Re: FW: Together ControlCenter for jakarta projects

[Leo Simons]

On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 15:04, Vincent Massol wrote:
> What do you think ? Do you think it would be nice to have a free
> TogetherCC license so that projects who wish can create UML diagrams as
> part of their website docs for example ?

yes!

It's funny to see jakarta as an academy though.

You think you can get them to extend the offer to all of apache? (some
of our friends at xml may like it, too :)

- Leo

> 
> -Vincent
> 
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Richard Pitt [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: 19 July 2002 10:47
> > To: Vincent Massol (E-mail)
> > Subject: Together ControlCenter for jakarta projects
> > 
> >  Hi Vincent,
> > 
> >  I am just persuing the Together ControlCenter licence issue for you.
> >  I am proposing that TogetherSoft gives the Jakarta Project an
> academic
> >  licence, and that all the committers be considered as faculty
> members.
> > 
> >  Do you think this would be useful for and/or wanted by jakarta sub-
> > projects?
> > 
> >  Regards,
> >  Richard
> > 
> >  Richard Pitt
> >  Mentor
> >  TogetherSoft UK



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FW: Together ControlCenter for jakarta projects

[Vincent Massol]

What do you think ? Do you think it would be nice to have a free
TogetherCC license so that projects who wish can create UML diagrams as
part of their website docs for example ?

-Vincent

> -Original Message-
> From: Richard Pitt [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: 19 July 2002 10:47
> To: Vincent Massol (E-mail)
> Subject: Together ControlCenter for jakarta projects
> 
>  Hi Vincent,
> 
>  I am just persuing the Together ControlCenter licence issue for you.
>  I am proposing that TogetherSoft gives the Jakarta Project an
academic
>  licence, and that all the committers be considered as faculty
members.
> 
>  Do you think this would be useful for and/or wanted by jakarta sub-
> projects?
> 
>  Regards,
>  Richard
> 
>  Richard Pitt
>  Mentor
>  TogetherSoft UK
> 
>  direct  +44 14 8986 6029
>  mobile +44 77 7328 6784


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Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Andrew C. Oliver]

>
>
>What? And lose my 10-minute investment in learning PHP? No way!
>
>Besides, now I can have fun a whole weekend, just changing the name of a
>field in the database. My life would seem empty in comparison, if I got to
>use those pesky frameworks that do everything for you.
>
>(Never thought one day I would get to pull Jon's leg. Hey folks, it's a
>great sensation! I feel important!)
>  
>
Just make sure thatoh nevermind... :-)

Then you should really try ASP!  Its great!  Not only do you have the 
quick development, quick learning time, but
you can also play with COM components and DLLs and stuff.  

COM programming with ASP is the ultimate maintenance rush.  Microsoft 
should be applauded for it.  

I think we should drop the Maven and Centipede thing and just redo the 
Jakarta site using ASP.  I volunteer you
Alex to maintain it.  :-)

-Andy

>:)
>
>Alex.
>
>  
>
>>-Andy
>>
>>
>
>  
>




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Re: Know each other

[Jeff Martin]

I'm kinda London based at the moment (Although I'm not really actively
apache at the moment) 

I've also met both Vincent Massoll (Cactus) and Paul Hamett (Avalon)
both of whom have been know to attend XTC
http://www.xpdeveloper.com/cgi-bin/wiki.cgi?ExtremeTuesdayClub

On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 07:58, Alex McLintock wrote:
> At 12:14 18/07/02, Aaron wrote:
> >I have a question.  It seems that you all kinda know each other. Where is
> >everyone located?
> >Aaron
> 
> Working with Open Source software is a pretty unpopular pastime - if I was 
> a BEA Weblogic expert for instance I would have people beating down my door 
> to get to know me :-)
> 
> I think most of the people on the general list are concerned with Apache 
> (or at least Jakarta) as a whole rather than just one particular Apache 
> project. It is only natural that people with the same interest get to know 
> more about each other and sometimes meet up in real life.
> 
> I would be quite keen to meet more Apache people in London or nearby but so 
> far the only person I know lives nearby is Pier Fumigalli and I still 
> haven't met him yet.
> 
> I'm particularly keen to hear from UK and other European companies doing 
> Apache Open Source so that I can add them to my OSS directory 
> http://www.OWAL.co.uk/oss_support/
> 
> Alex McLintock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Openweb Analysts Ltd, London.
> Software For Complex Websites http://www.OWAL.co.uk/
> Open Source Software Companies please register here 
> http://www.OWAL.co.uk/oss_support/
> 
> 
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jeff martin
information technologist
mkodo limited

mobile: 44 (0) 78 5547 8331
phone: 44 (0) 20 2226 4545
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Know each other

