Re: GNOME Local user groups
On Mon, 2006-08-14 at 10:51 +0200, Rodrigo Moya wrote: On Fri, 2006-08-11 at 14:12 +0200, Quim Gil wrote: El dv 11 de 08 del 2006 a les 13:46 +0200, en/na Rodrigo Moya va escriure: My question is: how we can have marketing materials easily? that is also my question :) What do you have in mind when you talk about 'marketing materials'? The answer possibly differs depending on the materials. Stickers, t-shirts, banners etc have different problematics. I was mainly thinking about t-shirts, stickers and CDs. Don't forget the Gnome socks :-) However, cross-border trade restrictions mean it can work out better to have a fund for locally-produced clothing rather than trying to export/import it. E.g. there are tarrifs involved in moving textiles between US and Canada, despite NAFTA. Developing a set of guidelines for branding (that is, for use of the Gnome foot logo and the name, including specifying colours and sizes and positioning etc., or possibly a simple approval process) can make everything a lot easier. Liam -- Liam Quin - XML Activity Lead, W3C, http://www.w3.org/People/Quin/ Pictures from old books: http://fromoldbooks.org/ Ankh: irc.sorcery.net irc.gnome.org www.advogato.org ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
On Thu, 2006-08-10 at 17:33 -0400, Felipe Barros S. wrote: Hello Rodrigo: You know about the meeting that GNOME Chile have in November, one day of the VII Encuentro Linux is for día de GNOME. Our plan is to invite one or two Rock Star to talk with us :) In this moment we are quoting to print some stickers and other stuffs, Fernando and others brought some t-shirts from the GUADEC. All those things we hope to have in order to give to our attenders. My question is: how we can have marketing materials easily? that is also my question :) or is possible for the invited Rock Star to bring some gift below his arm? ;) if possible, yeah, that would solve the problem I guess -- Rodrigo Moya [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
El dv 11 de 08 del 2006 a les 13:46 +0200, en/na Rodrigo Moya va escriure: My question is: how we can have marketing materials easily? that is also my question :) What do you have in mind when you talk about 'marketing materials'? The answer possibly differs depending on the materials. Stickers, t-shirts, banners etc have different problematics. The starting point is http://live.gnome.org/MarketingTeam/MarketingMaterial . Any help updating/improving this list is appreciated. We plan to work at least with Killermundi to have a GNOME shop. That said, the problem is not just to pay the production of, say, t-shirts but also the transport to, say, Chile. In your case self-production is an important part of the strategy, as previously discussed. or is possible for the invited Rock Star to bring some gift below his arm? ;) If the rock star can afford them and they are easy to carry... -- Quim Gil /// http://desdeamericaconamor.org | http://guadec.org signature.asc Description: Això és una part d'un missatge, signada digitalment ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
Hello Quin: Quim Gil wrote: El dv 11 de 08 del 2006 a les 13:46 +0200, en/na Rodrigo Moya va escriure: My question is: how we can have marketing materials easily? that is also my question :) What do you have in mind when you talk about 'marketing materials'? The answer possibly differs depending on the materials. Stickers, t-shirts, banners etc have different problematics. As Rodrigo to said, perhaps some t-shirts. Stickers, Posters and Banners are easily to make, but an t-shirts of good quality and low cost are difficult to find The starting point is http://live.gnome.org/MarketingTeam/MarketingMaterial . Any help updating/improving this list is appreciated. exactly, we translated three posters[1] to Spanish and we are going to print them for the stand that we have in the meeting for the two days before the día de GNOME [1] http://wiki.gnome.cl/Posters We plan to work at least with Killermundi to have a GNOME shop. That said, the problem is not just to pay the production of, say, t-shirts but also the transport to, say, Chile. No, I say we can collect money and buy t-shirts to Killermundi and pay the taxes and all this stuffs, but I think may be the hacker can bring to us, obviously only if the hacker can carry a ton of t-shirts ;) In your case self-production is an important part of the strategy, as previously discussed. Yes, but for this meeting we have some t-shirts that Fernando and Pedro brought from GUADEC, perhaps for the next meeting we will do our own t-shirts to give to the participants or is possible for the invited Rock Star to bring some gift below his arm? ;) If the rock star can afford them and they are easy to carry... -- Felipe begin:vcard fn:Felipe Barros S. n:Barros S.;Felipe adr:;;;Santiago;;;Chile email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:http://www.linuxlab.cl/ version:2.1 end:vcard ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
