Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:44 AM, D Stubbs wrote:
It's a 'Stack of Disks'
If it is a stack of discs (platter)- and if something failed does
it stand to reason that it would fail one disc at at time?
BUT Data is written on all of the #1 cylinders (tracks on the
disk), then writing moves to 'Cylinder #2', then Cylinder #3,.
- so one's best security is to perhaps partition exactly to each
disc?
So Partitions do NOT correspond to 'disks' (platter)
I am trying to get my head around this concept - that a partition
is not a partition.
Think this way
Hard disk = File cabinet
Indexing system for locating data within the file cabinet = APS,
FAT32, FAT16 etc.
the top level of designations may be referred to as Partitions (or
not) Its all treated the same the same as 'File Names'.
Within 'Partitions' you have 'File Names' 'Directories' [Remember
being told that 'Directories are just a 'special case file name'?]
Partitions are just another 'Special Case' of 'File Name'.
To help visualize how the HD organizes things, you can think of
partitions as drawers in the file cabinet. [But that's to help you,
NOT an actual representation of real life.]
So, we have HD, partition table (tree), directories (more sub-trees)
files (data), directories (more sub-trees) files (data) ...
Meanwhile, the HD subsystem has been putting data of varying types
here and there on the sectors available. (Starts out as a nice clean
'Start at sector #1, next, next situation', then, the nice one right
after the other pattern 'goes to hell, in a handbasket' [Deleting
things, returns their 'used sectors' to the 'free sector' list
at the end of the list, and in whatever order they came available.
I.E. Use next sector could be anyplace on the HD.]
Notice, nowhere in this 'write data' description, is there a
reference to Partition, Directory, or File Name. The HD doesn't care,
all it does is keep track of where to find the NEXT sector used by
this 'batch of DATA' (directory, file).
This is why 'Crashes' can be so disastrous.
{Crash -- In the olden days, referred to what was usually an actual
'crash' of the read/write head onto the surface of the 'platter/ drum
(real old tech). Today is usually just a glitch on the surface of the
platter that doesn't respond properly to write/ read commands
(something that can develop over a period of time.)}
Said 'crash' confuses the electronics. It can no longer locate the
'Next' place to write/ read.
This is where 'Disk Recovery Software' goes to work, it ignores the
'original' tree structure, and reads everything, and tries to fit the
pieces back together (Often quite successfully).
This description is NOT a 'super accurate definition', its a
generalized tale of what is probably happening.
Specific Manufacturers do their own thing sometimes 'inside the HD'.
[Makes life interesting for the Data Recovery folk.]
Chuck D.
Tried googling Understanding Partitions and What is a
Partition. All I found were basic descriptions of the fact. Even
found a recent blog by Dan Knight on his partitioning:
http://lowendmac.com/musings/08mm/partition-your-hard-drive.html
But I am no further in understanding what is actually happening.
I suppose it is some kind of 'virtual directory'?
What makes no sense yet to me is how, say partition #3 could go
bad, and not the others - if it they all bunched together.
But then this question may be beyond the scope of the present
discussion - maybe someone knows of a url that is 'Understanding
partitions 101 for the average idget'?
Thanks for all the help, I have decided on 3 partitions.
Del
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Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:50 AM, Hunter Fuller wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 2009/1/5 D Stubbs : I am trying to get my head around this concept - that a partition is not a partition. Tried googling Understanding Partitions and What is a Partition. All I found were basic descriptions of the fact. Even found a recent blog by Dan Knight on his partitioning: http://lowendmac.com/musings/08mm/partition-your-hard-drive.html But I am no further in understanding what is actually happening. The post by Charles (I think it was) is incorrect. The disk is partitioned in this manner: Say you have multiple platters in a drive (the most common) and you have an 80 GiB disk. We will say it has four platters for simplicity. When you partition it, let's say you create 2x 40 GiB partitions. That means the data in partition one will be stored on platters 1-2 and the data in partition two on platters 3-4. MAYBE --- depends on the manufacturer. They can do it any way they want to, because it doesn't matter to the Operating System. For this to be true, the Numbering Scheme for sectors needs to start at the beginning of Platter #1 Side #1 (yes, they do use both sides at times,), then Platter #1 Side #2, then P #2, S#1, ... When in actuality, the usual numbering system follows the P #1, S#1, Cylinder #1, P#1, S#2, C#1, P#2,S#1,C#1, P#2,S#2,C#1, P#3,S#1,C#1,P#3,S#2,C#1, then after all the platter sides are used, start again at platter #1S#1,C#2, ... The reason being that it is faster to 'change the W/R head, than it is to physically move the W/R head to a different cylinder. Of course due to overhead, the break will not exactly be on the break in the platters (some of partition one might spill into platter 3). That is fine. One platter cannot fail. They are all on the same spindle motor and the same read head arm. Read heads are the only thing different between the platters and those 99.% of the time don't fail. I've never seen that happen and I've seen a lot of disks fail (unfortunately). I think the usual failure mode these days, is a surface deformity of some sort. Chuck D. I suppose it is some kind of 'virtual directory'? What makes no sense yet to me is how, say partition #3 could go bad, and not the others - if it they all bunched together. But then this question may be beyond the scope of the present discussion - maybe someone knows of a url that is 'Understanding partitions 101 for the average idget'? Thanks for all the help, I have decided on 3 partitions. Del - -- - -hackmiester --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mail oddity
On Jan 4, 2009, at 4:56 PM, George Hozendorf wrote: - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth When I open Mail it quits before a window opens. I'm not having problems with the two accounts I have under my login. What do you mean move aside Mail's preferences? Since this account had never been set up go into the users Library/ Preferences folder and delete com.apple.Mail.plist -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Hunter Fuller wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 2009/1/4 Charles Davis : But as I sit here with 26 (yes Twenty six) partitions on the right hand side of my screen, there are times when the amount of 'real estate' is a bother, but on the other hand, I can see that I have 12 bootable systems (OS9 + X and 10/ X clones of varying ages), 7 that are empty, and 7 more with varying contents. Damn, unmount some of those CCCs!! That would free up some real-estate on screen, but I have a large screen, so it's not a bother. Chuck The trick is to let the 'Partition Name' reflect it's contents. [Bless Apples 'long fillename ability']. Chuck D. - -- - -hackmiester --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 2009/1/5 D Stubbs : I am trying to get my head around this concept - that a partition is not a partition. Tried googling Understanding Partitions and What is a Partition. All I found were basic descriptions of the fact. Even found a recent blog by Dan Knight on his partitioning: http://lowendmac.com/musings/08mm/partition-your-hard-drive.html But I am no further in understanding what is actually happening. The post by Charles (I think it was) is incorrect. The disk is partitioned in this manner: Say you have multiple platters in a drive (the most common) and you have an 80 GiB disk. We will say it has four platters for simplicity. When you partition it, let's say you create 2x 40 GiB partitions. That means the data in partition one will be stored on platters 1-2 and the data in partition two on platters 3-4. Of course due to overhead, the break will not exactly be on the break in the platters (some of partition one might spill into platter 3). That is fine. One platter cannot fail. They are all on the same spindle motor and the same read head arm. Read heads are the only thing different between the platters and those 99.% of the time don't fail. I've never seen that happen and I've seen a lot of disks fail (unfortunately). I suppose it is some kind of 'virtual directory'? What makes no sense yet to me is how, say partition #3 could go bad, and not the others - if it they all bunched together. But then this question may be beyond the scope of the present discussion - maybe someone knows of a url that is 'Understanding partitions 101 for the average idget'? Thanks for all the help, I have decided on 3 partitions. Del - -- - -hackmiester -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.8 (Darwin) Comment: http://getfiregpg.org iEYEARECAAYFAkliHj0ACgkQZGCrekxoMEWHtACdHnC/+KM3E3h1GsVt1NoRnqGJ GQ4AniQRiqtHK6kXNEc1LpF+Ye0YJr71 =bLWa -END PGP SIGNATURE- --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
At 12:28 PM -0500 1/5/2009, Charles Davis wrote: I think the usual failure mode these days, is a surface deformity of some sort. Surface deformities are mapped out during factory low-level formatting. Oxide formations are what causes most sector failures -- RUST. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 12:35 PM, Dan wrote: At 12:28 PM -0500 1/5/2009, Charles Davis wrote: I think the usual failure mode these days, is a surface deformity of some sort. Surface deformities are mapped out during factory low-level formatting. Oxide formations are what causes most sector failures -- RUST. well now, that would explain the high failure rate when I cool my drives with salt water. ;) -sam --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 12:35 PM, Dan wrote: At 12:28 PM -0500 1/5/2009, Charles Davis wrote: I think the usual failure mode these days, is a surface deformity of some sort. Surface deformities are mapped out during factory low-level formatting. Yeah, those 'scratches that didn't polish out, 'holidays' in the plating, etc. Oxide formations are what causes most sector failures -- RUST. - Dan. -- Well, that IS a surface deformity that develops over time. Chuck D. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