[Jeff Martin]

I'm kinda London based at the moment (Although I'm not really actively
apache at the moment) 

I've also met both Vincent Massoll (Cactus) and Paul Hamett (Avalon)
both of whom have been know to attend XTC
http://www.xpdeveloper.com/cgi-bin/wiki.cgi?ExtremeTuesdayClub

On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 07:58, Alex McLintock wrote:
> At 12:14 18/07/02, Aaron wrote:
> >I have a question.  It seems that you all kinda know each other. Where is
> >everyone located?
> >Aaron
> 
> Working with Open Source software is a pretty unpopular pastime - if I was 
> a BEA Weblogic expert for instance I would have people beating down my door 
> to get to know me :-)
> 
> I think most of the people on the general list are concerned with Apache 
> (or at least Jakarta) as a whole rather than just one particular Apache 
> project. It is only natural that people with the same interest get to know 
> more about each other and sometimes meet up in real life.
> 
> I would be quite keen to meet more Apache people in London or nearby but so 
> far the only person I know lives nearby is Pier Fumigalli and I still 
> haven't met him yet.
> 
> I'm particularly keen to hear from UK and other European companies doing 
> Apache Open Source so that I can add them to my OSS directory 
> http://www.OWAL.co.uk/oss_support/
> 
> Alex McLintock
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Openweb Analysts Ltd, London.
> Software For Complex Websites http://www.OWAL.co.uk/
> Open Source Software Companies please register here 
> http://www.OWAL.co.uk/oss_support/
> 
> 
> --
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:   
> For additional commands, e-mail: 
> 

-- 
Jeff Martin

Memetic Engineer

http://www.custommonkey.org/ 


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RE: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Martin van den Bemt]

He is just the first dutch serial killer on the  loose ;))

Mvgr,
Martin

On Fri, 2002-07-19 at 13:57, Stephane Bailliez wrote:
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Leo Simons [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> 
> [...]
> > the world. I have also taken the precaution of killing all my 
> > family and friends so you have no way to blackmail me.
> 
> Are you by any chance a relative of Kaiser Soze ? ;-)
> 
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RE: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Fernandez Martinez, Alejandro]

Hi Andy!

> -Mensaje original-
> De: Andrew C. Oliver [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Enviado el: viernes 19 de julio de 2002 13:28
> Para: Jakarta General List
> Asunto: Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???
> 
> Initial development costs are < 1/3 of the overall cost of a project. 
>  Once you've been stuck maintaining a few of those
> nasty beasts you create in PHP you'll move on to want 
> something else and 
> be very appologetic to everyone you
> pumped that crud out for.  I've full confidence that one day 
> a smart guy 
> like you will abandon the "right is wrong" principal.
> :-) ;-)

What? And lose my 10-minute investment in learning PHP? No way!

Besides, now I can have fun a whole weekend, just changing the name of a
field in the database. My life would seem empty in comparison, if I got to
use those pesky frameworks that do everything for you.

(Never thought one day I would get to pull Jon's leg. Hey folks, it's a
great sensation! I feel important!)

:)

Alex.

> -Andy

RE: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Stephane Bailliez]

> -Original Message-
> From: Leo Simons [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]

[...]
> the world. I have also taken the precaution of killing all my 
> family and friends so you have no way to blackmail me.