On Thu, 2006-07-06 at 12:47 -0400, Fernando San Martín Woerner wrote: Hi all: In GUADEC i've been talking with people from the board and from other local groups, as we talk there, local groups are a good chance to do advocacy and get more users for GNOME and why not some hackers too. By today we have a good community, GUADEC is good example for this, but also there are other ways to spread the word around the world. In Chile we started small meetings to train GNOME developers (Reuniones de formación de desarrolladores de GNOME), our first goal was to train a small group of developers to get a good level using GNOME platform, so then we can invite some Rock star hacker to do some more advanced talks. After two or three meetings we receive invitations from universities asking us to give some basic talks to their students and user groups, after two years we've been talking about GNOME in more than 16 meetings, some of them with more than 100 people in the room, and still we get invitations to give talks. A lot of those talks are just for users but every advocacy is a good effort to bring more users to the desktop. The same idea is doing by GNOME-Es at spain, so this is an invitation to local groups to get organized and look forward how they can do advocacy in their countries, every single step is one step forward to the same goal. one thing that would be cool would be to have marketing materials easily. It is a bit sad to say 'no, sorry, no t-shirts' to people asking for some at conferences -- Rodrigo Moya [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
Hello Rodrigo: You know about the meeting that GNOME Chile have in November, one day of the VII Encuentro Linux is for día de GNOME. Our plan is to invite one or two Rock Star to talk with us :) In this moment we are quoting to print some stickers and other stuffs, Fernando and others brought some t-shirts from the GUADEC. All those things we hope to have in order to give to our attenders. My question is: how we can have marketing materials easily? or is possible for the invited Rock Star to bring some gift below his arm? ;) Rodrigo Moya wrote: [snip] one thing that would be cool would be to have marketing materials easily. It is a bit sad to say 'no, sorry, no t-shirts' to people asking for some at conferences -- Felipe begin:vcard fn:Felipe Barros S. n:Barros S.;Felipe adr:;;;Santiago;;;Chile email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:http://www.linuxlab.cl/ version:2.1 end:vcard ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
El dv 28 de 07 del 2006 a les 09:45 +0200, en/na Dave Neary va escriure: Hi, Felipe Barros S. wrote: 3. To resolve in part the expenses of the meetings that we make. We can sell some stuffs like a stickers, mugs, pencils or whatever, using GNOME logos and fonts? 1. In general, no. The foundation has a couple of agreements with vendors selling GNOME merchandise (and more on the way). Selling GNOME merchandise for-profit (even as a fundraiser) is explicitly forbidden in the user group agreement I referred to earlier. Also my personal take, not knowing most of the legal stuff implied. Conceptually, I think self-sustainability of GNOME user groups must be a principle stronger than the commitments and dependencies of the GNOME Foundation with merchandising vendors. In case of conflict we should look first after the GNOME user groups. With this concept clear, coherent practices could be: - If we can have agreements with several vendors because we sell no exclusivity, we could set something like vendor agreements with GNOME user groups. - These agreements would make sense specially in countries with strong problems of distribution, where buying a t-shirt to an official vendor would imply paying more for the transport than for the t-shirt itself. Reasonable vendors should understand this. - In places with no distribution problems i.e. with a vendor and a user group in the same country we would enforce coordination instead, requesting vendors to offer special prices to user groups. Reasonable vendors should be interested on this deal with a good customer. - Note that an agreement with the GNOME Foundation implies that the user group has a legal entity. This makes sense: a group wanting to move money needs to account their finances legally. This is what i.e. GNOME Hispano is doing. The same issue applies if you want to get money from sponsors, apply to public funds, and so on. If you don't want to go through the process of creating an association you probably don't want to go either through the process of getting serious on fundraising. - If you are out of the main GNOME distribution channels, your group has no legal entity and you still want to raise some money selling GNOME merchandising... as Dave says we can't really stop you from doing this. Just make sure what you do is fully compliant to the first principle of GNOME user group self-sustainability. Don't do anything that could upset the GNOME Foundation (community or board) and, please, don't get in competition with our vendors. If the latter is your case don't except much more official help from us... but bring some t-shirts to the next GUADEC / GNOME event because we GNOME merchandise collectors will pay for them as anybody else. ;) -- Quim Gil /// http://desdeamericaconamor.org | http://guadec.org signature.asc Description: Això és una part d'un missatge, signada digitalment ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