Hello All, Thanks for your input! I wanted to 'expand' on how I'm handling this family photo archive project. :-) I AM COMMITTED TO DOING THE SCANNING AND ORGANIZING OF FILES O-N-C-E DOING IT R-I-G-H-T AND NOT HAVING TO REPEAT THE W-O-R-K FOR THESE PARTICULAR PHOTOGRAPHS! My work motto is ' Do it Right, Do it Right the First Time, And Not Do It Over! My Goal is to finish this project with a 'product' that is something a Photographer (like me) many years in the future will have the 'data' to do anything he wants to do with any particular image. Equally important, I want the 'data' to be a genealogical and historical treasure trove to whoever goes through the image files and associated 'data'. I'm not doing any 'genealogical' work per se, but am going to work to 'tag' the images with as much names, dates, and event info as I can glean for each image. A) The Original Photographs will NOT Be Discarded! Very little beats having the originals, but I am mostly left with cheap color prints from the 70's and 80's at this point and the underlying chemistry of how these were made defines them as NON-Archival. The HUGE quantities of black and whites (the Good Stuff) is either buried at the landfill or burned at the County Incinerator. Sigh. B) The Scans them selves will be at deep resolutions and a good bit depth. With nominal adjustments and editing to keep the image files 'true' and without forced color or contrast changes. This minimizes my workload and keeps from having 'image data' lost through the 'restoration' process. C) I'll be using TIFF file format because it turnes out that it is an industry norm for long term digital image storage. D) The Names and Date info for each image will be stored integral to the image file itself. This way each image stands on it's own as a seperate file and if 'say' half the files on a disc become unreadable, it has no material effect on retrieving all the info important to the other half of the files. E) I'll be practicing a defense in depth strategy for storing the files: --- Two copies of the data set will be disperesed to a geographically diverse group of relatives and in good numbers (My Dad is one of 10 kids!). --- The Dispered Copies will be One set of discs for 'use' and one will be for 'storage'. The 'Storage' set will hopefully be in a nice container that wil give a high likelyhood of the discs in their cases will stay vertical and be kept stress free. I'm shooting for a really elegant storage container - custom wood box ? - that shouts I'm important - Take Good Care Of Me! I'm leaning toward jpeg's on the 'for use' discs to maximize the convenience. Nothing firm on that front has been decided yet. --- My personal copies of the 'storage set' will be multiple and on diverse media including Optical and HD. F) I am 'Planning' to use a Scheduled Media RollOver Process to keep the data safe for many many years. I'm hoping to be doing the process every 5 yrs with media I can count on for 10yrs. Maybe it's something I'll do every year, every other year. Query! - As someone who has definitely experienced the loss of data in hd failure, optical disc failure/damage, floppy/zip failure, and video tape decay. I wonder how something as fragile as 'Tapes' can be advocated over high grade opticals for my application. A 'corporate' structure and funding can create a viability for corporate data storage on tapes, but it seems quite expensive and effort intensive to keep the tapes viable and quite actively replacing tapes over time. This isn't Liberty Mutual Insurance with billions on the line and the millions to support the project! It's just us - the ward family - and large segments of our family are barely middle class and none are rich financially :-). Myself, I'm coping with multiple illnesses and only made a few thousand dollars last year! :-) To Everybody, I'm doing this scan project because of how important Photographs and Images are to me. I am in my soul a very caring, creative, and intensely visual person who has bonded those qualities to the art and science of photography. I am doing this to Protect my Dad's Families visual heritage and to disperse it to family members spread from Michigan, to Kansas, to Florida, to California. Richard --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:44 AM, D Stubbs wrote: I suppose it is some kind of 'virtual directory'? What makes no sense yet to me is how, say partition #3 could go bad, and not the others - if it they all bunched together. The following is vastly simplified, and there are a lot of exceptions, but should explain things. There are 2 types of disk problems, hardware and software. Many software problems with a partition are because of directory problems within that partition. If the directory of partition A gets trashed for whatever reason, the directories of partitions B and C are not affected, since they are completely independent virtual disks. Think of this type of problem as if you had 3 firewire external disks daisy chained together (or for old school folks, multiple SCSI disks). If one disk went bad, the other 2 should still work with no problems. Hardware problems can affect 1 partition, multiple partitions or the whole mechanical drive. Examples: Say that there is a head crash that scratches a small portion of one of the platters. If the head is OK, this will most likely affect a small portion of one of the partitions, unless it is part of the directory. It should not affect the other partitions. Now imagine that that same head crash destroyed the head. This could affect either 1 partition (if it is the large partition which spans multiple platters) or multiple partitions if they are on the same physical platter (your 2 smaller partitions). Lastly are things that cause total disk failure. Some examples: The head crash is epic and spews parts of the platter or heads around the inside of the drive. Power surge that trashes the controller board. Spindle bearing failure that keeps the disk from spinning. If something like this happens, all partitions are gone and it is time to restore from your backup (cheap) or call DriveSavers with your AmEx Black card. HTH, Len --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Un-Mounting Drive
At 10:34 PM -0500 1/4/09, Dan posted: At 1:27 PM -0800 1/4/2009, Amanda Ward wrote: Maxtor OneTouch 4P 250 GB external drive Sawtooth running X 10.5.6. Disk Utility says it can't unmount the drive and I can't eject it because The drive is in use. When this happens to me, it's usually TextEdit or Preview that's somehow hanging on to a file that is already closed. Try Quitting both of these apps. When Quitting all apps doesn't work, I restart the computer. Steve R -- Reopen NAFTA. Reclaim our sovereignty. http://www.straightgoods.ca/ViewFeature8.cfm?REF=333 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
At 10:13 AM -0800 1/5/2009, aussieshepsrock wrote: I wanted to 'expand' on how I'm handling this family photo archive project. :-) [snip - lots of details] Sounds like a good, well thought out plan to me. Query! - As someone who has definitely experienced the loss of data in hd failure, optical disc failure/damage, floppy/zip failure, and video tape decay. I wonder how something as fragile as 'Tapes' can be advocated over high grade opticals for my application. Magnetic media is actually less fragile than burned media. heh. I've got tapes and floppies that were written in the 80s, that still read just fine. Tapes/etc store data as magnetic patterns that don't degrade / fade much. Burned media stores data as pits in the substraight, under the outer plastic coating. Over time, oxygen leeches through the plastic, and forms rust (oxide), which fill the pits, creating read errors. Tapes/etc can be cleaned, then read with stronger-field heads. Burned media - only the outer plastic can be cleaned - the pits are permanently filled in, so the data is gone. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 2009/1/4 Charles Davis : But as I sit here with 26 (yes Twenty six) partitions on the right hand side of my screen, there are times when the amount of 'real estate' is a bother, but on the other hand, I can see that I have 12 bootable systems (OS9 + X and 10/ X clones of varying ages), 7 that are empty, and 7 more with varying contents. Damn, unmount some of those CCCs!! The trick is to let the 'Partition Name' reflect it's contents. [Bless Apples 'long fillename ability']. Chuck D. - -- - -hackmiester -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.8 (Darwin) Comment: http://getfiregpg.org iEYEARECAAYFAkliGRsACgkQZGCrekxoMEUKTgCfXcXSqKEhjzhibxp1WXitYwgi YFQAoOelg2FwKeu6ZYrXdwHCj/7TXfF7 =MuJf -END PGP SIGNATURE- --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 1:13 PM, aussieshepsrock ilovaussiesh...@yahoo.com wrote: Query! - As someone who has definitely experienced the loss of data in hd failure, optical disc failure/damage, floppy/zip failure, and video tape decay. I wonder how something as fragile as 'Tapes' can be advocated over high grade opticals for my application. A 'corporate' structure and funding can create a viability for corporate data storage on tapes, but it seems quite expensive and effort intensive to keep the tapes viable and quite actively replacing tapes over time. This isn't Liberty Mutual Insurance with billions on the line and the millions to support the project! It's just us - the ward family - and large segments of our family are barely middle class and none are rich financially :-). Myself, I'm coping with multiple illnesses and only made a few thousand dollars last year! :-) __ I understand your dilemma but assure you tapes kept away from EMF damage in a rather stable environment are still considered to outlast CD/DVDs which undergo their own kinds of material deterioration. Old 40 and 60 GB tape cartridges and the drive to use them are in a backroom somewhere as forgotten technology waiting to be given away to someone. I am not saying this is best for you but the old stuff is out there, hardly used in many cases and still viable. They were designed for long term archiving from the start. No one much cared about that with CDs as they are so convenient. Keeping disks in controlled environments is important too. especially regarding sunlight. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
2009/1/4 Charles Davis c...@gamewood.net: BUT Data is written on all of the #1 cylinders (tracks on the disk), then writing moves to 'Cylinder #2', then Cylinder #3,. This is wrong. On an 80 GiB disk, for instance, if I make two 40 GiB partitions, and save a file to the second, it gets written just after the middle of the disk. - so one's best security is to perhaps partition exactly to each disc? So Partitions do NOT correspond to 'disks' (platter) Therefore this is also incorrect. I didn't exactly buy the most expensive unit out there - so some attention to possible HD falure would seem prudent. Not a bad thought. Sometimes 'Paranoia' does have its usefulness. This is why you keep hearing MAKE BACKUPS. Make backups, no matter how much you trust the drive. As soon as you trust it, it will fail. That's my advice. (In case it matters - at the bottom of the following URL are specs on my particular new HD http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other%20World%20Computing/NPFW7500GB/) thanks, Del HTH Chuck D. -- -hackmiester --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
At 1:34 PM -0500 1/5/2009, Wallace Adrian D'Alessio wrote: Old 40 and 60 GB tape cartridges LOL Guess I'm dating myself. When I think of mag tape, I think of 9track - 800 or 1600 or 6250bpi reels, not carts. I have some mylar paper tape, from the 70s and 80s. No data degradation there! - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Cleaning memory chip contacts?