Are you by any chance a relative of Kaiser Soze ? ;-)

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Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Andrew C. Oliver]

LOL :-)

Danny Angus wrote:

>>I have also taken the precaution of killing all my family and
>>friends
>>
>>
>
>Seems like a sound move to me, we could all do it, that'd show Micro$oft
>who's the boss.
>d.
>
>
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Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Andrew C. Oliver]

Leo Simons wrote:

>I didn't reply because I know POI is just one of microsoft's ploys to
>bring java to its knees. The idea behind this scheme is to bring the
>worsts bits of their own software to java, promote it using massive FUD
>(your recent e-mail proof of this, as is JSP), then improve their own
>software, and finally block java from windows all together stating as
>reason that it contains lots of crappy stuff like POI.
>  
>
LOL!  :-D -  Yes soon everyone will encode everything as a OLE 2 CDF 
Document.  You know
POI stands for Poor Obfuscation Implmentation

>You, of course, secretly work for microsoft and were specifically hired
>to start this dirty game.
>  
>
Oh yes... The other day when I was standing next to Bill on Steve's 
yacht, I said "How can we bring
Java to its knees?" and after a bit Steve snapped his fingers, raised 
arms so we could see those
sweaty pits and said "Developers Developers Developers"... . Bill 
interperated this for me as "Why
not port OLE 2 Compound Document Fromat to Java under the guise of 
breaking our monopoly
on file formats while secretly getting everyone to use them"

And I bowed down and said "I'm not worthy" and here I am..  You all fell 
for it too!  Just wait!  Soon
we will embrace and extend Java.  Tomcat will require you to edit the 
config files with Microsoft Word
(but it will finally use Avalon with 10 layers of inheritance behind 
every class like Cocoon)...  

>I was going to keep silent (as you sent me quite a few of micro$oft $$
>to do so), but since you now asked for it specifically, I feel obliged
>to share this valuable and dangerous knowledge with the jakarta
>community.
>
>best regards,
>
>- Leo Simons
>
>PS: I will be moving house and country 2 minutes after I send this
>message, have transferred all my funds to Swiss banks, am undergoing a
>sex change tomorrow and have contacted the MIB to erase my identity, so
>do not try and track me to let me pay for bringing this news out into
>the world. I have also taken the precaution of killing all my family and
>friends so you have no way to blackmail me.
>  
>
But Leo!  You didn't realize?  All of Jakarta is in on it!  Jon even! 
 He's writing a new framework based on
turbine that requires to to view all pages in MS Word.  It even 
integrates with Jetspeed to create an
MSWordPortal.

-Andy

-Andy

>;)
>
>On Thu, 2002-07-18 at 22:10, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:
>  
>
>>But no one replied to my lovely email when I said that other than POI 
>>and HTTPD there was only actually
>>one Apache project, all the others are the same project implemented 
>>different ways and that JSP had the
>>structure of a dog turned inside out...  I was so proud of that...how 
>>mean of you all not to respond :-(
>>
>>;-)
>>
>>-Andy
>>
>>
>
>
>
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Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Andrew C. Oliver]

Fernandez Martinez, Alejandro wrote:

>Hi Andrew,
>
>  
>
>>
>>
>That is condescending and paternal. I like it! ;)
>
;-) I stole his tone from him.

>  
>
>>-Andy
>>
>>JSP = Java's Super PERL! :-)
>>
>>
>
>Your comment is right on target. You seem to be in the right object-oriented
>state of mind. When your skills progress, after you have helped create a
>couple of webapp frameworks, and bashed JSPs to death on every occasion: you
>will end up using PHP despite it being "fugly" because
>[...] you can get a lot more done with it in a short amount of time
>[...]
>  
>
Initial development costs are < 1/3 of the overall cost of a project. 
 Once you've been stuck maintaining a few of those
nasty beasts you create in PHP you'll move on to want something else and 
be very appologetic to everyone you
pumped that crud out for.  I've full confidence that one day a smart guy 
like you will abandon the "right is wrong" principal.
:-) ;-)

-Andy

>Sheesh!
>
>Alex.
>  
>
>>>James Mitchell
>>>Software Engineer\Struts Evangelist
>>>Struts-Atlanta, the "Open Minded Developer Network"
>>>http://www.open-tools.org/struts-atlanta
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>  
>>>
-Original Message-
From: Andrew C. Oliver [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 4:10 PM
To: Jakarta General List
Subject: Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???


