Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
On Sat, 27 Aug 2005 17:05:23 -0400 John Dangler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: After some more reading, I decided to emerge Firefox and Thunderbird anyway... It installs fine, except it's really annoying that mousing over a menu selection turns the colors white on white... (developer's joke, perhaps) This problem is is caused by a gtk+ theme engine that is not compatible with Firefox in some way. My guess is that you're using gtk-engines-gtkstep. HTH -- T.G. -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
[gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
I've just completed setting up x server and gnome (why gnome - I'm a relic of *nix and Motif and gnome sort of reminds me of the older look and feel). gnome installs mozilla by default, which has browsing, news, and mail. How does this stack up against Firefox? I've seen a lot of press about using one or the other, but I'm trying to get a feel for why. Is one better suited to Gentoo than the other? (This particular box is used primarily for business apps and remote webserver/site tweaking when needed). Thanks for the input. John D -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
I just found some docs on this that say Large organizations that require an integrated suite (past Netscape Communicator users) should consider moving towards Mozilla 1.7. All others should consider upgrading to Firefox and Thunderbird. So, I guess the question becomes, can I unmerge Mozilla and emerge Firefox and Thunderbird? Or do they need to see Mozilla libs somewhere, since they're offered by the same org? Thanks for the input. John D -Original Message- From: John Dangler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:33 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail I've just completed setting up x server and gnome (why gnome - I'm a relic of *nix and Motif and gnome sort of reminds me of the older look and feel). gnome installs mozilla by default, which has browsing, news, and mail. How does this stack up against Firefox? I've seen a lot of press about using one or the other, but I'm trying to get a feel for why. Is one better suited to Gentoo than the other? (This particular box is used primarily for business apps and remote webserver/site tweaking when needed). Thanks for the input. John D -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
To me it depends on what you want/need/like. I don't like Mozilla because it has everything in one package. I like to be able to use Firefox as the browser and other programs for news and mail. On Sat, 27 Aug 2005, John Dangler wrote: I've just completed setting up x server and gnome (why gnome - I'm a relic of *nix and Motif and gnome sort of reminds me of the older look and feel). gnome installs mozilla by default, which has browsing, news, and mail. How does this stack up against Firefox? I've seen a lot of press about using one or the other, but I'm trying to get a feel for why. Is one better suited to Gentoo than the other? (This particular box is used primarily for business apps and remote webserver/site tweaking when needed). Thanks for the input. John D -- Brett I. Holcomb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Registered Linux User #188143 Remove R777 to email -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
You can unmerge them. I never had Mozilla on my system and Firefox and Thunderbird work well. If you have some valuable emails in Mozilla's mailbox be sure you can access them later. On Sat, 27 Aug 2005, John Dangler wrote: I just found some docs on this that say Large organizations that require an integrated suite (past Netscape Communicator users) should consider moving towards Mozilla 1.7. All others should consider upgrading to Firefox and Thunderbird. So, I guess the question becomes, can I unmerge Mozilla and emerge Firefox and Thunderbird? Or do they need to see Mozilla libs somewhere, since they're offered by the same org? Thanks for the input. John D -Original Message- From: John Dangler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:33 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail I've just completed setting up x server and gnome (why gnome - I'm a relic of *nix and Motif and gnome sort of reminds me of the older look and feel). gnome installs mozilla by default, which has browsing, news, and mail. How does this stack up against Firefox? I've seen a lot of press about using one or the other, but I'm trying to get a feel for why. Is one better suited to Gentoo than the other? (This particular box is used primarily for business apps and remote webserver/site tweaking when needed). Thanks for the input. John D -- Brett I. Holcomb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Registered Linux User #188143 Remove R777 to email -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