Has anyone used CRC LECTRA CLEAN to clean contact points and if so, is it advisable? Opinions? Thank you John Callahan jcalla...@stny.rr.com If there are no dogs in Heaven, when I die I want to go where they went.¨ --Will Rogers extreme positive = (ybya2) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:28 AM, Charles Davis wrote: The reason being that it is faster to 'change the W/R head, than it is to physically move the W/R head to a different cylinder. Well- and for the obvious reason that you aren't always partitioning into pieces that divide perfectly among platters! --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: My computer
As for your older files, You should be able to use OS9 Classic Environment either way for files 9.2 and older. On Jan 4, 10:21 pm, joe j...@joethejuggler.com wrote: On Jan 1, 2009, at 4:05 AM, Kris Tilford wrote: The key to this Mac is: Machine Model: PowerMac3,3 An AGP Graphics (Sawtooth) should be PowerMac3,1. Yes. Also, on my AGP Graphics (originally a 450 mhz) the profiler even identifies it as AGP Graphics: Hardware Overview: Machine Name: Power Mac G4 (AGP graphics) Machine Model: PowerMac3,1 CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (3.3) Number Of CPUs: 1 CPU Speed: 1.4 GHz L2 Cache (per CPU): 256 KB L3 Cache (per CPU): 2 MB Memory: 1.5 GB Bus Speed: 100 MHz Boot ROM Version: 4.2.8f1 Serial Number: XB022C40J2S Sales Order Number: 0100232123XB022C401234123412341234 == Joe the Juggler 4148 Wyoming St. St. Louis, MO 63116 (314) 771-3243 http://joethejuggler.com == --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:33 AM, Hunter Fuller wrote: 2009/1/4 Charles Davis c...@gamewood.net: BUT Data is written on all of the #1 cylinders (tracks on the disk), then writing moves to 'Cylinder #2', then Cylinder #3,. This is wrong. On an 80 GiB disk, for instance, if I make two 40 GiB partitions, and save a file to the second, it gets written just after the middle of the disk. Yup!!! You are right!!! FOR A SINGLE PLATTER, HD otherwise your wrong. The graphic representation you look at may seem to say that, but that ain't what is happening in real life. - so one's best security is to perhaps partition exactly to each disc? So Partitions do NOT correspond to 'disks' (platter) Therefore this is also incorrect. See above. I didn't exactly buy the most expensive unit out there - so some attention to possible HD falure would seem prudent. Not a bad thought. Sometimes 'Paranoia' does have its usefulness. This is why you keep hearing MAKE BACKUPS. Make backups, no matter how much you trust the drive. As soon as you trust it, it will fail. That's my advice. Right! Hard Disk Drives are Mechanical Devices, they have a measurable life before failure. Don't let yourself be caught by Murphy!! (In case it matters - at the bottom of the following URL are specs on my particular new HD http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other%20World%20Computing/ NPFW7500GB/) thanks, Del HTH Chuck D. -- -hackmiester Chuck D. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
At 8:44 AM -0600 1/5/2009, D Stubbs wrote: I am trying to get my head around this concept - that a partition is not a partition. Tried googling But I am no further in understanding what is actually happening. I suppose it is some kind of 'virtual directory'? What makes no sense yet to me is how, say partition #3 could go bad, and not the others - if it they all bunched together. Ok. From the top... simplified (ie, I'm leaving some details out)... Physically... A hard drive is made of platters, stacked together, with space between them. The platter is divided into concentric rings called tracks. Each track is divided into sectors. Depending on how your drive is formatted, the sectors are 512 bytes or 1024 or 2048, etc. Taken together, vertically, a cylinder is a column of tracks. The drive's read/write heads are mounted on arms (fingers) that reach in to a cylinder and read or write - as much as the whole track at once. Need a different sector? Move that arm to a new position (seek), wait for the platter to spin around until the sector you need is near the read/write head (latency), then read or write. But how do you access all that? Between the HD mechanism, its on-board controller, the controller in your computer, and the operating system... those cylinder/track/sector designations are converted into Logical Block Numbers (LBN), 1 thru n. That's still a bit unmanagable, so we divide things further into more managable chunks, called Partitions. A partition is physically, more or less, a group of cylinders. (it's not always a clean n cylinders as the user can pick any size). When we initialize a drive, we're actually laying down the Partition Map at the beginning of the drive. The first partition holds the Partition Map. The next few hold special data - things like the disk's driver, parameter files, etc. The last partitions are the ones that you-the-user see as mountable volumes. Within those volumes we lay down a File System. Within that file system, you put your files. Here is the partition map from my HD... (from the command 'diskutil list') #: type name size identifier 0: Apple_partition_scheme*74.5 GB disk0 1:Apple_partition_map 31.5 KB disk0s1 2: Apple_Driver43 28.0 KB disk0s2 3: Apple_Driver43 28.0 KB disk0s3 4: Apple_Driver_ATA28.0 KB disk0s4 5: Apple_Driver_ATA28.0 KB disk0s5 6: Apple_FWDriver 256.0 KB disk0s6 7: Apple_Driver_IOKit 256.0 KB disk0s7 8: Apple_Patches 256.0 KB disk0s8 9: Apple_HFS Stuff9.9 GBdisk0s10 10: Apple_HFS MacHD 64.4 GB disk0s12 As you can see, I have two mountable volumes on this drive, one called Stuff and one called MacHD. Because partitions are maintained as separately managed things by the Operating System, it is rare for any disk write to spaz out and scribble beyond a partition boundary. That's why you can destroy the file system in one volume without hurting the one in another. Of course, if there's a hardware failure, all bets are off. If it is a stack of discs - and if something failed does it stand to reason that it would fail one disc at at time? - so one's best security is to perhaps partition exactly to each disc? Ok. Failures... Hard and Soft. A hard failure is when something in the Hard Drive physically goes bad. Blocks (sectors) go bad now and then. Usually it's because they got a bit of oxidation on them. When the controller notices (ie, you try to read the block) it tries to correct the data with whatever checksums or CRC information it has, then it maps-out that block and puts your data in a different location. When a block goes bad, often it's not just one block. Usually, the bad block creep is in the adjoining blocks, in the same track. Sometimes the block on adjoining tracks fail too, but that's pretty rare. (the inter-track gap is gigantic compared to the inter-sector gap). Then there's a head crash... that's when one of those read/write heads accidentally touches the platter. The head is damaged, the platter is damaged. Worse - tiny bits of material (schrapnel) flies around and starts destroying other things. ...Great high school physics problem, figuring the impact velocity of a bit of oxide flung against a platter spinning at 7200rpm... A soft failure is when bad data is written to the drive. This can be outright bad data (spazz), or omission of data (the app or OS crashes before it finishes sending data to the drive). If the error is within the structure of a file system or the partition map itself, then a tool such as Disk Utility is used to repair it. If the error is within a file's data, then it's up to the user to
Re: Quicksilver motherboard in digital audio case??
