shorthand for Take the building down. But the former meaning fits the context of what the guy was saying a lot better: Let's not keep trying to save the building, let's get everybody out before even more people die. Moreover, common sense should tell you that if there had actually been a conspiracy to rig the building for demolition, nobody involved would be likely to spill the beans so casually on camera in a PBS documentary. That this guy's comment has gotten so much traction among the 9/11 conspiracy theorists is an indication, to me, that their thinking is extraordinarily sloppy. But no one can pull a building and have it pancake down like Building Seven without MONTHS OF PLANNING. Exactly. But the conspiracy theorists claim it was *already* rigged for demolition, that it *had* been planned. So why were they trying to save it?? Just doesn't make any sense. 6. The Saudi family being allowed to fly a plane when all the other planes were grounded. Not so. Bin Laden's family members were flown out of the U.S. after the grounding order had been lifted. The thing stinks with muddy issues. There are a lot of muddy issues that do appear to stink, but there's so much misinformation (and, IMHO, disinformation) and paranoia involved that it's very difficult to sort it all out. It's far from an open-and-shut case either way. But 9-11 was merely a blip on Evil's radar screen. The one thing that Bill Maher and Bill Clinton have not addressed in their debunking efforts is the fact that the USA is a country that tortures whole nations with carnage upon the innocents. The idea that Americans in high places could never do such a thing as an inside job, is so unbelievably untrue given even the history allowed to be reported in the USA. But there's a difference here: This involved the cold-blooded murder of thousands of American citizens. There isn't a whole lot of history of the government doing that sort of thing. Moreover, the more important question is whether it would have been *physically possible* for them to do it. As unlikely as it seems for them to have been *willing* to massacre Americans, it's vastly less likely that they could have actually accomplished it, for a whole bunch of reasons--not least their demonstrated lack of competence in accomplishing practically anything. snip that bulldozer guy who SLOWLY RAN OVER A WHITE CHRISTIAN AMERICAN BEAUTIFUL YOUNG WOMAN WHILE CAMERAS ROLLED IN FRONT OF A CROWD He was IDF, not an American. And there are some excellent arguments, including eyewitness testimony, that the whole thing was a horrible accident. So it's not open-and-shut either. snip Conspiracy nuts should pick their battles better. Agreed. Hell with 9-11, read this morning's headlines. Here's just a mild sample: Director of fake FEMA press conference promoted. Actually, he had already obtained another gig in a different agency and had already resigned prior to the press conference; his resignation was to become effective several days afterward. He has apologized profusely for his misjudgment. Both the White House and Michael Chertoff, director of Homeland Security, have publicly blasted FEMA for this stunt. Chertoff: I think it was one of the dumbest and most inappropriate things I've seen since I've been in government. I have made unambiguously clear, in Anglo-Saxon prose, that it is not to ever happen again and there will be appropriate disciplinary action taken against those people who exhibited what I regard as extraordinarily poor judgment. I'm obviously not a supporter of the Bush administration, but I do believe in trying to
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
But I'm getting really tired of people getting a Righteous Anger Jones on and trying to convince others that they're actually *doing something* about any of the things they're using as an excuse for ranting. Truthfully I was sucking one tit down on the self-righteousness pig from Edg when I responded. I got my panties in a bunch over nothing. The 9-11 conspiracy bunch have been in the news a lot lately. It must be an organized plot by a secretive organization or something... One funny thing about living with Washington bureaucrats is that the idea that this bunch has the ability to do something sneaky in an organized fashion and then keep their mouths shut about it is laughable. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung no_reply@ wrote: I don't claim anything about 9-11 -- rocket attack included. I merely reported where I still had open questions. Willy sent me to an excellent debunking site, but you're avoiding the big issues and trying to make me out to a conspiracy nut about a small blip, when the larger issues of evil are ignored by you. You are refusing to show your cards and not answer the accusations I've made about you. Who would you vote for? Show us you heart. When you do, Curtis, don't forget to wear it on your sleeve and milk it for all the sappy emotion you can. If you work at it, you can probably work up some decent right- eous anger to go along with the sappy emotion. As I said before, and still think I'm right about, Righteous anger is the closest that some people can get to feeling righteous. They milk the heavy emotional issues to try to get themselves to *feel* something. They use these heavy emotion issues the same way that a sloppy drunk uses alcohol, to work themselves up to a good cry, or a good rant. Meanwhile, most of the other patrons at the bar have learned to just move to the other end of the bar after the drunk orders his or her third beer. Is this harsh of me? Possibly. But I'm getting really tired of people getting a Righteous Anger Jones on and trying to convince others that they're actually *doing something* about any of the things they're using as an excuse for ranting. I think they're just ranting because that's the only time they feel alive.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Fuck you Curtis. I'm only talking about holes-in-walls that don't make sense to me. The people who died in the crashes are not the issue. Of course their memories are sacred in the minds of their loved ones. SNIP The people who died in the pentagon crash are an issue -- if you believe that a rocket hit the pentagon, then you're saying the plane did not and that those people on the plane did not in fact die, or you have to account for their disappearance somehow. Anyway, there are published studies by engineers out there that show the damage to the pentagon is perfectly consistent with a plane crash -- basically the wings fall off on contact while the momentum of the plane core penetrates much like a rocket. There are suspicious things about that day, for me most notably, the failure to scamble fighter jets and the collapse of the 3rd WTC building later that day that does seem like a demolition, unlike the twin towers whose collapse can be explained by the effects of the plane crashes/fire/engineering.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