Brett~ Thanks for the reply. I did find some additional information about these that tells me I should be using Firefox and Thunderbird... The USE flags on portage for thunderbird don't require gnupg, but I noticed in Mozilla mail that in order to use encrypted mail, Mozilla mail wanted it. Is there a gnupg USE flag that will emerge Thunderbird with this feature built-in? John D -Original Message- From: Brett I. Holcomb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:42 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail To me it depends on what you want/need/like. I don't like Mozilla because it has everything in one package. I like to be able to use Firefox as the browser and other programs for news and mail. On Sat, 27 Aug 2005, John Dangler wrote: I've just completed setting up x server and gnome (why gnome - I'm a relic of *nix and Motif and gnome sort of reminds me of the older look and feel). gnome installs mozilla by default, which has browsing, news, and mail. How does this stack up against Firefox? I've seen a lot of press about using one or the other, but I'm trying to get a feel for why. Is one better suited to Gentoo than the other? (This particular box is used primarily for business apps and remote webserver/site tweaking when needed). Thanks for the input. John D -- Brett I. Holcomb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Registered Linux User #188143 Remove R777 to email -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
John Dangler schreef: I just found some docs on this that say Large organizations that require an integrated suite (past Netscape Communicator users) should consider moving towards Mozilla 1.7. All others should consider upgrading to Firefox and Thunderbird. So, I guess the question becomes, can I unmerge Mozilla and emerge Firefox and Thunderbird? Or do they need to see Mozilla libs somewhere, since they're offered by the same org? The answer to your question is yes and no. Not because Firefox needs Mozilla to run (it doesn't), but because you have emerged the gnome meta-package, of which the Mozilla Suite is a (deep) dependency (because the full GNOME installation installs GNOME's web browser, Epiphany, which directly depends on Mozilla). So if you uninstall Mozilla now, you will 1) break Epiphany, and 2) break the meta-package. GNOME will still work, except for Epiphany, but Portage will at some point become aware that one of the dependencies for one of your installed applications-- in this case, the gnome meta-package-- has been uninstalled. Which is, of course, not cool as far as Portage is concerned, so it will, of course, attempt to reinstall Mozilla at every opportunity. Which is kind of a PITA, if you went to all the trouble to uninstall it in the first place. The solution? Replace the 'gnome' metapackage with the 'gnome-light' metapackage, which installs a full GNOME desktop, without the applications that could be considered 'cruft', such as Mozilla, sound-juicer, Totem, Evolution (and Evolution Data Server) and GStreamer. How do you switch when GNOME is already installed? 1) emerge -C gnome. This will *not* unmerge any applications, just the metapackage itself, thereby orphaning the dependencies that you want to uninstall. 2) emerge -C the 'extra' programs you don't want (Mozilla, Epiphany, Evo, EDS, Totem, Sound Juicer, whatever). Also make sure that your USE flags conform to your choices (add -mozilla, and also -eds if you don't want evolution-data-server to be re-emerged when you upgrade gnome-panel). 3) emerge gnome-light This will not emerge anything new (unless you ripped out Nautilus or something in your purge ;) ), but will 'adopt' all the orphaned GNOME desktop dependencies that were orphaned by your unmerge of the gnome meta-package, so when you next emerge -uDv world, if there are updates to GNOME, they will be picked up (because they are dependencies of the gnome-light package). Hope this helps, Holly -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
Holly~ I wish I had know this before emerging gnome... :( What I may do (just because gnome is such a pig on compilation) is emerge firefox and thunderbird, and leave it as-is. I may as well explore the apps that gnome has been so gracious to include, and then, when I've discovered which are useful and which aren't, I can go back, unmerge gnome, and emerge gnome-light and build in what I want to use... The crux of the issue is that there are thousands of packages in portage that we (as noob's) don't really know what they are (or what they mean, since the names are a little cryptic at times), so we plow ahead with what we think we want, only to discover scenarios just like the one I'm in now. If it doesn't already exist, I'm thinking of trying to build a set of pages that gives a friendlier look and feel to portage... PACKAGE STABLE OTHER Thunderbird Mail/News Client1.0.6-r21.0.6-r3 1.0.6-r4 1.0.6-r5 (HARD MASKED) Selecting the package name would bring up a page that shows all of the information... LONG DESCRIPTION COMMENTS USE FLAGS DEPENDENCIES/REVERSE DEPENDENCIES SCREENSHOTS BUGS CHANGELOG STABLE w/link OTHER w/link I don't know how far this can go, since some of the packages may not be able to be named so succinctly, but it may be worth a shot... John D -Original Message- From: Holly Bostick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 2:45 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail John Dangler schreef: I just found some docs on this that say Large organizations that require an integrated suite (past Netscape Communicator users) should consider moving towards Mozilla 1.7. All others should consider upgrading to Firefox and Thunderbird. So, I guess the