But no one replied to my lovely email when I said that 


>>other than POI
>>
>>
and HTTPD there was only actually
one Apache project, all the others are the same project implemented
different ways and that JSP had the
structure of a dog turned inside out...  I was so proud of 


>>that...how
>>
>>
mean of you all not to respond :-(

;-)

-Andy

Leo Simons wrote:

   



>>>Is that site generated by maven ? ;))
>>>
>>>Mvgr,
>>>Martin
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>  
>>>
>>Anakia
>>
>>I hate to admit it here, but the output is .html files 
>>
>>
>>which are then
>>
>>
>>processed through PHP. I'm going to be moving away from even
>>   
>>
>>
>>
using Anakia
   



>>and just using PHP.
>>
>>PHP is terribly fugly and encourages the worst code design
>>   
>>
>>
>>
ever, but you can
   



>>get a lot more done with it in a short amount of time and there
>>   
>>
>>
>>
is no way in
   



>>hell I would ever lower myself to using JSP.
>>
>>=)
>>
>>
>>   
>>
>>
>>
>yeah. And it's got a template language called Smarty which is *way*
>better than velocity!!!
>
>:P
>
>- Leo, who figured there was another flamefest when he saw 
>  
>
>>all those
>>
>>
>e-mails and is now eagerly waiting for a picture of a crossdressing
>jon...
>
>
>
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RE: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Danny Angus]

> I have also taken the precaution of killing all my family and
> friends

Seems like a sound move to me, we could all do it, that'd show Micro$oft
who's the boss.
d.


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Re: localhost:8080 vs localhost???

[Leo Simons]

I didn't reply because I know POI is just one of microsoft's ploys to
bring java to its knees. The idea behind this scheme is to bring the
worsts bits of their own software to java, promote it using massive FUD
(your recent e-mail proof of this, as is JSP), then improve their own
software, and finally block java from windows all together stating as
reason that it contains lots of crappy stuff like POI.

You, of course, secretly work for microsoft and were specifically hired
to start this dirty game.

I was going to keep silent (as you sent me quite a few of micro$oft $$
to do so), but since you now asked for it specifically, I feel obliged
to share this valuable and dangerous knowledge with the jakarta
community.

best regards,

- Leo Simons

PS: I will be moving house and country 2 minutes after I send this
message, have transferred all my funds to Swiss banks, am undergoing a
sex change tomorrow and have contacted the MIB to erase my identity, so
do not try and track me to let me pay for bringing this news out into
the world. I have also taken the precaution of killing all my family and
friends so you have no way to blackmail me.

;)

On Thu, 2002-07-18 at 22:10, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:
> But no one replied to my lovely email when I said that other than POI 
> and HTTPD there was only actually
> one Apache project, all the others are the same project implemented 
> different ways and that JSP had the
> structure of a dog turned inside out...  I was so proud of that...how 
> mean of you all not to respond :-(
> 
> ;-)
> 
> -Andy



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RE: Know each other

[Danny Angus]

I'm 30 miles sw of Glasgow, there's another guy in Scotland, and about a
dozen (if that) all together in the UK AFAIK.
d.

> -Original Message-
> From: Alex McLintock [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: 19 July 2002 07:59
> To: Jakarta General List
> Subject: Know each other
>
>
> At 12:14 18/07/02, Aaron wrote:
> >I have a question.  It seems that you all kinda know each other. Where is
> >everyone located?
> >Aaron
>
> Working with Open Source software is a pretty unpopular pastime -
> if I was
> a BEA Weblogic expert for instance I would have people beating
> down my door
> to get to know me :-)
>
> I think most of the people on the general list are concerned with Apache
> (or at least Jakarta) as a whole rather than just one particular Apache
> project. It is only natural that people with the same interest
> get to know
> more about each other and sometimes meet up in real life.
>
> I would be quite keen to meet more Apache people in London or
> nearby but so
> far the only person I know lives nearby is Pier Fumigalli and I still
> haven't met him yet.
>
> I'm particularly keen to hear from UK and other European companies doing
> Apache Open Source so that I can add them to my OSS directory
> http://www.OWAL.co.uk/oss_support/
>
> Alex McLintock
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Openweb Analysts Ltd, London.
> Software For Complex Websites http://www.OWAL.co.uk/
> Open Source Software Companies please register here
> http://www.OWAL.co.uk/oss_support/
>
>
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