curtisdeltablues wrote: But I'm getting really tired of people getting a Righteous Anger Jones on and trying to convince others that they're actually *doing something* about any of the things they're using as an excuse for ranting. Truthfully I was sucking one tit down on the self-righteousness pig from Edg when I responded. I got my panties in a bunch over nothing. The 9-11 conspiracy bunch have been in the news a lot lately. It must be an organized plot by a secretive organization or something... One funny thing about living with Washington bureaucrats is that the idea that this bunch has the ability to do something sneaky in an organized fashion and then keep their mouths shut about it is laughable. That would be a misread on the 9-11 movement. They don't say that Bush nor politicians did 9-11. That's where Maher got it wrong by saying the 9-11 truth folks said Bush did it. More likely it is a rogue group within the military working in cahoots with other interests such as rogue corporate and even organized crime. As for the Pentagon the place is ringed with cameras, why don't we see that footage. It would show us how a airliner could manage to crash into a building and neatly fold the wings into that small hole. A plane BTW flown by an amateur pilot do maneuvers that many experienced airline pilots say they couldn't even do. Those videos plus the ones the FBI confiscated from nearby businesses would put the issues to rest wouldn't they? But they don't release them maybe because they show a missile (Global Hawk) instead of an airliner. We owe the people who supposedly died in that crash to investigate more thoroughly what happened and what really happened to the plane they were on. And furthermore in the name of justice we should not again let the perpetrators get away with it. And to those who buy the Arab hijackers story why didn't we go to war with the Saudis instead?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
Are you serious? I have seen the footage of the Pentagon crash several times. It is a plane, you know. Also, don't use your intuitive understanding of slow-speed physics to try to understand high-speed physics. --- Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: curtisdeltablues wrote: But I'm getting really tired of people getting a Righteous Anger Jones on and trying to convince others that they're actually *doing something* about any of the things they're using as an excuse for ranting. Truthfully I was sucking one tit down on the self-righteousness pig from Edg when I responded. I got my panties in a bunch over nothing. The 9-11 conspiracy bunch have been in the news a lot lately. It must be an organized plot by a secretive organization or something... One funny thing about living with Washington bureaucrats is that the idea that this bunch has the ability to do something sneaky in an organized fashion and then keep their mouths shut about it is laughable. That would be a misread on the 9-11 movement. They don't say that Bush nor politicians did 9-11. That's where Maher got it wrong by saying the 9-11 truth folks said Bush did it. More likely it is a rogue group within the military working in cahoots with other interests such as rogue corporate and even organized crime. As for the Pentagon the place is ringed with cameras, why don't we see that footage. It would show us how a airliner could manage to crash into a building and neatly fold the wings into that small hole. A plane BTW flown by an amateur pilot do maneuvers that many experienced airline pilots say they couldn't even do. Those videos plus the ones the FBI confiscated from nearby businesses would put the issues to rest wouldn't they? But they don't release them maybe because they show a missile (Global Hawk) instead of an airliner. We owe the people who supposedly died in that crash to investigate more thoroughly what happened and what really happened to the plane they were on. And furthermore in the name of justice we should not again let the perpetrators get away with it. And to those who buy the Arab hijackers story why didn't we go to war with the Saudis instead? To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bhairitu Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 12:01 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip thought police) We owe the people who supposedly died in that crash to investigate more thoroughly what happened and what really happened to the plane they were on. And furthermore in the name of justice we should not again let the perpetrators get away with it. And to those who buy the Arab hijackers story why didn't we go to war with the Saudis instead? Are there any sane theories out there as to what happened to that plane if it didn’t hit the Pentagon? Also, I’ve heard that some don’t believe the plane crashed in Shanksville, PA. What’s supposed to have happened to that one? Seems to me these conspiracy folks would do a lot better to focus on the more credible parts of the situation, such as controlled demolition and the collapse of WTC 13, rather than discrediting themselves with the less credible parts. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1097 - Release Date: 10/28/2007 1:58 PM