question becomes, can I unmerge Mozilla and emerge Firefox and Thunderbird? Or do they need to see Mozilla libs somewhere, since they're offered by the same org? The answer to your question is yes and no. Not because Firefox needs Mozilla to run (it doesn't), but because you have emerged the gnome meta-package, of which the Mozilla Suite is a (deep) dependency (because the full GNOME installation installs GNOME's web browser, Epiphany, which directly depends on Mozilla). So if you uninstall Mozilla now, you will 1) break Epiphany, and 2) break the meta-package. GNOME will still work, except for Epiphany, but Portage will at some point become aware that one of the dependencies for one of your installed applications-- in this case, the gnome meta-package-- has been uninstalled. Which is, of course, not cool as far as Portage is concerned, so it will, of course, attempt to reinstall Mozilla at every opportunity. Which is kind of a PITA, if you went to all the trouble to uninstall it in the first place. The solution? Replace the 'gnome' metapackage with the 'gnome-light' metapackage, which installs a full GNOME desktop, without the applications that could be considered 'cruft', such as Mozilla, sound-juicer, Totem, Evolution (and Evolution Data Server) and GStreamer. How do you switch when GNOME is already installed? 1) emerge -C gnome. This will *not* unmerge any applications, just the metapackage itself, thereby orphaning the dependencies that you want to uninstall. 2) emerge -C the 'extra' programs you don't want (Mozilla, Epiphany, Evo, EDS, Totem, Sound Juicer, whatever). Also make sure that your USE flags conform to your choices (add -mozilla, and also -eds if you don't want evolution-data-server to be re-emerged when you upgrade gnome-panel). 3) emerge gnome-light This will not emerge anything new (unless you ripped out Nautilus or something in your purge ;) ), but will 'adopt' all the orphaned GNOME desktop dependencies that were orphaned by your unmerge of the gnome meta-package, so when you next emerge -uDv world, if there are updates to GNOME, they will be picked up (because they are dependencies of the gnome-light package). Hope this helps, Holly -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
default gnupg (Enigmail) integration with Thunderbird was removed recently because of trouble with the build. from the ebuild: ewarn Enigmail Support has been dropped since it doesn't work on fresh install. ewarn The Gentoo Mozilla team is working on making enigmail its own build, ewarn sorry for the inconvenience. For now, you can download enigmail from ewarn http://enigmail.mozdev.org; --myk John Dangler wrote: Brett~ Thanks for the reply. I did find some additional information about these that tells me I should be using Firefox and Thunderbird... The USE flags on portage for thunderbird don't require gnupg, but I noticed in Mozilla mail that in order to use encrypted mail, Mozilla mail wanted it. Is there a gnupg USE flag that will emerge Thunderbird with this feature built-in? John D -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
Myk~ I just got that message... I went to enigmail.mozdev.org Current version showing release is v0.92.0 There is an article on the right side that says 0.90.2 - Use this with Thunderbird 1.0.2 The latest stable version of Thunderbird in portage is 1.0.5 ... hmm... So, which version should be used to install from mozdev? John D -Original Message- From: Myk Taylor [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 3:14 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail default gnupg (Enigmail) integration with Thunderbird was removed recently because of trouble with the build. from the ebuild: ewarn Enigmail Support has been dropped since it doesn't work on fresh install. ewarn The Gentoo Mozilla team is working on making enigmail its own build, ewarn sorry for the inconvenience. For now, you can download enigmail from ewarn http://enigmail.mozdev.org; --myk John Dangler wrote: Brett~ Thanks for the reply. I did find some additional information about these that tells me I should be using Firefox and Thunderbird... The USE flags on portage for thunderbird don't require gnupg, but I noticed in Mozilla mail that in order to use encrypted mail, Mozilla mail wanted it. Is there a gnupg USE flag that will emerge Thunderbird with this feature built-in? John D -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
Ouch! I just came across this in the release notes for enigmail... Enigmail needs to be compiled using the same environment as the Thunderbird or Mozilla Suite you are about to install it on. This usually means that you should either use the official binary builds of both (the Mozilla application and Enigmail) - or only use packages provided by your distribution - or build both manually. For example if you use a distribution Thunderbird package with the official Enigmail build, you will encounter problems! Enigmail is only tested against the milestone releases of Thunderbird, Mozilla and Netscape. If you use a nightly, third-party or own build Enigmail may not always work and may even crash the application! maybe sticking with Mozilla suite until this gets figured out isn't so bad... John D -Original Message- From: John Dangler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 