Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] Re: Conflicting RDEPENDS

[René 'Necoro' Neumann]

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Duncan schrieb:
> Patrick Börjesson  posted
> 20090529201741.gb11...@nexon.nexus, excerpted below, on  Fri, 29 May 2009
> 22:17:41 +0200:
> 
>> Why exactly would you want to use --oneshot for a "leaf package" that is
>> not depended on by any other package in the world set? If spam IS
>> depended on by any other package (recursively) in the world set, it will
>> be pulled in by --complete-graph, but that's not the case here if i
>> understand it correctly, thus it's a package that you explicitly wanted
>> installed, thus it belongs in the world set, and you should thus not use
>> --oneshot for it.
> 
> I use -1 by default, here (via scriptlet), mainly so I don't have to 
> worry about cluttering up my world file while emerging individual 
> packages, just as I always use -NuD with my @system and @world runs.
> 
> But for leaf packages, it serves as a sort of test install as well.  
> Since I always do revdep-rebuild -p and emerge --depclean -p after every 
> update (typically 2-3 times a week), then rebuild and clean as I need to, 
> keeping the "trial merges" on the depclean list for a few days keeps me 
> aware of them.  If I know it's something I want to keep, I run a 
> different scriptlet without the -1, but that's not often once a system is 
> up and running with the normal working set merged.  Meanwhile, I 
> ultimately either emerge -C (or let depclean handle it) the "trialware", 
> or emerge --noreplace, thus adding it to world.
> 
> But experimental installs and their deps typically sit in the --depclean 
> list for anything from a few minutes to a few days, until I decide 
> whether I want to keep or remove them.
> 
> If he was testing how the switches under discussion here worked and has a 
> similar policy, I could easily see him using -1 by habit, even if he 
> didn't explicitly reason that it was a test and therefore something he 
> didn't want in @world.
> 

Well ... as one can probably see from the package names, I was just
testing whether portage actually checks RDEPENDs of installed packages
or not ;) (if it does not, Portato does not need to either ;))

And I often use -1 w/o even thinking about it

- - René
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Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] Re: Conflicting RDEPENDS

[René 'Necoro' Neumann]

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Marijn Schouten (hkBst) schrieb:>
>>> Why is a custom set less convenient?
> 
> Well, instead of "emerge --trialware package" you would first have to edit 
> your
> @trialware set and then "emerge @trialware". The same goes for when you want 
> to
> remove some trialware.
> Perhaps some generalization of --trialware along the lines of
> --add-to-set=trialware could be fleshed out as a useful extension of portage.
> 
> Marijn

Well - and you also need to keep in mind to clean the set from time to
time ... instead of just having a --depclean run

- - René
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Re: [gentoo-portage-dev] Re: Conflicting RDEPENDS

[Marijn Schouten (hkBst)]

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Alec Warner wrote:
> On Sun, May 31, 2009 at 4:21 AM, Marijn Schouten (hkBst)
>  wrote:
> Duncan wrote:
 Patrick Börjesson  posted
 20090529201741.gb11...@nexon.nexus, excerpted below, on  Fri, 29 May 2009
 22:17:41 +0200:

> Why exactly would you want to use --oneshot for a "leaf package" that is
> not depended on by any other package in the world set? If spam IS
> depended on by any other package (recursively) in the world set, it will
> be pulled in by --complete-graph, but that's not the case here if i
> understand it correctly, thus it's a package that you explicitly wanted
> installed, thus it belongs in the world set, and you should thus not use
> --oneshot for it.
 I use -1 by default, here (via scriptlet), mainly so I don't have to
 worry about cluttering up my world file while emerging individual
 packages, just as I always use -NuD with my @system and @world runs.

 But for leaf packages, it serves as a sort of test install as well.
 Since I always do revdep-rebuild -p and emerge --depclean -p after every
 update (typically 2-3 times a week), then rebuild and clean as I need to,
 keeping the "trial merges" on the depclean list for a few days keeps me
 aware of them.  If I know it's something I want to keep, I run a
 different scriptlet without the -1, but that's not often once a system is
 up and running with the normal working set merged.  Meanwhile, I
 ultimately either emerge -C (or let depclean handle it) the "trialware",
 or emerge --noreplace, thus adding it to world.

 But experimental installs and their deps typically sit in the --depclean
 list for anything from a few minutes to a few days, until I decide
 whether I want to keep or remove them.

 If he was testing how the switches under discussion here worked and has a
 similar policy, I could easily see him using -1 by habit, even if he
 didn't explicitly reason that it was a test and therefore something he
 didn't want in @world.
> I think this is an interesting use-case. It would be very simple to handle it 
> by
> introducing an additional file that the package manager would use to record 
> the
> packages that are installed on trial-basis. This would make it possible to
> include these packages in dep-calculations, while still distinguishing them 
> from
> packages that are in @world. Of course you can also fake it by creating a 
> local
> virtual/trialware package (or possibly a @trialware group) of which you edit 
> the
> deps, but this would be less convenient. For my personal workflow using -1 for
> trials is working well enough, atm.
> 
>> Why is a custom set less convenient?

Well, instead of "emerge --trialware package" you would first have to edit your
@trialware set and then "emerge @trialware". The same goes for when you want to
remove some trialware.
Perhaps some generalization of --trialware along the lines of
- --add-to-set=trialware could be fleshed out as a useful extension of portage.

Marijn

- --
If you cannot read my mind, then listen to what I say.

Marijn Schouten (hkBst), Gentoo Lisp project, Gentoo ML
, #gentoo-{lisp,ml} on FreeNode
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