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
My partner was an emergency responder for the American Red Cross Disaster team which was sent to the Pentagon. It was a plane guys...not a missile. Some people will believe anything to assuage their own paranoia. It's bizarre, some of the most intelligent people I know are buying into various conspiracy theories on this subject, despite some good material debunking the c-theories for some time now. On Oct 29, 2007, at 1:55 PM, Peter wrote: Are you serious? I have seen the footage of the Pentagon crash several times. It is a plane, you know. Also, don't use your intuitive understanding of slow-speed physics to try to understand high-speed physics.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
Judy, You're correct on just about everything below. And, all the others folks who are pointing out to me various reasons to debunk are correct too as far as I can tell -- but being a non-expert, the conspiracists can get me worrying as easily as debunkers can get me calmed down. That's why I don't say FOR CERTAIN the 9-11 was an inside job. In fact, I have arguments against it being an inside job that seldom get an airing, but erp, a Curtis post -- just now -- arrived that makes this very point too: The rigging of Building Seven and the Towers with squibs would have been a labor intensive BIGASS amount of work by a lot of workers over months of time. Someone would have blown the whistle by now on. Too big a thingie to hide the causes of it so well. This concept holds a lot of water with which to douse my flames of paranoiac conspiracy. Too many people would have to be in on the 9-11 deal, that the papers should be flooded with stories about how so-and-so didn't go to work that day or so-and-so pulled his wife off a 9-11 plane, like that. Very hard to find these kinds of stories about 9-11 that spotlight any foreknowledge. All the above said, I think my looking at 9-11 and asking open questions that others here may have put to bed, is legitimate given the climate of BushCo's shutting down of access to ALL INSIDE INFORMATION -- just because they can. Why not try to get clarity about 9-11? Why does that have to be seen as unpatriotic? What with America's brutal actions of the past, and with the slamming doors, this atmosphere strongly nurtures every sort of paranoia. Evil drips from every Walmart slave-made garment, and we're rage-faced that anyone could ever think that it could happen? Millions of Arabs -- breathing, loving, men, women, and children -- people who bleed and feel even a pin prick as do you and me -- are seeing a huge twelve-gauge American shotgun, held by Cheney no less, aimed at them, and they're right -- if Iran gets bombed, they're going to die by the tens of thousands in the first wave of bombings. And that's not a conspiracy-nut position for them to take, right? They've seen a million Iraqis die by American hands in a few years, and years before that they saw about two million Iraq and Iran army members die in a war that America told Saddam to wage and paid him to do it and gave him the poison gas and guns to do it. Come on, what's 9-11 possible-evil compared to that historical actual evil? Fox News obscuration of truth by flooding their broadcasts with disinformation, spun and skewed titillations of the lusts of the masses, and outright evil morals promulgated as Christian Ideals is the strategy of GlobalBiz. Fox News can make even the smartest people throw in the towel and give up trying to unravel any mess. Too much work, too risky to undertake, not enough time, trust the broadcasters, etc. Who can fight the good fight and hope to keep a job, raise a family, etc.? And as for my gratuitously and arbitrarily attacking you again, yeah, you have a right to fear that, sorry, that's the way things have worked for us, but I gotta tell ya, with Turq's unwillingess to deny predation as a psychic scourge for any culture, I've become a big fan of your counterturqing that so often, in so few words, make his rationalizations and corrupt dialectic stand out like a pool of puke on a cafeteria floor. Yay on ya fer dat. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Edg, I don't think you're arguing so much for a 9/11 conspiracy as you are suggesting that there's so much other dirt we'll miss if we become preoccupied exclusively with 9/11. On that point I agree. However, I have a couple of factual corrections and comments on specifics. (Note: If all I get back from you is one of your denunciations, the hell with you. If you'd like to actually respond and discuss anything I've said, I'll be happy to do so. But please do me the courtesy of quoting whatever you're responding to.) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung no_reply@ wrote: snip 2. This pancaking is seen to be perfectly happening in the fall of Building Seven also. After Building Seven fell, an official being interviewed admits ON CAMERA that yeah, we pulled it. FWIW, here's what he actually said: I remember getting a call from the fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were gonna be able to contain the fire, and I said, 'We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it.' And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse. From everything I've read, pull the building is firefighter's shorthand for Pull everybody out of the building (i.e., because it's too dangerous for them to stay). It's *also* demolition shorthand for Take the building down. But the former meaning fits the context of what the guy was saying a lot better: Let's not
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