You would need to adapt the DA power supply to match the Quicksilver's pinout; see: http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/tips/MDD_ps_mods/MDD_PS_Mods.html On Jan 5, 12:52 am, jonas ulrich jonasulrich3...@gmail.com wrote: I was wondering if it is possible to put a quicksilver mother board in a digital audio case? thanks!!-Jonas --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: I am thinking about a processor upgrade for my G4/400 AGP
Bruce may not have the time to say what he said a few weeks ago. So, I will pass it on. It was a single line that essentially suggests; get a G5 than spend money on a G4 upgrade. I'm still mulling that suggestion. I have Sawtooths. I was hoping to get a DA but Bruce gave me something to think about...and I hope you too. aussieshepsrock wrote: HiYa RiverMan, There is a big 'IF' in my reccomendation, but I see the cheapest and most straight forward speed bump you can achieve is by sliding an Intel Mini in the place of your Tower. When I compare the 'benchmark' numbers in the MacTracker App between a 400mhz g4 agp to a late model Mini it goes from a 221 score to a 2300 score. That is a 10 fold increase. The big 'IF' is whether you can live without the PCI slots, Native OS9, and internal drive expansion and the like. A mini can be had for a lot less than tricking out a G4/400/agp. There is also no rule saying you have to throw away the G4 tower after getting your mini - peaceful coexistence really can happen! In my personal opinion, when faced with jumping upwards from an early G4 tower, there are multiple good reasons to pick a Mini and multiple reasons to not pick a mini - the answer for 'YOU' depends on what variables are important in your computing world and what budget you're working with. It's also hard to call a 10x power increase for 600ish bucks a mistake. At worst I personally would call it a relatively inexpensive technological placeholder to buy the power and see if it will work before dropping a ton of bucks on a current or late model Mac Tower. Richard On Jan 4, 4:31 pm, RiverMan scarumcr...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone tried the upgrade from XLR8 or Newer Tech? I read about a 1.6 Ghz and a 2.0 Ghz upgrade for my G4 but would love to hear from people who have tried it. Or should I just save my cash and get a newer model? Thanks! -=] RiverMan [=- --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: My computer
On Jan 5, 2009, at 12:21 AM, joe wrote: On Jan 1, 2009, at 4:05 AM, Kris Tilford wrote: The key to this Mac is: Machine Model: PowerMac3,3 An AGP Graphics (Sawtooth) should be PowerMac3,1. Yes. Also, on my AGP Graphics (originally a 450 mhz) the profiler even identifies it as AGP Graphics: Hardware Overview: Machine Name: Power Mac G4 (AGP graphics) Machine Model: PowerMac3,1 CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (3.3) Number Of CPUs: 1 CPU Speed: 1.4 GHz L2 Cache (per CPU): 256 KB L3 Cache (per CPU): 2 MB Memory: 1.5 GB Bus Speed: 100 MHz Boot ROM Version: 4.2.8f1 Serial Number: XB022C40J2S Sales Order Number: 0100232123XB022C401234123412341234 chipmonk says (http://www.chipmunk.nl/klantenservice/applemodel.html): aantalip: 0 Serial number: XB022C40J2S Name: Power Macintosh G4 (AGP Graphics) Model: M PowerMac G4 400MHz/450MHz/500MHz CTO Bus speed: 100MHz Memory - number of slots: 4 Factory: XB (ElkGrove/Sacramento, California) URL: Technical specifications by apple-history.com code_to_number: C40 - G84188YDPXD Model introduced: 1999 Production year: 2000 Production week: 22 (June) Production number: 14008 (within this week) Uitbreidingen: Uitbreidingsmogelijkheden van dit apparaat Bill Connelly artsite: http://mysite.verizon.net/moonstoneartstudio myspace: http://www.myspace.com/moonstoneartstudio --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: My computer
Here is Leopards minimum requirements in the following link. http://www.apple.com/macosx/techspecs/ On Jan 4, 10:21 pm, joe j...@joethejuggler.com wrote: On Jan 1, 2009, at 4:05 AM, Kris Tilford wrote: The key to this Mac is: Machine Model: PowerMac3,3 An AGP Graphics (Sawtooth) should be PowerMac3,1. Yes. Also, on my AGP Graphics (originally a 450 mhz) the profiler even identifies it as AGP Graphics: Hardware Overview: Machine Name: Power Mac G4 (AGP graphics) Machine Model: PowerMac3,1 CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (3.3) Number Of CPUs: 1 CPU Speed: 1.4 GHz L2 Cache (per CPU): 256 KB L3 Cache (per CPU): 2 MB Memory: 1.5 GB Bus Speed: 100 MHz Boot ROM Version: 4.2.8f1 Serial Number: XB022C40J2S Sales Order Number: 0100232123XB022C401234123412341234 == Joe the Juggler 4148 Wyoming St. St. Louis, MO 63116 (314) 771-3243 http://joethejuggler.com == --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: I am thinking about a processor upgrade for my G4/400 AGP
The modeling that determines what CPU to use is more complex than has been stated. it is not simply a matter of cost and capability but, and these are just some more considerations, it is a matter of answering these two additional questions: 1- Am I satisfied with what my current CPU does? 2- Will I be satisfied in the future (pick a time)? E.G. Since 1990, I have been using a IIci offline using OS 6.0.8. It is perfect for my text work (using WORD 4.0 and EXCEL 2.2) and it resides alongside a G4 either a DA or one of the earlier models when I take the current G4 out of service to do some offline maintenance and upgrading as I please. All my G4 use OS 10.4.11 flawlessly. I day trade and email quite a bit and a 133 bus speed and a 667 MHz in the DA is fine for my purposes whereas the 100 bus speed and lets say a 400 MHz cPU pon the ealrier G4s are also suitable for me. Spares are abundant and are usually less than 10% of original cost. The sine qua non for my configuraitons is that they are not put out of service with either hardware or software problems and with that in mind, I leave others to pave the way with new OS, software and hardware. That is important to me but may not be important ot others so I cannot give adivce on what to do but can give the advice as follows: 1- Know what you need to do; not what you want ot do. 2- Find the most reliable older CPU that will satisfy that need. 3- Buy spares. 4- Don't try to convert a Honda in to a Ferrari when all you will use the Honda is for grocery shopping. That principle should also apply to using computers. BTW: I and my wife own and use a 1981 Accord SE, a 1985 Accord Hatchback and a 1959 VW PU truck (which we use about 200 miles a year). I hope this minor opinion has helped. Mel --- On Mon, 1/5/09, nestamicky nestami...@gmail.com wrote: From: nestamicky nestami...@gmail.com Subject: Re: I am thinking about a processor upgrade for my G4/400 AGP To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 11:19 AM Bruce may not have the time to say what he said a few weeks ago. So, I will pass it on. It was a single line that essentially suggests; get a G5 than spend money on a G4 upgrade. I'm still mulling that suggestion. I have Sawtooths. I was hoping to get a DA but Bruce gave me something to think about...and I hope you too. aussieshepsrock wrote: HiYa RiverMan, There is a big 'IF' in my reccomendation, but I see the cheapest and most straight forward speed bump you can achieve is by sliding an Intel Mini in the place of your Tower. When I compare the 'benchmark' numbers in the MacTracker App between a 400mhz g4 agp to a late model Mini it goes from a 221 score to a 2300 score. That is a 10 fold increase. The big 'IF' is whether you can live without the PCI slots, Native OS9, and internal drive expansion and the like. A mini can be had for a lot less than tricking out a G4/400/agp. There is also no rule saying you have to throw away the G4 tower after getting your mini - peaceful coexistence really can happen! In my personal opinion, when faced with jumping upwards from an early G4 tower, there are multiple good reasons to pick a Mini and multiple reasons to not pick a mini - the answer for 'YOU' depends on what variables are important in your computing world and what budget you're working with. It's also hard to call a 10x power increase for 600ish bucks a mistake. At worst I personally would call it a relatively inexpensive technological placeholder to buy the power and see if it will work before dropping a ton of bucks on a current or late model Mac Tower. Richard On Jan 4, 4:31 pm, RiverMan scarumcr...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone tried the upgrade from XLR8 or Newer Tech? I read about a 1.6 Ghz and a 2.0 Ghz upgrade for my G4 but would love to hear from people who have tried it. Or should I just save my cash and get a newer model? Thanks! -=] RiverMan [=- --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
It's a 'Stack of Disks' If it is a stack of discs (platter)- and if something failed does it stand to reason that it would fail one disc at at time? BUT Data is written on all of the #1 cylinders (tracks on the disk), then writing moves to 'Cylinder #2', then Cylinder #3,. - so one's best security is to perhaps partition exactly to each disc? So Partitions do NOT correspond to 'disks' (platter) I am trying to get my head around this concept - that a partition is not a partition. Tried googling Understanding Partitions and What is a Partition. All I found were basic descriptions of the fact. Even found a recent blog by Dan Knight on his partitioning: http://lowendmac.com/musings/08mm/partition-your-hard-drive.html But I am no further in understanding what is actually happening. I suppose it is some kind of 'virtual directory'? What makes no sense yet to me is how, say partition #3 could go bad, and not the others - if it they all bunched together. But then this question may be beyond the scope of the present discussion - maybe someone knows of a url that is 'Understanding partitions 101 for the average idget'? Thanks for all the help, I have decided on 3 partitions. Del --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
'Tis an interesting discussion. As for mag tapes, higher bit density leads to less than permanent storage. Good old 7 track 256 BPI tapes had a good reputation. In spite of the better magnetic materials, group-encoded tape records with their auto correcting error codes just got worse and worse in terms of long term storage. As for optical disks the little pits are smaller for higher density DVDs than for CD-ROMs. I should be expected that smaller pits will be more subject to damage than bigger ones. But an important part of the safety is the material in which the pits are formed. For one-at-a -time burning with a solid state laser the pits are formed in a thin optical layer on the back side of the transparent blank that is the plastic disk. Commercially pressed disks are formed in the plastic itself by forming against a master that is made with a recorder that is much more pricey than a home unit. Pressed disks are expected to have a lot better archival performance. Now a question: Is anyone offering the performance of pressed CD-ROMS for a fee that would be reasonable for a dozen copies? One day we may have holographic recording using three dimensions of the optical medium. Meanwhile. . . Hammer chisel and stone remain the best. -- -- From the U S of A, the only socialist country that refuses to admit it. -- --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