quote who=Quim Gil - Note that an agreement with the GNOME Foundation implies that the user group has a legal entity. Note that we have to take our tax status in the US into account when talking about relationships with international groups - it has come up as an issue in the past, so we need some legal advice about this before making anything official. - Jeff -- linux.conf.au 2007: Sydney, Australia http://lca2007.linux.org.au/ I think of [commercial Open Source development] as being the biggest private investment in public works in decades. - Andrew Tridgell ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
Quim Gil wrote: El dv 28 de 07 del 2006 a les 09:45 +0200, en/na Dave Neary va escriure: Hi, Felipe Barros S. wrote: 3. To resolve in part the expenses of the meetings that we make. We can sell some stuffs like a stickers, mugs, pencils or whatever, using GNOME logos and fonts? 1. In general, no. The foundation has a couple of agreements with vendors selling GNOME merchandise (and more on the way). Selling GNOME merchandise for-profit (even as a fundraiser) is explicitly forbidden in the user group agreement I referred to earlier. Also my personal take, not knowing most of the legal stuff implied. Conceptually, I think self-sustainability of GNOME user groups must be a principle stronger than the commitments and dependencies of the GNOME Foundation with merchandising vendors. In case of conflict we should look first after the GNOME user groups. With this concept clear, coherent practices could be: - If we can have agreements with several vendors because we sell no exclusivity, we could set something like vendor agreements with GNOME user groups. It's could help to user groups to be self-sustainable and avoid a financial dependency of the foundation or the members directly. - These agreements would make sense specially in countries with strong problems of distribution, where buying a t-shirt to an official vendor would imply paying more for the transport than for the t-shirt itself. Reasonable vendors should understand this. Perhaps something like a reseller could help, Buy from Chile something from USA or Europe is very expensive and slow. - In places with no distribution problems i.e. with a vendor and a user group in the same country we would enforce coordination instead, requesting vendors to offer special prices to user groups. Reasonable vendors should be interested on this deal with a good customer. - Note that an agreement with the GNOME Foundation implies that the user group has a legal entity. This makes sense: a group wanting to move money needs to account their finances legally. This is what i.e. GNOME Hispano is doing. The same issue applies if you want to get money from sponsors, apply to public funds, and so on. If you don't want to go through the process of creating an association you probably don't want to go either through the process of getting serious on fundraising. - If you are out of the main GNOME distribution channels, your group has no legal entity and you still want to raise some money selling GNOME merchandising... as Dave says we can't really stop you from doing this. Just make sure what you do is fully compliant to the first principle of GNOME user group self-sustainability. Don't do anything that could upset the GNOME Foundation (community or board) and, please, don't get in competition with our vendors. Of course not If the latter is your case don't except much more official help from us... but bring some t-shirts to the next GUADEC / GNOME event because we GNOME merchandise collectors will pay for them as anybody else. ;) :) -- Felipe begin:vcard fn:Felipe Barros S. n:Barros S.;Felipe adr:;;;Santiago;;;Chile email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] x-mozilla-html:FALSE url:http://www.linuxlab.cl/ version:2.1 end:vcard ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
On 7/27/06, Richard Stallman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How about encouraging some sort of cooperation between GNOME usergroups and the GNU Project?Most of GNOME users use the GNU system,and all of them use one important GNU package.___ Hello,sorry but...what're you related for?I mean, GNOME users are real GNU users already, 99% of GNOME users are GNU system users, GNOME is embedded into the GNU world!!! Please, which is the important GNU package you mean?ThanksLuca Cappelletti-- ---Luca CappellettiInfodomestic.com...Together we stand, divided we fall. .O...GTalk: luca dot cappelletti at gmail dot comJabber: luca dot cappelletti at jabber dot orgICQ: 302067395MSN: luca underscore cappelletti at hotmail dot com Yahoo: mutoiderzSkype: luca dot cappellettiLinux Registered User: #223411http://www.advogato.org/person/mutek/ http://persone.softwarelibero.org/person/mutekhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucaCappelletti/l'intelligenza è utile per la sopravvivenza se ci permette di estinguere una cattiva idea prima che la cattiva idea estingua noi La chiave di ogni uomo è il suo pensiero. Benché egli possa apparire saldo e autonomo, ha un criterio cui obbedisce, che è l'idea in base alla quale classifica tutte le cose. Può essere cambiato solo mostrandogli una nuova idea che sovrasti la sua Uno studioso è soltanto un modo in cui una biblioteca crea un'altra biblioteca ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