Rick Archer wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bhairitu Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 12:01 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip thought police) We owe the people who supposedly died in that crash to investigate more thoroughly what happened and what really happened to the plane they were on. And furthermore in the name of justice we should not again let the perpetrators get away with it. And to those who buy the Arab hijackers story why didn't we go to war with the Saudis instead? Are there any sane theories out there as to what happened to that plane if it didn’t hit the Pentagon? Also, I’ve heard that some don’t believe the plane crashed in Shanksville, PA. What’s supposed to have happened to that one? Seems to me these conspiracy folks would do a lot better to focus on the more credible parts of the situation, such as controlled demolition and the collapse of WTC 13, rather than discrediting themselves with the less credible parts. There are allegations that all the planes were sent to Cleveland and parked at a hanger at the edge of the airport. The passengers were told there was a bomb on board, disembarked and taken to the hanger. Some supposedly even called friends and relatives reporting that. Some think they were put (at gunpoint) on one remote controlled plane that was taken to sea and crashed. If you think that is insane so is the official story too. Building 13? I've not heard of that one. :) I think you mean building 7. Actually there is quite a faction of 9-11 truth that focuses on that one because it is hard to explain. I believe the perpetrators were quite sloppy because they thought they'd have the country under martial law by that weekend. That was the plan. They might have succeeded had they pulled off the Chicago and west coast attacks. (BTW we know that SF mayer Willie Brown was warned not to fly that day as he had a flight booked). To Peter, I've seen the released footage and there is no airliner in that. There has to be better footage but I bet it shows something they don't want the public to see. Edgy, the Popular Mechanics report has been debunked. Popular Mechanics is owned by Hearst well known for yellow journalism. I have a cousin who worked in that section of the Pentagon. He was working at home that day because that section was under renovation. I haven't had a chance to speak to him since 9-11 but I would like to know his take on it (if he will actually reveal anything). Another cousin who was an airlines captain flew a flight to SF on 9-11. I would like to also hear his opinion on 9-11 to but he is also retired a retired Marine colonel so I don't know if he'll reveal anything either. My favorite book on the subject is by Princeton scholar Webster G. Tarpley called 9/11 Synthetic Terror. Tarpley's investigative journalism goes back to the Aldo Moro assassination which he wrote a book about. His book is thorough and well documented. He alleges that Bush actually didn't know what was going on and claims that a message was received when at the school that Angel is next. Angel is the code name for Air Force One. People in Sarasota said that Air Force One took off like a rocket almost straight up. We can all remember that it flew around quite a bit aimlessly that day and allegedly without fighter escort. Bush himself revealed the message in a CBS interview a year later. Tarpley documents through news reports conflicting press releases throughout the day that suggest that the Bush administration (sans Cheney) first stood up to the rogue regime and then gave in. History is rife with conspiracies and to be ignorant of them is a shame. Many were omitted or spun differently from the history books you read in school. You have to dig a little deeper to find the real story. Have you all forgotten Iran-Contra already? To Curtis, if you know DC then you know how politicians can be corrupt. We have the best government that money can buy. I can understand that some people don't want to entertain the idea that official 9-11 was cover because that would mean they are living under a hostile regime. Duh. Even without 9-11 we have the most corrupt government in the history of the nation. If you can't see that then you're part of the problem and obviously taking (to use the Matrix movie analogy) the blue pill. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sal Sunshine Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 1:42 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip thought police) On Oct 29, 2007, at 10:56 AM, Duveyoung wrote: Fuck you Curtis...Fuck you, you enabling bastard...you cowardly spin-master for evil... your immorality...cold-heartedness... try to besmirch me and my essay...I condemn you...evil's apologistWhat a disappointment, what joke for a personality,what a sell out... How you manage to still love anything is astounding... Still committed to elevating the dialog and cleaning up the place, I see. :) Careful, Edg, or Bronte might swoon when she sees your latest rap. Sal Ahem. Etiquette police here. Please tone it down a bit Edg. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1097 - Release Date: 10/28/2007 1:58 PM
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
On Oct 29, 2007, at 10:56 AM, Duveyoung wrote: Fuck you Curtis...Fuck you, you enabling bastard...you cowardly spin-master for evil... your immorality...cold-heartedness... try to besmirch me and my essay...I condemn you...evil's apologistWhat a disappointment, what joke for a personality,what a sell out... How you manage to still love anything is astounding... Still committed to elevating the dialog and cleaning up the place, I see. :) Careful, Edg, or Bronte might swoon when she sees your latest rap. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
Bhairitu wrote: We owe the people who supposedly died in that crash to investigate more thoroughly what happened and what really happened to the plane they were on. KENS 5 in San Antonio had Alex Jones on a Sunday news talk show to discuss martial law with counter-guest Jeff Addicot, identified as a terrorism expert. The topic centered around the recent addition of PDD-51 , parts of which are classified and even Congress has not been allowed to see all of it. Read more: http://www.martiallaw911.info/
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
2007-10-29
Thread
Samadhi Is Much Closer Than You Think -- Really! -- It's A No-Brainer. Who'd've Thunk It?
