[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 17, 2007, at 11:20 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: On Sep 17, 2007, at 10:24 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread Vaj
On Sep 18, 2007, at 11:40 AM, authfriend wrote: Stop trying to twist people intentions as if you knew what they were. Yeah, it's a drag when somebody sees right through your intentions, ain't it? You tell me.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread Richard J. Williams
Bhairitu wrote: Indian yogis personified the fields of nature... You need to get some smarts, Mr. Bharat2. There were no 'yogis' mentioned in the Vedas. It was the Vedic authors who personified the forces of nature. Patanjali does not mention any 'forces of nature' in his Yoga Sutras.

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread Richard J. Williams
When the Rishis wanted to express the silent value of pure consciousness they gave a name Shiva Mr. Henry Herzberger needs to read some Indian history. There's no mention of 'Shiva' in the Rig Veda and no mention of any bija mantras. The various Hindu sects, Shaivaism, Vaishnaiva, and

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread Richard J. Williams
emptybill wrote: Over the years I have heard an argument professed by some former TM meditators who stopped practicing because they claimed they were deceived about the meaning of mantra-s. Have you noticed, Bill, how rapidly the content of messages like this go from intelligence to

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread Bhairitu
Richard J. Williams wrote: Bhairitu wrote: Indian yogis personified the fields of nature... You need to get some smarts, Mr. Bharat2. There were no 'yogis' mentioned in the Vedas. It was the Vedic authors who personified the forces of nature. Patanjali does not mention any

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-18 Thread Richard J. Williams
All the Indian deified heros such as Vasudeva, Rama, Ramchandra, and Krishna came long after the composition of the Vedas in 1500 B.C. Bhairitu wrote: Depends upon the translations doesn't it? No. You are mistaken if you mean the Rig Veda refers to a dark lustful youth playing on a

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Belief is gods is silly. OffWorld Belief in humans is silly. The gods, over cocktails

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread gullible fool
The gods need humans to invent things like cocktails. --- TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Belief is gods is silly. OffWorld Belief in humans is silly. The gods, over cocktails To

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gullible fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The gods need humans to invent things like cocktails. Wouldn't that be a cool thing to have on your resume? Bartender, the Samadhi bar at the Brahmaloka Hilton: * Designed, mixed and served cocktails from the finest *

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread Vaj
On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote: I think it dismisses way too much to reduce the gods to qualities of consciousness. In the sense that we are all just qualities of consciousness, I suppose you could say that's true. But in the practical sense, the gods are unique

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote: I think it dismisses way too much to reduce the gods to qualities of consciousness. In the sense that we are all just qualities of consciousness, I suppose you

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread Vaj
On Sep 17, 2007, at 10:24 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote: I think it dismisses way too much to reduce the gods to qualities of consciousness. In the sense that we are all just

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 17, 2007, at 10:24 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote: I think it dismisses way too much to reduce the

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread Vaj
On Sep 17, 2007, at 11:20 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sep 17, 2007, at 10:24 AM, authfriend wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote:

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread emptybill
On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote: I think it dismisses way too much to reduce the gods to qualities of consciousness. In the sense that we are all just qualities of consciousness, I suppose you could say that's true. But in the practical sense, the gods are unique

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-17 Thread Vaj
On Sep 17, 2007, at 7:51 PM, emptybill wrote: On Sep 16, 2007, at 11:51 PM, Bronte Baxter wrote: I think it dismisses way too much to reduce the gods to qualities of consciousness. In the sense that we are all just qualities of consciousness, I suppose you could say that's true. But in the

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread off_world_beings
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, emptybill [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Over the years I have heard an argument professed by some former TM meditators who stopped practicing because they claimed they were deceived about the meaning of mantra-s. I have also seen similar declarations put

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread Rick Archer
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of off_world_beings Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 5:55 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation Belief is gods is silly. You don’t think

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: snip Indian yogis personified the fields of nature they perceived to make the science of yoga more understandable to the general public. I heard a great lecture on this when in Cochin once. Personification also makes

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread qntmpkt
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip Indian yogis personified the fields of nature they perceived to make the science of yoga more understandable to the general public. I heard a

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread tertonzeno
--Thx, Authfriend, excellent article! (but there's one minor flaw in it). He's implying that such entities are only symbolic of impersonal forces and forgot the convenient fact that the Deities are also real Personalities that can interact with humans, just as humans can interact with other

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread off_world_beings
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of off_world_beings Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 5:55 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between

RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread Rick Archer
From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of off_world_beings Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 9:09 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation Do you think any subtle or celestial beings

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread off_world_beings
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of off_world_beings Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 9:09 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread Marek Reavis
Judy, a very good find, thanks. ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: snip Indian yogis personified the fields of nature they perceived to make the science of yoga more understandable to

[FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Marek Reavis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Judy, a very good find, thanks. I'd completely forgotten it existed. I can't believe I came across it entirely accidentally right on the heels of emptybill's post on the same topic.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread Bronte Baxter
Indra The Unifying Value of the Self which unifies all the laws of nature in order to promote evolution (the Power of dharma) Indrani or Sachi The feminine power of unification and evolution Hmm. If gods are simply anthropomophisms invented by the sages to explain concepts they

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Confusion between mantras and deities in meditation

2007-09-16 Thread Bhairitu
Bronte Baxter wrote: Indra The Unifying Value of the Self which unifies all the laws of nature in order to promote evolution (the Power of dharma) Indrani or Sachi The feminine power of unification and evolution Hmm. If gods are simply anthropomophisms invented by the sages