At 2:34 PM -0500 1/5/2009, Charles Davis wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 1:48 PM, MIKO .. wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 9:28 AM, Charles Davis wrote: Well- and for the obvious reason that you aren't always partitioning into pieces that divide perfectly among platters! But, you forget Partitions are YOUR thinking. The HD doesn't give a rip!!! And to take this one step further, there's a process called scatter gather. Various virtual and logical i/o requests are queued up, and the OS sorts them so as to send fewer / more efficient physical i/o commands to the drive (gather). When the response is received, the OS breaks up the buffer, handing each piece to the appropriate requester (scatter). This is also re done in the drive's controller, as it translates the logical block numbers to real cylinder/track/sectors. And everything is buffered here and there and everywhere... - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
At 1:31 PM -0700 1/5/2009, Doug McNutt wrote: As for optical disks the little pits are smaller for higher density DVDs than for CD-ROMs. I should be expected that smaller pits will be more subject to damage than bigger ones. But an important part of the safety is the material in which the pits are formed. and the quality improvements in the lasers - both the intensity (power levels) and frequencies used - which creates all sorts of backward compatibility issues. Now a question: Is anyone offering the performance of pressed CD-ROMS for a fee that would be reasonable for a dozen copies? Not for a dozen. Maybe for thousands. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Cleaning memory chip contacts?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 12:00 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: In the slot or on the DIMMS? I've always gone low tech on the dimms, using a white Mars eraser on them. Cleans the traces right up. I've never used that CRC product, but I've used Permatex electrical contact cleaner in the past with good results http://tinyurl.com/ 8pljzl. You can get it at any auto parts store. -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs -- On the dimms, what do you suggest for the slots? Thanks ~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list- unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/ group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~--- John Callahan jcalla...@stny.rr.com If there are no dogs in Heaven, when I die I want to go where they went.¨ --Will Rogers extreme positive = (ybya2) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
Old 40 and 60 GB tape cartridges and the drive to use them are in a backroom somewhere as forgotten technology waiting to be given away to someone. I am not saying this is best for you but the old stuff is out there, hardly used in many cases and still viable. They were designed for long term archiving from the start. No one much cared about that with CDs as they are so convenient. Keeping disks in controlled environments is important too. especially regarding sunlight. It seems from this excellent interchange that for long term storage tape is the longest lasting. Does anyone have suggestions for converting computer images to tape? What is the life of 35 mm slides? I have some ten thousand of them that I have been scanning and burning to discs. Upsetting to learn of the failure of disc storage. Thank you --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Cleaning memory chip contacts?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 2:22 PM, John Callahan wrote: On the dimms, what do you suggest for the slots? Thanks That's what I've used the spray cleaner for. However, when I've used stuff like that it's usually because I've needed to do a serious cleaning and so have disassembled the system, so I can spray the board and let the solvent run off..under normal circumstances, cleaning the DIMMS and inserting/extracting them from the slot a few times cleans any oxidation off the slot contacts. -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
Regarding the format of your archived photos: The photo industry believes that the highest quality version of an image is its RAW version, when available. The address this, and a global standard, the DNG format has been evolving and DNG format with the original RAW image embedded along the DNG conversion is supposedly going to be the most standard way of archiving images for the long term. I don't recommend CDs or DVDs because none seem high enough quality for me. If you were to go that route and wanted future compatibility, wouldn't you go with Blu-Ray? No physical media type (like CD-R) is going to remain in existence forever, but if you're concerned you should maybe store your images on SOLID STATE drives since they are probably the wave of the future... Maybe if you wait until the end of this year there will be a good sized solid-state drive out there. Toshiba is launching a 512gb solid state drive: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-10125861-64.html Also, a drive used for archiving should be used and then set aside in a nice safe clean cool dry place and not used much- it will live more years that way. Acknowledge that even if a drive type does not become obsolete, its connector might- Apple is one of those impatient instigators of hardware upgrades and so they are killing FW400 and eventually there will be no FW800 nor USB 2.0. Hopefully the ISO/OSI Int'l standards people are thinking about a permanently backwards compatible connector type- if one develops to will probably be closer to USB or Sata I think, or FDDI, and not Firewire, since business/pc users aren't the biggest users of firewire (though Hollywood and Pixar may be big users, I don't know)... HOWEVER- My guess is that CABLES are going to finally become more obsolete because I'm seeing camera card flash-type drives with built in static wi-fi! See Eye-fi: http://www.eye.fi/ Get a storage medium that will have multiple ways to connect to over devices (or share with other devices) or will remain compatible with future enclosures or standards. I see wifi/wireless large-storage solid state drives as coming along very soon... I always store important files in two different ways, at least, to ensure useability of one over another. Another good idea is to always keep a computer around that will open the files you have now- if your current computer becomes obsolete instead of dying, store in in a clean cool dry place with keyboard and monitor and maybe it'll be there for you when you need to read a disk in 2025 that you made today. Peace, MIKO Miko's Support and Design in Seattle, WA --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
On Jan 5, 2009, at 10:31 AM, Dan wrote: Magnetic media is actually less fragile than burned media. heh. I've got tapes and floppies that were written in the 80s, that still read just fine. Tapes/etc store data as magnetic patterns that don't degrade / fade much. I think tapes are awesome and almost recommended that but I'm worried about losing them to future standards, and to cats. Cats and little kids love pulling tape out of things... I dunno- just worried about the tape itself- la cinta- so that's why I went with a recommendation for solid state drives or wireless flash drives. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
At 4:34 PM -0500 1/5/2009, John Callahan wrote: It seems from this excellent interchange that for long term storage tape is the longest lasting. yes, but... The tape market is undergoing big changes, format, interface etc. I think the built-in obsolescence is very limiting. At least in the DVD market, backwards compatibility will let you read the discs for years to come. What is the life of 35 mm slides? I've got some taken in the late 1960s that still look sharp/crisp with good color. I have some ten thousand of them that I have been scanning and burning to discs. Upsetting to learn of the failure of disc storage. Multiple copies / backups. Burned DVDs and HDs, kept in different locations. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
At 1:55 PM -0800 1/5/2009, MIKO .. wrote: The photo industry believes that the highest quality version of an image is its RAW version, when available. Each company has its own variant of RAW. There will be no standard any time soon. TIFF is better. No physical media type (like CD-R) is going to remain in existence forever, but if you're concerned you should maybe store your images on SOLID STATE drives since they are probably the wave of the future... Maybe SSD will improve SOMEDAY to becoming a long-term storage solution, but for now the error rate is far too high. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