The thing is, heir hugo, that that is exactly what happened, over approximately a 2 year period, performed by a company headed by DumbDung's younger brother. Whole floors of offices were temporarily relocated to perform the rework that preceded the demolition of each tower. Funny [*NOT*] how such is not and continues not to get any news. Oh, and the DumbDung's lil' brother? He's in charge of security at the twin towers at the time of the demolition. Selective amnesia is a moral disease, not just a medical disease. *Of all that anyone leading or teaching has to convey, the most valuable thing to cultivate and convey to others is a moral conscience. Only such persons deserve to lead others, in any capacity. Anything less is a menace to society. http://PROUTCompared.tophonors.com* Probably designed to collapse like that rather than fall over and possibly killing millions. The reverse implication being that people had got inside the building and wired it to collapse as in a proper demolition job, I think those working inside might have noticed the cables pulling the alls together and asked a few questions about the explosives needed. On 10/29/07, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've read a ton about the 9-11 inside-job concept, and it is very hard to keep from getting enraged when the material is gone over. But that's just me. To me there are certain big issues that seem to be inadequately explained by the anti-conspiracy explanations. Just off the top of my head, here's the issues that most bother me even after all my research lite. 1. The pancaking of the floors happened so well that any demolition company that had had the job would have been given an extra bonus for not harming the surrounding buildings by having a whole tower fall like a tree -- sideways. Both towers fell straight down for the most part. Probably designed to collapse like that rather than fall over and possibly killing millions. The reverse implication being that people had got inside the building and wired it to collapse as in a proper demolition job, I think those working inside might have noticed the cables pulling the alls together and asked a few questions about the explosives needed. 2. This pancaking is seen to be perfectly happening in the fall of Building Seven also. After Building Seven fell, an official being interviewed admits ON CAMERA that yeah, we pulled it. But no one can pull a building and have it pancake down like Building Seven without MONTHS OF PLANNING. A few fire officials and firemen/women could NEVER have put anything in place that would have allowed for the building to be imploded -- and they're firemen/women NOT explosives experts. Again, vibrations in the superstructure damaged the metal frame and it collapsed, it looks suspicious but if it was part of an inside jbo why bother with that building? why not just be happy that the WTC fell down as planned? 3. The hole in the Pentagon walls all the way to the inner rings can't be explained by ANY large aircraft, but is easily explained by a rocket attack. A lot of people saw the plane hit, it wasn't a rocket. The wings were blown off backwards by the force of the impact, they are there in the wreckage of the plane. 4. The reactions of Bush when the news got to him. Shock is my guess, lets be honest, how many here didn't stand slack jawed for a minute or two when they heard the news. Imagine being the guy who has to sort it out and come up with some sort of response, I don't like him but I don't envy him either. 5. The non-reactions of shoot 'em down warcraft that didn't scramble in any fashion I would call what the Air Force is supposed to do. That's an easy one, they didn't know what was going on til it was all over. If you missed the movie United 93 watch it as it stars, playing themselves, all the people from airtraffic control in new york, you really get an idea of the confusion and shock, it's all taken from recordings of what happened. It's a superb film anyway, both depressing yet uplifting in it's depiction of true bravery. 6. The Saudi family being allowed to fly a plane when all the other planes were grounded. Money talks. Too much is made of the fact it was relatives of Bin Laden being flown out, he had been exiled from Saudi for a while by this time. The thing stinks with muddy issues. But 9-11 was merely a blip on Evil's radar screen. The one thing that Bill Maher and Bill Clinton have not addressed in their debunking efforts is the fact that the USA is a country that tortures whole nations with carnage upon the innocents. The idea that Americans in high places could never do such a thing as an inside job, is so unbelievably untrue given even the history allowed to be reported in the USA. We
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
