Re: [geo] Re: White roof snag

2011-11-04 Thread Ken Caldeira
I should keep my mouth shut until I go through this paper carefully, but I am highly skeptical of this reported result. Even if white roofs cause local increases in vertical stability, I would be very skeptical if increases in surface albedo were to cause decreases in planetary albedo, except in

[geo] Re: White roof snag

2011-11-04 Thread Charlie Zender
It is helpful to frame the Jacobson results on white roofs in terms of direct and indirect effects. The unambiguous effect of white roofs is to increase the direct radiative forcing of any aerosols above. To be precise, brighter surfaces increase absorption by overlying aerosols and thus increase

RE: [geo] Re: White roof snag

2011-11-04 Thread Rau, Greg
...@uci.edu] Sent: Friday, November 04, 2011 9:46 AM To: geoengineering Subject: [geo] Re: White roof snag It is helpful to frame the Jacobson results on white roofs in terms of direct and indirect effects. The unambiguous effect of white roofs is to increase the direct radiative forcing of any aerosols

[geo] Re: White roof snag

2011-11-04 Thread Charlie Zender
George, My name is Charlie :) It's hard to isolate the effects of BC in nature because of all the other processes that simultaneously affect regional climate. Snow is disapppearing more quickly in springtime in Asia than North America. Flanner et al. ACP 2009 show this is consistent with

[geo] Re: White roof snag

2011-11-03 Thread O Morton
Stephen (or John, or Phil, or anyone else) have any of your modellings of cloud brightening looked at this effect? If you were to brighten clouds under a dark aerosol (eg Asian Brown Cloud or equivalent off west africa) might you not be trading warming at the surface for warming at the dark

Re: [geo] Re: White roof snag

2011-11-03 Thread Andrew Lockley
Increased column stability may affect hydrological cycle and thus thermohaline circulation. This could be problematic and modelling seems wise A On Nov 3, 2011 4:15 PM, O Morton omeconom...@gmail.com wrote: Stephen (or John, or Phil, or anyone else) have any of your modellings of cloud