Original Poster Here: Query? - There are Ultra-High Grade Discs made with Gold (to resist corrosion), High Grade Plastics to resist scratches and etc, and with the use of 'higher' stability Dyes (?) all put together with high quality construction processes in their production. The prices are very high for these discs compared to the el-cheapo spindles on sale every week at the BigBox stores. eg: a hundred discs are 150 bucks versus 10 bucks. The 'Tested' theoretical life of these gold disks are 300yrs versus 100yrs for 'normal' High Grade disks. In my non-digital photo printing life there was an outfit doing printing paper and storage methods testing for expected life spans and such who's AUTHORITY and METHODS were exceptionally well regarded. Where is an organization like this for storage mediums. One (or more) has to exist but where do I find it? Query: Where is the 'glaring hole' in my data backup plan for these image files? My 'intended' burning methodologies are to burn very slowly (1x if possible) which in theory and personal experience gives very nice burns with excellent readability in multiple drives. Multiple data integrity tests using multiple drives to verify the burns contents is intended. These methods combined with numerous multiple copies of the entire data set seems like it would give a LOT of data security. With the 'Science' 'Experience' I have and know about - My intended use of 'Ultra-Grade' materials and 'Ultra-Careful' methods to create at least 10 pristine duplicate Disc Sets that will be stored 'as sets', in a durable container, with each disc in individual jewel cases, and a Case that promotes vertical storage, should be an Ass Kicking method to ensure that say 5yrs from now a 'Pristine' copy of this data set exists to be replicated onto whatever is the best method to use 5yrs from now. I would also provide to each 'set holder' a User Copy to use and abuse as they access and view the images. I personally DON'T see the hole in this plan. It will be time and labor intensive to implement this plan, but I have nothing but time on my hands and the 'labor' is labor I can do with my physical limitations. I am 100% - hands on - personally aware of the perils Data burned on Optical Media present. I'm currently dealing with a large cd binder of cd-r's that a roof leak gunked up in the family office. Some of these discs are surface ruined from previous rough handling, some are substrate damaged/corrossion, and some have the reflective layer flaking off the topside. I also note that -absent mildew/moisture- that the 5yr old Name Brand disks that were clean read perfectly. I'm thinking well made disc's that are well stored (some in safety deposit boxes - I hope) are going to be there for us to use for many many years. Richard On Jan 5, 3:45 pm, Dan dantear...@gmail.com wrote: At 1:31 PM -0700 1/5/2009, Doug McNutt wrote: As for optical disks the little pits are smaller for higher density DVDs than for CD-ROMs. I should be expected that smaller pits will be more subject to damage than bigger ones. But an important part of the safety is the material in which the pits are formed. and the quality improvements in the lasers - both the intensity (power levels) and frequencies used - which creates all sorts of backward compatibility issues. Now a question: Is anyone offering the performance of pressed CD-ROMS for a fee that would be reasonable for a dozen copies? Not for a dozen. Maybe for thousands. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
On Jan 5, 2009, at 5:12 PM, Dan wrote: At 1:55 PM -0800 1/5/2009, MIKO .. wrote: The photo industry believes that the highest quality version of an image is its RAW version, when available. Each company has its own variant of RAW. There will be no standard any time soon. TIFF is better. From a pro perspective image quality of a TIFF is not good enough, RAW is much better. But yes, lack of standardization is a HUGE PITA!Particularly on very early digital images, stuff we've got from the mid 90's requires us to keep an old G3 in mothballs just incase.Shots with the older systems we're phasing out now are iffy.But the calls I get when pulling images from our archives usually require resizing, color adjustments made 10-15 years ago to the file are usually totally wrong (monitors, calibrators, etc have come a LONG way) etc that give MUCH better results from the RAW file rather than a TIFF. At this point with newer systems they're generally all supported by Photoshop CameraRAW and can be converted to DNG. i feel that's reasonably safe since I'm seeling the useful life right around 10 years for an image, I don't see many calls for images older than that, even than with images more than 2-3 years old i only get a request maybe once a year ... -sam --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
RE: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
Hey one I can answer! It seems to be that Kodachrome 25 has a life of at least it seems 70 years under proper conditions of archival storage, Ektachrome seems to be about half to 3/4s of that time as some visible fading has occurred. BW prints properly fixed and rinsed are limited by the paper it seems and color prints vary with the paper. These are figures that I have read in photo mags Kirk He who has honor need not fear death. Eva Marie LeGrand Morrison 5/24/1958-6/26/2008 My beloved wife, and my best friend, I miss you CC: jcalla...@stny.rr.com From: jcalla...@stny.rr.com Subject: Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2009 16:34:00 -0500 To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Old 40 and 60 GB tape cartridges and the drive to use them are in a backroom somewhere as forgotten technology waiting to be given away to someone. I am not saying this is best for you but the old stuff is out there, hardly used in many cases and still viable. They were designed for long term archiving from the start. No one much cared about that with CDs as they are so convenient. Keeping disks in controlled environments is important too. especially regarding sunlight. It seems from this excellent interchange that for long term storage tape is the longest lasting. Does anyone have suggestions for converting computer images to tape? What is the life of 35 mm slides? I have some ten thousand of them that I have been scanning and burning to discs. Upsetting to learn of the failure of disc storage. Thank you _ Send e-mail anywhere. No map, no compass. http://windowslive.com/oneline/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_anywhere_122008 --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mail oddity
On Jan 5, 2009, at 11:30 AM, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Jan 4, 2009, at 4:56 PM, George Hozendorf wrote: - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth When I open Mail it quits before a window opens. I'm not having problems with the two accounts I have under my login. What do you mean move aside Mail's preferences? Since this account had never been set up go into the users Library/ Preferences folder and delete com.apple.Mail.plist -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs Thanks, Bruce. That did it. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
On Jan 5, 2009, at 2:42 PM, Sam Macomber wrote: Each company has its own variant of RAW. There will be no standard any time soon. TIFF is better. Whoever wrote this is a bit rude. Yes of course I know that every form on RAW is different, which is EXACTLY why you convert it to DNG and embed the original RAW. The DNG is the standard. Do I have to state every obvious thing to not get a weird comment about it when I'm trying to help? I state what's necessary to convey the information. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
On Jan 5, 2009, at 2:42 PM, Sam Macomber wrote: At this point with newer systems they're generally all supported by Photoshop CameraRAW and can be converted to DNG. i feel that's reasonably safe since I'm seeling the useful life right around 10 years for an image, I don't see many calls for images older than that, even than with images more than 2-3 years old i only get a request maybe once a year ... I can see that for stock images, but for art images that develop some clout, a good print could be requested at any time. I'd love it if there was a 50 megapixel dng out there of Ansel Adams' Moonrise! or Half Dome --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
How about storing our archival digital disks in a hermetically sealed container, flushed with nitrogen or carbon dioxide (easy to obtain, even from a flake of dry ice, dropped into the storage container just before sealing it)? That way, there should be little or no oxyge, and little or no oxidation of the burned pits, and therefore no degradation of the data. Just an idea . . . ** On Jan 5, 2009, at 1:31 PM, Dan wrote: At 10:13 AM -0800 1/5/2009, aussieshepsrock wrote: I wanted to 'expand' on how I'm handling this family photo archive project. :-) [snip - lots of details] Sounds like a good, well thought out plan to me. Query! - As someone who has definitely experienced the loss of data in hd failure, optical disc failure/damage, floppy/zip failure, and video tape decay. I wonder how something as fragile as 'Tapes' can be advocated over high grade opticals for my application. Magnetic media is actually less fragile than burned media. heh. I've got tapes and floppies that were written in the 80s, that still read just fine. Tapes/etc store data as magnetic patterns that don't degrade / fade much. Burned media stores data as pits in the substraight, under the outer plastic coating. Over time, oxygen leeches through the plastic, and forms rust (oxide), which fill the pits, creating read errors. Tapes/etc can be cleaned, then read with stronger-field heads. Burned media - only the outer plastic can be cleaned - the pits are permanently filled in, so the data is gone. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
Hi Miko, I happen to personally 'like' your DNG suggestion and am a genuine devotee of RAW files and actively shoot and store them! However, the archive I am creating is NOT an archive for ME or being created for MY use. It's being created for two equally important 'future' relatives - Someone who is looking for pictures of relatives AND someone (like me) who wants great image files to do beautiful things with. The 'Image Archive Industry' relies on the 100% NON-Proprietary nature of TIFF so it's 'future' isn't tied to ANY corporation or group of corporations AND the nature of the file format itself is designed for storing lots of information in the headers (in my case an excellent parking space for my 'exif type info/names,dates,titles). Further benefits come from the fact Any Tiff file is openable many decades from now because even if it falls into total disuse 'generally' all it takes is a programmer to write a program to read the info and retrieve the image in the file. This is a seperate question from the current 'media' choice for storing the group of image files I'm grappling with. No matter how wonderful your raw/dng file suggestion is, it's trumped by the 'benefits' TIFF brings to my specific situation. In my own personal archive I see the incredible merits of DNG when it comes to my personal image making. Sorry Miko, The purpose of my project disqualifies your suggestion for reasons seperate to what makes dng raw so wonderful. I dearly hope that 5-10 years from now DNG has the status of TIFF. LONG LIVE ADOBE - LONG LIVE PHOTOSHOP! Richard On Jan 5, 6:22 pm, MIKO .. miko.supp...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 2:42 PM, Sam Macomber wrote: At this point with newer systems they're generally all supported by Photoshop CameraRAW and can be converted to DNG. i feel that's reasonably safe since I'm seeling the useful life right around 10 years for an image, I don't see many calls for images older than that, even than with images more than 2-3 years old i only get a request maybe once a year ... I can see that for stock images, but for art images that develop some clout, a good print could be requested at any time. I'd love it if there was a 50 megapixel dng out there of Ansel Adams' Moonrise! or Half Dome --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Cleaning memory chip contacts?