I, for one, know that Curtis plays the devil's chord in private! He's a bad, bad, boy! --- curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Oct 29, 2007, at 10:56 AM, Duveyoung wrote: Fuck you Curtis...Fuck you, you enabling bastard...you cowardly spin-master for evil... your immorality...cold-heartedness... try to besmirch me and my essay...I condemn you...evil's apologistWhat a disappointment, what joke for a personality,what a sell out... How you manage to still love anything is astounding... Still committed to elevating the dialog and cleaning up the place, I see. :) Careful, Edg, or Bronte might swoon when she sees your latest rap. Sal Ahem. Etiquette police here. Please tone it down a bit Edg. I join Lenny Bruce in accepting the phrase Fuck You as a blessing rather than a curse. I took it as his sincere wish that I enjoy some great sex with Dennis Kucinich's wife. Lenny Bruce: Fuck you. Never understood that insult, because fucking someone is actually really pleasant. If we're trying to be mean, we should say unfuck you! spin master for evil and evil's apologist are just traditional ways to describe someone who plays the devil's music. And if I wasn't an enabling bastard I wouldn't have any close friends in the music business! No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.15.12/1097 - Release Date: 10/28/2007 1:58 PM To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip (BTW we know that SF mayer Willie Brown was warned not to fly that day as he had a flight booked). That seems to have been a routine press briefing from the State Department a week before 9/11 directed at Americans *overseas*, particularly those at U.S. military bases in Japan and South Korea. See this SFGate report from 2006 (scroll down about halfway): http://tinyurl.com/thlm7 To Peter, I've seen the released footage and there is no airliner in that. There is, but it's hard to see. Edgy, the Popular Mechanics report has been debunked. It hasn't been debunked per se, but it's pretty flimsy, a very poor job of rebutting the conspiracy theories, which are a lot more sophisticated than it portrays them to be. My favorite book on the subject is by Princeton scholar Webster G. Tarpley called 9/11 Synthetic Terror. Tarpley's investigative journalism goes back to the Aldo Moro assassination which he wrote a book about. His book is thorough and well documented. He alleges that Bush actually didn't know what was going on and claims that a message was received when at the school that Angel is next. Angel is the code name for Air Force One. People in Sarasota said that Air Force One took off like a rocket almost straight up. We can all remember that it flew around quite a bit aimlessly that day and allegedly without fighter escort. Bush himself revealed the message in a CBS interview a year later. Actually, Ari Fleischer, the press secretary, revealed it the next day at a press conference. It was relayed to the Bush folks after Air Force One had taken off, not at the school. And the code name wasn't secret; it had been published numerous times. Moreover, it turned out to have been a misunderstanding all along, in the chaos after the attacks. The White House has promoted it as an excuse for Air Force One's aimlessness and for Bush not coming back to D.C. right away. So much for your guy's thorough documentation. snip I can understand that some people don't want to entertain the idea that official 9-11 was cover because that would mean they are living under a hostile regime. Guess what, Bhairitu? Some of us have been well aware for some years that we're living under a hostile regime, and we *still* think the 9/11 conspiracy theories are bunkum. Those two ideas are not mutually exclusive, sorry. Duh. Even without 9-11 we have the most corrupt government in the history of the nation. If you can't see that then you're part of the problem and obviously taking (to use the Matrix movie analogy) the blue pill. We *do* see that, Bhairitu. We just don't find the conspiracy theories about 9/11 convincing.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Samadhi Is Much Closer Than You Think -- Really! -- It's A No-Brainer. Who'd've Thunk It? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Heir hugo, I must say that's the first time I've been called a nazi. The thing is, heir hugo, that that is exactly what happened, over approximately a 2 year period, performed by a company headed by DumbDung's younger brother. Whole floors of offices were temporarily relocated to perform the rework that preceded the demolition of each tower. Funny [*NOT*] how such is not and continues not to get any news. Oh, and the DumbDung's lil' brother? He's in charge of security at the twin towers at the time of the demolition. Selective amnesia is a moral disease, not just a medical disease. Are you suggesting I'm immoral because I don't accept as fact every crackpot idea I read? Far out. Prove it, prove any of it and please not just with a link to some wacko conspiracy site. *Of all that anyone leading or teaching has to convey, the most valuable thing to cultivate and convey to others is a moral conscience. Only such persons deserve to lead others, in any capacity. Anything less is a menace to society. http://PROUTCompared.tophonors.com* Probably designed to collapse like that rather than fall over and possibly killing millions. The reverse implication being that people had got inside the building