3:08 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail Holly~ I wish I had know this before emerging gnome... :( What I may do (just because gnome is such a pig on compilation) is emerge firefox and thunderbird, and leave it as-is. I may as well explore the apps that gnome has been so gracious to include, and then, when I've discovered which are useful and which aren't, I can go back, unmerge gnome, and emerge gnome-light and build in what I want to use... The crux of the issue is that there are thousands of packages in portage that we (as noob's) don't really know what they are (or what they mean, since the names are a little cryptic at times), so we plow ahead with what we think we want, only to discover scenarios just like the one I'm in now. If it doesn't already exist, I'm thinking of trying to build a set of pages that gives a friendlier look and feel to portage... PACKAGE STABLE OTHER Thunderbird Mail/News Client1.0.6-r21.0.6-r3 1.0.6-r4 1.0.6-r5 (HARD MASKED) Selecting the package name would bring up a page that shows all of the information... LONG DESCRIPTION COMMENTS USE FLAGS DEPENDENCIES/REVERSE DEPENDENCIES SCREENSHOTS BUGS CHANGELOG STABLE w/link OTHER w/link I don't know how far this can go, since some of the packages may not be able to be named so succinctly, but it may be worth a shot... John D -Original Message- From: Holly Bostick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 2:45 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail John Dangler schreef: I just found some docs on this that say Large organizations that require an integrated suite (past Netscape Communicator users) should consider moving towards Mozilla 1.7. All others should consider upgrading to Firefox and Thunderbird. So, I guess the question becomes, can I unmerge Mozilla and emerge Firefox and Thunderbird? Or do they need to see Mozilla libs somewhere, since they're offered by the same org? The answer to your question is yes and no. Not because Firefox needs Mozilla to run (it doesn't), but because you have emerged the gnome meta-package, of which the Mozilla Suite is a (deep) dependency (because the full GNOME installation installs GNOME's web browser, Epiphany, which directly depends on Mozilla). So if you uninstall Mozilla now, you will 1) break Epiphany, and 2) break the meta-package. GNOME will still work, except for Epiphany, but Portage will at some point become aware that one of the dependencies for one of your installed applications-- in this case, the gnome meta-package-- has been uninstalled. Which is, of course, not cool as far as Portage is concerned, so it will, of course, attempt to reinstall Mozilla at every opportunity. Which is kind of a PITA, if you went to all the trouble to uninstall it in the first place. The solution? Replace the 'gnome' metapackage with the 'gnome-light' metapackage, which installs a full GNOME desktop, without the applications that could be considered 'cruft', such as Mozilla, sound-juicer, Totem, Evolution (and Evolution Data Server) and GStreamer. How do you switch when GNOME is already installed? 1) emerge -C gnome. This will *not* unmerge any applications, just the metapackage itself, thereby orphaning the dependencies that you want to uninstall. 2) emerge -C the 'extra' programs you don't want (Mozilla, Epiphany, Evo, EDS, Totem, Sound Juicer, whatever). Also make sure that your USE flags conform to your choices (add -mozilla, and also -eds if you don't want evolution-data-server to be re-emerged when you upgrade gnome-panel). 3) emerge gnome-light This will not emerge anything new (unless you ripped out Nautilus or something in your purge ;) ), but will 'adopt' all the orphaned GNOME desktop dependencies that were orphaned by your unmerge of the gnome meta-package, so when you next emerge -uDv world
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
After some more reading, I decided to emerge Firefox and Thunderbird anyway... It installs fine, except it's really annoying that mousing over a menu selection turns the colors white on white... (developer's joke, perhaps) When I go to the extensions dialog, there aren't any. So, I seect Check for updates. Receive a dialog box saying Thunderbird is now checking for available updates... this may take a few minutes... Yeah - like 30 minutes and no updates. So I select Get More Extensions (since the extension dialog box is empty, I assume that it needs to go and 'find some'... It launches Firefox to an empty page... So, if my earlier reading is correct, Thunderbird is broke as far as enigmail is concerned, unless you download source packages for Firefox, Thunderbird, and enigmail... Has anyone had luck getting these modules to run together on Gentoo? Thanks for the input John D -Original Message- From: John Dangler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 4:01 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail Ouch! I just came across this in the release notes for enigmail... Enigmail needs to be compiled using the same environment as the Thunderbird or Mozilla Suite you are about to install it on. This usually means that you should either use the official binary builds of both (the Mozilla application and Enigmail) - or only use packages provided by your distribution - or build both manually. For