Hi Luca, Luca Cappelletti wrote: Please, which is the important GNU package you mean? I'm guessing that it starts with G, ends in ME, and has a NO in the middle. Cheers, Dave. -- David Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
Helklo Dave,On 7/27/06, Dave Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Luca,Luca Cappelletti wrote: Please, which is the important GNU package you mean?I'm guessing that it starts with G, ends in ME, and has a NO in the middle.Cheers,Dave. I misunderstanding the RMS starting thread due to my lack in english.I'm sorry,Thanks to all of you now I understand the meaning.Yeah...RMS rules... ;)bye,Luca-- ---Luca CappellettiInfodomestic.com...Together we stand, divided we fall. .O...GTalk: luca dot cappelletti at gmail dot comJabber: luca dot cappelletti at jabber dot orgICQ: 302067395MSN: luca underscore cappelletti at hotmail dot com Yahoo: mutoiderzSkype: luca dot cappellettiLinux Registered User: #223411http://www.advogato.org/person/mutek/ http://persone.softwarelibero.org/person/mutekhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucaCappelletti/l'intelligenza è utile per la sopravvivenza se ci permette di estinguere una cattiva idea prima che la cattiva idea estingua noi La chiave di ogni uomo è il suo pensiero. Benché egli possa apparire saldo e autonomo, ha un criterio cui obbedisce, che è l'idea in base alla quale classifica tutte le cose. Può essere cambiato solo mostrandogli una nuova idea che sovrasti la sua Uno studioso è soltanto un modo in cui una biblioteca crea un'altra biblioteca ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
- Active mailing list for coordination Required Ok, this is enough for the kind of 'certification' I'm looking for. Should be hosted in the GNOME server? My vote is +1.\ My opinion is No. For example in Mongolia not everyone has broadband and high speed connection. Thus it would be better to host ML in Mongolia. Maybe there are more such issues. We should consider it. - GNOME Foundation members in the group Desirable (I'd like to make this required - it would be nice for all user groups to maintain a full membership list) I think this is a requirement if you want to have your group listed at www.gnome.org. You wouldn't need Foundation members to start a group, and you could be operating with mailing list and live.gnome.org pages. The fact of starting and consolidating a GNOME user group should be enough to qualify to become a Foundation member. You see my point, this way we list in wgo consolidated groups with Foundation members in it. I agree. ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
El dc 26 de 07 del 2006 a les 07:36 +0200, en/na David Neary va escriure: You mean like live.gnome.org/UserGroups? Definitely, this is a very good start. I searched local by title (no relevant results) and by text (too much results) and din't find this page. A first step into certification would be to agree a name for these groups. :) Another step could be to agree on a checklist of required + desirable points. Some of them are already there as recommendations. - Active mailing list for coordination - Website up to date - Responsive IRC channel - GNOME Foundation members in the group - Agreed contact with the GNOME Foundation - Local press contact - Democratic and non-profit structure (legal existence desirable) Perhaps a first question would be whether we need to have something like an official list of GNOME groups and a checklist to know if your group is official or not. I think some kind of certification is needed to avoid conflicts like i.e. which is the real Russian GNOME website (or are both as real?) or risks like some guys linked to a profit company weaving the GNOME flag for selfish interests in a part of the planet where it is difficult to us to check what's going on. In the new www.gnome.org we want to map all the official GNOME subsites, and the local groups are related to a big percentage of them: http://live.gnome.org/GnomeWeb/GnomeSubsites . This one reason to have an official list with some kind of control from the GNOME Foundation. And one more thing that perhaps could help in the coordination Fernando was requesting. Since organization of meetings, participation in events and fundraising for such activities are a common and primary mission of the local groups, I wonder if it would be useful to have a gnome-local or gnome-events mailing list to exchange ideas and experiences. Now this is supposed to go to marketing-list but, really, I think many people very active in local activities can be not interested in many discussions going on in marketing-list. -- Quim Gil /// http://desdeamericaconamor.org | http://guadec.org signature.asc Description: Això és una part d'un missatge, signada digitalment ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