On Jan 5, 2009, at 4:36 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 2:22 PM, John Callahan wrote: On the dimms, what do you suggest for the slots? Thanks That's what I've used the spray cleaner for. However, when I've used stuff like that it's usually because I've needed to do a serious cleaning and so have disassembled the system, so I can spray the board and let the solvent run off..under normal circumstances, cleaning the DIMMS and inserting/extracting them from the slot a few times cleans any oxidation off the slot contacts. Might I suggest a bit of research for 'Blotter/ Card stock' of the proper thickness to act as a 'phantom DIMM'. your choice of cleaning solvent, insert and remove several times, let dry, should be 'good to go' Chuck D. -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
On Jan 5, 2009, at 7:13 PM, Stanton Mitrany wrote: How about storing our archival digital disks in a hermetically sealed container, flushed with nitrogen or carbon dioxide (easy to obtain, even from a flake of dry ice, dropped into the storage container just before sealing it)? That way, there should be little or no oxyge, and little or no oxidation of the burned pits, and therefore no degradation of the data. Just an idea . . . ** Not a bad one either -- except, you are counting on subsequent users to be aware of the method used, and to 'reload' the interior of the case with 'nitrogen/ carbon dioxide'. Not a big deal to do, just that you are depending on 'someone' [unknown interest and/or technical ability'] at sometime in the future 'keeping faith' with your intent. Human nature says you have a hopeless wish. Chuck D. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
On Jan 5, 2009, at 4:16 PM, aussieshepsrock wrote: Sorry Miko, The purpose of my project disqualifies your suggestion for reasons seperate to what makes dng raw so wonderful. I dearly hope that 5-10 years from now DNG has the status of TIFF. LONG LIVE ADOBE - LONG LIVE PHOTOSHOP! No need to be sorry- I was being a purist, as a photographer. But when you provide further information, I'm fine with the TIFF for your purposes. Note that saving TIFFs has several options and one of them is compression. If you can afford to not compress, I'd recommend avoiding that. There are also two types of compression- LZW and ZIP- and I'm not certain if one is going to remain more standard than the other, so you might want to look into that. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
On Jan 5, 2009, at 4:13 PM, Stanton Mitrany wrote: How about storing our archival digital disks in a hermetically sealed container, flushed with nitrogen or carbon dioxide (easy to obtain, even from a flake of dry ice, dropped into the storage container just before sealing it)? That way, there should be little or no oxyge, and little or no oxidation of the burned pits, and therefore no degradation of the data. Just an idea . . . LOL. Perhaps, also, a hyperbaric chamber will help. And the storage room should be lined with lead in case we get attacked with a superstrong electromagnetic pulse (EMP)... :) --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mail oddity
On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 6:13 PM, George Hozendorf ghoze...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 11:30 AM, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Jan 4, 2009, at 4:56 PM, George Hozendorf wrote: - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth When I open Mail it quits before a window opens. I'm not having problems with the two accounts I have under my login. What do you mean move aside Mail's preferences? Since this account had never been set up go into the users Library/ Preferences folder and delete com.apple.Mail.plist ns do not have opinions, merely customs Thanks, Bruce. That did it. Just a quick question about the fix. Why didn't deleted the com.apple.Mail.plist affect the other accounts? From what I can tell, there were two other account already working in Mail. Wouldn't their info be stored in the same plist? JUST WONDERING - Marty --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
2009/1/5 Dan dantear...@gmail.com: At 8:50 AM -0600 1/5/2009, Hunter Fuller wrote: The disk is partitioned in this manner: Say you have multiple platters in a drive (the most common) and you have an 80 GiB disk. We will say it has four platters for simplicity. When you partition it, let's say you create 2x 40 GiB partitions. That means the data in partition one will be stored on platters 1-2 and the data in partition two on platters 3-4. AFAIK, logical to physical block translation is done in CYLINDER order, not platter order. So partitions cut a swath of cylinders thru a drive. They do NOT live on a single platter. That would be quite inefficient; totally eliminating the point of having independent arms. At least from what I have seen, cylinder order *is* done by numbering cylinders starting on one platter, then the next, etc. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth -- -hackmiester --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Mail oddity
On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 7:58 PM, George Hozendorf ghoze...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 6:51 PM, Marty Levine wrote: On Mon, Jan 5, 2009 at 6:13 PM, George Hozendorf ghoze...@gmail.com wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 11:30 AM, Bruce Johnson wrote: On Jan 4, 2009, at 4:56 PM, George Hozendorf wrote: - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth When I open Mail it quits before a window opens. I'm not having problems with the two accounts I have under my login. What do you mean move aside Mail's preferences? Since this account had never been set up go into the users Library/ Preferences folder and delete com.apple.Mail.plist ns do not have opinions, merely customs Thanks, Bruce. That did it. Just a quick question about the fix. Why didn't deleted the com.apple.Mail.plist affect the other accounts? From what I can tell, there were two other account already working in Mail. Wouldn't their info be stored in the same plist? JUST WONDERING - Marty I only deleted the plist for that specific user in the users library. I must be missing something. I have 5 mail accounts (addresses) setup for one user. I do not see more than one plist SLAP ON THE SIDE OF THE HEAD - ITS A NEW USER ON THE MAC - NOT AN ADDITIONAL MAIL ACCOUNT FOR AN EXISTING USER. Sorry for the confusion but I have been having problems with some of my email addresses under the same user account and I misread the original post. I was hoping this thread would help my problem - Marty --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
At 2:28 PM -0800 1/5/2009, aussieshepsrock wrote: There are Ultra-High Grade Discs made with Gold (to resist corrosion), High Grade Plastics to resist scratches and etc, and with the use of 'higher' stability Dyes (?) all put together with high quality construction processes in their production. The prices are very high for these discs compared to the el-cheapo spindles on sale every week at the BigBox stores. eg: a hundred discs are 150 bucks versus 10 bucks. The 'Tested' theoretical life of these gold disks are 300yrs versus 100yrs for 'normal' High Grade disks. The few times we've used such, they did seem to last longer. But they still threw errors eventually. Data integrity is achieved with multiple backups. I really doubt using expensive media will significantly increase the reliability. Where is an organization like this for storage mediums. There are corporate groups and ITU committees, and NIST... The former deals with PR efforts and the latter two just maintain and report upon the functional standards. Where is the 'glaring hole' in my data backup plan for these image files? My 'intended' burning methodologies are to burn very slowly (1x if possible) which in theory and personal experience gives very nice burns with excellent readability in multiple drives. Even 2x seems to work well. 4x or faster is where I later run into drives that cannot read them. more than once is going to mean much. It's x months/years down the road that count. Ok, +/- your paranoia... How do you tell if the data within a file has degraded? Funny thing about picture type data - stills or video - a few errors here and there don't mean much. And often minor errors will go unreported by the drive reading the burned media. I guess you could generate a md5 for each file... I think one of my clients is doing something like this. I'll ask 'em for the particulars. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Dumb Powerbook Question - Thanks To All That Replied
The task I have is to transfer a number of calls on my answering machine to a digital file. So I have to do it with a mike input. I figured since the Powerbook has a built-in mike that I can set levels on, recording would be a simple task. But of course, it ain't. I'm probably gonna spring for QT pro... JT Andy wrote: On 1/4/09 2:36 PM, Doug Burton of slu...@embarqmail.com sent On Jan 4, 2009, at 1:23 PM, James E. Therrault wrote: I have an Aluminum Powerbook G4, 2GB ram, 1.25GHz processor that has a built-in microphone. I know how to turn the microphone on, set the levels how in the blazes do you record something? TIA, JT A very good question and the answer is you can't. At least without downloading a sound editor or other recording software. Audacity comes to mind as adequate and free. Not sure how Windows got that over OS X, but they have always included a simple sound recorder app. HTH Just a message from Doug... Hello Doug, You’ll need one of any of a number of good, cheap (free) recording apps, like Audacity, Amadeus, or Audio Hijack (for ex.). These will know what your default input device is once booted up, and you’re good to go. HTH, Dana ...or you could launch QuickTime Player and choose filenew audio recording then click the red button when your ready. Very basic audio and I think you need to have QuickTime pro. Andy --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Address Book import
Could some one tell me an easy way to import Last Name, First Name and eMail address info from Excel into the Address Book Application? George --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
Some personal data points to add to the discussion: Wooden box = bad idea! You want a CHEMICALLY INERT container. Wood has all sorts of acids/ resins/whatever that may leach out and attack/contaminate the dyes that hold the data on your precious disks. Go for stainless steel (good luck finding that!) or archival plastics. Optical disks: Go for the Gold! There is a hierarchy of long-term stability in the optical disk market, with gold, silver, and blue dyes representing decreasing stability. Guess which is hardest to find and most expensive to buy. You have been warned. Diversity tip: When burning multiple copies of disks, burn each copy onto a disk from a different manufacturing lot, or preferably a different manufacturer. The point is that anyone can manufacture the odd bad lot of disks. You don't want to find, ten years from now that ALL your copies of the wedding were burned onto disks from a single spindle that represented the same bad manufacturing run. 35 mm slides: You simply cannot talk about the longevity of slides without discussing their chemistry. There have been many, many chemistries used throughout the decades, and they vary widely in their longevity. As a general rule, only Kodachromes can be expected to last. Anything else manufactured up to maybe two decades ago is either already lost or seriously degraded. Newer emulsions should last longer, BUT they will still eventually fade. It's what they do. Magnetic tapes: Ignore this talk about stray magnetic fields; it is damned difficult to erase a tape on purpose -- I've tried. It's degradation of the substrate and binding that you have to worry about. My personal long term experience is with analog (audio) tapes. Stuff from the 50s and 60s on acetate media is a real problem; polyester media has proven better. Video tapes from the 80s and 90s seem to suffer not from breakage/stretching that the earlier tapes suffer from, but loss of adhesion between the substrate and the magnetic material. I have not encountered (yet?) any of these problems with my DAT tape archives, although the oldest of them is no more than 15 years old. DAT drives, on the other hand, cannot be used in the same sentence with the word longevitiy. Archiving data with tape means keeping a bare minimum of two working drives in storage. On Jan 5, 11:13 am, aussieshepsrock ilovaussiesh...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello All, Thanks for your input! I wanted to 'expand' on how I'm handling this family photo archive project. :-) [snip!] --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
2009/1/5 Clark Martin cm...@sonic.net: At least from what I have seen, cylinder order *is* done by numbering cylinders starting on one platter, then the next, etc. Cylinderx SPAN platters, so they don't start on one platter, etc. TRACKS start on one platter then the next and on to the next cylinder I think this was what I was attempting to say but I am so thoroughly confused now that I give up trying to explain. :P -- Clark Martin Redwood City, CA, USA Macintosh / Internet Consulting I'm a designated driver on the Information Super Highway -- -hackmiester --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
Original Poster Here: who's AUTHORITY and METHODS were exceptionally well regarded. Where is an organization like this for storage mediums. One (or more) has to exist but where do I find it? You can find some information from NIST here: http://www.itl.nist.gov/iad/894.05/home.html or try the Library of Congress here: http://www.loc.gov/preserv/rt/#cd It looks like the longevity testing of CDs and DVDs is ongoing. Bob --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn about long lasting cdr's or dvdr's ????