and wired it to collapse as in a proper demolition job, I think those working inside might have noticed the cables pulling the alls together and asked a few questions about the explosives needed. On 10/29/07, hugheshugo [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung no_reply@ wrote: I've read a ton about the 9-11 inside-job concept, and it is very hard to keep from getting enraged when the material is gone over. But that's just me. To me there are certain big issues that seem to be inadequately explained by the anti-conspiracy explanations. Just off the top of my head, here's the issues that most bother me even after all my research lite. 1. The pancaking of the floors happened so well that any demolition company that had had the job would have been given an extra bonus for not harming the surrounding buildings by having a whole tower fall like a tree -- sideways. Both towers fell straight down for the most part. Probably designed to collapse like that rather than fall over and possibly killing millions. The reverse implication being that people had got inside the building and wired it to collapse as in a proper demolition job, I think those working inside might have noticed the cables pulling the alls together and asked a few questions about the explosives needed. 2. This pancaking is seen to be perfectly happening in the fall of Building Seven also. After Building Seven fell, an official being interviewed admits ON CAMERA that yeah, we pulled it. But no one can pull a building and have it pancake down like Building Seven without MONTHS OF PLANNING. A few fire officials and firemen/women could NEVER have put anything in place that would have allowed for the building to be imploded -- and they're firemen/women NOT explosives experts. Again, vibrations in the superstructure damaged the metal frame and it collapsed, it looks suspicious but if it was part of an inside jbo why bother with that building? why not just be happy that the WTC fell down as planned? 3. The hole in the Pentagon walls all the way to the inner rings can't be explained by ANY large aircraft, but is easily explained by a rocket attack. A lot of people saw the plane hit, it wasn't a rocket. The wings were blown off backwards by the force of the impact, they are there in the wreckage of the plane. 4. The reactions of Bush when the news got to him. Shock is my guess, lets be honest, how many here didn't stand slack jawed for a minute or two when they heard the news. Imagine being the guy who has to sort it out and come up with some sort of response, I don't like him but I don't envy him either. 5. The non-reactions of shoot 'em down warcraft that didn't scramble in any fashion I would call what the Air Force is supposed to do. That's an easy one, they didn't know what was going on til it was all over. If you missed the movie United 93 watch it as it stars, playing themselves, all the people from airtraffic control in new york, you really get an idea of the confusion and shock, it's all taken from recordings of what happened. It's a superb film anyway, both depressing yet uplifting in it's depiction of true bravery. 6. The Saudi family being allowed to fly a plane when all the other planes were grounded. Money talks. Too much is made of the fact it was relatives of
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip (BTW we know that SF mayer Willie Brown was warned not to fly that day as he had a flight booked). That seems to have been a routine press briefing from the State Department a week before 9/11 directed at Americans *overseas*, particularly those at U.S. military bases in Japan and South Korea. See this SFGate report from 2006 (scroll down about halfway): http://tinyurl.com/thlm7 To Peter, I've seen the released footage and there is no airliner in that. There is, but it's hard to see. You must be seeing things (or what you want to see). You see a Boeing airliner eh? Edgy, the Popular Mechanics report has been debunked. It hasn't been debunked per se, but it's pretty flimsy, a very poor job of rebutting the conspiracy theories, which are a lot more sophisticated than it portrays them to be. I think there's been a pretty good job done of debunking the PM report. My favorite book on the subject is by Princeton scholar Webster G. Tarpley called 9/11 Synthetic Terror. Tarpley's investigative journalism goes back to the Aldo Moro assassination which he wrote a book about. His book is thorough and well documented. He alleges that Bush actually didn't know what was going on and claims that a message was received when at the school that Angel is next. Angel is the code name for Air Force One. People in Sarasota said that Air Force One took off like a rocket almost straight up. We can all remember that it flew around quite a bit aimlessly that day and allegedly without fighter escort. Bush himself revealed the message in a CBS interview a year later. Actually, Ari Fleischer, the press secretary, revealed it the next day at a press conference. It was relayed to the Bush folks after Air Force One had taken off, not at the school. And the code name wasn't