example if you use a distribution Thunderbird package with the official Enigmail build, you will encounter problems! Enigmail is only tested against the milestone releases of Thunderbird, Mozilla and Netscape. If you use a nightly, third-party or own build Enigmail may not always work and may even crash the application! maybe sticking with Mozilla suite until this gets figured out isn't so bad... John D -Original Message- From: John Dangler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 3:08 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail Holly~ I wish I had know this before emerging gnome... :( What I may do (just because gnome is such a pig on compilation) is emerge firefox and thunderbird, and leave it as-is. I may as well explore the apps that gnome has been so gracious to include, and then, when I've discovered which are useful and which aren't, I can go back, unmerge gnome, and emerge gnome-light and build in what I want to use... The crux of the issue is that there are thousands of packages in portage that we (as noob's) don't really know what they are (or what they mean, since the names are a little cryptic at times), so we plow ahead with what we think we want, only to discover scenarios just like the one I'm in now. If it doesn't already exist, I'm thinking of trying to build a set of pages that gives a friendlier look and feel to portage... PACKAGE STABLE OTHER Thunderbird Mail/News Client1.0.6-r21.0.6-r3 1.0.6-r4 1.0.6-r5 (HARD MASKED) Selecting the package name would bring up a page that shows all of the information... LONG DESCRIPTION COMMENTS USE FLAGS DEPENDENCIES/REVERSE DEPENDENCIES SCREENSHOTS BUGS CHANGELOG STABLE w/link OTHER w/link I don't know how far this can go, since some of the packages may not be able to be named so succinctly, but it may be worth a shot... John D -Original Message- From: Holly Bostick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 2:45 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail John Dangler schreef: I just found some docs on this that say Large organizations that require an integrated suite (past Netscape Communicator users) should consider moving towards Mozilla 1.7. All others should consider upgrading to Firefox and Thunderbird. So, I guess the question becomes, can I unmerge Mozilla and emerge Firefox and Thunderbird? Or do they need to see Mozilla libs somewhere, since they're offered by the same org? The answer to your question is yes and no. Not because Firefox needs Mozilla to run (it doesn't), but because you have emerged the gnome meta-package, of which the Mozilla Suite is a (deep) dependency (because the full GNOME installation installs GNOME's web browser, Epiphany, which directly depends on Mozilla). So if you uninstall Mozilla now, you will 1) break Epiphany, and 2) break the meta-package. GNOME will still work, except for Epiphany, but Portage will at some point become aware that one of the dependencies for one of your installed applications-- in this case, the gnome meta-package-- has been uninstalled. Which is, of course, not cool as far as Portage is concerned, so it will, of course, attempt to reinstall Mozilla at every opportunity. Which is kind of a PITA, if you went to all the trouble to uninstall
RE: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail
You're welcome. I'm not that up on Tbird. I used it briefly a long time ago on another Gentoo box but didn't like it so I went to Pine and I did not use encryption either. The only other install has been on a windows box that I used when both my Gentoo boxes were dead. When I get my main box back up I intend to use Tbird. Run ufed as root and see what flags there are or check the gentoo site - they have a list. Let us know how it goes. On Sat, 27 Aug 2005, John Dangler wrote: Brett~ Thanks for the reply. I did find some additional information about these that tells me I should be using Firefox and Thunderbird... The USE flags on portage for thunderbird don't require gnupg, but I noticed in Mozilla mail that in order to use encrypted mail, Mozilla mail wanted it. Is there a gnupg USE flag that will emerge Thunderbird with this feature built-in? John D -Original Message- From: Brett I. Holcomb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 1:42 PM To: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] browser,news,mail To me it depends on what you want/need/like. I don't like Mozilla because it has everything in one package. I like to be able to use Firefox as the browser and other programs for news and mail. On Sat, 27 Aug 2005, John Dangler wrote: I've just completed setting up x server and gnome (why gnome - I'm a relic of *nix and Motif and gnome sort of reminds me of the older look and feel). gnome installs mozilla by default, which has browsing, news, and mail. How does this stack up against Firefox? I've seen a lot of press about using one or the other, but I'm trying to get a feel for why. Is one better suited to Gentoo than the other? (This particular box is used primarily for business apps and remote webserver/site tweaking when needed). Thanks for the input. John D -- Brett I. Holcomb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Registered Linux User #188143 Remove R777 to email -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