Hi, Quim Gil wrote: Definitely, this is a very good start. I searched local by title (no relevant results) and by text (too much results) and din't find this page. Yeah - it's linked off TeamWorkspaces - I've added a link to the top of GnomeWorldwide too, which seems like a logical place to look for user groups. A first step into certification would be to agree a name for these groups. :) GNOME user groups. Another step could be to agree on a checklist of required + desirable points. Some of them are already there as recommendations. - Active mailing list for coordination Required - Website up to date Desirable - Responsive IRC channel Desirable - GNOME Foundation members in the group Desirable (I'd like to make this required - it would be nice for all user groups to maintain a full membership list) - Agreed contact with the GNOME Foundation English speaker - for the gugmasters mailing list we discussed during the marketing BOF. The idea is to have one mailing list where user groups co-ordinate (announce event participation, ask for help from others, communicate results of stuff they're doing and so on) - the resource should be enormously valuable, if we get buy-in from the various groups. See the Infrastructure section of http://live.gnome.org/MarketingTeam/GuadecBof2006 for more details (and I will be looking for volunteers in September to get the infrastructure mentioned in there off the ground and living and breathing). - Local press contact Required, probably. And this should be a person. No more mailing lists as press contacts! - Democratic and non-profit structure (legal existence desirable) Definitely not required. Perhaps a first question would be whether we need to have something like an official list of GNOME groups and a checklist to know if your group is official or not. I don't think so. We should simply have a list of all the groups we know about, but you don't need a stamp of approval to support GNOME in your town/region. The whole point of bottom-up marketing is to avoid any approval process (even tacit or unwritten) and empower people to do things on their own. We want to know what you're doing, to benefit everyone, but there will be no official and unofficial GNOME groups. I think some kind of certification is needed to avoid conflicts like i.e. which is the real Russian GNOME website (or are both as real?) or risks like some guys linked to a profit company weaving the GNOME flag for selfish interests in a part of the planet where it is difficult to us to check what's going on. I disagree quite strongly. We can take out the bad guys one at a time, using the community mark idea. But we need to allow people to self-organise without passing through the GNOME Foundation. Since organization of meetings, participation in events and fundraising for such activities are a common and primary mission of the local groups, I wonder if it would be useful to have a gnome-local or gnome-events mailing list to exchange ideas and experiences. Now this is supposed to go to marketing-list but, really, I think many people very active in local activities can be not interested in many discussions going on in marketing-list. A GNOME user group masters mailing list is on the TODO list. Language is one barrier, but if we can find one committed volunteer per user group who speaks English, then we can avoid the problem (at least partially). I insist, though, that the foundation is not the place where groups get created or made official. We will be a service provider for user groups - a place for information exchange and co-ordination - not a centralised command control structure. Cheers, Dave. -- David Neary [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
How about encouraging some sort of cooperation between GNOME user groups and the GNU Project? Most of GNOME users use the GNU system, and all of them use one important GNU package. ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
Re: GNOME Local user groups
El dj 06 de 07 del 2006 a les 12:47 -0400, en/na Fernando San Martín Woerner va escriure: On the other hand i would like to hear ideas on how we can coordinate this efforts, and how the board and the foundation can help, having strong user groups it is signal of good health of our community. What about creating a wiki page in order to define: - What is a GNOME local group, including minimal requirements to be recognized as an official local group by the GNOME Foundation. - List of current GNOME local groups. This is important because we want to put more trust and responsibilities on the local groups (inviting new foundation members, press contacts, local web maintainers etc). Therefore we need to know what and who are we talking about. It will also be useful for contributors wanting to create a new local group: what do we request them, what can they expect from us. -- Quim Gil /// http://desdeamericaconamor.org | http://guadec.org signature.asc Description: Això és una part d'un missatge, signada digitalment ___ foundation-list mailing list foundation-list@gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-list