secret; it had been published numerous times. Whatever. It was around that time. Neither did I say it was a secret code word. Moreover, it turned out to have been a misunderstanding all along, in the chaos after the attacks. The White House has promoted it as an excuse for Air Force One's aimlessness and for Bush not coming back to D.C. right away. So much for your guy's thorough documentation. So you believe the Bush administration? Find those WMDs yet? snip I can understand that some people don't want to entertain the idea that official 9-11 was cover because that would mean they are living under a hostile regime. Guess what, Bhairitu? Some of us have been well aware for some years that we're living under a hostile regime, and we *still* think the 9/11 conspiracy theories are bunkum. Those two ideas are not mutually exclusive, sorry. This is like reviewing a movie without actually seeing it. Most of the people here have only read short accounts and really don't have that much knowledge of the 9-11 truth movement. How much of the movie have you seen? I just can't believe you fall for the official story. Duh. Even without 9-11 we have the most corrupt government in the history of the nation. If you can't see that then you're part of the problem and obviously taking (to use the Matrix movie analogy) the blue pill. We *do* see that, Bhairitu. We just don't find the conspiracy theories about 9/11 convincing. Who's we? Do you have multiple personality syndrome? :D Again I have my doubts that you've looked into it that much.
[FairfieldLife] Re: 9-11 -- The Inside Job was merely a blip (snip .... thought police)
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip (BTW we know that SF mayer Willie Brown was warned not to fly that day as he had a flight booked). That seems to have been a routine press briefing from the State Department a week before 9/11 directed at Americans *overseas*, particularly those at U.S. military bases in Japan and South Korea. See this SFGate report from 2006 (scroll down about halfway): http://tinyurl.com/thlm7 To Peter, I've seen the released footage and there is no airliner in that. There is, but it's hard to see. You must be seeing things (or what you want to see). You see a Boeing airliner eh? I see something that looks an awful lot like a big airplane, yes. snip Actually, Ari Fleischer, the press secretary, revealed it the next day at a press conference. It was relayed to the Bush folks after Air Force One had taken off, not at the school. And the code name wasn't secret; it had been published numerous times. Whatever. It was around that time. Neither did I say it was a secret code word. No, you didn't, but Tarpley does, and administration shills do as well. Moreover, it turned out to have been a misunderstanding all along, in the chaos after the attacks. The White House has promoted it as an excuse for Air Force One's aimlessness and for Bush not coming back to D.C. right away. So much for your guy's thorough documentation. So you believe the Bush administration? Huh? Do I believe it was a legitimate threat? Did you read what I wrote? Find those WMDs yet? Complete non sequitur. Am I making you a little nervous? I can understand that some people don't want to entertain the idea that official 9-11 was cover because that would mean they are living under a hostile regime. Guess what, Bhairitu? Some of us have been well aware for some years that we're living under a hostile regime, and we *still* think the 9/11 conspiracy theories are bunkum. Those two ideas are not mutually exclusive, sorry. This is like reviewing a movie without actually seeing it. I beg your pardon? Most of the people here have only read short accounts and really don't have that much knowledge of the 9-11 truth movement. How much of the movie have you seen? Quite a bit. I've spent many hours on the various Web sites, watched several of the films. For awhile I thought there was something to it, but then I began to find some very good debunking sites, and most of the claims just don't hold up under examination. I just can't believe you fall for the official story. It's a lot more than just the official story. You don't have to depend on what the government says--or on Popular Mechanics, for that matter-- to figure out that the conspiracy theories are bunk. Duh. Even without 9-11 we have the most corrupt government in the history of the nation. If you can't see that then you're part of the problem and obviously taking (to use the Matrix movie analogy) the blue pill. We *do* see that, Bhairitu. We just don't find the conspiracy theories about 9/11 convincing. Who's we? Do you have multiple personality syndrome? :D There are several people on FFL who are skeptical of the conspiracy theories. Again I have my doubts that you've looked into it that much. I've been very interested in it ever since it happened and have read everything I could find on it. How do you think I know the Popular Mechanics debunking was so poor and simplistic if I haven't looked into the theories in some detail? You don't seem to see the contradictions in your own arguments.