On Jan 5, 2009, at 7:40 PM, MIKO .. wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 4:13 PM, Stanton Mitrany wrote: How about storing our archival digital disks in a hermetically sealed container, flushed with nitrogen or carbon dioxide (easy to obtain, even from a flake of dry ice, dropped into the storage container just before sealing it)? That way, there should be little or no oxyge, and little or no oxidation of the burned pits, and therefore no degradation of the data. Just an idea . . . LOL. Perhaps, also, a hyperbaric chamber will help. And the storage room should be lined with lead in case we get attacked with a superstrong electromagnetic pulse (EMP)... :) U!! EMP shouldn't have any effect - there isn't anything Magnetic about DVD/CDs It's Optical remember. Chuck D. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Address Book import
On 5 Jan 2009, at 17:58:51 PST, George Hozendorf wrote: Could some one tell me an easy way to import Last Name, First Name and eMail address info from Excel into the Address Book Application? George --- Maybe save it as a text file, each record a separate line, fields separated by commas. Ken http://mysite.verizon.net/res7gt1w/stackomacs --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
At 5:42 PM -0500 1/5/2009, Sam Macomber wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 5:12 PM, Dan wrote: At 1:55 PM -0800 1/5/2009, MIKO .. wrote: The photo industry believes that the highest quality version of an image is its RAW version, when available. Each company has its own variant of RAW. There will be no standard any time soon. TIFF is better. From a pro perspective image quality of a TIFF is not good enough, RAW is much better. Never heard that before. In what way is TIFF lacking? At this point with newer systems they're generally all supported by Photoshop CameraRAW and can be converted to DNG. i feel that's reasonably safe since I'm seeling the useful life right around 10 years for an image, DNG still bothers me a bit. It's an Adobe format, a container for their particular variant of RAW, based on TIFF. I don't trust Adobe much. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: LCD screen flickering and going black.
On Jan 5, 2:17 pm, dorayme Had a moment this morning to see if I could open the LCD screen. I have been putting it off because it never looked easy! I located the part I probably need, the tube in US. ...Am stuck for now. Am searching web for tips and found some but I dunno... I need better set of tools, guitar plucks and stuff. Not quite sure whether I should force the lip from the back off, or from the front off. I am taking pics of everything but I won't bother folks here unless there is someone who has actually taken one of these mothers apart... g Well, that would be me now. Managed to spring the guts out out of the frame. You must not be too feint hearted as I was for a while. I plunged a flat screen drive blade in one of the 4 or five tiny square holes in the rim and twisted and that little bit sprang a gap. Working all around, it all came off!. The fluro tube is buried deeper still and I will approach it slowly... I hope this is not too boring for everyone. Maybe someone will want to know. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: New 500G Firewire HD - folders or partitions?
You do need to be aware that the simplest questions, posed here, can generate excessive amounts of only possibly useful information. ;-) Chuck D. [On being aware!!, it's probably obvious by now!!!] On Jan 5, 2009, at 11:59 PM, D Stubbs wrote: Whew, I am a bit speechless. I am going to read all these responses 4 more times.After I have slept on the first round. I am learning another new language, French, I think it's easier. 'Partition 101' indeed! thanks, Del --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
On Jan 5, 2009, at 7:34 PM, insightinmind wrote: I haven't read this entire enormous thread, but has anyone mentioned storing the data files in cyberspace? I definitely wanted to mention this but GUESS WHAT! I HAVE EXPERIENCE! I was storing music files onlinr and then the company suddenly went out of business without announcement and I lost a lot! Also, AOL Pictures DID warn its people this past week but still, millions of people lost images when AOL Pictures shut down on 12/31. SO Online means out of our hands and that makes me scared- I only recommend what I view as safest. If we could LEGALLY bind online storage companies to NEVER losing or deleting our data, I'd recommend cyberspace. But it definitely happens. So YEs, I thought about it, but according to my motto- I only say what people need to know, otherwise it clutters the usefulness of the reply. MIKO in Seattle Miko's Support and Design Services --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
External DVD RW play dvds in osx??
I have an external DVD Burner that for some reason will only read and burn dvds connected through USB to my Powermac G4. I can play dvds from it on other computers that have internal dvd drives, but not mine because I have an internal CD RW drive. DVD player just says there is no supported dvd drive found. VLC, and mplayer won't work either. What can I do to make it play dvds?-Jonas --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
At 9:09 PM -0800 1/5/2009, MIKO .. wrote: On Jan 5, 2009, at 7:34 PM, insightinmind wrote: I haven't read this entire enormous thread, but has anyone mentioned storing the data files in cyberspace? Nothing wrong with keeping a copy of your files up on a remote server somewhere. Apps like iWeb can make very nice albums. I wouldn't depend on the storage tho... I was storing music files onlinr and then the company suddenly went out of business without announcement and I lost a lot! ouch! :( If we could LEGALLY bind online storage companies to NEVER losing or deleting our data, I'd recommend cyberspace. After the off-line backup thread last week, I started perusing the various cloud storage solutions. Not pretty. They all have disclaimers in their TCs. And none are willing to give specifics as to their actual set-up and backup systems. :\ - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
Re: Where do I learn.... becomes archiving files and images- the future
Well, for the ultimate in archivalness (is that a word?), to preserve things for future generations of your family, do what I plan to do: get rid of both magnetic and optical storage. Back to basics here. Sure, we all shoot digital now, but we don't have to store that way. Print out your most important digital images at high resolution on archival paper, using long-lasting pigmented inks, and then keep these prints in an album, dry, clean, and out of light, except when you look at them. They ought to last a generation or two that way (Epson says 200 years, at least). And then, to really save them for the ages, use a copy stand to shoot those prints with a camera that uses film, and the best film for the purpose is black and white. The black and white negatives will last practically forever, and any silver-based prints made from them (in an old-fashioned chemical darkroom, like I have) would last as long as the paper, which can also be centuries. In other words, get your important pictures out of the electronic devices altogether, and back into the shoebox, alongside Grandma's. All the future generations have to do then is pick them up and hold them in their hand, and look at them. Eyeballs never become obsolete. --~--~-~--~~~---~--~~ You received this message because you are subscribed Low End Mac's G3-5 List, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to g3-5-list-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list?hl=en Low End Mac RSS feed at feed://lowendmac.com/feed.xml -~--~~~~--~~--~--~---
